Bernard Gui Posted June 13, 2017 Posted June 13, 2017 (edited) 26 minutes ago, MiserereNobis said: From the Mormon point-of-view, what do you think God looks like? What is His age? His hair? His skin color? Since God is a physical being in your theology, He must have these attributes. What are they? D&C 110 1 The veil was taken from our minds, and the eyes of our understanding were opened. 2 We saw the Lord standing upon the breastwork of the pulpit, before us; and under his feet was a paved work of pure gold, in color like amber. 3 His eyes were as a flame of fire; the hair of his head was white like the pure snow; his countenance shone above the brightness of the sun; and his voice was as the sound of the rushing of great waters, even the voice of Jehovah, saying: 4 I am the first and the last; I am he who liveth, I am he who was slain; I am your advocate with the Father. Ether 3 6 And it came to pass that when the brother of Jared had said these words, behold, the Lord stretched forth his hand and touched the stones one by one with his finger. And the veil was taken from off the eyes of the brother of Jared, and he saw the finger of the Lord; and it was as the finger of a man, like unto flesh and blood; and the brother of Jared fell down before the Lord, for he was struck with fear. 7 And the Lord saw that the brother of Jared had fallen to the earth; and the Lord said unto him: Arise, why hast thou fallen? 8 And he saith unto the Lord: I saw the finger of the Lord, and I feared lest he should smite me; for I knew not that the Lord had flesh and blood. 9 And the Lord said unto him: Because of thy faith thou hast seen that I shall take upon me flesh and blood; and never has man come before me with such exceeding faith as thou hast; for were it not so ye could not have seen my finger. Sawest thou more than this? 10 And he answered: Nay; Lord, show thyself unto me. 11 And the Lord said unto him: Believest thou the words which I shall speak? 12 And he answered: Yea, Lord, I know that thou speakest the truth, for thou art a God of truth, and canst not lie. 13 And when he had said these words, behold, the Lord showedhimself unto him, and said: Because thou knowest these things ye are redeemed from the fall; therefore ye are brought back into my presence; therefore I show myself unto you. 14 Behold, I am he who was prepared from the foundation of the world to redeem my people. Behold, I am Jesus Christ. I am the Father and the Son. In me shall all mankind have life, and that eternally, even they who shall believe on my name; and they shall become my sons and my daughters. 15 And never have I showed myself unto man whom I have created, for never has man believed in me as thou hast. Seest thou that ye are created after mine own image? Yea, even all men were created in the beginning after mine own image. 16 Behold, this body, which ye now behold, is the body of my spirit; and man have I created after the body of my spirit; and even as I appear unto thee to be in the spirit will I appear unto my people in the flesh. Edited June 13, 2017 by Bernard Gui 3
Marginal Gains Posted June 13, 2017 Posted June 13, 2017 One suggestion for improving race relations would be to have a racially diverse set of Apostles leading the Church. It has to start there.
Bernard Gui Posted June 13, 2017 Posted June 13, 2017 (edited) 4 hours ago, Marginal Gains said: One suggestion for improving race relations would be to have a racially diverse set of Apostles leading the Church. It has to start there. Has diversity in the mission and temple presidencies, area authorities, and Seventies helped? There are no Icelandic, Polish, or Russian Apostles. Edited June 13, 2017 by Bernard Gui 1
Meerkat Posted June 14, 2017 Posted June 14, 2017 On 6/13/2017 at 9:58 AM, Bernard Gui said: Has diversity in the mission and temple presidencies, area authorities, and Seventies helped? There are no Icelandic, Polish, or Russian Apostles. It appears that Scandanavians are well represented though: Monson, Nelson, Christofferson, Anderson, Stevenson, Renlund (I think.) 2
Jeanne Posted June 14, 2017 Posted June 14, 2017 On 6/13/2017 at 8:41 AM, Marginal Gains said: One suggestion for improving race relations would be to have a racially diverse set of Apostles leading the Church. It has to start there. Oh...wouldn't that be nice. I agree! How about a dedicated member who is a farmer..a regular Joe..who is faithful? No lawyers..doctors and heavy donors with money...
Calm Posted June 14, 2017 Author Posted June 14, 2017 5 minutes ago, Jeanne said: Oh...wouldn't that be nice. I agree! How about a dedicated member who is a farmer..a regular Joe..who is faithful? No lawyers..doctors and heavy donors with money... Would you come back to the faith if this occurred? 3
Bernard Gui Posted June 14, 2017 Posted June 14, 2017 1 hour ago, Jeanne said: heavy donors with money... ??? The positions are bought?
Jeanne Posted June 14, 2017 Posted June 14, 2017 1 hour ago, Calm said: Would you come back to the faith if this occurred? I don't know...I believe and feel that if this happened..there would be a humble change in this church. For the people I love that are in the church..it wouldn't be about dollars and cents..penalties.. Obedience to the Lord is a wonderful thing..and a personal thing..In being a servant of the Lord in such capacity would take away all elite last names and esteemed professions. This would be the kind of person who God would want to talk to and to whom others might listen.
Calm Posted June 14, 2017 Author Posted June 14, 2017 So in your view there is nothing wrong with the doctrine, only the way leadership acts?
Jeanne Posted June 14, 2017 Posted June 14, 2017 11 minutes ago, Bernard Gui said: ??? The positions are bought? No...last names sometimes....but rich people know a lot of other rich people..contacts..real estate..It just seems like that these people have other things to offer outside of the gospe of Jesus Christ.
