Interfaith relationships

[poptart]

How often does this happen in LDS circles?  Was thinking the other day how my first GF was LDS.  She was from Japan so it wasn't quite the same as dating someone from Zion (or so i've been told.) 

Are they as annoying as some Catholics who insist on going to mass, no birth control, the kids being raised Catholic etc.  Hate to sound mean, that's just been what i've seen so I'm curious about the LDS experience.  Can't think of a better place to ask.

[Jane_Doe]

I'm an LDS Christian lady married to a Protestant Christian dude.

Ok, so I'm going to break your OP down into different questions: 

-- How do these relationships come to?  I actually added this question, because it's important.  You'll get interfaith marriages lots of different ways.  You could have a couple that gets married when both are active in different faiths.  You can have couples where they were the same faith (LDS Christian or not) and one later converts to a different faith.  You can have one or both people be inactive in a old faith, and later reactivate.  And so many other ways.

--How often does this happen?  It depends on where you're talking about, and the local LDS Christian population density.  In very high LDS Christian population areas, you'll get a much higher percentage of LDS-LDS marriages than in an area where there's very few LDS folks.  

-- How does it play out?   That really depends on family to family.  There's a lot of factor's going into it.      

 

Running with the example of my marriage/family: I'm an LDS Christian, he's a Protestant Christian.  Little girl is too young to have made her choice, but comes to church with me.  Hubby really dislikes going to any church so he usually stays home.  We don't have any conflicts over drinking or coffee or smoking because we are both anti that stuff.  Keeping Sunday's quiet he's actually more adamant about than me actually-- "Sunday is family day!".  We're in agreement on the functionality pretty much everything.  He'll occasionally come to a church event with me (like I'll drag him to the ward back-to-school picnic at the park in a few weeks here) and is... honestly he's ussually just bored, but goes to support me.  He's very supportive of my personal faith, and we talk about everything, and he actually talked me through lot of pre-endowment jitters.  He doesn't go to sealing-marriages in the family, but honestly if he had his way he'd ditch the entire wedding festivities just because he doesn't want to be social. 

As to our extended family: mine's completely chill with things, very supportive, ad most of the time pretty much forget he's not LDS.  He atheist dad actually harasses him about "son, you should go to church with your wife and have family time".   His Evangelical mom is ... very not supportive of the faith aspects of our marriage, but doesn't want to even think about it.   Rest of his extended family is chill-- faith doesn't really come up.

[poptart]

2 minutes ago, Jane_Doe said:

I'm an LDS Christian lady married to a Protestant Christian dude.

Ok, so I'm going to break your OP down into different questions: 

-- How do these relationships come to?  I actually added this question, because it's important.  You'll get interfaith marriages lots of different ways.  You could have a couple that gets married when both are active in different faiths.  You can have couples where they were the same faith (LDS Christian or not) and one later converts to a different faith.  You can have one or both people be inactive in a old faith, and later reactivate.  And so many other ways.

--How often does this happen?  It depends on where you're talking about, and the local LDS Christian population density.  In very high LDS Christian population areas, you'll get a much higher percentage of LDS-LDS marriages than in an area where there's very few LDS folks.  

-- How does it play out?   That really depends on family to family.  There's a lot of factor's going into it.      

 

Running with the example of my marriage/family: I'm an LDS Christian, he's a Protestant Christian.  Little girl is too young to have made her choice, but comes to church with me.  Hubby really dislikes going to any church so he usually stays home.  We don't have any conflicts over drinking or coffee or smoking because we are both anti that stuff.  Keeping Sunday's quiet he's actually more adamant about than me actually-- "Sunday is family day!".  We're in agreement on the functionality pretty much everything.  He'll occasionally come to a church event with me (like I'll drag him to the ward back-to-school picnic at the park in a few weeks here) and is... honestly he's ussually just bored, but goes to support me.  He's very supportive of my personal faith, and we talk about everything, and he actually talked me through lot of pre-endowment jitters.  He doesn't go to sealing-marriages in the family, but honestly if he had his way he'd ditch the entire wedding festivities just because he doesn't want to be social. 

