Final Destination

[Stargazer]

12 minutes ago, Dario_M said:

So basically you can watch what you want without commiting a sin?

That's my view. Others may differ.

Your original question dealt with watching horror films. I've not watched any of the Final Destination film series, nor am I interested in doing so, but I don't think they deal in anything other than horror. But there is a special case when it comes to pornography. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints takes a dim view of members viewing pornography, as do I. President Dallin Oaks gave an entire general conference talk about the subject in 2005 -- read or watch his talk here: Pornography

A salient point he brought up, I'll quote a bit here:

"In the second chapter of the book that bears his name, Jacob condemns men for their “whoredoms” (Jacob 2:23, 28). He told them they had “broken the hearts of [their] tender wives, and lost the confidence of [their] children, because of [their] bad examples before them” (Jacob 2:35).

"What were these grossly wicked “whoredoms”? No doubt some men were already guilty of evil acts. But the main focus of Jacob’s great sermon was not with evil acts completed, but with evil acts contemplated.

"Jacob began his sermon by telling the men that “as yet, [they had] been obedient unto the word of the Lord” (Jacob 2:4). However, he then told them he knew their thoughts, that they were “beginning to labor in sin, which sin appeareth very abominable … unto God” (Jacob 2:5). “I must testify unto you concerning the wickedness of your hearts” (Jacob 2:6), he added. Jacob was speaking as Jesus spoke when He said, “Whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart” (Matt. 5:28; see also 3 Ne. 12:28; D&C 59:6; D&C 63:16). -- some emphasis in original

I don't think that the prophet Jacob, nor Jesus when he said the same thing, were saying that committing adultery in one's heart was the same as actually committing adultery in real life. If this were the case, how many of us could honestly answer the temple recommend question "Do you keep the law of chastity?" with a "Yes"? 

But regardless, it is not conducive to maintaining the presence of the Holy Ghost in our lives if we are participating in pornography -- this is because the procreative drive is so strong in us, much stronger than the drive for robbing banks and murdering people. 

One of my favorite scriptures is this one (D&C 121:45,46):

45 Let thy bowels also be full of charity towards all men, and to the household of faith, and let virtue garnish thy thoughts unceasingly; then shall thy confidence wax strong in the presence of God; and the doctrine of the priesthood shall distil upon thy soul as the dews from heaven.
46 The Holy Ghost shall be thy constant companion, and thy scepter an unchanging scepter of righteousness and truth; and thy dominion shall be an everlasting dominion, and without compulsory means it shall flow unto thee forever and ever.

It is hard for virtue to garnish one's thoughts in the face of pornography. Much harder than other kinds of thoughts.

 

 

 

[Dario_M]

38 minutes ago, Stargazer said:

That's my view. Others may differ.

Your original question dealt with watching horror films. I've not watched any of the Final Destination film series, nor am I interested in doing so, but I don't think they deal in anything other than horror. But there is a special case when it comes to pornography. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints takes a dim view of members viewing pornography, as do I. President Dallin Oaks gave an entire general conference talk about the subject in 2005 -- read or watch his talk here: Pornography

 

This is TMI maybe but i've also watched some pornographic matters these days. Me and my partner are easy with that.

I knew that watching porn is absolutely against the law of chastity. But sometimes it's hard to resist it.

38 minutes ago, Stargazer said:

A salient point he brought up, I'll quote a bit here:

"In the second chapter of the book that bears his name, Jacob condemns men for their “whoredoms” (Jacob 2:23, 28). He told them they had “broken the hearts of [their] tender wives, and lost the confidence of [their] children, because of [their] bad examples before them” (Jacob 2:35).

This is from the Book of Mormon. It's nearly 2 years ago that i read the book of Mormon. So....what does this scripture means?

38 minutes ago, Stargazer said:

"What were these grossly wicked “whoredoms”? No doubt some men were already guilty of evil acts. But the main focus of Jacob’s great sermon was not with evil acts completed, but with evil acts contemplated.

"Jacob began his sermon by telling the men that “as yet, [they had] been obedient unto the word of the Lord” (Jacob 2:4). However, he then told them he knew their thoughts, that they were “beginning to labor in sin, which sin appeareth very abominable … unto God” (Jacob 2:5). “I must testify unto you concerning the wickedness of your hearts” (Jacob 2:6), he added. Jacob was speaking as Jesus spoke when He said, “Whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart” (Matt. 5:28; see also 3 Ne. 12:28; D&C 59:6; D&C 63:16). -- some emphasis in original

I don't think that the prophet Jacob, nor Jesus when he said the same thing, were saying that committing adultery in one's heart was the same as actually committing adultery in real life. If this were the case, how many of us could honestly answer the temple recommend question "Do you keep the law of chastity?" with a "Yes"? 

