Duncan Posted September 9, 2013 Posted September 9, 2013 I know that in the Doctrine and Covenants it mentions the Twelve Apostles are to be "Special witnesses of Christ" and the Seventy are to be "especial witnesses" but what is the difference between special and especial?
Darren10 Posted September 9, 2013 Posted September 9, 2013 "Especial" is the Spanish / Portuguese translation for the English "special". 1
Darren10 Posted September 9, 2013 Posted September 9, 2013 (edited) Huh, I did not know "especial" existed in English: es·pe·cial /ɪˈspɛʃəl/ Show Spelled [ih-spesh-uhl] Show IPA adjective 1. special; exceptional; outstanding: of no especial importance; an especial friend. 2. of a particular kind, or peculiar to a particular one; particular: your especial case. Compared to: spe·cial /ˈspɛʃəl/ Show Spelled [spesh-uhl] Show IPA adjective 1. of a distinct or particular kind or character: a special kind of key. 2. being a particular one; particular, individual, or certain: You'd better call the special number. 3. pertaining or peculiar to a particular person, thing, instance, etc.; distinctive; unique: the special features of a plan. 4. having a specific or particular function, purpose, etc.: a special messenger. 5. distinguished or different from what is ordinary or usual: a special occasion; to fix something special. Both definitions are from dictionary.reference.com. Edited September 9, 2013 by Darren10
Darren10 Posted September 9, 2013 Posted September 9, 2013 I guess that the 70 are exceptional witnesses of Christ but the Quorum of the 12 are "particular" / "distinct" witnesses of Christ. It makes a lot of sense to me. The original 12 tarried with Christ Himself and we know visions of Christ happened in the New Testament after Christ's ascension into heaven. Interesting here is that although Paul was not part of the 12 Christ ordained, he, Paul, was nonetheless qualified, i think, to be a "particular" witness of Christ since he saw Christ in the Savior's godly state of existence.
Scott Lloyd Posted September 9, 2013 Posted September 9, 2013 I think you guys are reading too much into this.Especial is a somewhat archaic synonym for special. Consider its adverb form especially. 1
Darren10 Posted September 9, 2013 Posted September 9, 2013 I think you guys are reading too much into this. Especial is a somewhat archaic synonym for special. Consider its adverb form especially. According to my rerence, it is an adjective and carries it's own distinct / "special" meaning from thwe word "special".
The Nehor Posted September 9, 2013 Posted September 9, 2013 The Seventy are more pretentious about it? 2
Darren10 Posted September 9, 2013 Posted September 9, 2013 Also, here's the entire "especial" verse: 25 The Seventy are also called to preach the gospel, and to be especial witnesses unto the Gentiles and in all the world—thus differing from other officers in the church in the duties of their calling. It specifically mentions a differentiation of the 70 from the "other officers" of the LDS Church. The officers previously mentioned in the same chapter (107) were the Quorum of the 12 and First Presidency. Thus "especial" is used to differenticate the 70 from the rest of the officers ofthe Church, not to create something synomynous (at least not entirely) with other Church officers.
Darren10 Posted September 9, 2013 Posted September 9, 2013 The Seventy are more pretentious about it? Here: pre·ten·tious/prɪˈtɛnʃəs/ Show Spelled [pri-ten-shuhs] Show IPA adjective 1. characterized by assumption of dignity or importance, especially when exaggerated or undeserved: a pretentious, self-important waiter. 2. making an exaggerated outward show; ostentatious. 3. full of pretense or pretension. If they were self agrandizing their positions, yes, that would make the Quorum of the 70 pretentious but since it is God who declares their "exaggerated" importance, than, no, they are not pretentious.
