Mola Ram Suda Ram Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 "But this teaching is often misrepresented by those who caricature the faith." This sentence is an implicit denial of the belief in question.Lol no it is not. It is often misrepresented. What I often heard in the mission field was "Don't you believe you will be come God".That is a misrepresentation. I see absolutely no denial of the belief. You have read that into the statement. I think this is one reason I am not as active on this board. Because of questions like these. It gets old and tired.
Mola Ram Suda Ram Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 In Mormonism it is a Man,Man's world!.... The LDS Teaching that women must look towards their husbands as their lord is quite reveling.You clearly are a woman. Lol The feminist movement is over. This is not 1960 anymore.
Mola Ram Suda Ram Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 If anyone would like to discuse LDS teachings, history or doctrines my e-mail address is [don't post personal e-mail addresses or other identifying information on the discussion board]For the truth call 1-800-HATE-LDSLol this is comical. Like you would be a source for LDS doctrine that in any way resembles what I believe.
Mola Ram Suda Ram Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 One of Many reasons why Mormons are not Christians is this teaching that Men can become Gods.....Trololololol. Women partake in the divine nature as equals with men. Stop trolling and QQing this thread.
Scott Lloyd Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 (edited) Trololololol. Women partake in the divine nature as equals with men. Stop trolling and QQing this thread."QQing"?Added: Never mind. I just consulted the trusty Urban Dictionary. Edited March 12, 2012 by Scott Lloyd
Deborah Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 The scriptures talk of us becoming sons (or daughters) of God or becoming as God. I don't think anyone knows for sure what that means but there certainly has been speculation on it. I think of becoming a "god" (little g) as a position obtained when one has followed all the commandments and become exalted. That we may have eternal increase is part of expectations of exaltation but again what does that mean? Jesus Christ was God from the beginning. The Pearl of Great Price talks of the "Gods" participating in creation, so evidently there were more one that participated in the creation. Perhaps this includes some of the "noble and great ones" spoken of in Abraham.
Mola Ram Suda Ram Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 (edited) "QQing"?Added: Never mind. I just consulted the trusty Urban Dictionary.Not sure why I included it into this thread probably because the post just did a hit and run. It does not really fit but it is fun to say. Edited March 12, 2012 by Mola Ram Suda Ram
Deborah Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 In Mormonism it is a Man,Man's world!.... The LDS Teaching that women must look towards their husbands as their lord is quite reveling.How sad that you don't understand the teachings of the LDS church at all. You must have been married to a bully. As 1 Corinthians 11:11 says "Nevertheless neither is the man without the woman, neither the woman without the man, in the Lord."Adam and Eve worked together. I suggest you read Valerie Hudson's The Two Trees: http://www.fairlds.o...0-the-two-trees
Hestia Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 If anyone would like to discuse LDS teachings, history or doctrines my e-mail address is [don't post personal e-mail addresses or other identifying information on the discussion board]If you are going to make statements about the church you must support them with documentation. Otherwise refrain from telling us what we believe.
Calm Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 In Mormonism it is a Man,Man's world!.... The LDS Teaching that women must look towards their husbands as their lord is quite reveling.I agree it is quite telling, it tells that we pay attention to scripture for one thing:Genesis 3:16 Unto the woman he said......thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.
thesometimesaint Posted March 13, 2012 Posted March 13, 2012 No woman is required to follow her husband into hell.Brigham Young
why me Posted March 13, 2012 Posted March 13, 2012 Then shall they be gods, because they have no end; therefore shall they be from everlasting to everlasting, because they continue; then shall they be above all, because all things are subject unto them. Then shall they be gods, because they have all power, and the angels are subject unto them.The clue is in these sentences. Since they will have no end, they will become gods. God has no end. And as such they will be the same as god. But I see no reference to having one's own planet or having the power of our heavenly father.Also, we need to look at the early church and how it was organized. First we have the angel moroni. Why wasn't moroni a god, with his own planet? He seems that he was just a messenger. Then, when we have both priesthoods brought back, some very important spirits did it. Why weren't they gods already with their own planet and having the power of god? It seems that they were still working to further the will of god.So, the D&C verses are very flowerly, attempting to show through a visualization process just what will occur when one is faithful.
