Epidemic Of Pornography Foretold In D&c 45:31

[Joseph Antley]

Last night I attended a fireside at BYU by Mark Kastleman, one of the co-founders of Candeo and the author of several books. What really struck me was something Kastleman said President Gordon B. Hinckley said at a training meeting for mission presidents. He said that President Hinckley said that the the "overflowing scourge" and "desolating sickness" prophesied of in D&C 45:31 is pornography in the modern world.

"And there shall be men standing in that generation, that shall not pass until they shall see an overflowing scourge; for a desolating sickness shall cover the land. But my disciples shall stand in holy places, and shall not be moved" (D&C 45:31-32).

I found this very interesting.

[Kollow]

Certainly sounds like a description of pornography to me. I spent a couple years at the SLC Library as a security guard in my early twenties. 80% of my job was to catch people viewing porn on the public library computers. I caught men looking at porn in the childrens section of the library. I caught young boys looking at the some of the most discusting hardcore porn imaginable, and married men looking at gay porn and all of this in public place where anyone could see you surfing for porn. Somedays that's all I did was kick men off the computer for looking at porn.

[jadams_4242]

Certainly sounds like a description of pornography to me. I spent a couple years at the SLC Library as a security guard in my early twenties. 80% of my job was to catch people viewing porn on the public library computers. I caught men looking at porn in the childrens section of the library. I caught young boys looking at the some of the most discusting hardcore porn imaginable, and married men looking at gay porn and all of this in public place where anyone could see you surfing for porn. Somedays that's all I did was kick men off the computer for looking at porn.

Dallin H Oaks has spoken extensively on this subject the last four years or so. and i heard that the statistics are about 50 percent of male members view some form of it regularly. {which if true is very disturbing in itself}.

[MorningStar]

Certainly sounds like a description of pornography to me. I spent a couple years at the SLC Library as a security guard in my early twenties. 80% of my job was to catch people viewing porn on the public library computers. I caught men looking at porn in the childrens section of the library. I caught young boys looking at the some of the most discusting hardcore porn imaginable, and married men looking at gay porn and all of this in public place where anyone could see you surfing for porn. Somedays that's all I did was kick men off the computer for looking at porn.

That must've been really awkward. Did any of them ever come back again after you caught them?

[abqfriend]

I respected Gordon B. Hinckley very much-thanks for sharing his words.

We now have all kinds of Porn-unfortunately.

-Carol

Last night I attended a fireside at BYU by Mark Kastleman, one of the co-founders of Candeo and the author of several books. What really struck me was something Kastleman said President Gordon B. Hinckley said at a training meeting for mission presidents. He said that President Hinckley said that the the "overflowing scourge" and "desolating sickness" prophesied of in D&C 45:31 is pornography in the modern world.

"And there shall be men standing in that generation, that shall not pass until they shall see an overflowing scourge; for a desolating sickness shall cover the land. But my disciples shall stand in holy places, and shall not be moved" (D&C 45:31-32).

I found this very interesting.

[BCSpace]

Certainly sounds like a description of pornography to me. I spent a couple years at the SLC Library as a security guard in my early twenties. 80% of my job was to catch people viewing porn on the public library computers. I caught men looking at porn in the childrens section of the library. I caught young boys looking at the some of the most discusting hardcore porn imaginable, and married men looking at gay porn and all of this in public place where anyone could see you surfing for porn. Somedays that's all I did was kick men off the computer for looking at porn.

I've heard of instances of people winning the "right" to view porn in public libraries right out in the open. This was long ago and in another state. What's the latest word in this? Is it allowed in your state/locality?

[Kollow]

That must've been really awkward. Did any of them ever come back again after you caught them?

Some came back but most of the men I had never seen before.

[Kollow]

I've heard of instances of people winning the "right" to view porn in public libraries right out in the open. This was long ago and in another state. What's the latest word in this? Is it allowed in your state/locality?

It wasn't allowed when I worked there but that was back in 2001. I'm pretty sure it's still not allowed though.

[Paddy]

"... they shall see an overflowing scourge; for a desolating sickness shall cover the land. .

