Pres. Uchtdorf'S Priesthood Talk About Diversity

[Stone holm]

What is the consensus on where Pres. Uchtdorf meant to lead the Church on the subject of diversity. What did his remarks about non-homogenizing mean? Are we going to loosen up about beards? Be more European in our outlook? What was he getting at?

[Duncan]

What does be more 'European in our outlook' mean?

[PoisonWell]

Yeah, aren't many European countries significantly more xenophobic than the U.S?

It'd be awesome if they loosened up on beards. Where'd the beard hate come from in the first place? You can't even pass the sacrament in some of the wards I've been in if you're not clean shaven.

[Saints Alive]

. Where'd the beard hate come from in the first place?

Opposition to 60s anticomformists that sported the bearded and unkempt look.

Although the clean shaven look really became popular in the 50s due to all the returning GIs from WWII being used to grooming themselves that way because of army standards. Being clean shaven only became an army standard because of chemical warfare, a beard can prevent a gas mask from sealing properly.

Edited April 11, 2013 by Saints Alive

[Stone holm]

Opposition to 60s anticomformists that sported the bearded and unkempt look.

Although the clean shaven look really became popular in the 50s due to all the returning GIs from WWII being used to grooming themselves that way because of army standards. Being clean shaven only became an army standard because of chemical warfare, a beard can prevent a gas mask from sealing properly.

That is my understanding of the beard ban as well. It's another one of those things that has outlived its usefulness, and is a little ironic given some of the groups that favor short hair and clean shaven. There has been some media noise referring to us as a cult of normalcy because our grooming and dress standards resemble the 1960s Cleaver family.

[Calm]

Just think though, if a terrorist attack requires use of gas masks, LDS will be much better prepared.

[Stone holm]

Just think though, if a terrorist attack requires use of gas masks, LDS will be much better prepared.

Not in our Ward, I would say that at least half of our adult males have beards, although the Stake still insists on beardless Bishoprics.

[Saints Alive]

Just think though, if a terrorist attack requires use of gas masks, LDS will be much better prepared.

Do you own a gas mask? I don't Edited April 11, 2013 by Saints Alive

[Stone holm]

Do you own a gas mask? I don't

There are so many wrong directions that I could run with that comment..sigh...but really folks what did his talk mean in a Church which seeks to guide as to facial hair, number of piercingly, even the color of shirts and whether women wear dresses?

[volgadon]

Do you own a gas mask? I don't

I do, or at least I did, until I moved to the USA. Have had one since early childhood.

[Stone holm]

Was the purpose of the talk related to the obvious push now underway in Africa and Asia and who in particular was it directed at?

[Darren10]

What does be more 'European in our outlook' mean?

That's when women don't shave their armpits and men don't shower daily. Beer is consumed rampantly, the only real sport is soccer, and cigarettes are not smoked filtered. Movies have far less censorship, kids are not produced nearly enough to keep up with economic growth, economic austerity rules the day, and anyone or nation who endorses self responsibility is defiled.

Any questions?

[Sine Saw Square]

Maybe It means I won't be condemned any more for my white socks on Sunday?

[Nathair/|\]

Do you own a gas mask? I don't

Gas masks scare me now.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=38DgjKQhhys

[Duncan]

That's when women don't shave their armpits and men don't shower daily. Beer is consumed rampantly, the only real sport is soccer, and cigarettes are not smoked filtered. Movies have far less censorship, kids are not produced nearly enough to keep up with economic growth, economic austerity rules the day, and anyone or nation who endorses self responsibility is defiled.

Any questions?

sounds like a party, who's bringing the crisps?!

Edited April 11, 2013 by Duncan

[PoisonWell]

Gas masks scare me now.

[media=]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=38DgjKQhhys

That freaked me out so much when I first saw that episode. Love me some doctor who :3

[Darren10]

sounds like a party, who's bringing the crisps?!

Of course it's a party...it's Europe.

[Robert F. Smith]

sounds like a party, who's bringing the crisps?!

Uh, uh. Pork rinds.

