Does The Movie "frozen" Have A Hidden Gay Agenda?

[mormonnewb]

Well, if you felt like taking the same view of the movie as the aforementioned deseret news article and see it as a christian allegory, the uncontrollable power could be our inherent nature to sin. In more general terms, it could be anything that we have a hard time controlling that causes harm to others and we're ashamed of: anger, lust, greed, addictive behavior - take your pick.

 

It also could be a movie for children ... and their parents who want two hours of relative peace and quiet.  Oh yeah, and for those of us who will use ANY excuse to enjoy some movie theater popcorn.

Edited February 19, 2014 by mormonnewb

[mormonnewb]

This fits much better than Disney having a hidden gay agenda.

 

If there's a hidden evil agenda (as implied by the writer of the blog) one would have to believe that those behind this movie sat down, brainstormed and schemed together to come up with subliminal messages, cleverly written lyrics and dialogue, questionable characters and so on.  Then they'd have to hope that these hidden messages would get through to the children watching it.

 

That's pretty far fetched, IMO.

 

I guess the writer of this blog has disabled comments and posted this:

 

Oh, it's so sad when people don't have tolerance for intolerance.

[Gray]

I think it's propaganda for the frozen desserts industry. 

[jkwilliams]

My response: http://runtu.wordpress.com/2014/02/19/waking-up-to-the-gay-agenda/

 

I have to admit that I really enjoyed writing it.

[mormonnewb]

My response: http://runtu.wordpress.com/2014/02/19/waking-up-to-the-gay-agenda/

 

I have to admit that I really enjoyed writing it.

 

Very funny post!  I literally LOL'd when I got to the part about Home Improvement's Tim Taylor and the creepy neighbor Wilson.  How I missed such overt messaging I'll never know!

[ERayR]

Speaking of hidden messages, that blog post was so poorly written I kept looking for the point to be reached, but none was forthcoming. Absolutely awful writing doesn't help crazy.

 

Whatever the movie is about many here seem to be intent on attacking the bloggers lack of education to invalidate his/her claims.  The last I looked a poor education wasn't a reason to dismiss out of hand.  If you want to take issue with the claims do so on their merits not there presenters skills.  This dismissal seems a bit elitist to me.

Edited February 19, 2014 by ERayR

[mormonnewb]

Whatever the movie is about many here seem to be intent on attacking the bloggers lack of education to invalidate his/her claims. The last I looked a poor education wasn't a reason to dismiss out of hand. If you want to take issue with the claims do so on their merits not there presenters skills. This dismissal seems a bit elitist to me.

In fairness, I think we've been equally elitist in attacking her reasoning. Jkwilliams wrote an entire blog entry in which he cleverly demonstrated the flawed logic in her essay (without a single reference to writing style). That being said, you do raise a good point in questioning the tone and tenor of our disagreement. I too was surprised at the strident tone taken by some in this thread. This is not to,say that I haven't been equally mean, but I'm a newb so I can be excused. However, some of you longtime Mormons should be ashamed of yourselves!

Edited February 19, 2014 by mormonnewb

[ALarson]

Well, now the story is on Huffington Post.

 

Great 

 

Too bad she associates herself so strongly with being a Mormon as the comments are not favorable towards her (mainly) or towards the church.

 

  http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/02/18/disney-frozen-mormon-gay-_n_4810851.htm

 

Title:  "Disney's 'Frozen' Slammed By Mormon Grandmother For 'Gay Agenda To Normalize Homosexuality'"

Edited February 19, 2014 by ALarson

[teddyaware]

Well, if you felt like taking the same view of the movie as the aforementioned deseret news article and see it as a christian allegory, the uncontrollable power could be our inherent nature to sin. In more general terms, it could be anything that we have a hard time controlling that causes harm to others and we're ashamed of: anger, lust, greed, addictive behavior - take your pick.

So are we expected to joyfully embrace our inherent nature to sin? Are we also supposed to joyfully embrace anger, lust, greed and addictive behavior? Though I haven't seen the movie, do I speak aright when I say Elsa eventually comes to embrace her magical power and claim it as a good thing, something that in reality she should have never been ashamed? If so, your examples are not analogous to the inherent personal gift of power Elsa eventually comes to unabashedly embrace. Isn't this what the song  "Let it Go." is all about?