As to our extended family: mine's completely chill with things, very supportive, ad most of the time pretty much forget he's not LDS.  He atheist dad actually harasses him about "son, you should go to church with your wife and have family time".   His Evangelical mom is ... very not supportive of the faith aspects of our marriage, but doesn't want to even think about it.   Rest of his extended family is chill-- faith doesn't really come up.

Yeah well you're one of the cool mormons, big suprise.  TBH, despite everything I've met more accomidating LDS folks than among other flavors of Christendom, save the Episcopals and Lutherans.  Also your ward BBQ's are awesome, who wouldn't go?

[rpn]

It is really tough to be a faithful member in a mixed faith relationship.   Non-members often don't want the encompassing commitment that members are used to and that is part of a members way they live their lives..   And members want to teach their children what they believe is the truth.    Such relationships often don't work unless the couple can establish and foster what they share, rather than how they are different.

[poptart]

1 hour ago, rpn said:

It is really tough to be a faithful member in a mixed faith relationship.   Non-members often don't want the encompassing commitment that members are used to and that is part of a members way they live their lives..   And members want to teach their children what they believe is the truth.    Such relationships often don't work unless the couple can establish and foster what they share, rather than how they are different.

Really, all I care about is having my space, not having my affairs meddled in and not having foreign beliefs pushed on me.  If kids happened, no problem with letting them be mormon, in fact i'd encourage it.  I'll give the LDS church this, they'd probably do a better job of teaching them how to live in society than I could, that and they'd grow up in something far more stable than I've ever known.  Anymore the LDS church is one of the few Christian based organizations that I think can pull it off, the rest are either way too liberal or dying. 

[rpn]

Most people would absolutely like to share their religious life with their spouse.   It is hard to go alone.    In the restored Church of Jesus Christ, birth control and number of children are up to couples and the Lord.  If a couple decides that includes contraceptives,, they are not violating any commandment (and they are supposed to make these decisions in concert with God).

And since I now know you are speaking about yourself, I can't imagine your choosing a partner who tells you what to do ---- just would not be what I'd imagine you'd see as a good fit.

[poptart]

I like space but can be reasonable.  Gripe I have is there really is no such thing as compromise, it's either all their way or no way at all.  That and I've been a bachelor for a while, one of those few who is just fine on his own.

[3DOP]

On 8/26/2019 at 10:44 AM, poptart said:

How often does this happen in LDS circles?  Was thinking the other day how my first GF was LDS.  She was from Japan so it wasn't quite the same as dating someone from Zion (or so i've been told.) 

Are they as annoying as some Catholics who insist on going to mass, no birth control, the kids being raised Catholic etc.  Hate to sound mean, that's just been what i've seen so I'm curious about the LDS experience.  Can't think of a better place to ask.

No way. Really? You have met Catholics like that and I am not related to them? They are not my friends? I thought I was an endangered species!!!

[poptart]

23 hours ago, 3DOP said:

No way. Really? You have met Catholics like that and I am not related to them? They are not my friends? I thought I was an endangered species!!!

Uh, what?

[3DOP]

24 minutes ago, poptart said:

Uh, what?

"Are they as annoying as some Catholics who insist on going to mass, no birth control, the kids being raised Catholic etc."

I am pleased Poptart, that you are familiar with "some Catholics who insist on going to mass, no birth control, the kids being raised Catholic etc." I thought we were very few and far between. In a way, if not for faith, I would think we are about to be extinct to look at Rome today and "Catholics" today. Tell me about "some Catholics...etc." Encourage me.

Edited August 30, 2019 by 3DOP

[poptart]

18 minutes ago, 3DOP said:

"Are they as annoying as some Catholics who insist on going to mass, no birth control, the kids being raised Catholic etc."

I am pleased Poptart, that you are familiar with "some Catholics who insist on going to mass, no birth control, the kids being raised Catholic etc." I thought we were very few and far between. In a way, if not for faith, I would think we are about to be extinct to look at Rome today and "Catholics" today. Tell me about "some Catholics...etc." Encourage me.

