bluebell Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 I live in Utah, and I give priesthood blessings often in our home.I don't remember the last time I performed one assisted by someone else. The reason for that is the requests for blessings nearly always occur late at night or in the early hours of the morning. It seems a bit much to call someone out of bed to come to my home for that purpose and to insist that the family member who is suffering wait for the other person to arrive.Aware that Church policy allows for both the anointing and the sealing to be performed by one person, I feel no guilt whatsoever regarding this.My husband almost always gives healing blessings to our family on his own as well. 3
JLHPROF Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 So . . . if you are inspired to drive along 7th East instead of 6th East, thus avoiding a downed power line, that isn't G-d actually speaking? That is exactly what you said it is. God inspiring me to take a different route for my safety. Who's arguing that point? But did God speak to me? Did he command me to take a different route? Did he show me what would happen if I stayed on my current route? Did he tell me it was his will that I avoid the downed power line? Nope. He merely prompted me for my benefit. Inspiration is 100% valid as a communication from God. But anyone who doesn't believe it is more easily influenced by our mortal condition than some other methods isn't paying attention. The scriptures are full of stories where if you replaced the direct revelation with a inspired feeling the results almost certainly wouldn't have worked out as well. Although sometimes we ignore direct revelation just as easily as we ignore promptings...
cdowis Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 (edited) (Emphasis mine) So I take it, then, that you acknowledge that inspiration is a form of revelation, as opposed to be separate, different or distinct from revelation.Elder Oaks tells us the answer Revelation is communication from God to man. It can occur in many different ways. Some prophets, like Moses and Joseph Smith, have talked with God face to face. Some persons have had personal communication with angels. Other revelations have come, as Elder James E. Talmage (1862–1933) of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles described it, “through the dreams of sleep or in waking visions of the mind.” 1 In its more familiar forms, revelation or inspiration comes by means of words or thoughts communicated to the mind (see Enos 1:10; D&C 8:2–3), by sudden enlightenment (see D&C 6:14–15), by positive or negative feelings about proposed courses of action, or even by inspiring performances, as in the performing arts. As President Boyd K. Packer, Acting President of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles, has stated, “Inspiration comes more as a feeling than as a sound.” 2 https://www.lds.org/new-era/2004/09/eight-ways-god-can-speak-to-you?lang=eng Edited June 20, 2014 by cdowis 2
JLHPROF Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 (Emphasis mine) So I take it, then, that you acknowledge that inspiration is a form of revelation, as opposed to be separate, different or distinct from revelation. Oh, of course I do. I just know which of the "forms" of revelation are more reliable in determining Gods will.
Teancum Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 Wow, it just never ends. Women are indeed left out or put out of the circle, compared to yesteryear. Yes indeed. Even though you are told you are not...you really are a second class citizen in the Kingdom of God.......rather sad isn't it?
MorningStar Posted June 20, 2014 Author Posted June 20, 2014 Yes indeed. Even though you are told you are not...you really are a second class citizen in the Kingdom of God.......rather sad isn't it?I don't think different equals second class. 1
JLHPROF Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 Elder Oaks tells us the answer Revelation is communication from God to man. It can occur in many different ways. Some prophets, like Moses and Joseph Smith, have talked with God face to face. Some persons have had personal communication with angels. Other revelations have come, as Elder James E. Talmage (1862–1933) of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles described it, “through the dreams of sleep or in waking visions of the mind.” 1In its more familiar forms, revelation or inspiration comes by means of words or thoughts communicated to the mind (see Enos 1:10; D&C 8:2–3), by sudden enlightenment (see D&C 6:14–15), by positive or negative feelings about proposed courses of action, or even by inspiring performances, as in the performing arts. As President Boyd K. Packer, Acting President of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles, has stated, “Inspiration comes more as a feeling than as a sound.” 2 https://www.lds.org/new-era/2004/09/eight-ways-god-can-speak-to-you?lang=eng All true. But which are more able to be influenced by our feelings. But this is beside the point and is derailing the thread a bit. Back to the original subtopic - KK & OW and the calling of women to priesthood offices. I stand by my point to Gray. If God calls men to priesthood offices only by inspiring mortal men when they are praying then, as Gray argued, their feelings and biases could easily prevent a woman from being called. They would never pray about a woman as a choice. They would never believe a feeling inspiring them to call a woman came from God. However, if God on occasion has called men to priesthood offices by directly TELLING (speaking/visiting/sending messengers or similar) the leaders who to call as I believe happened in the D&C and other scriptures and Church history then the lack of such a revelation ever calling a woman provides as least some evidence that God doesn't approve. Such revelations negate any mortal biases.
Gray Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 Humm,Could just as easily mean "black of heart" as "black of skin".But, by all means, continue your sanctimonious preaching. I try to keep my sanctimony separate from my preaching. I save the latter for when I'm discussion TV shows
Gray Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 Since heterosexual marriage is ordained of God, the answer is plainly "no." Thanks, -Smac The answer is equally "no" for gay couples.