Jeanne Posted June 14, 2017 Posted June 14, 2017 Just now, Calm said: So in your view there is nothing wrong with the doctrine, only the way leadership acts? I believe that some doctrine would remain..but truth is more apt to come from someone who has nothing to offer..but himself. 1
Rain Posted June 15, 2017 Posted June 15, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, Jeanne said: I don't know...I believe and feel that if this happened..there would be a humble change in this church. For the people I love that are in the church..it wouldn't be about dollars and cents..penalties.. Obedience to the Lord is a wonderful thing..and a personal thing..In being a servant of the Lord in such capacity would take away all elite last names and esteemed professions. This would be the kind of person who God would want to talk to and to whom others might listen. 1 hour ago, Jeanne said: I believe that some doctrine would remain..but truth is more apt to come from someone who has nothing to offer..but himself. So I have an "elite last name". My husband is related to an apostle. Some of his family history has been shared in conference. He is an engineer that is often persued by other companies and we are not hurting for money. We even just came home from a two week trip to Spain and another trip to Israel last year. So he is out? Because he has the right last name and isn't poor? God wouldn't want to talk to him? Because the poor are pretty much the only ones who can be truly humble? Truth isn't apt to come from him? It doesn't matter that he is one of the sweetest men? That he steps in to help people all the time? That 15 years later people still thank him for the time he took out for them? That he home teaches the most disliked, grumpiest man in the ward and truly likes him because my husband looks on his heart? I always thought the Lord looked on the heart too. I know, I know. Of course not my husband. Only every other "rich" person with a well known name. Just to be clear- I'm good with a farmer apostle. I'm good with a garbage man apostle. I just get so tired of the criticisms that the rich are prideful without actually looking at the person's heart. Edited June 15, 2017 by Rain 4
Meerkat Posted June 15, 2017 Posted June 15, 2017 2 hours ago, Jeanne said: No...last names sometimes....but rich people know a lot of other rich people..contacts..real estate..It just seems like that these people have other things to offer outside of the gospe of Jesus Christ. It's hard to argue against how things may appear. My take is that successful people I know in demanding Church callings got there by serving faithfully as Sunday School teachers, Scout and Priesthood leaders. They were, I believe, faithful tithe payers and we're blessed financially. For the most part, they didn't covet their Church positions, but served where called, without pay, after their normal work hours. Most served out of love for God and their fellow man. Some, who the Lord blessed with wealth, are now able to serve full time. If it were for money, couldn't they earn more applying their financial skills? I've served in some demanding callings along with other good people, and I can tell you that from what I can see, they serve out of love. 3
RevTestament Posted June 16, 2017 Posted June 16, 2017 On 6/14/2017 at 5:22 PM, Jeanne said: I believe that some doctrine would remain..but truth is more apt to come from someone who has nothing to offer..but himself. Who would listen to a lawn mower man?
RevTestament Posted June 16, 2017 Posted June 16, 2017 On 6/14/2017 at 5:22 PM, Jeanne said: I believe that some doctrine would remain..but truth is more apt to come from someone who has nothing to offer..but himself. From the last chapter of Isaiah: 1 Thus saith the Lord, The heaven is my throne, and the earth is my footstool: where is the house that ye build unto me? and where is the place of my rest? 2 For all those things hath mine hand made, and all those things have been, saith the Lord: but to this man will I look, even to him that is poor and of a contrite spirit, and trembleth at my word. 2
Jeanne Posted June 16, 2017 Posted June 16, 2017 27 minutes ago, RevTestament said: Who would listen to a lawn mower man? I would listen to anyone who was sincere in what he thinks and believes..I may or may not agree..but I would listen. And who would listen to a doughnut gal??
RevTestament Posted June 16, 2017 Posted June 16, 2017 9 minutes ago, Jeanne said: I would listen to anyone who was sincere in what he thinks and believes..I may or may not agree..but I would listen. And who would listen to a doughnut gal?? I would if she had warm, fresh sour-creme cake donuts!! She might even get me to bark and pant! I listen to what you have to say Jeanne. I don't always agree with you, but I find you to be a very warm, sincere person.
Jeanne Posted June 16, 2017 Posted June 16, 2017 12 minutes ago, RevTestament said: I would if she had warm, fresh sour-creme cake donuts!! She might even get me to bark and pant! I listen to what you have to say Jeanne. I don't always agree with you, but I find you to be a very warm, sincere person. Thank you...and just so you know..I made an eight count dougnut box for sour cream cake doughnuts about hours ago..oooo...they are so good..hot and glazed. I love that you know who you are and so open. Best ot you Rev!!
RevTestament Posted June 16, 2017 Posted June 16, 2017 17 minutes ago, Jeanne said: Thank you...and just so you know..I made an eight count dougnut box for sour cream cake doughnuts about hours ago..oooo...they are so good..hot and glazed. I love that you know who you are and so open. Best ot you Rev!! Thanks Jeanne. When can I come pick them up? Do you want me to bring my mower?
Jeanne Posted June 16, 2017 Posted June 16, 2017 23 minutes ago, RevTestament said: Thanks Jeanne. When can I come pick them up? Do you want me to bring my mower? Bring the mower..weedeater and a large garbage bag!!
rpn Posted June 17, 2017 Posted June 17, 2017 This is another good resource. Russell W. Stevenson, For the Cause of Righteousness: A Global History on Blacks and Mormonism, 1830–2013 1
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