Edited February 19, 2014 by teddyaware

[cinepro]

Can someone who supports the thesis of the blog post please explain to me how it fits the "gay agenda" in a practical application?

 

Since Elsa isn't actually coming out as a lesbian, everything has to be implied.  So what is the plan?  My two daughters have seen the movie many, many times (we had a screener copy at home that was on high rotation for longer than I could stand).  What specific effect will this have had on them as it fits into the "gay agenda"?

 

The first question is whether it will be more likely that either of them will be gay later in life.  I think there is probably universal agreement that it won't effect that likelihood, but if you disagree, let me know.

 

So what then?  In the future, when they see gay or lesbian people in real life, or in entertainment or other media, will they some how react differently?  How so?  How will having seen Elsa sing "Let it Go" change anything?

[mormonnewb]

So are we expected to joyfully embrace our inherent nature to sin? Are we also supposed to joyfully embrace anger, lust, greed and addictive behavior? Though I haven't seen the movie, do I speak aright when I say Elsa eventually comes to embrace her magical power and claim it as a good thing, something that in reality she should have never been ashamed? If so, your examples are not analogous to the inherent personal gift of power Elsa eventually comes to unabashedly embrace. Isn't this what the song  "Let it Go." is all about?

To answer all of your questions -- NO!

 

The movie does NOT promote just embracing our destructive attributes.  Instead, it embraces the concept of curtailing these impulses and only using them in their proper context.  And while the song "Let It Go" is a wonderful song, it is being sung by Elsa in her role as villain (only later, did she become a heroine).  No one is cheering her on as she is singing the song because she is literally DESTROYING the community.

 

So let's work through the analogy again.  Let's just say that Elsa's power is a symbol for lust.  In that context, Elsa's parents have recognized her penchant for lust and have forbid her from it.  In fact, they've gone so far as to cloister her away for the protection of herself (and others).  However, after their death, Elsa is forced to engage again with the larger society.  At first, she tries to hold back her lust, but the temptation is strong.  For a time, she runs amuck with her lust (all the while singing Let It Go).  However, in doing so, she is literally destroying the very fabric of society.  However, due to the love of others, she finally returns home.  In doing so, she learns to control her lust and only uses it when appropriate (i.e., in the bounds of holy matrimony, or in the movie, to allow her snowman friend to survive through the summer months).

 

Once again, NOTHING about this movie preaches a message of unbridled restraint.  When Elsa lets loose with her powers, it is ... and I can repeat this enough ... a catastrophe.  If a hedonistic wrote this movie to promote his/her way of life, he/she did a really poor job.

Edited February 19, 2014 by mormonnewb

[mormonnewb]

Well, now the story is on Huffington Post.

 

Great 

 

Too bad she associates herself so strongly with being a Mormon as the comments are not favorable towards her (mainly) or towards the church.

 

  http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/02/18/disney-frozen-mormon-gay-_n_4810851.htm

 

Title:  "Disney's 'Frozen' Slammed By Mormon Grandmother For 'Gay Agenda To Normalize Homosexuality'"

 

I had trouble with your link.  Here is an alternative one:

 

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/02/18/disney-frozen-mormon-gay-_n_4810851.html?utm_hp_ref=entertainment&ir=Entertainment

 

The really good news is that there are now over 1,000 comments and ... spoiler alert ... almost ALL of them are negative (I haven't found a positive one yet).  Here's my "favorite" comment so far (edited for new favorite):

 

a "well behaved mormon woman" does this mean she has sister wives? she has the nerve to bash a kids movie she claims pushes the gay agenda meanwhile her "religion" (cult) promotes women as second class citizens, polgamy, is ultra secretive and does not allow non mormons into their "churches" and my favorite believe their "magic" underwear protect them from everything. i guess she never heard the phrase those who live in glass houses shouldnt throw stones

 

Wow, who woulda thunk that when you start accusing people of nefarious plots and schemes that they are going to come back with even worse (and equally false) accusations against you?  Shocking!

