Scott Lloyd Posted October 9, 2015 Author Posted October 9, 2015 I would say the Atonement is quite the foundational issue! I chose faith over understanding because life went so much better than when I didn't. OK, so you had a problem understanding the atonement, but what about the really important stuff?
ttribe Posted October 9, 2015 Posted October 9, 2015 OK, so you had a problem understanding the atonement, but what about the really important stuff? Nice. I clarified in a later post. No need to pile on at this point.
Ahab Posted October 10, 2015 Posted October 10, 2015 If you are equating "certainty" with confidence based on your perception of assurances, than we are having semantic differences only.I think my explanation was better than yours. To my understanding being certain of something is the same thing as being sure about it. In my mind, "certainty" leaves no room for possible error.I think you're talking about absolute certainty, and I think there are lesser degrees of certainty rather than only absolute certainty. Just like there are lesser degrees of being sure of something rather than only being absolutely sure about it. And a person being sure or certain of something doesn't necessarily mean they are not in error even if they are sure they are right. A person can be sure or certain of something and still be wrong. And yes that means that a person with faith can be wrong, even if they are sure their faith is from God. If their faith in something really is from God then they would be right, because God is right of course, but a person can be sure their faith is from God when it really is not.When I said that faith and uncertainty coexist, I was saying that faith and the lack of perfect knowledge coexist. I think we can agree with that.Yes we can, and I do.To me, certainty is nothing more than stiff necked ignorance.Did you really mean to say that? I certainly do not agree. There are various degrees and kinds of knowledge and at the most basic level knowledge is to simply be aware of something. Like how a person can say they know someone even when not knowing everything about them. Like how I know you, pogi, even though I don't know everything about you. So I am not ignorant of you even though I don't know everything about you. And no it's not a stiff necked ignorance either.It doesn't leave room for other possibilities despite its lack of absolute certainty. It is the cause of ignorant evil performed in the name of God. It is dangerous.So you think certainty is dangerous too, do you? Maybe sometimes, but you shouldn't say that generally.
CV75 Posted October 10, 2015 Posted October 10, 2015 Okay, just curious. Obviously, I'm familiar with Alma's counsel.We're good. Here's an intersting one: I knew someone who, when teaching Primary of all things, was put off by the "stories" from Church History--didn't beleive them! Thought they were made up; they sounded fake, etc. (the various miracles of the early saints, pioneers, etc.). Nothing would shake that attitude, and couldn't teach it anymore, then suffered quite the faith crisis after that. The only thing that turned it around was readig the Book of Mormon, and now is more faithful than ever! -- and there had never been a faith problem before running across the Primary stories.
CV75 Posted October 13, 2015 Posted October 13, 2015 I am reporting this spammerYes, you don't need that stuff, all you need to do choose to believe -- LOL
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