Violating D&C 89

[mfbukowski]

I've heard that joke before, but not in context of becoming a Mormon (just quitting drinking), but it is definitely better in your version. I'm going to tell my wife the joke and see if she laughs.

I think that makes it- my wife laughed but told me I couldn't tell that one over the pulpit. (I still haven't totally grasped Mormon Culture after 30 years of membership)

I like it because it captures our tendency to make excuses about the W.O.W.- no ice tea but diet coke is ok- Postum is in, but coffee is out, near-beer is ok but real beer is taboo, Jesus drank grape juice, not wine- etc

[Stone holm]

I think that makes it- my wife laughed but told me I couldn't tell that one over the pulpit. (I still haven't totally grasped Mormon Culture after 30 years of membership)

I like it because it captures our tendency to make excuses about the W.O.W.- no ice tea but diet coke is ok- Postum is in, but coffee is out, near-beer is ok but real beer is taboo, Jesus drank grape juice, not wine- etc

Told it to mine, she didn't laugh...oh well, I thought it was funny.

[ERayR]

Told it to mine, she didn't laugh...oh well, I thought it was funny.

Is my wife the only one with a sense of humor?

[thesometimesaint]

Do you know why you should never invite just one Mormon on a fishing trip? If alone they'll drink all the beer, and smoke all the cigarettes.

[Stone holm]

Is my wife the only one with a sense of humor?

I told it while in the course of explaining that I wanted to work it into an HP lesson.

[sdc999]

Is my wife the only one with a sense of humor?

My wife and I don't always have the same sense of humor. My oldest daughter and I do. The recent video of the circus in Shanghi of the bear and the monkey riding the bicycles around the ring. The monkey falls over and the bear, making the best of the opportunity, stops and eats the monkey. I laughed for 5 minutes and my daughter, "I think it's best we don't show that to mom."

[Calm]

My wife and I don't always have the same sense of humor. My oldest daughter and I do. The recent video of the circus in Shanghi of the bear and the monkey riding the bicycles around the ring. The monkey falls over and the bear, making the best of the opportunity, stops and eats the monkey. I laughed for 5 minutes and my daughter, "I think it's best we don't show that to mom."

I'm with Mom on this....

[TruthSeeker2013]

I was under great pressure to change who I was. Imagine telling the Stake President that you believed in Joseph Smith, the BOM, and all the standard documents. That, and I still believed in the Prophet Muhammad PBUH, and the Qur'an, simply feeling that Islam was the intermediate step between Jesus Christ and Martin Luther, and finally on to Joseph Smith. Outside, I am quintessential Mormon woman. Inside I am still Hijabi.

People all the time get culture mixed up with doctrine.

Fascinating. I love to hear stories of big-tent Mormonism. On another note, while you distingiush your beliefs from your culture, I've often wondered what it would be like to be both Mormon and Jewish, for example, or Mormon and Buddhist. I think it could be enlightening.

[Ahab]

I think that makes it- my wife laughed but told me I couldn't tell that one over the pulpit. (I still haven't totally grasped Mormon Culture after 30 years of membership)

I like it because it captures our tendency to make excuses about the W.O.W.- no ice tea but diet coke is ok- Postum is in, but coffee is out, near-beer is ok but real beer is taboo, Jesus drank grape juice, not wine- etc

You can go ahead and call it an "excuse" if you want to but I prefer to think of it as explaining my reasoning.

Diet coke is okay because caffeine isn't restricted by the W.O.W. and if a member of the Church has a personal opinion on it then it is his or her personal opinion and we can still have our own personal opinion even if it doesn't agree with the personal opinion of some other person. And the same principle holds true for all of those other things you mentioned.

Certain things are restricted by the Lord, and then some other things are restricted because of the various personal opinions of various people in a crowd. We'll never get to the point where everyone agrees with us so you should do whatever you feel is right, preferably doing the will of the Lord in all things.

[Stone holm]

You can go ahead and call it an "excuse" if you want to but I prefer to think of it as explaining my reasoning.

Diet coke is okay because caffeine isn't restricted by the W.O.W. and if a member of the Church has a personal opinion on it then it is his or her personal opinion and we can still have our own personal opinion even if it doesn't agree with the personal opinion of some other person. And the same principle holds true for all of those other things you mentioned.

Certain things are restricted by the Lord, and then some other things are restricted because of the various personal opinions of various people in a crowd. We'll never get to the point where everyone agrees with us so you should do whatever you feel is right, preferably doing the will of the Lord in all things.

Diet Coke isn't restricted because too many Saints are addicted to it. The Brethren in the past have indicated they wouldn't have it in their homes -- but I was at a Varsity Scout Woodbadge course once and mid-way on a hot hike they had a truck pull up with nothing but caffeinated beverages in it which I thought was odd because 100% of the adult leaders taking the course were LDS.