Joseph

If this is talking about pornography, what do you believe are the social and/or spiritual "sicknesses" that will come as a result...?

P

[pcarthew]

Last night I attended a fireside at BYU by Mark Kastleman, one of the co-founders of Candeo and the author of several books. What really struck me was something Kastleman said President Gordon B. Hinckley said at a training meeting for mission presidents. He said that President Hinckley said that the the "overflowing scourge" and "desolating sickness" prophesied of in D&C 45:31 is pornography in the modern world.

"And there shall be men standing in that generation, that shall not pass until they shall see an overflowing scourge; for a desolating sickness shall cover the land. But my disciples shall stand in holy places, and shall not be moved" (D&C 45:31-32).

I found this very interesting.

Very interesting. I have sat in many disciplinary proceedings over the years and I would guess that nearly 90% had a very sad and tragic tale to tell about pornography. I have seen it destroy both women and men and wreck families. It is insidious, it is literally a "desolating sickness" as you so correctly point out. There are scriptures that also use the words "filthy dreamers" I would assume that has also reference to pornography. I have in the past 2 years seen an unprecedented occurrence of pornography addiction amongst women in my stake, which has lead to tragic consequences. So very sad....!

[kamenraider]

Isaiah 28:15-18

15 Because ye have said, We have made a covenant with death, and with hell are we at agreement; when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, it shall not come unto us: for we have made lies our refuge, and under falsehood have we hid ourselves:

16

[Bill “Papa” Lee]

Last night I attended a fireside at BYU by Mark Kastleman, one of the co-founders of Candeo and the author of several books. What really struck me was something Kastleman said President Gordon B. Hinckley said at a training meeting for mission presidents. He said that President Hinckley said that the the "overflowing scourge" and "desolating sickness" prophesied of in D&C 45:31 is pornography in the modern world.

"And there shall be men standing in that generation, that shall not pass until they shall see an overflowing scourge; for a desolating sickness shall cover the land. But my disciples shall stand in holy places, and shall not be moved" (D&C 45:31-32).

I found this very interesting.

My duties as Spam Buster have been put to the test lately. It is "Every man's battle", and in this day and age not just men it is gaining much popularity in the female world as well

[LeSellers]

My duties as Spam Buster have been put to the test lately.

Thank you for your work.

Lehi

[katherine the great]

Last night I attended a fireside at BYU by Mark Kastleman, one of the co-founders of Candeo and the author of several books. What really struck me was something Kastleman said President Gordon B. Hinckley said at a training meeting for mission presidents. He said that President Hinckley said that the the "overflowing scourge" and "desolating sickness" prophesied of in D&C 45:31 is pornography in the modern world."And there shall be men standing in that generation, that shall not pass until they shall see an overflowing scourge; for a desolating sickness shall cover the land. But my disciples shall stand in holy places, and shall not be moved" (D&C 45:31-32).I found this very interesting.

That is an interesting interpretation. I had always interpreted this as meaning some kind of contagious venereal disease or plague. I suppose addiction to porn makes even more sense as it is a disease of the spirit that can (and is) resisted by the righteous.

Very interesting. I have sat in many disciplinary proceedings over the years and I would guess that nearly 90% had a very sad and tragic tale to tell about pornography. I have seen it destroy both women and men and wreck families. It is insidious, it is literally a "desolating sickness" as you so correctly point out. There are scriptures that also use the words "filthy dreamers" I would assume that has also reference to pornography. I have in the past 2 years seen an unprecedented occurrence of pornography addiction amongst women in my stake, which has lead to tragic consequences. So very sad....!

It's really hard for me to believe that women can become addicted to porn, but apparently it does happen.

[Black Moclips]

This scripture is way to vague and general. It could refer to just about anything. Since porn is a hot topic, it just happens to be about that. It could just as easily be referring to consumer debt, which I find to be more "desolating" than porn. Not to mention it is a second hand account of what someone supposeably said. There are lots of bigger problems in the world.