Either way, not my cup of tea.  I care for none of those things, find them foreign and rather foolish.  Then again, I don't believe in diety as you do so there's that.  On the bright side of things, wow are your people well dressed.  Also, the bling, I can appreciate that.  The flashy robes, music and all the other trappings alone make me like the Catholic church, everyone else seriously needs to step their game up.

 

[3DOP]

No picture...deleted on purpose

Edited August 30, 2019 by 3DOP

[3DOP]

1 hour ago, poptart said:

Either way, not my cup of tea.  I care for none of those things, find them foreign and rather foolish.  Then again, I don't believe in diety as you do so there's that.  On the bright side of things, wow are your people well dressed.  Also, the bling, I can appreciate that.  The flashy robes, music and all the other trappings alone make me like the Catholic church, everyone else seriously needs to step their game up.

 

What makes you think that these people in this picture are "some Catholics who insist on going to mass, no birth control, the kids being raised Catholic etc."? Are there any words to go along with the pictures? I hope you are correct and that is what they believe. Maybe I am being rash in thinking that they are like you. Maybe you are being rash in thinking that they are like me!

[poptart]

Uhh, Order of Malta?  Maybe?  I dunno.  All I know is they're made up of nobles and a lot of doctors and lawyers, also wow those vestments are sweeeet!  I wish I could be like them, I'd out swag em all.  Would so put up with some stuffy dude for an hour if I had a shot at being in and having those robes and title. 

Here's one type of Catholic I'm very fond of...

 

Edited August 30, 2019 by poptart

[poptart]

2 hours ago, 3DOP said:

"Are they as annoying as some Catholics who insist on going to mass, no birth control, the kids being raised Catholic etc."

I am pleased Poptart, that you are familiar with "some Catholics who insist on going to mass, no birth control, the kids being raised Catholic etc." I thought we were very few and far between. In a way, if not for faith, I would think we are about to be extinct to look at Rome today and "Catholics" today. Tell me about "some Catholics...etc." Encourage me.

Also these guys, wish they had em here. 

 

[3DOP]

17 hours ago, poptart said:

Uhh, Order of Malta?  Maybe?  I dunno.  All I know is they're made up of nobles and a lot of doctors and lawyers, also wow those vestments are sweeeet!  I wish I could be like them, I'd out swag em all.  Would so put up with some stuffy dude for an hour if I had a shot at being in and having those robes and title. 

Here's one type of Catholic I'm very fond of...

 

 

[3DOP]

Thank you for encouraging me, poptart.

However, you can not very successfully use the Knights of Malta as an example of "Catholics who insist on going to mass, no birth control, the kids being raised Catholic etc."?  Pope Francis did not mind, but conservatives and Traditionalists in the Church disapprove of the Knights because they have failed to uphold the Catholic teaching on birth control, and perhaps abortion too. You like their vestments? They seemed drab to me. They use the new liturgy. Now that IS drab.

"The scandal caused by the Knights of Malta distributing condoms through its charitable arm exploded publicly at the end of 2016. That’s when the Order’s Grand Master Fra’ Matthew Festing ordered Grand Chancellor Albrecht von Boeselager to resign from his position. It was Boeselager who oversaw MI and who was ultimately responsible for approving the projects that not only distributed condoms and contraceptive pills, but abortifacient pills as well. 

But Boeselager refused to step down, forcing Festing to exert his position to entirely remove him from the Order. 

Then, in a series of surprise moves, Pope Francis demanded that Festing resign from his position, which he did, and went on to reinstate the official dismissed for peddling contraception. The move was surprising given that the Knights of Malta is a sovereign entity and has no official connection to the Pope or the Vatican."

