VideoGameJunkie Posted February 7, 2016 Posted February 7, 2016 What is the Mormon stance on reincarnation? I've read so many Near Death Experiences that say people die and are born again, or this life is just one of many lives on earth that someone lives. Here's even a scripture where Jesus somewhat mentions the reincarnation of Elijah being John the Baptist. "And the disciples asked him, saying, 'Why then do the scribes say that Elijah must come first?' But he answered them and said, 'Elijah indeed is to come and will restore all things. But I say to you that Elijah has come already, and they did not know him, but did to him whatever they wished. So also shall the Son of Man suffer at their hand.' Then the disciples understood that he had spoken of John the Baptist." Matthew 17: 10-13 And would reincarnation explain the Adam God doctrine as well or Christ coming to earth after being Jehovah? In all honesty, reincarnation is terrifying, with the idea of having to repeatedly live mortal lives again. I would hope when we die, we can rest from physical pain and resurrect with a perfect body and enjoy eternity as exalted or wherever kingdom we end up. Does the Plan of Salvation support reincarnation or is it against it?
VideoGameJunkie Posted February 7, 2016 Author Posted February 7, 2016 I know people don't trust NDEs, but here's a list of NDE examples and what they claim about reincarnation. http://www.near-death.com/science/research/reincarnation.html
RevTestament Posted February 7, 2016 Posted February 7, 2016 Jesus was not saying that Elijah was John the Baptist. He was saying that John the Baptist held the same priesthood key as Elijah. And Elijah came once again before the great and dreadful day of the Lord - but not to live another reincarnated life, but as himself in Kirtland to restore a lost key. What does Elijah mean? Learn that and hopefully it will make more sense to you.
Freedom Posted February 7, 2016 Posted February 7, 2016 Reincarnation is coming back in different forms to overcome ignorance and pride. Reincarnation is at odds with Heavenly Fathers Plan 1
VideoGameJunkie Posted February 7, 2016 Author Posted February 7, 2016 7 minutes ago, Freedom said: Reincarnation is coming back in different forms to overcome ignorance and pride. Reincarnation is at odds with Heavenly Fathers Plan Good. But why is it so popular among Near Death Experiencers and the eastern religions?
Russell C McGregor Posted February 7, 2016 Posted February 7, 2016 I understand that if you come back as a hillbilly, it's called reintarnation. 1
VideoGameJunkie Posted February 7, 2016 Author Posted February 7, 2016 1 minute ago, Russell C McGregor said: I understand that if you come back as a hillbilly, it's called reintarnation. Coming back as a hillbilly sounds like a bad karma punishment.
Glenn101 Posted February 7, 2016 Posted February 7, 2016 50 minutes ago, VideoGameJunkie said: Good. But why is it so popular among Near Death Experiencers and the eastern religions? Why is anything popular that sounds good? Endless chances to get it right. As far as NDE's, no one has been given a revelation as to just what is going on. I don't know.
Freedom Posted February 7, 2016 Posted February 7, 2016 A near death experience is not reincarnation since they are coming back as the same person. They would have to have a full death experience and be born as a different person. I don't think you will find a single example of someone being able to prove such an experience. Their former self always seems to have died so long ago that there are never any witnesses to test their knowledge of the deceased.
strappinglad Posted February 7, 2016 Posted February 7, 2016 Just for fun, go to youtube, the fountain of all truth , and you will find several videos about reincarnation. Some are quite well documented or can be traced to books that are. You might be surprised that hundreds of case studies have been collected. As these are mostly anecdotal and many from India where such belief is not uncommon, one must take it with a grain or two of salt. I have said before that I don't personally have a problem with returning, if it is voluntary and the gospel has not been fully received yet. A body is just a vessel and can be exchanged, otherwise what are we to do with the Siamese twins that have two heads and one body. Do the spirits flip a coin? Besides, it might get a bit boring hanging around heaven waiting for the resurrection so why not get more earth experience. Now I do draw the line at coming back as a cockroach or something.
VideoGameJunkie Posted February 7, 2016 Author Posted February 7, 2016 47 minutes ago, strappinglad said: Just for fun, go to youtube, the fountain of all truth , and you will find several videos about reincarnation. Some are quite well documented or can be traced to books that are. You might be surprised that hundreds of case studies have been collected. As these are mostly anecdotal and many from India where such belief is not uncommon, one must take it with a grain or two of salt. I have said before that I don't personally have a problem with returning, if it is voluntary and the gospel has not been fully received yet. A body is just a vessel and can be exchanged, otherwise what are we to do with the Siamese twins that have two heads and one body. Do the spirits flip a coin? Besides, it might get a bit boring hanging around heaven waiting for the resurrection so why not get more earth experience. Now I do draw the line at coming back as a cockroach or something. I don't want to come back into mortality because I don't want to feel physical pain again after this life. I'm only 30, but I've experienced quite a bit already and will be happy when it's over.
Walden Posted February 8, 2016 Posted February 8, 2016 On 2/7/2016 at 9:17 PM, Freedom said: A near death experience is not reincarnation since they are coming back as the same person. They would have to have a full death experience and be born as a different person. I don't think you will find a single example of someone being able to prove such an experience. Their former self always seems to have died so long ago that there are never any witnesses to test their knowledge of the deceased. "I don't think you will find a single example of someone being able to prove such an experience,"....that is true whether one is talking about reincarnation, the existence of heaven, or even the reality of near death experiences themselves. With regard to musings on post-physical life destinations or happenings within the multiple belief systems in this world, reincarnation has just as much "proof" as does the existence of heaven: both are tied at zero.
