What Is The Damage That Gay Marriage Does To Children

[LOSTONE]

I take it you are not Mormon.

 

Scott, I would love to give you a simple answer of yes or no, but most of the time, I'm not sure I am even human, much less of what faith. However, my original reply was just my opinion and not meant to be offesive or argumentive. Best to you.

[EllenMaksoud]

I think the proposition in the opening thread went to "gay marriage." Not whether a celibate was raising a family, which is somewhat of a contradiction.  I'm pretty sure that if a gay couple went and got themselves married, that their children wouldn't be attending Scouts, Mutual and Primary.   Seems to make sense to me.  And that is an answer to the opening post -- their parents would very likely deny the kids the blessings of the gospel.

Well, if I married another woman, I certainly would not be advertising it. May be you and she just have a difference of opinion in spite of the fact that she recognizes the goodness of the teachings of the church.

 

I don't have one of those polished, gold plated testimonies of the church, but I stay and obey what I can. I certainly don't discuss my failings with someone like you who could judge me when Heavenly Father does not. I know for a fact that God put me in the church. I don't understand why, but I know he did.  I wonder how many members would excercise unrighteous dominion if they were put in the position to do so.

 

Perhaps less nattering about the failings of others and more focus on your own?

[Tacenda]

That's an interesting assumption, Bob.

I am an openly gay man engaged to another man, awaiting the day when Utah legally recognizes our union. We are both returned missionaries. Neither of us believes in the church, or are active, ourselves. My fiancé is often invited to sing at LDS friends special occasions, funerals, etc. When invited, we attend family Missionary Farwells, baby blessings, Homecomings, wedding receptions, etc. We give Fast Offerings whenever the Deacons knock on our door, and also donate to the Scouting drives whenever they come to our home. The bishop occasionally stops by to visit, although we don't usually talk religion. My fiancé was excommunicated years ago, after his wife left him. I comfortably and officially resigned approximately 8 years ago, six months after a formal disciplinary counsel was held "on my behalf' and told I had a year to either repent or be excommunicated.

Between the two of us, we have seven kids. He has four (his are older than mine), and I have three (still at home). One of his children lives with us, and his other daughter lives with her Mom. His other kids are grown up and living on their own. Conversely, I share joint custody of my kids.

Both my partner and I are proud of the many praiseworthy aspects of our LDS heritage. We often sing Primary song snippets, or quote LDSisms that reflect our cultural identify. We stay current on what's happening in the church, what temples are announced, what's happening in our missions, and the highs and lows of my alma mater, BYU. We engage our friends and family in matters where we feel the church is overly intrusive into our lives and rights... I jokingly refer to it as my "gay missionary work," and attribute my strong desire to share what is of good report to the passion I learned in the mission field. I am very vocal and involved in pro-equality initiatives both socially, politically, and at work.

Every Sunday on the weeks that my kids are with me, I take them to church. They attend Scouting, Mutual, and Achievement Days. On their weeks with me, I take them to whatever Young Women's activities or Scouting campouts they go to, and have signed my son up for several BYU pow wows to help him earn his merit badges. I likewise attend my daughter's Personal Progress events. Besides church, I support my kids' involvement in swim team practice and meets, ballroom dancing, tech crew, orchestra, band, football games, spelling bees, and the school carnivals we volunteer at through the PTA.

I will never return to activity in the church, and have no desire to ever be re-baptized, nor would I ever rejoin even when the church changes and accepts gay members and relationships in full fellowship. That ship has sailed, and there's too much water under the bridge. I don't believe the church is true, but I know it has value in my children's lives, and I will support that for as long as they have a desire to stay involved.

That support will not change when my fiancé and I marry.

My fiancé and I are not alone. I know many gay families that are supportive of raising their kids LDS. Of course, that isn't universally true.... every family is different, and everyone makes different choices. I know other gay families active in my own Faith--that of Unitarian Universalist. They have many active programs for kids, just like Mormons and other Faiths do.