----https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/knights-of-malta-staff-defends-condoms-in-leaked-email-new-popepublicly-sta

You showed a Mass presided at by Bp. Bernard Tissier de Mallerais! Bravo. I do not speak German. Do you know what was the occasion? The three bishops of the Society of St. Pius X are so busy giving Confirmations around the world that I am guessing that is what this was. I believe he confirmed my son and my nephews and gave conditional Confirmations to my wife and I. I have been privileged to be seated next to his excellency at a dinner hosted by some friends, and I have spoken with him on other occasions. He is soft-spoken and kind, but very earnest and serious. He is French but has been living in Chicago for the last few years and at around 70, I think his English has improved. My son was in our seminary where Bp. Tissier has recently moved, and he has some amusing anecdotes about how the little man has a large presence about him that can make even an experienced priest a little nervous to make sure the ceremonies are done with precision. 

I guess I forgot about the Society of St. Pius X. Thanks for the reminder, heh.  

3DOP 

[poptart]

7 minutes ago, 3DOP said:

Thank you for encouraging me, poptart.

However, you can not very successfully use the Knights of Malta as an example of "Catholics who insist on going to mass, no birth control, the kids being raised Catholic etc."?  Pope Francis did not mind, but conservatives and Traditionalists in the Church disapprove of the Knights because they have failed to uphold the Catholic teaching on birth control, and perhaps abortion too. You like their vestments? They seemed drab to me. They use the new liturgy. Now that IS drab.

"The scandal caused by the Knights of Malta distributing condoms through its charitable arm exploded publicly at the end of 2016. That’s when the Order’s Grand Master Fra’ Matthew Festing ordered Grand Chancellor Albrecht von Boeselager to resign from his position. It was Boeselager who oversaw MI and who was ultimately responsible for approving the projects that not only distributed condoms and contraceptive pills, but abortifacient pills as well. 

But Boeselager refused to step down, forcing Festing to exert his position to entirely remove him from the Order. 

Then, in a series of surprise moves, Pope Francis demanded that Festing resign from his position, which he did, and went on to reinstate the official dismissed for peddling contraception. The move was surprising given that the Knights of Malta is a sovereign entity and has no official connection to the Pope or the Vatican."

----https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/knights-of-malta-staff-defends-condoms-in-leaked-email-new-popepublicly-sta

You showed a Mass presided at by Bp. Bernard Tissier de Mallerais! Bravo. I do not speak German. Do you know what was the occasion? The three bishops of the Society of St. Pius X are so busy giving Confirmations around the world that I am guessing that is what this was. I believe he confirmed my son and my nephews and gave conditional Confirmations to my wife and I. I have been privileged to be seated next to his excellency at a dinner hosted by some friends, and I have spoken with him on other occasions. He is soft-spoken and kind, but very earnest and serious. He is French but has been living in Chicago for the last few years and at around 70, I think his English has improved. My son was in our seminary where Bp. Tissier has recently moved, and he has some amusing anecdotes about how the little man has a large presence about him that can make even an experienced priest a little nervous to make sure the ceremonies are done with precision. 

I guess I forgot about the Society of St. Pius X. Thanks for the reminder, heh.  

3DOP 

No idea about what tennants the order stand for, main thing i care about is its a great organization to belong to if you're in medical.  It sucks, everyone is so leary of someone trying to haul em into court for malpractice, you really, really have to watch whom you associate with anymore, esp. Stateside.  Biggest chuckle i have about the catholic church is the masonic hate.  Considering the things Rome has pulled, yeah thats literally the pot calling the kettle black. 

No idea, my German isn't the best, i just had that deutcher orden one saved.  I think in a way they kinda beat out the order of malta bling wise, then again I'm biased towards Germans.  I admit that with pride lol.

[poptart]

22 minutes ago, 3DOP said:

Thank you for encouraging me, poptart.

However, you can not very successfully use the Knights of Malta as an example of "Catholics who insist on going to mass, no birth control, the kids being raised Catholic etc."?  Pope Francis did not mind, but conservatives and Traditionalists in the Church disapprove of the Knights because they have failed to uphold the Catholic teaching on birth control, and perhaps abortion too. You like their vestments? They seemed drab to me. They use the new liturgy. Now that IS drab.

"The scandal caused by the Knights of Malta distributing condoms through its charitable arm exploded publicly at the end of 2016. That’s when the Order’s Grand Master Fra’ Matthew Festing ordered Grand Chancellor Albrecht von Boeselager to resign from his position. It was Boeselager who oversaw MI and who was ultimately responsible for approving the projects that not only distributed condoms and contraceptive pills, but abortifacient pills as well. 