[ERayR]

You can go ahead and call it an "excuse" if you want to but I prefer to think of it as explaining my reasoning.

Diet coke is okay because caffeine isn't restricted by the W.O.W. and if a member of the Church has a personal opinion on it then it is his or her personal opinion and we can still have our own personal opinion even if it doesn't agree with the personal opinion of some other person. And the same principle holds true for all of those other things you mentioned.

Certain things are restricted by the Lord, and then some other things are restricted because of the various personal opinions of various people in a crowd. We'll never get to the point where everyone agrees with us so you should do whatever you feel is right, preferably doing the will of the Lord in all things.

I have only one question: Does it have to be diet Coke to be ok? What about regular Dr. Pepper or regular Dr. Pepper Cherry?

[ERayR]

Diet Coke isn't restricted because too many Saints are addicted to it. The Brethren in the past have indicated they wouldn't have it in their homes -- but I was at a Varsity Scout Woodbadge course once and mid-way on a hot hike they had a truck pull up with nothing but caffeinated beverages in it which I thought was odd because 100% of the adult leaders taking the course were LDS.

If you read the labels there are not many soft drinks that are not caffeinated.

[Tsuzuki]

How far to we take free agency?

Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law.

[Ahab]

I have only one question: Does it have to be diet Coke to be ok? What about regular Dr. Pepper or regular Dr. Pepper Cherry?

Heh, I hope you're not asking me to answer that question for you. You can come up with your own answers, ya know.

For me it usually is Diet AND Caffeine-free Dr. Pepper Cherry Vanilla, or just the ... Cherry flavored, or just the Diet Dr. Pepper if I can't get the caffeine free version. But sometimes I will also go with the Coke versions, or a Pepsi version, when the mood strikes me. Or sometimes I go with an Orange soda, or a Black Cherry soda, or a Lemon-Lime soda, or some other kind of soda when I'm in the mood for a soda. And when I go caffeine free it's not because I'm thinking I'm not supposed to be drinking the caffeinated version, but just because I really don't need the caffeine and it doesn't really add muchto the flavor anyway.

And about our guys who say they don't like to have soda in their house... I think that's just a thing some older people do when they start thinking more about their health while trying to choose more healthy foods and drinks. I sometimes go on a health kick too, only wanting to drink water or lemonade, but then later I just get in the mood to have myself a soda !

[ERayR]

Heh, I hope you're not asking me to answer that question for you. You can come up with your own answers, ya know.

For me it usually is Diet AND Caffeine-free Dr. Pepper Cherry Vanilla, or just the ... Cherry flavored, or just the Diet Dr. Pepper if I can't get the caffeine free version. But sometimes I will also go with the Coke versions, or a Pepsi version, when the mood strikes me. Or sometimes I go with an Orange soda, or a Black Cherry soda, or a Lemon-Lime soda, or some other kind of soda when I'm in the mood for a soda. And when I go caffeine free it's not because I'm thinking I'm not supposed to be drinking the caffeinated version, but just because I really don't need the caffeine and it doesn't really add muchto the flavor anyway.

And about our guys who say they don't like to have soda in their house... I think that's just a thing some older people do when they start thinking more about their health while trying to choose more healthy foods and drinks. I sometimes go on a health kick too, only wanting to drink water or lemonade, but then later I just get in the mood to have myself a soda !

Tongue in cheek. Though I would seriously question the use of artificial sweeteners as it seems there is evidence of deleterious effects on the kidneys from their use.

[Ahab]

Tongue in cheek. Though I would seriously question the use of artificial sweeteners as it seems there is evidence of deleterious effects on the kidneys from their use.

Yeah, so my wife has been telling me lately. Kinda sad too because I'd rather not have to worry about calories when I'm having a soda. I think I may have found an okay alternative, though, at least for sodas other than colas. My boys have a SodaStream machine they use to make sodas from those syrups people use to make Italian sodas with. For some reason I prefer the fizzy pops instead of drinks without carbonation. Pretty soon someone will probably say the carbonation isn't good for us, either.

[Stone holm]

Yeah, so my wife has been telling me lately. Kinda sad too because I'd rather not have to worry about calories when I'm having a soda. I think I may have found an okay alternative, though, at least for sodas other than colas. My boys have a SodaStream machine they use to make sodas from those syrups people use to make Italian sodas with. For some reason I prefer the fizzy pops instead of drinks without carbonation. Pretty soon someone will probably say the carbonation isn't good for us, either.

If you were around my wife much, the "pretty soon" would have already be past tense, carbonation isn't good for us. Not that I pay attention.

[Ahab]

If you were around my wife much, the "pretty soon" would have already be past tense, carbonation isn't good for us. Not that I pay attention.

For me it doesn't count until my wife tells me something. And even then I will usually still wait for God to tell me, too.