[katherine the great]

This scripture is way to vague and general. It could refer to just about anything. Since porn is a hot topic, it just happens to be about that. It could just as easily be referring to consumer debt, which I find to be more "desolating" than porn. Not to mention it is a second hand account of what someone supposeably said. There are lots of bigger problems in the world.

I suppose that anything that enslaves you could be considered desolating.

[Black Moclips]

I suppose that anything that enslaves you could be considered desolating.

True, but I think the whole porn thing is overblown because its something "new" so to speak. I sort of view it like alcohol. In the extreme, alcohol can be "enslaving". Almost everyone I know outside the church drinks alcohol. But most are not drunks. They drink casually here and there, but it doesn't rule there lives by any means. Its just a way to relax and have fun, and they do it responsibly. However, the church strategy for such things is to demonize it in such a way (usually for the youth) that if you do it once or twice, you are on the verge of obssession and addiction and your life will be destroyed. While that may work to scare youth away from such things, in real life, it just isnt' the case. Sure, there are people that become alcoholics. But most people do not.

I think its the same thing with pornography. People may browse the internet occasionally or catch a move while out of town traveling. But most aren't the porn obsessed freaks they talk about in church. Sure, it can ruin your life in the extreme, but for a majority of people, its a simple entertainment that doesn't get any worse than that. Several of my friends wives don't care at all if they look at porn. And guess what, they aren't 24/7 porn consuming freaks.

[Nofear]

True, but I think the whole porn thing is overblown â?¦ I think its the same thing with pornography. People may browse the internet occasionally or catch a move while out of town traveling. But most aren't the porn obsessed freaks they talk about in church. Sure, it can ruin your life in the extreme, but for a majority of people, its a simple entertainment that doesn't get any worse than that. Several of my friends wives don't care at all if they look at porn. And guess what, they aren't 24/7 porn consuming freaks.

Not every one who caught the pig-flu died.

Not every one who drives drunk gets in an accident.

Not every divorce horribly scars the children.

etc.

The point being, just because not every one who partakes of pornography is ruined by addiction, doesn't make it a societal problem that merits limiting laws or outright prohibition. Granted, you didn't say pornography is tolerable - but I thought I'd point out that laws often have to be measured against the population as a whole and not the "strongest" of them.

[cinepro]

Last night I attended a fireside at BYU by Mark Kastleman, one of the co-founders of Candeo and the author of several books. What really struck me was something Kastleman said President Gordon B. Hinckley said at a training meeting for mission presidents. He said that President Hinckley said that the the "overflowing scourge" and "desolating sickness" prophesied of in D&C 45:31 is pornography in the modern world."And there shall be men standing in that generation, that shall not pass until they shall see an overflowing scourge; for a desolating sickness shall cover the land. But my disciples shall stand in holy places, and shall not be moved" (D&C 45:31-32).I found this very interesting.

I think it may be appropriate to call pornography an "overflowing scourge" and "desolating sickness", but I'm not so sure it makes sense to say that that was what the Lord was specifically thinking when he revealed that verse. Also, what does it mean when it says that the men "shall not pass"?

Also, if the claims in this thread are accurate, then the idea that the Lord's disciples will "stand in holy places, and shall not be moved" is a false prophecy, since pornography is apparently moving a great many of the "disciples".

And I guess the good Brother Kastleman didn't get the memo about spreading around GA comments from non-general meetings.

Not every one who caught the pig-flu died.Not every one who drives drunk gets in an accident.Not every divorce horribly scars the children.etc.The point being, just because not every one who partakes of pornography is ruined by addiction, doesn't make it a societal problem that merits limiting laws or outright prohibition. Granted, you didn't say pornography is tolerable - but I thought I'd point out that laws often have to be measured against the population as a whole and not the "strongest" of them.

Interesting point. I wonder if the Lord cares more about same-sex marriage than pornography...

[Bond...James Bond]

I have in the past 2 years seen an unprecedented occurrence of pornography addiction amongst women in my stake, which has lead to tragic consequences. So very sad....!

Husbands not up to the task?

Certainly sounds like a description of pornography to me.