But Boeselager refused to step down, forcing Festing to exert his position to entirely remove him from the Order. 

Then, in a series of surprise moves, Pope Francis demanded that Festing resign from his position, which he did, and went on to reinstate the official dismissed for peddling contraception. The move was surprising given that the Knights of Malta is a sovereign entity and has no official connection to the Pope or the Vatican."

----https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/knights-of-malta-staff-defends-condoms-in-leaked-email-new-popepublicly-sta

You showed a Mass presided at by Bp. Bernard Tissier de Mallerais! Bravo. I do not speak German. Do you know what was the occasion? The three bishops of the Society of St. Pius X are so busy giving Confirmations around the world that I am guessing that is what this was. I believe he confirmed my son and my nephews and gave conditional Confirmations to my wife and I. I have been privileged to be seated next to his excellency at a dinner hosted by some friends, and I have spoken with him on other occasions. He is soft-spoken and kind, but very earnest and serious. He is French but has been living in Chicago for the last few years and at around 70, I think his English has improved. My son was in our seminary where Bp. Tissier has recently moved, and he has some amusing anecdotes about how the little man has a large presence about him that can make even an experienced priest a little nervous to make sure the ceremonies are done with precision. 

I guess I forgot about the Society of St. Pius X. Thanks for the reminder, heh.  

3DOP 

Btw, since your catholic I'll ask you, are Catholics abroad nicer?  Been my experience, the ones I've met here state side were judgmental and mean.  Same thing with the saints.  Ones I've met from Hawaii and e.asia were fantastic.  First gf was lds, thing is she was from Japan so was different than the ones from Zion.  I've met a few cool Catholics, mostly from the Midwest, Germany, asia and the reservations.  St. Leos parish in Tacoma is awesome, think at least half the people are natives from the local nations.  Ohh boy, i knew a few locals, ethnic irish and italians.  Boy did they hate the natives and the asians there and were all about the manifest destiny bit yet they feel entitled for society to raise and protect their bratty kids while they do nothing. Contemporary American entitlement right there...

[3DOP]

23 hours ago, poptart said:

Btw, since your catholic I'll ask you, are Catholics abroad nicer?  Been my experience, the ones I've met here state side were judgmental and mean.  Same thing with the saints.  Ones I've met from Hawaii and e.asia were fantastic.  First gf was lds, thing is she was from Japan so was different than the ones from Zion.  I've met a few cool Catholics, mostly from the Midwest, Germany, asia and the reservations.  St. Leos parish in Tacoma is awesome, think at least half the people are natives from the local nations.  Ohh boy, i knew a few locals, ethnic irish and italians.  Boy did they hate the natives and the asians there and were all about the manifest destiny bit yet they feel entitled for society to raise and protect their bratty kids while they do nothing. Contemporary American entitlement right there...

You are nice? You are never judgmental or mean? Do you love "ethnic Irish and Italians", even if you are deluded into thinking they "hate the natives and the asians there and were all about the manifest destiny bit yet they feel entitled for society to raise and protect their bratty kids while they do nothing. Contemporary American entitlement right there..."? Are you escaping the circle of hate yourself?

I'm not the guy for your questions. Take care.

 

Edited August 31, 2019 by 3DOP

[3DOP]

17 hours ago, 3DOP said:

You are nice? You are never judgmental or mean? Do you love "ethnic Irish and Italians", even if you are deluded into thinking they "hate the natives and the asians there and were all about the manifest destiny bit yet they feel entitled for society to raise and protect their bratty kids while they do nothing. Contemporary American entitlement right there..."? Are you escaping the circle of hate yourself?

I'm not the guy for your questions. Take care.