Edited February 19, 2014 by mormonnewb

[ALarson]

I had trouble with your link.  Here is an alternative one:

 

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/02/18/disney-frozen-mormon-gay-_n_4810851.html?utm_hp_ref=entertainment&ir=Entertainment

Thanks..

 

(And I agree, the comments are interesting to read through.)

Edited February 19, 2014 by ALarson

[ERayR]

Well, now the story is on Huffington Post.

 

Great 

 

Too bad she associates herself so strongly with being a Mormon as the comments are not favorable towards her (mainly) or towards the church.

 

  http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/02/18/disney-frozen-mormon-gay-_n_4810851.htm

 

Title:  "Disney's 'Frozen' Slammed By Mormon Grandmother For 'Gay Agenda To Normalize Homosexuality'"

 

What do you expect from the Huffington Post.  To be denigrated by the HuffPo should be a badge of honor.

[frank_jessop]

I don't know if there's a secret gay agenda in the movie Frozen or if there isn't. I simply wanted some input from others as to what they think Elsa's uncontrollable magic power might symbolize. What sort of potentially destructive, shame inducing, private human struggle does Elsa's uncontrollable magic power represent?

 

Flatulence.

 

One could take almost any human malady and claim that malady is represented by uncontrollable magic power.

[teddyaware]

To answer all of your questions -- NO!

 

The movie does NOT promote just embracing our destructive attributes.  Instead, it embraces the concept of curtailing these impulses and only using them in their proper context.  And while the song "Let It Go" is a wonderful song, it is being sung by Elsa in her role as villain (only later, did she become a heroine).  No one is cheering her on as she is singing the song because she is literally DESTROYING the community.

 

So let's work through the analogy again.  Let's just say that Elsa's power is a symbol for lust.  In that context, Elsa's parents have recognized her penchant for lust and have forbid her from it.  In fact, they've gone so far as to cloister her away for the protection of herself (and others).  However, after their death, Elsa is forced to engage again with the larger society.  At first, she tries to hold back her lust, but the temptation is strong.  For a time, she runs amuck with her lust (all the while singing Let It Go).  However, in doing so, she is literally destroying the very fabric of society.  However, due to the love of others, she finally returns home.  In doing so, she learns to control her lust and only uses it when appropriate (i.e., in the bounds of holy matrimony, or in the movie, to allow her snowman friend to survive through the summer months).

 

Once again, NOTHING about this movie preaches a message of unbridled restraint.  When Elsa lets loose with her powers, it is ... and I can repeat this enough ... a catastrophe.  If a hedonistic wrote this movie to promote his/her way of life, he/she did a really poor job.

In my post I wasn't intimating that that unbridled hedonism was the theme of the movie but that sinfulness seemed to be a poor simile (according to the suggestion of poster to whom I was responding) for Elsa's magical powers. The power to freeze things at will would seem to be morally neutral; something that could be used equally for either good or bad purposes (for example, if I had the power to fly like Superman, I could use that power for good or ill). But your example of lust seems off because lust is just plain old bad and is NEVER a good thing (in a healthy marriage lust would be absent but righteous passion within the bounds the Lord has set would present).

So I guess I'll now have to watch the movie for myself (something I was hoping to be able to avoid) so I can get a clear picture of the plot and characters for myself. It's interesting you said Elsa plays the role of villain in earlier portions of the movie because, as I understand it, originally her role was to be the onscreen villain but the writers gradually morphed her role into that of a heroine.

I guess the thing that confuses the issue here is that a Google search reveals there are several gay advocates who believe the film does have a gay subtext. After I see the film, I'll then throw in my two cents as to what message I think the film is attempting  to convey.