Sounds incredibly incredibly vague to me. Didn't see anything in that dealing with sex or porn.

I spent a couple years at the SLC Library as a security guard in my early twenties. 80% of my job was to catch people viewing porn on the public library computers. I caught men looking at porn in the childrens section of the library. I caught young boys looking at the some of the most discusting hardcore porn imaginable, and married men looking at gay porn and all of this in public place where anyone could see you surfing for porn. Somedays that's all I did was kick men off the computer for looking at porn.

How do you know what the "most discusting [sic] hardcore porn imaginable" looks like?

[Joseph Antley]

Also, what does it mean when it says that the men "shall not pass"?

I'm pretty sure it means that they would not die.

Also, if the claims in this thread are accurate, then the idea that the Lord's disciples will "stand in holy places, and shall not be moved" is a false prophecy, since pornography is apparently moving a great many of the "disciples".

I disagree. I would guess that though the scourge of pornography is less prevalent among Latter-day Saints than non-Latter-day Saints, even if it is too prevalent for comfort among us. And I think the majority of Latter-day Saints are indeed standing in holy places.

And I guess the good Brother Kastleman didn't get the memo about spreading around GA comments from non-general meetings.

I didn't get it either. Who gave it to you?

[bethabara]

Last night I attended a fireside at BYU by Mark Kastleman, one of the co-founders of Candeo and the author of several books. What really struck me was something Kastleman said President Gordon B. Hinckley said at a training meeting for mission presidents. He said that President Hinckley said that the the "overflowing scourge" and "desolating sickness" prophesied of in D&C 45:31 is pornography in the modern world.

"And there shall be men standing in that generation, that shall not pass until they shall see an overflowing scourge; for a desolating sickness shall cover the land. But my disciples shall stand in holy places, and shall not be moved" (D&C 45:31-32).

I found this very interesting.

I came upon this quote while preparing to speak in Sacrament Meeting this past Sunday.

â??If you cross to the devilâ??s side of the line one inch, you are in the tempterâ??s power, and if he is successful, you will not be able to think or even reason properly, because you will have lost the spirit of the Lord.â? Sharing the Gospel with Others, ed. Preston Nibley (1948), 43.

There are so many evil things that fit this bill, but pornography is perhaps the worst.

[Bond...James Bond]

I would guess that though the scourge of pornography is less prevalent among Latter-day Saints than non-Latter-day Saints, even if it is too prevalent for comfort among us. And I think the majority of Latter-day Saints are indeed standing in holy places.

How would you know? Do you check a majority of LDS folks internet history for porn?

[cinepro]

I didn't get it either. Who gave it to you?

If you're referring to the memo, I believe it was a letter read in Sacrament meeting, and reiterated with the latest hubbub over Elder Packer's recent remarks in a F&T meeting:

From time to time statements are circulated among members which are inaccurately attributed to the leaders of the Church. Many such statements distort current Church teachings and are often based on rumors and innuendos. They are never transmitted officially, but by word of mouth, e-mail, or other informal means.

We encourage members of the Church to never teach or pass on such statements without verifying that they are from approved Church sources, such as official statements, communications, and publications. Any notes made when General Authorities, Area Authority Seventies, or other general Church officers speak at regional and stake conferences or other meetings should not be distributed without the consent of the speaker. Personal notes are for individual use only.

True spiritual growth is based on studying the scriptures, the teachings of the Brethren, and Church publications.

http://www.fairblog.org/2008/10/20/talk-by...ker-goes-viral/

While I understand the danger of members of the Church listening to the ideas and claims of non-leaders, I find it hilarious that we are now at the point that we are being told not to listen to the leaders themselves unless certain preconditions are met.

[Tchild2]

While I understand the danger of members of the Church listening to the ideas and claims of non-leaders, I find it hilarious that we are now at the point that we are being told not to listen to the leaders themselves unless certain preconditions are met.

Maybe it isn't pornography at all, but fallability that is the scourge; the fallability and preponderance to excessively add "opinions of men" by God's chosen leaders. If you have to have a litmus test of reliability for God's leaders, then who can you trust?