Well i can honestly say that i've not really kept the law of chastity in honor. But that's a really difficult one for me. I have a bf and we are not even married and sometimes we have sex. 

38 minutes ago, Stargazer said:

But regardless, it is not conducive to maintaining the presence of the Holy Ghost in our lives if we are participating in pornography -- this is because the procreative drive is so strong in us, much stronger than the drive for robbing banks and murdering people. 

Yeah make sense.

38 minutes ago, Stargazer said:

 

It is hard for virtue to garnish one's thoughts in the face of pornography. Much harder than other kinds of thoughts.

 

 

 

Yeah the law of chastity is a really difficult one. Way more difficult then the other 10 commitments. Especially when you're gay. 

Edited August 26, 2024 by Dario_M

[Calm]

4 hours ago, Dario_M said:

There is also an American detective show that isn't so tough to watch as well. And old one i know. But i've forgetton the name of the series. The detective is an sweet old lady who works mostely in the area of Boston and she try's to solve crime casus. 

I wish i knew the name of the serie. I'm going to search it op. Give me a sec- 

Edit i've searched it with help from my partner. "Murder She Wrote" do you also watch that Calm? 😌

I was a devoted fan when it first came out and for the reruns, but haven’t watched it in some time. Fun show.  Very predictable but good characters. 

[Calm]

56 minutes ago, Dario_M said:

Yeah the law of chastity is a really difficult one. Way more difficult then the other 10 commitments. Especially when you're gay. 

I assume you know the Church’s teachings on that, so this is something you will need to resolve for yourself by seeking the spirit out and following the path it directs you down, whatever that might be for you.  God may inspire others to counsel you, but you have the right to determine what God wants for you yourself.

[Calm]

4 hours ago, Dario_M said:

Oh how horible must that been. Is it a heart condition?

Something is likely off in the central nervous system, which explains why there is such a variety of symptoms that can happen with it.  I have got a great doctor and he is working on getting me treatment for my back pain so I can stay active enough to manage the rest. 

[Calm]

2 hours ago, Stargazer said:

Have you watched The Squid Game?

I have tried. Too much suspense for me. 

I have seen many of the actors in other shows and liked them so I wish I could. Shows that are based on fatal competitions that bring out the worst in people are difficult for me to watch. I can manage evil and conflict when it is not on the screen most of the time, when you see the good guys working together or alone for a good cause, but I find suffering for no other purpose but the entertainment of others even if fake uninteresting and hard to watch. I like to see people fighting it, but they have to be mostly successful. Haven’t seen the Hunger Games either. Dystopias are depressing to me. I prefer a view of a decent future for mankind. I will watch them, just may skip over the parts where the elite abuse the poor and take great pleasure in it.  I haven’t been able to watch as much science fiction these days because so much of it is about a hopeless world.  
 

[Dario_M]

34 minutes ago, Calm said:

I was a devoted fan when it first came out and for the reruns, but haven’t watched it in some time. Fun show.  Very predictable but good characters. 

Yeah when i was young i also loved watching that. 🩵

[Dario_M]

32 minutes ago, Calm said:

I assume you know the Church’s teachings on that, so this is something you will need to resolve for yourself by seeking the spirit out and following the path it directs you down, whatever that might be for you.  God may inspire others to counsel you, but you have the right to determine what God wants for you yourself.

I need to pray. That God will allow it that me and my bf may stay together. On this moment i have nobody else in my life. All my family has abandoned me. 

If i marry with my bf at least that may be in the eyes of god a good thing. And in his eyes that i follow the law of chastity again. 

Edited August 26, 2024 by Dario_M

[Calm]

2 hours ago, Dario_M said:

As long as i don't do the same things that the people do in those movie then it's all fine. Got you.

I think it’s important to not get to a point where you wish you could do any of the sins or act out the evil that is shown as well. 

If you feel a show made you want to be a better person or doesn’t have an effect on you, then why be concerned (but be honest to yourself about the effect), but if you see the film making you think or feel doing evil could be fun and satisfying, you might want to skip it. 

Even a fun and upbeat show that shows people living a great life and doing good things might need to be avoided by someone who gets jealous about that great life and angry because they can’t have it rather than just enjoys watching others have fun or imagines oneself having that fun, but doesn’t get upset all they can do is imagine it. 
 

Like if the fantasy shows made me feel that real life was boring and not of much value and that humans around me weren’t worth much because they weren’t as interesting or as good looking as the ones in the shows, it would be a good idea for me to avoid them.  