Edited February 20, 2014 by teddyaware

[The Nehor]

The really good news is that there are now over 1,000 comments and ... spoiler alert ... almost ALL of them are negative (I haven't found a positive one yet).  Here's my "favorite" comment so far (edited for new favorite):

 

a "well behaved mormon woman" does this mean she has sister wives? she has the nerve to bash a kids movie she claims pushes the gay agenda meanwhile her "religion" (cult) promotes women as second class citizens, polgamy, is ultra secretive and does not allow non mormons into their "churches" and my favorite believe their "magic" underwear protect them from everything. i guess she never heard the phrase those who live in glass houses shouldnt throw stones

 

Wow, who woulda thunk that when you start accusing people of nefarious plots and schemes that they are going to come back with even worse (and equally false) accusations against you?  Shocking!

 

I just have to wonder what kind of adult refers to themselves as well-behaved. I have never heard of that concept outside of children (and usually young children). Does that mean she eats her veggies?

[omni]

I just have to wonder what kind of adult refers to themselves as well-behaved. I have never heard of that concept outside of children (and usually young children). Does that mean she eats her veggies?

I'm not real familiar with the website, but I believe they're trying to be the anti-Mormon Feminist Housewives.

[cinepro]

I don't know if there's a secret gay agenda in the movie Frozen or if there isn't. I simply wanted some input from others as to what they think Elsa's uncontrollable magic power might symbolize. What sort of potentially destructive, shame inducing, private human struggle does Elsa's uncontrollable magic power represent?

 

Can someone explain to me why "Frozen" is the one Disney movie that has to have concrete  (and intentional) symbolism? 

 

Although I've always suspected that "the Force" in Star Wars was symbolic of homosexuality, and the Jedi were all gay and Palpatine was just homophobic (and using the "hetero force"), and it was a story of Luke discovering his homo-force with the help of the ever-present Ben Kenobi.  Can anyone else think of what a mystical power shared by attractive but single men that must be hidden from the oppressive "Empire" could be?  There's just no other possible explanation!

[canard78]

Next thing you will be telling me are those Scottish dresses are a pillar of Scottish culture.

 

More of an umbrella over the whole culture.

 

It's not an umbrella I'd recommend sheltering under...

[jkwilliams]

Whatever the movie is about many here seem to be intent on attacking the bloggers lack of education to invalidate his/her claims.  The last I looked a poor education wasn't a reason to dismiss out of hand.  If you want to take issue with the claims do so on their merits not there presenters skills.  This dismissal seems a bit elitist to me.

 

I certainly didn't attack anyone's lack of education, so I'm not sure why you're pointing at me. Her writing is atrocious, and as a writer, I tend to point out poor writing. Heck, people say all kinds of mean things about my writing on my blog, and it doesn't bother me. I don't think people who criticize my writing skills are elitist.

[teddyaware]

Can someone explain to me why "Frozen" is the one Disney movie that has to have concrete  (and intentional) symbolism? 

 

Although I've always suspected that "the Force" in Star Wars was symbolic of homosexuality, and the Jedi were all gay and Palpatine was just homophobic (and using the "hetero force"), and it was a story of Luke discovering his homo-force with the help of the ever-present Ben Kenobi.  Can anyone else think of what a mystical power shared by attractive but single men that must be hidden from the oppressive "Empire" could be?  There's just no other possible explanation!

There's a rather simple explanation to your question: When it comes stories with other fictional characters who possess superpowers, their extraordinary abilities are usually embraced as something positive and there's no imprisonment, debilitating guilt or intense self loathing connected to the possession of the superpowers. Meanwhile, as I understand it, Frozen's main storyline is about the intense shame and guilt Elsa is caused to feel because the superpower she possesses is negatively perceived. Elsa's intense shame and guilt over an inborn personal trait cannot help but cause some viewers to wonder if they have an inherent trait that also causes them to feel shame and embarrassment. This movie presents a novel approach as to how a superpower is understood, and the whole unique concept cannot help but cause many viewers to wonder what Elsa's shame inducing superpower might represent, by way of metaphor, to the personal issues and struggles of real-life humans.

Edited February 20, 2014 by teddyaware

[rlds_coc_lds]

In my post I wasn't intimating that that unbridled hedonism was the theme of the movie but that sinfulness seemed to be a poor simile (according to the suggestion of poster to whom I was responding) for Elsa's magical powers. The power to freeze things at will would seem to be morally neutral; something that could be used equally for either good or bad purposes (for example, if I had the power to fly like Superman, I could use that power for good or ill). But your example of lust seems off because lust is just plain old bad and is NEVER a good thing (in a healthy marriage lust would be absent but righteous passion within the bounds the Lord has set would present).