why me Posted March 13, 2012 Posted March 13, 2012 (edited) I'm obliged to conclude that distortion is your aim.Or the person had a genuine lack of knowledge and understanding and has become under the influence of antimormon websites. I think that this is closer to an explanation. Edited March 13, 2012 by why me
thesometimesaint Posted March 13, 2012 Posted March 13, 2012 I wouldn't say "just". Being a messanger is a high calling.
why me Posted March 13, 2012 Posted March 13, 2012 I wouldn't say "just". Being a messanger is a high calling.That is true. But comparing a messenger with being a god, well, it does seem just a little less. What I find amazing is just how people don't realize the early history of the lds church when speaking about becoming a god. We certainly do not see John the Baptist becoming a god. And yet, since he now has no end, and he is everlasting---he certainly is a 'god'.
kolipoki09 Posted March 13, 2012 Posted March 13, 2012 No woman is required to follow her husband into hell.Brigham YoungSomething like that. It is not my general practice to counsel the sisters to disobey their husbands, but my counsel is—obey your husbands; and I am sanguine and most emphatic on that subject. But I never counselled a woman to follow her husband to the Devil. (Teachings of the Presidents of the Church: Brigham Young, 167). 1
Scott Lloyd Posted March 13, 2012 Posted March 13, 2012 (edited) Or the person had a genuine lack of knowledge and understanding and has become under the influence of antimormon websites. I think that this is closer to an explanation.Obviously he/she knew that the teaching applies equally to men and women. Yet he/she presented it as though it were a sexist teaching. It seems clear to me the intent was malicious. Edited March 13, 2012 by Scott Lloyd
why me Posted March 13, 2012 Posted March 13, 2012 Obviously he/she knew that the teaching applies equally to men and women. Yet he/she presented it as though it were a sexist teaching. It seems clear to the intent was malicious.And that was my point too. When one gets into the antimormon websites, all sorts of influence takes place. And it is not very balanced. It is no surprise that someone can be influenced by such websites. The best defense is the best offense. However, to deprogram someone from antimormon influence is not very easy.
Grundelwalken Posted March 13, 2012 Posted March 13, 2012 It's folklore? I grew up in southern Idaho in the 70's and 80's. Seemed to be common knowledge to me, not speculative. In fact I think the members of my wards would say anyone who called it folklore were ducking their faith....I grew up in Arizona and was taught as a new deacon that we HAD to hold our left arm behind us and carry the sacrament trays at a perfect 90 degree angle as we walked amongst the congregation. Unfortunately, there is nothing true about that teaching and I think much of what we believe is "true" about godhood is distorted by wishful thinking or myth. This is a doctrine but I do not know all I will know about it so I am content to wait and see how it all works out.Despite the play running on Broadway, I DO NOT believe I will one day have my own world and be independent of my Heavenly Father. MW 3
Areabird Posted March 14, 2012 Posted March 14, 2012 The clue is in these sentences. Since they will have no end, they will become gods. God has no end. And as such they will be the same as god. But I see no reference to having one's own planet or having the power of our heavenly father....How do you know they weren't gods? Couldn't they deliver a message AND be a God? And who says that as soon as you die you become a god? What if there is still progression that takes place after you die before you become a god?