[Robert F. Smith]

That's when women don't shave their armpits and men don't shower daily. Beer is consumed rampantly, the only real sport is soccer, and cigarettes are not smoked filtered. Movies have far less censorship, kids are not produced nearly enough to keep up with economic growth, economic austerity rules the day, and anyone or nation who endorses self responsibility is defiled.

If you happen to be religious in Denmark, your fellow students will bully you.

The fertility rate throughout Europe is so low that the entire Eurozone will be fully Islamic by 2100. Anyone for Sharia law?

By the way, what was Pres. Uchtdorf talking about anyway? Does anybody have a clue?

[thesometimesaint]

What is the consensus on where Pres. Uchtdorf meant to lead the Church on the subject of diversity. What did his remarks about non-homogenizing mean? Are we going to loosen up about beards? Be more European in our outlook? What was he getting at?

I think he meant that we should meet gospel standards, and not get overly concerned with cultural standards. IOW The Church isn't Utah of the 1950's. It's a world wide church of 2013.

[canard78]

That's when women don't shave their armpits and men don't shower daily. Beer is consumed rampantly, the only real sport is soccer, and cigarettes are not smoked filtered. Movies have far less censorship, kids are not produced nearly enough to keep up with economic growth, economic austerity rules the day, and anyone or nation who endorses self responsibility is defiled.

Any questions?

I love how you've smushed several European stereotypes into one

And thumbs up to more beards and Europeans.

[Hamba Tuhan]

Not in our Ward, I would say that at least half of our adult males have beards, although the Stake still insists on beardless Bishoprics.

I'm first counsellor in our bishopric, and I have facial hair, though I'm not sure most people would call it a 'beard' ...

Do you own a gas mask? I don't

I was seriously coveting one at Mutual Tuesday night. Half our Young Men showed up already, er, aromatic, and by the time we'd finished an hour-and-a-half of indoor soccer, the hall had become rather pungent.

I think he meant that we should meet gospel standards, and not get overly concerned with cultural standards.

Oh, it sounds like I'm going to like this talk when we finally get the broadcast this weekend!

[Hamba Tuhan]

And thumbs up to more beards and Europeans.

Definitely to more beards, and some saunas too, please!

[canard78]

The actual quote of course is not quite a beard request but still delights the soul:

But while the Atonement is meant to help us all become more like Christ, it is not meant to make us all the same. Sometimes we confuse differences in personality with sin. We can even make the mistake of thinking that because someone is different from us, it must mean they are not pleasing to God. This line of thinking leads some to believe that the Church wants to create every member from a single mold—that each one should look, feel, think, and behave like every other. This would contradict the genius of God, who created every man different from his brother, every son different from his father. Even identical twins are not identical in their personalities and spiritual identities.

It also contradicts the intent and purpose of the Church of Jesus Christ, which acknowledges and protects the moral agency—with all its far-reaching consequences—of each and every one of God’s children. As disciples of Jesus Christ, we are united in our testimony of the restored gospel and our commitment to keep God’s commandments. But we are diverse in our cultural, social, and political preferences.

The Church thrives when we take advantage of this diversity and encourage each other to develop and use our talents to lift and strengthen our fellow disciples.

http://www.lds.org/general-conference/2013/04/four-titles?lang=eng

Some will point out that we still require diversity within limits. But I much prefer this tone to the talk of a few years back that instructed us to take our appearance cue from the prophet.

Besides - I think this is about far more than dress and grooming. This is saying, be yourself. Celebrate differences. Bring both your character and personality to church with and don't try to pretend to be something you're not.

Edited April 11, 2013 by canard78

[Stroopwafel]

Disclaimer: I haven't heard nor read the whole talk, but I'll base my comment on the quote provided by canard78.

Reading this brought back to my mind an attitude which I find is dangerous in the Church. It is when members mistakenly believe that if they "feel" inspired by the Spirit for a particular matter, then they must be right all the way, and hence everybody else deviating from that course is necessarily and obviously not led by the Spirit, and therefore wrong (if not inspired by the devil himself!)

You see what I mean? A sort of pharisaic mindset.

I think Pres. Uchtdorf is doing the right thing by pointing out what members should really be looking for in other members, that is, what we share in common: "our testimony of the restored gospel and our commitment to keep God’s commandments."