Be careful of hasty judgment--especially from older never-married, armchair-coaching bachelors who, having no family experience of their own, spend their time in their ivory towers crafting link-heavy, scare-mongering, dogma-pushing blogs on the dangers gays and lesbians pose to children.

My fiancé's and my feelings for each other, and the love we have for our children, are not 'the boogy-men' that many try to make us out to appear. You might be surprised to learn that we aren't all that different from you.

Sounds like your living a fairly normal Mormon life, despite no longer being LDS. Stories like yours need to be told more often so as to dispel people's wild imaginations.

[EllenMaksoud]

So bear with me.... In Utah right now there is a huge confrontation going on regarding Marriage Equality. Those in favor of keeping marriage between one man and one woman are saying that gay marriage hurts children. I am curious..... how exactly is a child harmed by having two gay parents who are legally married? So what is the harm to a child who has parents that are married and gay?

I don't feel qualified to run the church, but I will say that a very large number of Mormons are pretty sick of the subject. I would guess up to around 1/3 of the membership of the USA. Having said that, when I was in Honduras and Kenya,  I saw no one who was openly gay, or lesbian, and I got the impression that those who got public about it were killed, at least in Honduras.

 

So, that begs the question, does America occupy the morally high ground? And comparing the life of America with other countries, I have heard history types say that the collapse of America is soon to come.  Maybe Isis does not need to attack us? Will a wide range of marriage types become the norm or will we lapse into a culture where women do not leave the house without an armed man?

[VideoGameJunkie]

The damage will be that the family can never be sealed together in the afterlife because 2 men can and will never be sealed together. It will separate the family in the next life which can be hard on a child.

[Robert F. Smith]

..................................................................  

My fiancé and I are not alone. I know many gay families that are supportive of raising their kids LDS. Of course, that isn't universally true.... every family is different, and everyone makes different choices. I know other gay families active in my own Faith--that of Unitarian Universalist. They have many active programs for kids, just like Mormons and other Faiths do.

Be careful of hasty judgment--especially from older never-married, armchair-coaching bachelors who, having no family experience of their own, spend their time in their ivory towers crafting link-heavy, scare-mongering, dogma-pushing blogs on the dangers gays and lesbians pose to children.

 

My fiancé's and my feelings for each other, and the love we have for our children, are not 'the boogy-men' that many try to make us out to appear.  You might be surprised to learn that we aren't all that different from you.

That is nice and even praiseworthy.

 

But not at all typical.  Those of us who have lived in gay meccas, recognize another, freakier side to the gay scene.  Of course, you are doing the best you can to be civilized, decent, and accommodating, but what is the bottom line?  If Unitarian Universalism and Mormonism are not ultimately more than human expressions of one’s socio-cultural preference, is that the only meaning we take away from the discussion?

[Robert F. Smith]

Sorry.

Edited September 24, 2014 by Robert F. Smith

[Bob Crockett]

Well, if I married another woman, I certainly would not be advertising it. May be you and she just have a difference of opinion in spite of the fact that she recognizes the goodness of the teachings of the church.

 

I don't have one of those polished, gold plated testimonies of the church, but I stay and obey what I can. I certainly don't discuss my failings with someone like you who could judge me when Heavenly Father does not. I know for a fact that God put me in the church. I don't understand why, but I know he did.  I wonder how many members would excercise unrighteous dominion if they were put in the position to do so.

 

Perhaps less nattering about the failings of others and more focus on your own?

I'm just responding to the opening post. I don't know who you are and it is irrelevant. If the post asked how Lutheranism damaged children my answer would be the same. Lutheran couples and gay couples just by definition aren't likely to escorting their children to youth baptisms at the Temple. If you feel that such a comment condemns you personally you have my apologies.

[Bob Crockett]

which makes it no worse than 99.8% of the population as mormons are only  point two percent.  So then..... only mormons should have kids or at least theirs are not damaged like the rest of the world..... this is silly

Seems then that that .2 percent are better off, wouldn't you say? Wouldn't you rather have your kids going to Mutual on Wednesday nights than to a video game party or a Lutheran Bible Study group, just as a matter of policy?