[EllenMaksoud]

Fascinating. I love to hear stories of big-tent Mormonism. On another note, while you distingiush your beliefs from your culture, I've often wondered what it would be like to be both Mormon and Jewish, for example, or Mormon and Buddhist. I think it could be enlightening.

I know Mormons that are very into Buddisim and will often say Namistase to others, or even over the pulpit. I have traveled a bit and love to learn of other cultures. It is extremely surprising to me that Mormons send Missionaries all over the world, but they seem to bring little of it home. It really makes me gnash my teeth when people tell me that Hijab is a religious symbol. Yallah !!!

Muhammad PBUH traveled a great deal before Islam and talked to Jews and Christians. I have heard that Joseph Smith had a Qur'an and read it. Knowledge is where we find it people ! I know a man that worked in Saudi Arabia for ARAMCO for 10 years and had his family with him. The wife even speaks of wearing the Niqab when she went out of the compound. How could a whole family live over there and not bring back some cultural understanding?

I like to think that in my experiences I learned from the good and the bad.

It's been 26 months since Heavenly Father dragged a very frightened and rejected feeling Muslim woman to the Mormons. These are the happiest days of my life!

[ERayR]

I know Mormons that are very into Buddisim and will often say Namistase to others, or even over the pulpit. I have traveled a bit and love to learn of other cultures. It is extremely surprising to me that Mormons send Missionaries all over the world, but they seem to bring little of it home. It really makes me gnash my teeth when people tell me that Hijab is a religious symbol. Yallah !!!

Muhammad PBUH traveled a great deal before Islam and talked to Jews and Christians. I have heard that Joseph Smith had a Qur'an and read it. Knowledge is where we find it people ! I know a man that worked in Saudi Arabia for ARAMCO for 10 years and had his family with him. The wife even speaks of wearing the Niqab when she went out of the compound. How could a whole family live over there and not bring back some cultural understanding?

I like to think that in my experiences I learned from the good and the bad.

It's been 26 months since Heavenly Father dragged a very frightened and rejected feeling Muslim woman to the Mormons. These are the happiest days of my life!

It has been my experience that a great many missionaries do bring back with them the most important things they learned in their missions. Almost 100% bring back a respect and love for the people they served and almost that many find a renewed respect and love of their own country and culture. What more could you ask than respect for and love of others from a different culture combined with a new respect and commitment to their own.

Congratulations on 26 months of commitment and growth and happiness. May it continue for eternity.

[Stone holm]

For me it doesn't count until my wife tells me something. And even then I will usually still wait for God to tell me, too.

Actually, that reminds me of an incident that occurred shortly after we were baptised in 76, the Sisters who taught us , taught that caffeinated beverages except hot chocolate were within the ban. We were busily engaged in missionary work and one eager investigator who spoke broken English thought they said "carbonated" beverages and was aghast when they accepted Vernors at our house. We raised our kids shunning caffeinated beverages, and that seemed to be the general tradition in our area, but we noticed that people moving in from out west did not follow that tradition. Although most of my large family are inactive, I notice that most still obey the word of wisdom and still inquire as to whether the root beer is the type with caffeine in it or not when at a restaurant, all of them except my daughter who is an MD and chases down caffeine pills with Mountain Dew...go figure.

[EllenMaksoud]

I have become comfortable enough with who I am that I would not and do not compromise my principles to be accepted or liked. I think it is a mistake to do so. If you do you end up with no principles and no friends.

It feels strange and unusual to begin to know people who have not feared for their life at their father's hand. It is also wonderful.

[Tacenda]

It feels strange and unusual to begin to know people who have not feared for their life at their father's hand. It is also wonderful.

Ellen, it breaks my heart to hear of your suffering at the hands of your father. I hope you find many father figures in the church to take his place. I hope I'm not overstepping my bounds in saying this. I've heard many times that an abused child still loves their parent. But they can only take so much. Edited May 17, 2013 by Tacenda

[EllenMaksoud]

Ellen, it breaks my heart to hear of your suffering at the hands of your father. I hope you find many father figures in the church to take his place. I hope I'm not overstepping my bounds in saying this. I've heard many times that an abused child still loves their parent. But they can only take so much.

The miracle of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints is that people are healed of things that others think are impossible. Finding the Tablets, The Stone Box, the early settlements, the proof is just unnecessary when Heavenly Father barges into your life.

[ronin]

It is interesting to note that the word of wisdom is just that, a recommendation. I know that in the last century the church has come down on the side of it being a commandment but the fact remains that for the first half of the history of the church all of the things mentioned in the word of wisdom were used by all in the church. I understand the principle of line upon line and that we are supposed to be held to a higher standard however when you consider that mild alcoholic drinks have been used and there use documented by our scriptures from the beginning it makes you wonder why the Lord suddenly changed his mind and told us no more.