Darren10 Posted September 9, 2013 Posted September 9, 2013 (edited) I just read the Spanish and Portuguese versions of the Doctrine and Covenants and there is no distinction of words between "special" and "especial". (Portuguese) 23 Os doze conselheiros viajantes são chamados para ser os Doze Apóstolos, ou seja, testemunhas especiais do nome de Cristo no mundo todo—diferindo assim dos outros oficiais da igreja nos deveres de seu chamado. 25 Os Setenta também são chamados para pregar o evangelho e ser testemunhas especiais junto aos gentios e em todo o mundo—diferindo assim dos outros oficiais da igreja nos deveres de seu chamado. (Spanish) 23 Los doce consejeros viajantes son llamados para ser los Doce Apóstoles, o sea, testigos especiales del nombre de Cristo en todo el mundo, y así se distinguen de los otros oficiales de la iglesia en los deberes de su llamamiento. 25 Los Setenta también son llamados para predicar el evangelio y ser testigos especiales a los gentiles y en todo el mundo, y así se distinguen de otros oficiales de la iglesia en los deberes de su llamamiento. Edited September 9, 2013 by Darren10
DBMormon Posted September 9, 2013 Posted September 9, 2013 Also just to add. The newest edition of the gospel principle book states a apostle in not a witness of Christ (old definition) but rather a witness for his name (new definiton) not sure what that all means either. http://www.lds.org/manual/gospel-principles/chapter-17-the-church-of-jesus-christ-today?lang=eng Twelve Apostles, who are special witnesses of the name of Jesus Christ, teach the gospel and regulate the affairs of the Church in all parts of the world.
Darren10 Posted September 9, 2013 Posted September 9, 2013 Also just to add. The newest edition of the gospel principle book states a apostle in not a witness of Christ (old definition) but rather a witness for his name (new definiton) not sure what that all means either. http://www.lds.org/manual/gospel-principles/chapter-17-the-church-of-jesus-christ-today?lang=eng That does not seem to make a difference as to the Quorum of the 12 being "special witnesses" of Jesus Christ.
The Nehor Posted September 9, 2013 Posted September 9, 2013 If they were self agrandizing their positions, yes, that would make the Quorum of the 70 pretentious but since it is God who declares their "exaggerated" importance, than, no, they are not pretentious.I meant God was being pretentious on their behalf. Either that or a scribal error. I find the former more fun.
CV75 Posted September 9, 2013 Posted September 9, 2013 (edited) I know that in the Doctrine and Covenants it mentions the Twelve Apostles are to be "Special witnesses of Christ" and the Seventy are to be "especial witnesses" but what is the difference between special and especial?It seems they can be used interchangeably: D&C 27: 12, And also with Peter, and James, and John, whom I have sent unto you, by whom I have ordained you and confirmed you to be apostles, and especial witnesses of my name, and bear the keys of your ministry and of the same things which I revealed unto them; D&C 107: 23,The twelve traveling councilors are called to be the Twelve Apostles, or special witnesses of the name of Christ in all the world—thus differing from other officers in the church in the duties of their calling. While every member takes upon himself the name of Jesus Christ (D&C 20:37) and stands as a witness of God in all things (Mosiah 18:9), a special witness of the actual name of Christ seems to convey the authority to bind and seal the witness we have made, by virtue of the keys they possess, in preparation for being sealed by the Holy Spirit of Promise. Edited September 9, 2013 by CV75 2
Duncan Posted September 9, 2013 Author Posted September 9, 2013 It seems they can be used interchangeably: D&C 27: 12, And also with Peter, and James, and John, whom I have sent unto you, by whom I have ordained you and confirmed you to be apostles, and especial witnesses of my name, and bear the keys of your ministry and of the same things which I revealed unto them; D&C 107: 23,The twelve traveling councilors are called to be the Twelve Apostles, or special witnesses of the name of Christ in all the world—thus differing from other officers in the church in the duties of their calling. While every member takes upon himself the name of Jesus Christ (D&C 20:37) and stands as a witness of God in all things (Mosiah 18:9), a special witness of the actual name of Christ seems to convey the authority to bind and seal the witness we have made, by virtue of the keys they possess, in preparation for being sealed by the Holy Spirit of Promise. what do you think is the lived experience of the part about "while every member"? how does this play out in real life?