 

 

I was just giving another possible interpretation. I don't think it's any more poor of a simile from the point of view of "liberal society" at large than that it is for homosexuality. Like a previous poster noted, why would someone promoting a gay lifestyle say that it is something to use only in some circumstances? Now sin on the other hand is interpreted in many different ways. Lust is a big positive for those that frequent underground sex clubs, but not so much for the majority of society. However if you have lustful thoughts about your spouse than it is deemed acceptable even if the urges are the same.

 

Another reason a power is not analogous to homosexuality from a gay person's point of view would be that a power (while perhaps inherent to the person) can be used or not used in most (if not all, depending on the power) circumstances. Whereas most gay people would argue that it's not something they have any ability (or should have any need) to control. So if it's a pro-gay agenda than this is not very analogous at all.

 

In any case, I believe there's no hidden agenda, or hidden analogy at all. It's just a story about being ashamed and being healed through love.

[teddyaware]

I was just giving another possible interpretation. I don't think it's any more poor of a simile from the point of view of "liberal society" at large than that it is for homosexuality. Like a previous poster noted, why would someone promoting a gay lifestyle say that it is something to use only in some circumstances? Now sin on the other hand is interpreted in many different ways. Lust is a big positive for those that frequent underground sex clubs, but not so much for the majority of society. However if you have lustful thoughts about your spouse than it is deemed acceptable even if the urges are the same.

 

Another reason a power is not analogous to homosexuality from a gay person's point of view would be that a power (while perhaps inherent to the person) can be used or not used in most (if not all, depending on the power) circumstances. Whereas most gay people would argue that it's not something they have any ability (or should have any need) to control. So if it's a pro-gay agenda than this is not very analogous at all.

 

In any case, I believe there's no hidden agenda, or hidden analogy at all. It's just a story about being ashamed and being healed through love.

The reason why a sin like lust is a poor simile for Elsa's superpower is that the ability to instantaneously freeze things is not an inherently evil power. I'm sure the Lord Himself actually does possess the knowledge and power to be able freeze things instantaneously, but He would never misuse that power. Unlike the power to instantaneously freeze, sins like lust are not morally neutral. You seem to think that lust is a positive in marriage, but Jeffery R. Holland would beg to disagree with you:

Why is lust such a deadly sin? Well, in addition to the completely Spirit-destroying impact it has upon our souls, I think it is a sin because it defiles the highest and holiest relationship God gives us in mortality—the love that a man and a woman have for each other and the desire that couple has to bring children into a family intended to be forever. Someone said once that true love must include the idea of permanence. True love endures. But lust changes as quickly as it can turn a pornographic page or glance at yet another potential object for gratification walking by, male or female. True love we are absolutely giddy about—as I am about Sister Holland; we shout it from the housetops. But lust is characterized by shame and stealth and is almost pathologically clandestine—the later and darker the hour the better, with a double-bolted door just in case. Love makes us instinctively reach out to God and other people. Lust, on the other hand, is anything but godly and celebrates self-indulgence. Love comes with open hands and open heart; lust comes with only an open appetite. (Jeffery R. Holland, April 2010 General Conference)

 

Wholesome passion reserved for one's one-and-only and lust are not the same thing.

[rlds_coc_lds]

sins like lust are not morally neutral. You seem to think that lust is a positive in marriage

 

I didn't say positive, I said acceptable. Again, it's dependent on who you talk to. Of course, coming from the position of a member of the LDS church, lust is not positive. But there are plenty of people in the world who have no problem with the idea of lusting after their wife. And some people may not see the difference between lust and passion.

 

Now, it seems to me that your disagreement with my analogy based on me saying sin could be seen in a less than evil light by some and not by others is disingenuous, unless we accept that homosexuality is morally neutral as well. Some would say yes, some would say no, exactly like some would say yes, some would say no for lust.