[DBMormon]

Seems then that that .2 percent are better off, wouldn't you say? Wouldn't you rather have your kids going to Mutual on Wednesday nights than to a video game party or a Lutheran Bible Study group, just as a matter of policy?

I would say my kids are better off than some and not better off than others.  I thionk it is ignorance that says LDS people are better off than others in the world as an absolute.  

[Daniel2]

That is nice and even praiseworthy.

 

But not at all typical.  Those of us who have lived in gay meccas, recognize another, freakier side to the gay scene.  Of course, you are doing the best you can to be civilized, decent, and accommodating, but what is the bottom line?  If Unitarian Universalism and Mormonism are not ultimately more than human expressions of one’s socio-cultural preference, is that the only meaning we take away from the discussion?

 

Of course it isn't typical, as Mormons only make less than 2% of the general population nationwide.  But it's probably a lot more typical in Utah, given the higher percentage of Mormon inhabitants,  than many may think and realize.

 

And of COURSE "gay meccas" are going to attract "the freakier side" of "the gay scene."  Just like the "straight meccas" that center around straight sexual identities attract "the freaker side" of "the straight scene."

 

Of course, straights are doing the best they can to be civilized, decent, and accomodating, outside of straight meccas like the Las Vegas strip, New Orleans (especially during Mardi Gras), or the strip club and red light district cultures of downtown New York, Chicago, Los Angeles, Fourt Lauderdale, Dallas, etc.

 

But the "freakier side of the gay scene" isn't an accurate representation of how many of us that are gay parents live.

 

Just as America once was riddled with racial ghettos, gay ghettos were formed as a safe haven during the period of our nation's history when it was dangerous and risky to be labeled as "homosexual."  They were outcasts from their families, religions, and communities, and they fled to larger, less conspicious, densely populated areas that were naturally more diverse and where they could blend in with "the freakier side of the straight scene" and not be as noticed as they had been in their rural communities.

 

And just as the influence and identify of racial ghettos, while not yet a thing of the past, have diminished over the years as different races have integrated into the predominate "white scene," so-too, are "gayborhoods" beginning to integrate and diminish.  The "gay meccas" you speak of have noticed a decline in numbers... gay bars are closing.... gay bookstores are going out of business... gay bathhouses are becoming abandoned relics.  There are many reasons for this; technology has allowed people to connect with others; technology can help us reach across distances, feel less isloated, and find shared humanity instead of being alone; gay clubs and bars are no longer the only venue to connect with other gay people; gays are becoming accepted in their neighborhoods and live lives openly within the mainstream of society, and no longer have to isolate themselves out of fear of rejection or reparative or shock therapy.  More and more businesses are advancing diversity initiatives to attract and retain the most qualified and productive employees, regardless of sexual orientation.  More and more religions are questioning previous policies that reject gays and their families, and finding ways to be inclusive instead of excluding.  More and more medical and health professions and social organizations have recognized the potential contributions that gays and lesbians can offer abandoned, neglected, and unwanted children and youth within the foster and adoptive systems, and are open to screening and accepting gay and lesbian parents as a valuable resource to decrease the strain of the unmanegeable number of kids in that system.  Gays and lesbians can and are encouraged to adopt in a majority of states---even those that deny such couples the ability to legally marry.  Gay parents and families are seeing more supportive social and familial resources for the, like Colage, and other local parenting organizations and clubs and social groups.  Where fear decreases, mental health improves.  There is open air to breath and live and love and feel and be free.

 

And of course, the tide has turned in the battle for equal civil marriage rights for LGBT couples.  There is still much work to be done, both on the marriage equality front, and the front to secure equal anti-discrimination protections for LGBT individuals and families on the same basis that those protections are granted on the basis of race, religion, gender, and disabilities.

 

Gay families--not "the freakier side of the gay scene" (a.k.a. 'Will and Grace' or 'The L Word' or 'Queer as Folk')--no, gay families--are increasingly being shown and accepted as part of the mainstream in entertainment--though we still aren't totally there, yet.  I am finally seeing myself represented in shows like Modern Family and The Fosters---------STELLAR shows, if you haven't seen them, check them out on Netflix, especially The Fosters (they are family-friendly).