Thankfully they are only fun for me, I am not the kind of person who gets envious…except on the rare occasion I see a perfect beachfront house as I have always dreamed of living on the beach…and it ain’t going to happen.  I probably shouldn’t watch the reality shows that take you to rich homes because that can make me unhappy with my own home and not being able to afford fixing it up just the way I want it. 

Edited August 26, 2024 by Calm

[Dario_M]

28 minutes ago, Calm said:

Something is likely off in the central nervous system, which explains why there is such a variety of symptoms that can happen with it.  I have got a great doctor and he is working on getting me treatment for my back pain so I can stay active enough to manage the rest. 

Oh how unfortunate must that be for you. 😓

[Dario_M]

14 minutes ago, Calm said:

I think it’s important to not get to a point where you wish you could do any evil that is shown as well. 

Yeah and i can remember bevore i was a mormon that i wish i could be somebody that had power to rule the world. But i don't think that came from a movie. That just a fantasy i had because i wanted to have controle about everything. Wich i didn't had obviously. I always felt powerless and helpless. 

14 minutes ago, Calm said:

If you feel a show made you want to be a better person or doesn’t have an effect on you, then why be concerned (but be honest to yourself about the effect), but if you see the film making you think or feel doing evil could be fun and satisfying, you might want to skip it. 

Yeah i see. That's a good idea indeed. Otherwise i will commit a sin. 

14 minutes ago, Calm said:

Even a fun and upbeat show that shows people living a great life and doing good things might need to be avoided by someone who gets jealous about that great life and angry because they can’t have it

Yup. Also guilty of that haha.

14 minutes ago, Calm said:

rather than just enjoys watching others have fun or imagines oneself having that fun, but doesn’t get upset all they can do is imagine it. 

That's exatly how the most mormon people are. They enjoy others being happy. They wanna see you happy as well. And they don't get upset if someone has more money, succes etc in life. 

You're also like that dear Calm i find. 🩵

Edited August 26, 2024 by Dario_M

[manol]

13 hours ago, Dario_M said:

Really? You don't like revenge movies?

I used to.  But outrage and vengefulness are no longer states of mind that I enjoy.  They don't feel good to me. 

6 hours ago, Stargazer said:

I'd say that watching or not watching a movie doesn't constitute a sin. It's important to realize what a sin is. In my view, a sin is doing a willful act that is contrary to God's commandments. So watching a movie or seeing a photo doesn't in itself constitute a sin. There's no commandment that covers it. Is it a sin to watch a film that portrays a bank robbery? The answer is obviously "No."  How about a murder? How can it be?

The possible problem with watching a film or viewing photographs that cause thoughts or desires to arise in our minds is that this can possibly lead us closer to performing willful acts that are contrary to God's laws. It is said that the easiest way to avoid falling off a cliff is to stay far away from that cliff's edge. Does watching a film about a sinful act make it easier for you to commit that sin yourself? If so, then you should avoid watching it. If not, then what's the problem?

I avoid watching horror films because I dislike them intensely. Others love them, for some reason. Whatever.

I pretty much agree with what @Stargazer is saying here.  My personal emphasis is more on which thoughts I allow or invite to occupy my mind. 

In my opinion, there is a cause-and-effect relationship between our thoughts and our actions.  Our thoughts are the cause and our actions are the effect.  Forcing one's actions to be at odds with one's thoughts can be done but often requires enormous effort, and the result tends to be inner conflict instead of inner peace because the part of the mind that wants something different is furious at being denied what it wants.

So in my opinion the real "battleground" is our thoughts, and my assumption is that we do have the ability to deliberately re-direct our thoughts.  My simplistic analogy is that the mind is like a radio which can be "tuned in" to a low station where negative thoughts like hate, outrage, fear, and despair occupy our awareness; or it can be "tuned in" to a high station where love, forgiveness, kindness, and even the Presence of the Holy Spirit occupy our awareness.  

So when you went to church, you were tuning in your "radio" to a high station.  Imo that "station" can be tuned-in to without being physically present in church, maybe not as easily or as strongly, but it still can be tuned-in to.  And I think that happens largely in the part of our mind where we are able to exercise conscious control. 

Anyway for me personally (not saying this applies to anyone else), what movies I watch seems to have an effect on what sort of station my "radio" is tuned-in to.  I can of course choose to deliberately "change the station", but I still don't really enjoy spending time tuned-in to what feels to me like an overall "negative energy" station. 

Edited August 26, 2024 by manol

[manol]

Oops double post ("quoted" when I meant to "edit")

Edited August 26, 2024 by manol

[Tacenda]

4 hours ago, Calm said:

Something is likely off in the central nervous system, which explains why there is such a variety of symptoms that can happen with it.  I have got a great doctor and he is working on getting me treatment for my back pain so I can stay active enough to manage the rest. 

Hugs to you Calm, I hope you get some help. 