Freedom Posted February 8, 2016 Posted February 8, 2016 1 hour ago, Walden said: "I don't think you will find a single example of someone being able to prove such an experience,"....that is true whether one is talking about reincarnation, the existence of heaven, or even the reality of near death experiences themselves. With regard to musings on post-physical life destinations or happenings within the multiple belief systems in this world, reincarnation has just as much "proof" as does the existence of heaven: both are tied at zero. Reincarnation would be very simple to prove. If I claimed to have been reincarnated, all I would have to do is to provide details that only the deceased would know. I should know mountains of details. But nobody who has claimed to have been reincarnated is ever able to provide any such evidence. If I died and came back, my new me would be able to provide so much personal information that it would take the media by storm. But alas, everybody who is reincarnated either cannot remember anything which means they have absolutely no cause to assume they were reincarnated, or their memories are proven wrong.
JLHPROF Posted February 8, 2016 Posted February 8, 2016 1 hour ago, Freedom said: Reincarnation would be very simple to prove. If I claimed to have been reincarnated, all I would have to do is to provide details that only the deceased would know. I should know mountains of details. But nobody who has claimed to have been reincarnated is ever able to provide any such evidence. If I died and came back, my new me would be able to provide so much personal information that it would take the media by storm. But alas, everybody who is reincarnated either cannot remember anything which means they have absolutely no cause to assume they were reincarnated, or their memories are proven wrong. Well gosh, we can't remember any details of our existence before coming to earth, but we had one. Why should that be any different for a reincarnated person? (There is no reincarnation of course, but given our understanding of the veil I don't think not remembering previous lives is much of an argument against it.) 1
smac97 Posted February 8, 2016 Posted February 8, 2016 Here is an article on this subject in The Encyclopedia of Mormonism. The money quote: "This theory is rejected by The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints." Here is an "I Have a Question" article in the August 1989 Ensign. The money quote: "Despite some similarities to LDS doctrine, reincarnation is contrary to revealed truth. The Prophet Joseph Smith taught that reincarnation is a false doctrine [see Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, sel. Joseph Fielding Smith, Salt Lake City: Deseret Book Co., 1938, pp. 104–5.]." Talmage's Jesus the Christ rejects this concept: "It is not possible that Jesus could have meant that John was the same individual as Elijah; nor could the people have so understood His words, since the false doctrine of transmigration or reincarnation of spirits was repudiated by the Jews." Here is a blog article which includes several statements from General Authorities about reincarnation (not over the pulpit, though). A quick search did not come up with anything definitive. But there's probably something out there. Thanks, -Smac 1
strappinglad Posted February 8, 2016 Posted February 8, 2016 A quick check on Amazon show a few books on the topic. One in particular called " Old Souls " by Tom Shroder presents the work on Dr. Ian Stevenson who has collected a couple of thousand case studies and tried to verify the stories. To say there is absolutely no evidence and no verification is not quite correct.
janderich Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 Joseph Smith once spoke to a man called Joshua who believed he was a literal descendant of the apostle Matthias. He believed that his spirit was resurrected in him and that the spirit transmigrated from father to son. Joseph told him that the doctrine was of the devil (see TPJS p 105). So clearly we do not believe in the transmigration of souls into different bodies, ie reincarnation. However, I do hold out that possibility that a long time after the resurrection, far after an assignment to a kingdom of glory, we may yet re-enter a new mortal realm. For we must understand that mortality is the time to prepare to meet God, not in the eternal realms, for there our state is fixed. Yet, our doctrine teaches that as God now is, man may become. 1
Calm Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 Whatdo you mean by our state is fixed in eternal realms? What do you understand by eternal progression?
janderich Posted February 10, 2016 Posted February 10, 2016 12 hours ago, Calm said: Whatdo you mean by our state is fixed in eternal realms? What do you understand by eternal progression? Certainly after this life there is learning and growth but there is a particular type of progression that can only be obtained by passing through a mortal experience. As Mormon states, "for we have a labor to perform whilst in this tabernacle of clay, that we may conquer the enemy of all righteousness, and rest our souls in the kingdom of God" (Moro 9:6).
saemo Posted February 10, 2016 Posted February 10, 2016 The Hindu belief of reincarnation are that each death and rebirth is a moving forward. It is how they reconcile evolution with incarnation, that is, evolution can be viewed as moving forward with incarnation intricately involved. Each rebirth of the soil is not immediate. They believe that the soul goes to a heaven or a hell, depending on the actions of the person in life. Remains in an ancestral heaven or hell for a while (no set time) and then after karma has all been settled, the soul enters another life. Could be a human, plant, animal or god. Some regional Hindu sects believe a person always reincarnated a particular plant or animal. When the cycle ends the soul is reunited with its source. Westerners would call this source God, but for Hindus, the souls of their gods come from this source just as theirs do, so not quite the same as a western understanding of God. This is the type of reincarnation where people claim to remember past lives. Buddhism, however, holds no belief in the soul. What is reborn is a sort of conscience, that is not a soul and has no memory or personality. There is not a Source to where a soul returns as there is no God or divine source in Buddhism. Buddhists have no expectation that past lives will be remembered. A rebirth may or may not retain something from a previous life but each rebirth is distinct and separate from previous rebirths. There may be shadow like glimpses that friends and relatives may view as recognizable as attributes, habits or preferences of a deceased person, but these are not considered memories of a previous life.
Alan Posted February 10, 2016 Posted February 10, 2016 I believe reincarnation occurs in certain circumstances. I recognize this is at odds with the doctrine of the church but it is nevertheless something I believe. I have my reasons for believing it.
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