Darren10 Posted September 9, 2013 Posted September 9, 2013 (edited) I meant God was being pretentious on their behalf. Either that or a scribal error. I find the former more fun. When God's pretentious, then it's OK. When mortals are pretentous, then they better claim scribble error. Edited September 10, 2013 by Darren10
CV75 Posted September 9, 2013 Posted September 9, 2013 what do you think is the lived experience of the part about "while every member"? how does this play out in real life?I think we each carry out (D&C 20:37) and (Mosiah 18:9) by degrees, but hopefully we can all be gathered to the Lord before the Final Judgement, and hopefully that's a looooong way off! 1
Scott Lloyd Posted September 10, 2013 Posted September 10, 2013 (edited) According to my rerence, it is an adjective and carries it's own distinct / "special" meaning from thwe word "special".I know it's an adjective. I said "especially" is its adverb form. Look up "especially" and you'll find it identified as an adverb, like most -ly words. And I don't see any material difference in the meanings you quoted. But what matters is the meanings the two words had back in the day when Joseph Smith used them in penning these sections. I still say it's a matter of "po-ta-to" vs "po-tah-to." Edited September 10, 2013 by Scott Lloyd
Scott Lloyd Posted September 10, 2013 Posted September 10, 2013 Also just to add. The newest edition of the gospel principle book states a apostle in not a witness of Christ (old definition) but rather a witness for his name (new definiton) not sure what that all means either.http://www.lds.org/manual/gospel-principles/chapter-17-the-church-of-jesus-christ-today?lang=engA lot of nitpicking going on here, say I.
Darren10 Posted September 10, 2013 Posted September 10, 2013 A lot of nitpicking going on here, say I. I don't know. Where are the nits?
Scott Lloyd Posted September 10, 2013 Posted September 10, 2013 (edited) Also just to add. The newest edition of the gospel principle book states a apostle in not a witness of Christ (old definition) but rather a witness for his name (new definiton) not sure what that all means either. http://www.lds.org/manual/gospel-principles/chapter-17-the-church-of-jesus-christ-today?lang=engIt probably means that the wording in the new manual was refined to more closely conform to the phrasing in scripture (see Doctrine and Covenants 27:12). That is, it's not that the old wording was wrong or repudiated, it's that it was adjusted to more accurately reflect the scriptural teaching. Edited September 10, 2013 by Scott Lloyd
WmLaw Posted September 10, 2013 Posted September 10, 2013 It probably means that the wording in the new manual was refined to more closely conform to the phrasing in scripture (see Doctrine and Covenants 27:12). That is, it's not that the old wording was wrong or repudiated, it's that it was adjusted to more accurately reflect the scriptural teaching.Or is it more subtle - Is it indicating that they are not necessarily 'witnesses' of Christ, as in visitations or visions, but as witnesses of his divine words and works?
Calm Posted September 10, 2013 Posted September 10, 2013 (edited) Or is it more subtle - Is it indicating that they are not necessarily 'witnesses' of Christ, as in visitations or visions, but as witnesses of his divine words and works?The Gospel Principles manual is not meant for subtleness, imo. Seventies are special witnesses of Jesus Christ to the world and assist in building up and regulating the Church under the direction of the First Presidency and Quorum of the Twelve Apostles (see D&C 107:25, 34, 38, 93–97). http://www.lds.org/manual/gospel-principles/chapter-14-priesthood-organization?lang=eng This has been the gift of prophets and apostles who have been called as special witnesses of Jesus Christ. http://www.lds.org/manual/gospel-principles/chapter-22-the-gifts-of-the-spirit?lang=eng Edited September 10, 2013 by calmoriah
Scott Lloyd Posted September 10, 2013 Posted September 10, 2013 (edited) Or is it more subtle - Is it indicating that they are not necessarily 'witnesses' of Christ, as in visitations or visions, but as witnesses of his divine words and works?I'm confident that in this instance the intent is to convey with exactness what is in the scriptures, and the change in wording is intended neither as an affirmation nor a denial that the apostles receive visitations or visions. So again I say that speculating or nitpicking about a simple revision in a lesson manual is not going to be very productive. Sorry to be a killjoy. I realize that reality usually isn't much fun when compared with conjecture. Edited September 10, 2013 by Scott Lloyd 1
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