[Calm]

6 hours ago, Tacenda said:

Hugs to you Calm, I hope you get some help. 

Send me some prayers on Thursday that my miracle will last longer this time, please.  The previous back procedure lasted 6 months and now that it is wearing off I can tell what a dramatic difference it made for me.  The relief from pain was fantastic, but it did much more than just that. 

This one I am getting on Thursday  is supposed to be even more effective and lasting.

And throw in some prayers to soften the hearts of the insurance people so I can get it done for my upper back too.  That would be bliss. 

Edited August 27, 2024 by Calm

[The Nehor]

I like my violence ugly and messy. The best war movies make me feel depressed afterwards. I think the “clean” violence of movies is more likely to encourage people to be violent than a more realistic take would. I am not worried as much about people being desensitized to violence than I am the idea that clean and “heroic” violence will be lauded and encouraged.

[Dario_M]

35 minutes ago, The Nehor said:

I like my violence ugly and messy. The best war movies make me feel depressed afterwards. I think the “clean” violence of movies is more likely to encourage people to be violent than a more realistic take would. I am not worried as much about people being desensitized to violence than I am the idea that clean and “heroic” violence will be lauded and encouraged.

What exactly do you mean with clean violence if i may be so free to ask? 

[The Nehor]

7 minutes ago, Dario_M said:

What exactly do you mean with clean violence if i may be so free to ask? 

War movies where people are killed cleanly and without any mess is probably the most egregious example.

I worry much less about actual cartoons and things that are meant to be ridiculous and unrealistic.

[Dario_M]

12 minutes ago, The Nehor said:

War movies where people are killed cleanly and without any mess is probably the most egregious example.

But is it not so that killing people always gives a mess? Or do you mean with "clean killing" that people get poisoned or so?

12 minutes ago, The Nehor said:

I worry much less about actual cartoons and things that are meant to be ridiculous and unrealistic.

True. But when it gets realistic it always gets tougher to watch i find. I believe it's actually possible that it can give some people ptsd. 

Edited August 27, 2024 by Dario_M

[Calm]

1 hour ago, The Nehor said:

I like my violence ugly and messy. The best war movies make me feel depressed afterwards. I think the “clean” violence of movies is more likely to encourage people to be violent than a more realistic take would. I am not worried as much about people being desensitized to violence than I am the idea that clean and “heroic” violence will be lauded and encouraged.

I still have guns change into hands going pow pow and hurting no one in my dreams, so the squeaky clean violence I have been watching hasn’t turned me psycho yet.  

[Tacenda]

On 8/26/2024 at 6:04 PM, Calm said:

Send me some prayers on Thursday that my miracle will last longer this time, please.  The previous back procedure lasted 6 months and now that it is wearing off I can tell what a dramatic difference it made for me.  The relief from pain was fantastic, but it did much more than just that. 

This one I am getting on Thursday  is supposed to be even more effective and lasting.

And throw in some prayers to soften the hearts of the insurance people so I can get it done for my upper back too.  That would be bliss. 

You'll be in my prayers for sure,  hopefully I won't jinx it!  🙏

[Dario_M]

Oh my... me and my partner......we have watched 3 movies so far and they were all 3 so bad. Just rubish. Such waste of time. In all this time i could have readed some scriptures and spend my time in a beter way.  

 

Edited August 30, 2024 by Dario_M

[Stargazer]

On 8/27/2024 at 6:13 AM, Dario_M said:

What exactly do you mean with clean violence if i may be so free to ask? 

I think he means graphic violence. If you watch the classic D-day movie, "The Longest Day," you will see soldiers getting shot, being hit by shrapnel, and they simply fall down. Sometimes they are wounded and express their pain, but partly due to the film being in black and white, the deaths are rather "clean." But if you watch a more modern one, such as "Saving Private Ryan," the deaths are very graphic and bloody. And in full color.

 

[Dario_M]

53 minutes ago, Stargazer said:

I think he means graphic violence. If you watch the classic D-day movie, "The Longest Day," you will see soldiers getting shot, being hit by shrapnel, and they simply fall down. Sometimes they are wounded and express their pain, but partly due to the film being in black and white, the deaths are rather "clean." But if you watch a more modern one, such as "Saving Private Ryan," the deaths are very graphic and bloody. And in full color.

 

Yeah that is with all those movies from these days. So realistic possible. With much graphic. Nearly as if it's all real. 💀

[Stargazer]

11 minutes ago, Dario_M said:

Yeah that is with all those movies from these days. So realistic possible. With much graphic. Nearly as if it's all real. 💀

Some of the D-Day veterans who watched "Saving Private Ryan" were somewhat re-traumatized by the realism of the D-Day sequence.