Sp0ckrates Posted June 17, 2015 Posted June 17, 2015 What is the Godhead?I'm thoughtfully considering what Mormons believe about the Godhead. I searched the Book of Mormon, Pearl of Great Price, and Doctrine and Covenants for the word and found only this:IntroductionIn the revelations, the doctrines of the gospel are set forth with explanations about such fundamental matters as the nature of the Godhead, the origin of man, the reality of Satan, the purpose of mortality, the necessity for obedience, the need for ...The Bible had this to say:Colossians 2:99 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.Will someone please help me understand what the Godhead is?
ksfisher Posted June 17, 2015 Posted June 17, 2015 The Church's first article of faith states, “We believe in God, the Eternal Father, and in His Son, Jesus Christ, and in the Holy Ghost.” These three beings make up the Godhead. They preside over this world and all other creations of our Father in Heaven.The Mormon view of the members of the Godhead corresponds in a number of ways with the views of others in the Christian world, but with significant differences. Latter-day Saints pray to God the Father in the name of Jesus Christ. They acknowledge the Father as the ultimate object of their worship, the Son as Lord and Redeemer, and the Holy Spirit as the messenger and revealer of the Father and the Son. But where Latter-day Saints differ from other Christian religions is in their belief that God and Jesus Christ are glorified, physical beings and that each member of the Godhead is a separate being. Additional InformationThe true doctrine of the Godhead was lost in the apostasy that followed the Savior's mortal ministry and the deaths of His Apostles. This doctrine began to be restored when 14-year-old Joseph Smith received his First Vision (see Joseph Smith—History 1:17). From the Prophet's account of the First Vision and from his other teachings, we know that the members of the Godhead are three separate beings. The Father and the Son have tangible bodies of flesh and bones, and the Holy Ghost is a personage of spirit (see D&C 130:22). Although the members of the Godhead are distinct beings with distinct roles, they are one in purpose and doctrine. They are perfectly united in bringing to pass Heavenly Father's divine plan of salvation.See also God the Father; Holy Ghost; Jesus Christ—See True to the Faith (2004), 73-74 https://www.lds.org/topics/godhead?lang=eng&query=godhead
Storm Rider Posted June 17, 2015 Posted June 17, 2015 Some additional scriptures on the Godhead are: Acts 17:29, Romans 1:20, When you were searching the Pearl of Great Price you may have seen the Articles of Faith; it is a brief summary of our beliefs. The First Article of Faith reads, "We believe in God, the Eternal Father, and in his Son, Jesus Christ, and in the Holy Ghost. These three make up the Godhead. Quoting from Guide to the Scriptures on a correct understanding of the Godhead: God created man in his own image: Gen. 1:26–27;The Lord spoke unto Moses face to face: Ex. 33:11;Eternal life is to know God the Father and Jesus Christ: John 17:3;The Father and Son have bodies of flesh and bones: D&C 130:22–23;The Father and the Son appeared to Joseph Smith: JS—H 1:15–20;Though it is easy to identify who we worship as God or even Gods, there is complexity as is found in the teachings of the doctrine of the Trinity. You will find that Latter-day Saints can talk as if we are strict monotheists, the Father is God. This echoes the words of Christ when he stated there was none good but one, God. On the other hand, some have labeled us as henothists because we acknowledge that each member of the Godhead is a God. I personally find the term inaccurate; our pantheon is the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit and we cannot choose to worship one without the other. We pray to the Father in the name of the Son through the Holy Spirit. We think of the Godhead as three Gods that are one in purpose, yet they remain separate and distinct.
bluebell Posted June 17, 2015 Posted June 17, 2015 The bible used the term Godhead a few times. The one you already referenced as well as:Romans 1:2020 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:Acts 17:2929 Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man’s device.This is what it says under the heading "Godhead" in the guide to the scriptures on lds.org-"There are three separate persons in the Godhead: God, the Eternal Father; his Son, Jesus Christ; and the Holy Ghost. We believe in each of them. From latter-day revelation we learn that the Father and the Son have tangible bodies of flesh and bone and that the Holy Ghost is a personage of spirit, without flesh and bone. These three persons are one in perfect unity and harmony of purpose and doctrine."