Gray Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 Right!So, they are only less miserable when they believe that society, as a whole, welcomes their deviancy. But they are totally miserable otherwise.And this is somehow a winning point?I don't think so. I don't think you'd be very happy if you group up thinking you were born a "deviant" and had to live a life of solitude, either.
Gray Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 I don't see that either repudiates the law of chastity as taught by the prophets and apostles. Again, we just see things differently. This is a matter of conscience for me.
Gray Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 17 If any man will do his will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God, or whether I speak of myself.3 And it is requisite with the justice of God that men should be judged according to their works; and if their works were good in this life, and the desires of their hearts were good, that they should also, at the last day, be restored unto that which is good.So,Those that reject God's will (by accepting the union of two (or more?) homosexuals and calling it marriage) will know of the doctrine?????? I think I quoted the wrong BOM passage. I meant to quote the one about wickedness never was happiness. Living true doctrines leads to happiness - I believe that. But gays who try to live by church standards do not experience happiness as a result. Rather the opposite.
Gray Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 Heaven forbid true doctrine ever cause misery. We know that the Atonement, Abraham's almost-sacrifice of Isaac, and plural marriage were all happy events for the individuals involved. True doctrine does not cause people to be miserable.
Scott Lloyd Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 I think I quoted the wrong BOM passage. I meant to quote the one about wickedness never was happiness. Living true doctrines leads to happiness - I believe that. But gays who try to live by church standards do not experience happiness as a result. Rather the opposite. Sometimes, happiness that results from keeping the commandments is deferred. 4
Vance Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 I don't think you'd be very happy if you group up thinking you were born a "deviant" and had to live a life of solitude, either. Right! Because only certain people have ungodly desires and are required to bridle their passions to be within the bounds the Lord has set. The rest of us are TOTALLY free from any such temptations and the necessity of bridling our passions. /SARC 2
Scott Lloyd Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 True doctrine does not cause people to be miserable. But the vicissitudes of mortality often do. I see SSA as being one of the vicissitudes. 3
Gray Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 For many, the happiness of the Lord is postponed on earth (I included) while their faith in Christ is tried to the utmost in the furnace of affliction. These saints, so tested, will not have their tears of sorrow and lament wiped away by the Lord until they have successfully passed through this phase of earthbound adversity -- even that blessed day when a multitude of tortured souls will finally find healing and rest in the glorious resurrection. Even Christ himself was a man of great sorrows and thoroughly acquainted grief.The following verses of scripture plainly manifest that suffering, trial and sorrow are part and parcel of the earthly probationary experience.24 And they that are Christ’s have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts. (Galatians 5) 6 For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.7 If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?8 But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.9 Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?10 For they verily for a few days chastened us after their own pleasure; but he for our profit, that we might be partakers of his holiness.11 Now no chastening for the present seemeth to be joyous, but grievous: nevertheless afterward it yieldeth the peaceable fruit of righteousness unto them which are exercised thereby. (Hebrews 12) 16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.18 For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us. (Romans 8:10-18) There are some citizens in the Lord's kingdom on earth who's rare moments of happiness are generated only by the bright hope of the holy resurrection from the dead, and the comforting knowledge that they continue to abide in the will of God despite their great temptations, trials and afflictions. For my yoke is easy and my burden is light We all have trials that are hard to bear. But if misery is coming living what we think are true principles, then something is wrong
USU78 Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 I don't think you'd be very happy if you group up thinking you were born a "deviant" and had to live a life of solitude, either. CFR for that "born that way" threadjack to which the OP keeps objecting. 1
Vance Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 I think I quoted the wrong BOM passage. I meant to quote the one about wickedness never was happiness. Living true doctrines leads to happiness - I believe that. But gays who try to live by church standards do not experience happiness as a result. Rather the opposite. IF you could just provide a verse that showed that the righteous were free from any sorrows, THEN you might have a point. I suspect that Alma and Amulek (and all those cast into the fire) would love to see such a scripture. 2
USU78 Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 Sometimes, happiness that results from keeping the commandments is deferred. But that dream seems to burst more often than not these days, a-lyin' there in the sun
Gray Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 Sometimes, happiness that results from keeping the commandments is deferred. I think that's a repressive idea that has lead to much unnecessary suffering.
Gray Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 Right! Because only certain people have ungodly desires and are required to bridle their passions to be within the bounds the Lord has set.The rest of us are TOTALLY free from any such temptations and the necessity of bridling our passions./SARC I don't think the two situations are comparable.
The Nehor Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 Based on the above count yourself among them. A half dozen other so called believers here as well. Sarcasm is just a theoretical concept to you isn't it?
JLHPROF Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 True doctrine does not cause people to be miserable. Nonsense. True doctrine does not cause people with righteous desires and Godly perspectives to be miserable. The wicked taketh the truth to be hard. 1
Gray Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 CFR for that "born that way" threadjack to which the OP keeps objecting. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/science-news/10637532/Being-homosexual-is-only-partly-due-to-gay-gene-research-finds.html http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epigenetic_theories_of_homosexuality A combination of genetics and gene expression most likely account for it.
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