 

And so, our culture is finally realizing that there is no one "Gay Lifestyle," just like there isn't a single "Straight Lifestyle."  It would be just as wrong for us to judge all straights based on the most lascivious, selacious, and scandalous (and certainly most attention-grabbing, shocking, and therefore most reported-on) aspects of "the freakier side of straight culture."  I don't judge my straight neighbors, or get stuck thinking about what happens behind their closed doors, based on what happens on HBO, Showtime, or pornographic websites or Raves or White Parties or Mardi Gras.  Those things all happen, of course--but it's most likely that they do not represent the straight but silent and less visual majority, and that has been my experience, as well.  The same is just as true of those of us who are oriented to love and be loved (romatincally, sexually, emotionally, spiritually, intellectually, and physically) by members of our shared gender.

 

2014 has been a good year, and 2015 will hopefully be even better.

Edited September 24, 2014 by Daniel2

[Rodeo]

And yet, even though we gloss over homosexuality and pretend its normal or even praiseworthy the facts still remain that they are highly promiscuous, have way more sex partners, and are still the leading group of spreading HIV. What we need is to actually have a Hollywood show that shows the actual average gay couple lifestyle. Perhaps they could show a couple that were promiscuous, abusive, and had them going to the clinic to get regular HIV tests. Maybe then we would see the lifestyle for what it really is.

[stemelbow]

Furthermore, as also indicated on my blog: 

 

Children are also being exploited in other ways. It was little more than a third of a century ago that homosexuality was not only generally considered as morally repugnant, but the psychiatric community also deemed it a mental disorder. (See

HERE)  Whereas, nowadays, homosexuality has become generally accepted and even celebrated in pop culture. (See HERE and HERE and HERE)

How did this happen?

The relatively short transition from condemning to condoning to embracing was a function of multiple factors, but none more key than the heightened indoctrination of our Nation's children. Kids as young as fourth grade have been the intended target of stained and skillfully executed PR campaigns, which have manifest themselves both in popular media (ibid) as well as throughout our public school system (see HEREand HERE and HERE and HERE and HERE and HERE and HERE and HERE andHERE and HERE and HERE and HERE and HERE and HERE and HERE), and this under the guise of "Multiculturalism" and "Safe Schools". (See HERE and HERE andHERE)

Here is a Top 10 list of strategies homosexual activists have used in public education. (See HERE)

And, it isn't just Right-wingers making this claim. Homosexual activists have also owned up to it (see HERE and HERE), and have included it as a plank in their manifestos and agendas. (See HERE and HERE and HERE),

In spite of liberals and gays scoffing at the notion of a "gay agenda" (see HERE andHERE and HERE and HERE), as mentioned in some of the links above, the primary architects of the real, massive, and rather detailed public relations campaign were Marshall Kirk and Hunter Madsen (a.k.a. "Erastes Pill"), by way of their 1987 article in Guide Magazine, "The Overhauling of Straight America," and their 1989 book "After the Ball: How America Will Conquer Its Fear and Hatred of Gays in the ’90s."

One may easily peruse the last several decades to see ample instances where most, if not all the Kirk and Madsen PR strategies have been adeptly employed, and even less unmistakably, the intended results of escalated favorable opinions (see HERE), particularly among young people. (See HERE and HERE and HERE and HERE)

Now, understandably, homosexual sympathizers have been quick to distance homosexuality from pedophilia (see HERE and HERE and HERE) even though studies have raised serious concerns somewhat to the contrary (see HERE and HEREand HERE and HERE). And, clever semantics have been employed to give the impression of greater distance than in reality (see HERE), and bold declarations by gay activists about child recruitment have been ardently downplayed (see HERE andHERE and HERE and HERE and HERE)

Never mind the fact that gay rights organizations like Boston-Boise Committee and the Mattachine Society and Gay Activist Alliance gave rise to the pedophilia/pederasty movement (see HERE and HERE and HERE), and several leading gay voices in the 1970's went on to become founding members and staunch supporters of NAMBLA and other pederast causes (see HERE and HERE and HERE and HERE and HEREand HERE and HERE), not to mention that until the late 80's and early 90's, NAMBLA published a gay pedophilia magazine (see HERE and HERE and HEREand HERE), and was a part of several gay alliances (see HERE and HERE and HEREand HERE and HERE), and was even a welcomed participant in gay pride parades (see HERE and HERE and HERE and HERE and HERE) until it became politically inexpedient (see HERE), even though not a few people on the Left are in denial about this (see HERE).