 

Today, that sounds a little harsh. It is hard to escape the "circle" that I mentioned. It makes for hell on earth, even if you don't believe in eternal hell. I know because I have been caught up in it, and still get entangled from time to time. We should have mercy with each other because of this, knowing we are all subject to the same frailties. Yesterday, I spent hours on a serious reply from a distinctly Catholic perspective, Poptart, but it became disorganized and I did not think it would make good enough sense to you or others. I do not think I have time to recompose it in a satisfactory manner. That is what I meant by "I'm not the guy for your questions." Be assured of my continuing concern for your well-being and happiness.

God bless you,

Rory

[Stargazer]

On 8/30/2019 at 3:42 AM, poptart said:

Also these guys, wish they had em here. 

 

This is the investiture ceremony of Archbishop Stefan Hesse as one of the 12 Honorary Knights of the Teutonic Order.  The Teutonic Order is similar to the Sovereign Military Order of Malta, but is one step lower in precedence.  For @3DOP

[Stargazer]

On 8/30/2019 at 10:36 PM, poptart said:

Btw, since your catholic I'll ask you, are Catholics abroad nicer?  Been my experience, the ones I've met here state side were judgmental and mean.  Same thing with the saints.  Ones I've met from Hawaii and e.asia were fantastic.  First gf was lds, thing is she was from Japan so was different than the ones from Zion.  I've met a few cool Catholics, mostly from the Midwest, Germany, asia and the reservations.  St. Leos parish in Tacoma is awesome, think at least half the people are natives from the local nations.  Ohh boy, i knew a few locals, ethnic irish and italians.  Boy did they hate the natives and the asians there and were all about the manifest destiny bit yet they feel entitled for society to raise and protect their bratty kids while they do nothing. Contemporary American entitlement right there...

You've had bad luck then.  Pretty much all the Catholics I've ever met were nice people and I got along fine with them.  Back when I was in the US Army and president of an LDS Serviceman's Branch in Germany, the Neu Ulm post chaplain was a Catholic priest and he was very helpful to us as a group.

[poptart]

5 hours ago, 3DOP said:

Today, that sounds a little harsh. It is hard to escape the "circle" that I mentioned. It makes for hell on earth, even if you don't believe in eternal hell. I know because I have been caught up in it, and still get entangled from time to time. We should have mercy with each other because of this, knowing we are all subject to the same frailties. Yesterday, I spent hours on a serious reply from a distinctly Catholic perspective, Poptart, but it became disorganized and I did not think it would make good enough sense to you or others. I do not think I have time to recompose it in a satisfactory manner. That is what I meant by "I'm not the guy for your questions." Be assured of my continuing concern for your well-being and happiness.

God bless you,

Rory

Such is life.

4 hours ago, Stargazer said:

This is the investiture ceremony of Archbishop Stefan Hesse as one of the 12 Honorary Knights of the Teutonic Order.  The Teutonic Order is similar to the Sovereign Military Order of Malta, but is one step lower in precedence.  For @3DOP

yeah, personally I prefer the Teutonic Orders vestments.

4 hours ago, Stargazer said:

You've had bad luck then.  Pretty much all the Catholics I've ever met were nice people and I got along fine with them.  Back when I was in the US Army and president of an LDS Serviceman's Branch in Germany, the Neu Ulm post chaplain was a Catholic priest and he was very helpful to us as a group.

When you get to grow up in a safe suburb it's amazing how much better your life is.  For the most part people are worse than most animals.

[Stargazer]

13 hours ago, poptart said:

When you get to grow up in a safe suburb it's amazing how much better your life is.  For the most part people are worse than most animals.

I suppose you'd had bad experiences. What about us who've run into a few jerks but by and large everyone seems pretty decent, even if some of them were a little iffy?

There's a genre of YouTube videos that basically read out Reddit stories about revenge done to miscreants, including bosses, bullies at work, bad neighbors, and so on, and if one spends a lot of time watching/listening to these one might get the impression that everyone is a jerk -- but one must remember that the mean people stand out while the rest of us very nice folks (like you and me) hardly get any attention.   One must also remember that while there are stories about bridges that collapse, virtually no stories are heard about bridges that stay quietly up -- which are the vast majority.  Listening to news about falling bridges, one might be afraid to cross any of them.