Sp0ckrates Posted June 17, 2015 Author Posted June 17, 2015 (edited) The Church's first article of faith states, “We believe in God, the Eternal Father, and in His Son, Jesus Christ, and in the Holy Ghost.” These three beings make up the Godhead. They preside over this world and all other creations of our Father in Heaven.The Mormon view of the members of the Godhead corresponds in a number of ways with the views of others in the Christian world, but with significant differences. Latter-day Saints pray to God the Father in the name of Jesus Christ. They acknowledge the Father as the ultimate object of their worship, the Son as Lord and Redeemer, and the Holy Spirit as the messenger and revealer of the Father and the Son. Well said, KSFisher! Is this even better?The Father is the worship receiver,The Son is the Lord and redeemer, The Holy Ghost is the messenger and revealer.But where Latter-day Saints differ from other Christian religions is in their belief that God and Jesus Christ are glorified, physical beings and that each member of the Godhead is a separate being. Additional InformationThe true doctrine of the Godhead was lost in the apostasy that followed the Savior's mortal ministry and the deaths of His Apostles. This doctrine began to be restored when 14-year-old Joseph Smith received his First Vision (see Joseph Smith—History 1:17). From the Prophet's account of the First Vision and from his other teachings, we know that the members of the Godhead are three separate beings. The Father and the Son have tangible bodies of flesh and bones, and the Holy Ghost is a personage of spirit (see D&C 130:22).Although the members of the Godhead are distinct beings with distinct roles, they are one in purpose and doctrine. They are perfectly united in bringing to pass Heavenly Father's divine plan of salvation.See also God the Father; Holy Ghost; Jesus Christ—See True to the Faith (2004), 73-74https://www.lds.org/topics/godhead?lang=eng&query=godheadSo it sounds to me like the Godhead is not God himself, but is instead the name of the group, or maybe organization, or perhaps government that the three gods are in. Is this correct? Edited June 17, 2015 by Sp0ckrates
Sp0ckrates Posted June 17, 2015 Author Posted June 17, 2015 (edited) <p>Some additional scriptures on the Godhead are: Acts 17:29, Romans 1:20, When you were searching the Pearl of Great Price you may have seen the Articles of Faith; it is a brief summary of our beliefs. The First Article of Faith reads, "We believe in God, the Eternal Father, and in his Son, Jesus Christ, and in the Holy Ghost. These three make up the Godhead. Quoting from Guide to the Scriptures on a correct understanding of the Godhead:God created man in his own image: Gen. 1:26–27;The Lord spoke unto Moses face to face: Ex. 33:11;Eternal life is to know God the Father and Jesus Christ: John 17:3;The Father and Son have bodies of flesh and bones: D&C 130:22–23;The Father and the Son appeared to Joseph Smith: JS—H 1:15–20;Though it is easy to identify who we worship as God or even Gods, there is complexity as is found in the teachings of the doctrine of the Trinity. You will find that Latter-day Saints can talk as if we are strict monotheists, the Father is God. This echoes the words of Christ when he stated there was none good but one, God. On the other hand, some have labeled us as henothists because we acknowledge that each member of the Godhead is a God. I personally find the term inaccurate; our pantheon is the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit and we cannot choose to worship one without the other. We pray to the Father in the name of the Son through the Holy Spirit. We think of the Godhead as three Gods that are one in purpose, yet they remain separate and distinct. StormRider: Excellent resources! Much appreciated. So would you say the Godhead is three gods similar to the way the Executive, Legislative and Judicial are three branches of the U.S. Government? That is, as there are three branches in one government, so too there are three gods in one Godhead? Edited June 17, 2015 by Sp0ckrates
Storm Rider Posted June 17, 2015 Posted June 17, 2015 (edited) On the one hand I could say yes, but on the other I would say no. This type of language undermines the unity of Father, Son, and Holy Ghost. Using a theological term, the Godhead has mystery that is beyond our comprehension and our language is incapable of summarizing them in a succinct manner. What is it that you are trying to understand? I will gladly admit that I cannot describe God except in terms that fall short of clearly defining him. My above response is as good as it gets. Edited June 17, 2015 by Storm Rider
Sp0ckrates Posted June 17, 2015 Author Posted June 17, 2015 The bible used the term Godhead a few times. The one you already referenced as well as:Romans 1:2020 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:Acts 17:2929 Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man’s device.This is what it says under the heading "Godhead" in the guide to the scriptures on lds.org-"There are three separate persons in the Godhead: God, the Eternal Father; his Son, Jesus Christ; and the Holy Ghost. We believe in each of them. From latter-day revelation we learn that the Father and the Son have tangible bodies of flesh and bone and that the Holy Ghost is a personage of spirit, without flesh and bone. These three persons are one in perfect unity and harmony of purpose and doctrine."Thanks, Bluebell. I find it interesting that there are three gods in the Godhead and also three passages of scripture about the Godhead in the Bible.So are you in agreement with the way Luke and Paul describe the Godhead, or do you think they misunderstood the Godhead?
Sp0ckrates Posted June 17, 2015 Author Posted June 17, 2015 On the one hand I could say yes, but on the other I would say no. This type of language undermines the unity of Father, Son, and Holy Ghost. Using a theological term, the Godhead has mystery that is beyond our comprehension and our language is incapable of summarizing them in a succinct manner. What is it that you are trying to understand? I will gladly admit that I cannot describe God except in terms that fall short of clearly defining him. My above response is as good as it gets.I'm trying to understand what the word Godhead means. When you say, "I cannot describe God," do you mean you cannot describe the Father, or do you mean you cannot describe the Godhead?