Hamba Tuhan Posted March 14, 2012 Posted March 14, 2012 (edited) I grew up in Arizona and was taught as a new deacon that we HAD to hold our left arm behind us and carry the sacrament trays at a perfect 90 degree angle as we walked amongst the congregation. Unfortunately, there is nothing true about that teaching....And in fact, the Handbook gives the following instruction, which has been in there since I can remember: 'The passing of the sacrament should be natural and unobtrusive, not rigid or overly formal. Those who pass the sacrament should not be required to assume any special posture or action, such as holding the left hand behind the back.' I'm sensing a pattern here.... Edited March 14, 2012 by Hamba Tuhan
Cobalt-70 Posted March 14, 2012 Posted March 14, 2012 QuoteLatter-day Saints believe that God wants us to become like Him. But this teaching is often misrepresented by those who caricature the faith. The Latter-day Saint belief is no different than the biblical teaching, which states, “The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: and if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together” (Romans 8:16-17). Through following Christ's teachings, Latter-day Saints believe all people can become "partakers of the divine nature" (2 Peter 1:4).http://www.mormonnew...rmonism-101#C13I know what I was taught and I know what's in the LDS scriptures.D&C 132If the Mormon view has been caricatured, then the first one to be guilty of that caricature was Joseph Smith. I see statements such as that made above by the LDS church on its website as a walking-away of Smith's original theology, back to their origins in Christian perfection doctrine. There are some who interpret these statements cynically, arguing that the LDS Church really teaches what Joseph Smith taught in his King Follett sermon, but that such public statements as that above are intended to deceptively obscure the true doctrine. I disagree. Official LDS doctrine is defined by what the LDS Church says its doctrine is. If the LDS Church seems to be walking away from Joseph Smith's theology, then I say it is walking away from Joseph Smith's theology. That's not necessarily a bad thing, because it makes the LDS Church increasingly more Protestant, and it will ultimately aide in proselytizing efforts. So long as the church doesn't start cracking down on those who continue to believe in the century-and-a-half-old "caricature," I see no problem.
Hamba Tuhan Posted March 14, 2012 Posted March 14, 2012 (edited) If the Mormon view has been caricatured, then the first one to be guilty of that caricature was Joseph Smith.I just reread the King Follett discourse and summarised its themes:God is [note: not was] a man.The first principle of the gospel is to know the character of God, that we can converse with him as one man does with another.God, the Father of us all, dwelt on an earth the same as Jesus Christ himself did.Like Jesus, the Father had power in himself to lay down his life and take it up again.We must learn to be Gods ourselves—to be kings and priests to God.The dead will rise to be heirs of God and joint heirs with Jesus.Christ’s kingdom further exalts the Father’s glory.In the beginning, the head God brought forth a council of Gods.Creation did not occur ex nihilo because matter cannot be destroyed, only reorganised.Like God, the spirits of men are self-existing and therefore immortal.Being greater than the spirits of men, God instituted laws which would enable men to advance toward his greatness—in glory, knowledge and power.We must seek after our dead so that they may have salvation in common with us.In the end, all those who do not commit the unpardonable sin will be saved through Jesus Christ.Those who will not be redeemed have the same spirit as those who sought to kill Christ; the same spirit motivated those who sought to kill Joseph.Be careful because the desire to shed blood is never of God but of the devil.We have great reason to have hope and consolation for our dead.Yep, that's pretty much the same 'caricature' one will find in The Godmakers or in one of Bill Maher's rants. Edited March 14, 2012 by Hamba Tuhan
Jaybear Posted March 14, 2012 Posted March 14, 2012 (edited) I just reread the King Follett discourse and summarised its themes:God is [note: not was] a man....Yep, that's pretty much the same 'caricature' one will find in The Godmakers or in one of Bill Maher's rants. WOW. Your very first bullet point shows you are more interested in obfuscation than accuracy. Here is what was Smith was reported to have said:"God himself was once as we are now, and is an exalted man, and sits enthroned in yonder heavens!"Later he says: "It is the first principle of the Gospel to know for a certainty the Character of God ... that he was once a man like us ...."Your statement: "not was" is patently false. He stated God was a man twice.Your reference to God now being a man, rather than an "exalted man" is imprecise and misleading.He also said: "...and you have got to learn how to be Gods yourselves, and to be kings and priests to God, the same as all Gods have done before you ..."So if I were to summarize Smith: God was once a man like us. Now he is an exalted man. All gods followed this path to exhaltation.Interesting and simple. Edited March 14, 2012 by Jaybear
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