It should come as no surprise, then, that pedophilia, which is estimated to be as prevalent if not more so than homosexuality (see HERE), has surged in reported incidences following the successes of the gay movement (see HERE and HERE andHERE and HERE and HERE), and that the movement has become a springboard for so-called "intergenerational sexuality" ( and HERE and HERE and HERE and HEREand HERE and HERE and HERE), which is the new code word for adults having sex with kids (see ibid, and HERE), as well as emboldening the movement towards pedophilia rights and normalization (see HERE and HERE and HERE and HEREand HERE and HERE and HERE and HERE and HERE and HERE and HERE andHERE and HERE and HERE and HERE and HERE)

This is not to equate homosexuality with pedophilia, or even suggest that homosexuals are generally in favor of sex with children. Rather, it is to show yet another way in which homosexuals have not only countenanced, but have used kids for their adult sake.

To summarize, one of the most disturbing aspects of the presumably adult issue of  "same-sex marriage," and the Leftist LUNC here is, how children have been falsely exploited to promote the cause, and yet sadly, as has been and will be shown in the following articles, if not also in due time, these children are at most risk of suffering the consequences of this radical social experiment.  

 

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

I'd suggest to consider that because Homosexuality was considered so bad by society at large, negative effects occurred in terms of uncommitted relationships. Give it more time as acceptable in society and see how different, if at all, such relationships are. As of now, the comparison is terrible.

Edited September 24, 2014 by stemelbow

[Mola Ram Suda Ram]

I'd suggest to consider that because Homosexuality was considered so bad by society at large, negative effects occurred in terms of uncommitted relationships. Give it more time as acceptable in society and see how different, if at all, such relationships are. As of now, the comparison is terrible.

Say anything to turn a blind eye to the dangers of the homosexual life stile and the indoctrination that it is "all good". The blatant dismissal is quite telling. Anything you say on this subject is to not be taken seriously.

[stemelbow]

Say anything to turn a blind eye to the dangers of the homosexual life stile and the indoctrination that it is "all good". The blatant dismissal is quite telling. Anything you say on this subject is to not be taken seriously.

I'm not sure what to make of this. I think it's fair to consider pariah-ing people because they are different will cause negative effects among that designated group. To call such consideration turning blind eye and indoctrination seems absurd on the face of it. It seems to be the epitome of projection.

After all, considering all the factors of the whys in studies is not dismissing the results. It's trying to understand them.

[wenglund]

no, but be sure to pack your strawman real tight in hopes I take the fork in the road.... but I will be heading yonder in another direction.  you need more straw in that arm.....  

 

It doesn't surprise me that you would conflate facts with straw even in the face of Daniel's personal experience inadvertently underscoring my point. 

 

 

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

[Bob Crockett]

I would say my kids are better off than some and not better off than others.  I thionk it is ignorance that says LDS people are better off than others in the world as an absolute.

I apologize for being ignorant. But this is a Mormon board where there is usually an assumption that putting your kids into a Mormon youth program is better than putting them into a Lutheran program, or some sort of gay-themed program. When I go out working with the missionaries that is what I tell people and I hope I'm not telling them lies.

[JLHPROF]

I would say my kids are better off than some and not better off than others.  I thionk it is ignorance that says LDS people are better off than others in the world as an absolute.  

 

No, if they know of the gospel, have access and take advantage of the ordinances and priesthood, and grow up with testimonies of Christ and the restoration, then they are 100% better off than the rest of the world.  Absolutely.