Anakin7 Posted June 17, 2015 Posted June 17, 2015 (edited) For me within the Heavenly Jerusalem Kingdom God The Father is the Monarch of The Universe, God The Son Jesus Christ is the Vice Monarch of The Universe, God The Holy Ghost Spirit is The Sanctifier/Testator of The Universe. Serving them are Archangels/Angels Rightiousness/Truth. They function as a True Monarch Kingdom GODHEAD. In His Eternal Debt/Grace Anakin7 Edited June 17, 2015 by Anakin7
bluebell Posted June 17, 2015 Posted June 17, 2015 Thanks, Bluebell. I find it interesting that there are three gods in the Godhead and also three passages of scripture about the Godhead in the Bible. So are you in agreement with the way Luke and Paul describe the Godhead, or do you think they misunderstood the Godhead? In Romans i think that Paul is using the term Godhead in a different way than most LDS would use it. It almost sounds like he's talking about Godhood. I'm not biblical scholar though so i don't feel comfortable declaring anything as a fact on exactly what paul was saying. Reading the bible sometimes it sounds like words are missing, or like it was translated by someone whose first language isn't English. Not always the easiest to figure out what is being said. I suppose that's why there are so many Christians religion who believe the bible to be the word of God (and so many who are bible-only religions) and yet completely disagree with each other on major points of doctrine. 2
Sp0ckrates Posted June 17, 2015 Author Posted June 17, 2015 For me within the Heavenly Jerusalem Kingdom God The Father is the Monarch of The Universe, God The Son Jesus Christ is the Vice Monarch of The Universe, God The Holy Ghost Spirit is The Sanctifier/Testator of The Universe. Serving them are Archangels/Angels Rightiousness/Truth. They function as a True Monarch Kingdom GODHEAD.In His Eternal Debt/Grace Anakin7Yes, I think I understand. By using the three branches of government, I didn't mean to suggest they were checks and ballances to each other. I understand they are always in perfect agreement. Do you think it is accurate, Anakin to say the three gods are in one Godhead?
Sp0ckrates Posted June 17, 2015 Author Posted June 17, 2015 (edited) In Romans i think that Paul is using the term Godhead in a different way than most LDS would use it. It almost sounds like he's talking about Godhood. I'm not biblical scholar though so i don't feel comfortable declaring anything as a fact on exactly what paul was saying.Understood. Not asking you to give me the definitive truth on the biblical texts. Just asking for your best guess.Reading the bible sometimes it sounds like words are missing, or like it was translated by someone whose first language isn't English. Not always the easiest to figure out what is being said. I suppose that's why there are so many Christians religion who believe the bible to be the word of God (and so many who are bible-only religions) and yet completely disagree with each other on major points of doctrine. Wow! I could not agree more. But you might be surprised to find how difficult it is to get most Catholics or Protestants to admit the Bible is ever ambiguous! So what about Acts and Colossians? Do you think either of those passages are defining Godhead correctly? Edited June 17, 2015 by Sp0ckrates
ksfisher Posted June 17, 2015 Posted June 17, 2015 Well said, KSFisher! Is this even better?The Father is the worship receiver,The Son is the Lord and redeemer,The Holy Ghost is the messenger and revealer. So it sounds to me like the Godhead is not God himself, but is instead the name of the group, or maybe organization, or perhaps government that the three gods are in.Is this correct? Please don't think that any of this is my words, it's all quoted from lds.org. Perhaps I didn't make that apparent enough. I believe your last statement is correct. The Godhead is a group composed of separate beings that are united in purpose.
thesometimesaint Posted June 17, 2015 Posted June 17, 2015 (edited) A good way to look at how the LDS define the Godhead is as a government. Not in the sense of checks and balances as checking and balancing one man greed against another mans avarice. But one of total unanimity of purpose. Edited June 17, 2015 by thesometimesaint
Sp0ckrates Posted June 17, 2015 Author Posted June 17, 2015 (edited) Please don't think that any of this is my words, it's all quoted from lds.org. Perhaps I didn't make that apparent enough.Not a problem. Truth is truth, no matter where it come from. No one can own it but God, and even he doesn't keep it to himself, but mate ad gives it away. (I can't take credit for Thais idea, either. Though I can't remember who gave it to me.) I believe your last statement is correct. The Godhead is a group composed of separate beings that are united in purpose.Yes, three gods in one Godhead. So is this an idea the Apostles believed? Or was it something new God did not reveal until he appeared to Joseph Smith? Edited June 17, 2015 by Sp0ckrates
Sp0ckrates Posted June 17, 2015 Author Posted June 17, 2015 A good way to look at how the LDS define the Godhead is as a government. Not in the sense of checks and balances as checking and balancing one man greed against another mans avarice. But one of total unanimity of purpose. Yes, three gods in one Godhead. Is this a biblical teaching, or is it unique to the more recent doctrines of the LDS church?
Anakin7 Posted June 17, 2015 Posted June 17, 2015 1 GOD in Love/Covenant/Authority/Power/Nature, Only seperate in the physical realm. Each is the possesor of the True GOD Nature. In His Eternal Debt/Grace Anakin7
thesometimesaint Posted June 17, 2015 Posted June 17, 2015 Not a problem. Truth is truth, no matter where it come from. No one can own it but God, and even he doesn't keep it to himself, but mate ad gives it away. (I can't take credit for Thais idea, either. Though I can't remember who gave it to me.) Yes, three gods in one Godhead. So is this an idea the Apostles believed? Or was it something new God did not reveal until he appeared to Joseph Smith? The LDS believe that the Godhead was understood/accepted by the original Apostles but was lost with their death. I personally believe it faded over time but ultimately was gone no later than about 120 CE.
Anakin7 Posted June 17, 2015 Posted June 17, 2015 (edited) Sp0ckrates God The Father is God The Son Jesus Christ's God - Matt 27:46 28:18 John 14:28 17:3 20:17 Acts 2:36-38,Romans 15:6, 1 Cor 11:3,15:24-28, 2 Cor 1:3, 11:31, Eph 1:3,17 Heb 1:1-9 I Peter 1:3 Rev 1:6, 3:2,12 . I took these Biblical refernces from my NIV Bible. In His Eternal Debt/Grace Anakin7 Edited June 17, 2015 by Anakin7
Robert F. Smith Posted June 17, 2015 Posted June 17, 2015 (edited) What is the Godhead?I'm thoughtfully considering what Mormons believe about the Godhead. I searched the Book of Mormon, Pearl of Great Price, and Doctrine and Covenants for the word and found only this: IntroductionIn the revelations, the doctrines of the gospel are set forth with explanations about such fundamental matters as the nature of the Godhead, the origin of man, the reality of Satan, the purpose of mortality, the necessity for obedience, the need for ...The Bible had this to say:Colossians 2:99 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.Will someone please help me understand what the Godhead is? Col 2:9 is speaking in Greek about the pleroma of the theotetos somatikos, which sounds a bit Gnostic, but which argues that Jesus Christ is the bodily embodiment in full of the Gottheit (essence of deity, Gottergestalt), and not simply an emanation. Since both God and the Holy Spirit are described anthropomorphically in the Book of Mormon, it is not possible to formulate a doctrine of hypostatic union among the members of the Gottheit, but rather no more than a full unity of purpose and love among perfect beings, with God the Father at their head -- one God (II Nephi 31:21, Jacob 4:5, Alma 11:44, III Nephi 11:32, 35-36, Mormon 7:7, Ether 12:41, Moroni 10:34). Formal language of cross-identification (Mosiah 13:28, 15:1-5) is, therefore, only to be taken as metaphorical, so that "the will of the Son" is "swallowed up in the will of the Father" (Mosiah 15:7). In fact, David Paulsen and Ari Bruening argue for a social trinity in III Nephi.[1][1] Paulsen & Bruening, "The Social Model of the Trinity in 3 Nephi," in Skinner & Strathearn, eds., Third Nephi, 191-233. Edited June 17, 2015 by Robert F. Smith 1
Sp0ckrates Posted June 17, 2015 Author Posted June 17, 2015 (edited) ... Edited June 17, 2015 by Sp0ckrates
Sp0ckrates Posted June 17, 2015 Author Posted June 17, 2015 1 GOD in Love/Covenant/Authority/Power/Nature, Only seperate in the physical realm. Each is the possesor of the True GOD Nature. In His Eternal Debt/Grace Anakin7Thanks for the post. Are you saying the Godhead is this nature? Or are you saying each God in the Godhead has this nature?
Sp0ckrates Posted June 17, 2015 Author Posted June 17, 2015 The LDS believe that the Godhead was understood/accepted by the original Apostles but was lost with their death. I personally believe it faded over time but ultimately was gone no later than about 120 CE.So since they knew it, is it correct to infer they correctly explained it in the Bible?
Sp0ckrates Posted June 17, 2015 Author Posted June 17, 2015 Sp0ckrates God The Father is God The Son Jesus Christs God - Matt 27:46 28:18 John 14:28 17:3 20:17 Acts 2:36-38,Romans 15:6, ! Cor 11:3,15:24-28, 2 Cor 1:3, 11:31, Eph 1:3,17 Heb 1:1-9 I Peter 1:3 Rev 1:6, 3:2,12 . I took these Biblical refernces from my NIV Bible.In His Eternal Debt/Grace Anakin7Is that a typeo, or are you saying there is one God who is both the Father and the Son?
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