[Rodeo]

No, if they know of the gospel, have access and take advantage of the ordinances and priesthood, and grow up with testimonies of Christ and the restoration, then they are 100% better off than the rest of the world.  Absolutely.

I agree. If we were to live as the prophets have exactly instructed us, it would mean we would be living at the top tier of all that is possible to ensure the happiness, safety and salvation of our souls eternally.

[wenglund]

Oh, Wade.... I am sorry that the obvious answer is staring you in the face, and you seem so blinded that you can't even see it.

By allowing gays and lesbians to marry a spouse of the gender to whom they are romantically, emotionally, spiritually, and physically attracted, less will feel pressure to enter mixed-orientation straight marriages out of a sense of religious or social duty that are statistically so doomed to fail, and so harmful for all concerned.

Church leaders within the LDS community have changed and are now vocally opposing such mixed-orientation marriages, having seen the devastation that divorce causes to the children involved.

Because gays and lesbians will be free to lead lives openly, honestly, and with integrity, and marrying same sex spouses of their choice, and with churches recognizing and abandoning ill-advised, albeit with previously-well-intentioned advice for gay men to "just get married, and all those gay feelings will take care of themselves/the Lord will bless you with heterosexual feelings as you follow his counsel/etc," there will BE fewer of the very marriages, and therefore divorces (and most importantly, children suffering such divorces) that you so readily condemn, and which are so accurately described as being devastating for children, mothers, and fathers.

Having said that.... sometimes, staying in an abusive marriage (straight or gay) is worse for both the children and adults than recognizing a need to end an abuse relationship, heeding the counsel of friends, family, ecclesiastical leaders, and health professionals intimately involved with the case.

You know little of "my own personal family circumstances" that drove me to divorce. You apparently see a divorced LDS gay man and assume that it ended because of some selfish desire on his part to follow some selfish need on his part.

You do not know the full story of why I divorced. And you never will. Because I have made it a point to not share the specifics of the details surrounding my case, and avoid speaking ill of my ex-wife. My children are growing, and may someday read the posts I write on these pages. Out of respect for their mother---but mostly out of respect for my children---I avoid trash talk, because that is the most healthy. Suffice it to say, divorce isn't the result of any single factor, and some divorces------even according to LDS belief--are justifiable (as recommended by our bishop and close family members at the time).

So please, don't presume to know everything about me, just because you see a portion of the equality I now fight for, here.

And I would suggest it's best for you to avoid slandering an entire group of divorcees------a topic about which a confirmed bachelor like yourself has absolutely no personal experience, and little knowledge or wisdom.

 

I clearly touched a nerve. There is a reason that you continue to carp on the irrelevant fact that the Church no longer encourages members with SSA to enter into heterosexual marriages, while ignoring the relevant fact that the Church strongly discourages members breaking up traditional families, including by way of pursuits of homosexual lust. You are in deep denial, and understandably so. How else can you abide your selfish and immoral choices to the detriment of your children?

 

Granted, I don't know all there is to know about your personal life, nor do I care to know. However, you have disclosed enough online over the years for me to get that you committed adultery via a homosexual relationship and subsequently tore your family apart, and that you now share partial custody of your children along with your gay partner.

 

I only mention this because you have been unrepentant and proudly open about it on this and other LDS forums, and more importantly because it underscores what I have been saying. Otherwise, it would have been none of my business and I would have said nothing about it.

 

You will note that I haven't mentioned californiaboy's personal experience, and this is because he has been quite a bit more circumspect and less haughty about airing his dirty laundry in public. If you are sensitive about your personal life, you would do well to take a clue from him.

 

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

 

Wade is out of the thread for being too personal.

[Daniel2]

And yet, even though we gloss over homosexuality and pretend its normal or even praiseworthy the facts still remain that they are highly promiscuous, have way more sex partners, and are still the leading group of spreading HIV. What we need is to actually have a Hollywood show that shows the actual average gay couple lifestyle. Perhaps they could show a couple that were promiscuous, abusive, and had them going to the clinic to get regular HIV tests. Maybe then we would see the lifestyle for what it really is.

Who's advocating "glossing over homosexuality"? What does that even mean...?

Homosexuality isn't normal for everyone--it's only normal for homosexuals. In the same fashion, heterosexuality is normal for heterosexuals.

Promiscuity is and had been understandably higher amount the gay (male) population than it is the heterosexual population, which in turn is more promiscuous than the gay (female) population. There's likely a variety of factors that contribute to this.

Clearly, encouraging lifelong abstinence, reparation therapy, mixed orientation marriages, withholding socially recognized same-sex marriages that could promote stable, monogamous relationships, and/or ongoing shaming and condemnation haven't had much effect on lowering gay male promiscuity. Go figure.

I'm not sure your statement that gays are "the leading group of spreading HIV" is accurate.

There have been gay shows accurately depicting gay life as you're suggesting, including raising awareness of the dangers of promiscuity, domestic violence, getting regularly tested for HIV, and living with (as well as dying from) the devastation of AIDS. Its called Queer as Folk, as well as HBO's recent The Normal Heart, The Band Played On, and a variety of other independent gay-themed films and documentaries. However, those shows have content unsuitable for cable, aren't targeted towards nor likely watched by LDS audiences, which would likely explain your ignorance about them.

Edited September 24, 2014 by Daniel2

[wenglund]

I'd suggest to consider that because Homosexuality was considered so bad by society at large, negative effects occurred in terms of uncommitted relationships. Give it more time as acceptable in society and see how different, if at all, such relationships are. As of now, the comparison is terrible.

 

While certainly well intended, your's is an incredibly naive and myopic view of the situation, and a lame dismissal of the wealth of supportive documentation I presented (much of which is fairly contemporary to our homosexual-friendly culture).

 

What is actually terrible is how easily and yet extensively you and others have not only been duped, but also the seemingly closed-minded tenacity with which you hold onto the dupe. I unleashed a deluge of countervailing data, and you are unfazed, Astonishing, 

 

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

[Rodeo]

Who's advocating "glossing over homosexuality"? What does that even mean...?

Homosexuality isn't normal for everyone--it's only normal for homosexuals. In the same fashion, heterosexuality is normal for heterosexuals.

Promiscuity is and had been understandably higher amount the gay (male) population than it is the heterosexual population, which in turn is more promiscuous than the gay (female) population. There's likely a variety of factors that contribute to this.

Clearly, encouraging lifelong abstinence, reparation therapy, mixed orientation marriages, withholding socially recognized same-sex marriages that could promote stable, monogamous relationships, and/or ongoing shaming and condemnation haven't had much effect on lowering gay male promiscuity. Go figure.

I'm not sure your statement that gays are "the leading group of spreading HIV" is accurate.

There have been gay shows accurately depicting gay life as you're suggesting, including raising awareness of the dangers of promiscuity, domestic violence, getting regularly tested for HIV, and living with (as well as dying from) the devastation of AIDS. Its called Queer as Folk, as well as HBO's recent The Normal Heart, The Band Played On, and a variety of other independent gay-themed films and documentaries. However, those shows have content unsuitable for cable, aren't targeted towards nor likely watched by LDS audiences, which would likely explain your ignorance about them.

According to the CDC, homosexuals are the main cause for the spread of HIV. http://www.cdc.gov/hiv/risk/gender/msm/facts/

[Bob Crockett]

No, if they know of the gospel, have access and take advantage of the ordinances and priesthood, and grow up with testimonies of Christ and the restoration, then they are 100% better off than the rest of the world.  Absolutely.

Bill has a rather unusual view that Mormonism may not be the best way to God's presence and may in fact be an inferior way. No real cites to authority on that, but that is his view. Of course, there's too much in the Book of Mormon and the D&C to contradict that.

[Mola Ram Suda Ram]

According to the CDC, homosexuals are the main cause for the spread of HIV. http://www.cdc.gov/hiv/risk/gender/msm/facts/

Don't bother us with the that biased right-wing source of information. Why spread the hate. Are you inline with Elder Andersen's view of love? How does stating this show that we love the homosexuals? One day gay marriage will be in the temple.