BCSpace Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 Revelation 3:21. Is sitting down in God's throne just part of the tour or is it representational of having the same power and authority as God? Partakers of the Divine nature....We have a divine nature within us because we are children of God, and through Jesus Christ we can partake of that nature and sit with Him in His throne. But I don't believe we currently possess the capability to completely understand what that means. Heck, we can barely comprehend the things of this universe; how can we expect to understand what exaltation in the highest degree of God's kingdom means?I generally agree. But I would say the early Christians had it right when they said that family life was a more accurate representation of God's provident care than the celebate life. In other words, we are well on the way to understanding what Godhood is because we are practicing it right now.Basically, I think the idea that we will create worlds and have spirit children that will worship us kind of misses the point. There's something a little more to it than that in my opinion.I disagree. Where we are going is the point entirely. And knowing God is a requirement for eternal life.
apostate1 Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 I know what I was taught and I know what's in the LDS scriptures.D&C 132Yes, Mormon Men are taught that they can become Gods and rule their own Celestrial kingdom... Also that their wife or Wives if they are loyal to their preisthood holding husbands can become goddesess.... and that they will create Spirit babies that are born to early parents.... also, LDS women must be married if not the best they can seek is that of a servent to the Celestrial kingdom Gods and their Goddesess....
JAHS Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 We can become "joint-heirs with Christ," and those who achieve this status are described as "gods," but we don't at present have a full understanding of what this means. The idea that we can create worlds or universes and populate them with our own spirit children is not a Church doctrine. This doesn't mean it's false, though, since the Church has never said that either; it just means that President Monson has not received a revelation about what being a "god" entails (or, if he has, he hasn't been told to share it with us yet).Joseph Smith said:"Here, then, is eternal life—to know the only wise and true God; and you have got to learn how to be Gods yourselves, and to be kings and priests to God, the same as all Gods have done before you, namely, by going from one small degree to another, and from a small capacity to a great one; from grace to grace, from exaltation to exaltation, until you attain the resurrection of the dead, and are able to dwell in everlasting burnings, and to sit in glory as do those who sit enthroned in everlasting power. . . .They shall be heirs of God and joint heirs with Jesus Christ. What is it? To inherit the same power, the same glory and the same power, the same glory and the same exaltation, until you arrive at the station of a God, and ascend the throne of eternal power, the same as those who have gone before. What did Jesus do? "Why; I do the things I saw my Father do when worlds came rolling into existence. My Father worked out his kingdom with fear and trembling, and I must do the same; and when I get my kingdom, I shall present it to my Father, so that he may obtain kingdom upon kingdom, and it will exalt him in glory. He will then take a higher exaltation, and I will take his place, and thereby <a class="search_hit" href="#m_55">become exalted myself."(Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith 344-348) Sounds like he is saying that we will be a God (Capital G) able to do everything our God has done. So even though Joseph Smith said this is it just his opinion and therefore not a church doctrine?
apostate1 Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 One of Many reasons why Mormons are not Christians is this teaching that Men can become Gods.....
Scott Lloyd Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 (edited) Yes, Mormon Men are taught that they can become Gods and rule their own Celestrial kingdom... Also that their wife or Wives if they are loyal to their preisthood holding husbands can become goddesess.... and that they will create Spirit babies that are born to early parents....CFR also, LDS women must be married if not the best they can seek is that of a servent to the Celestrial kingdom Gods and their Goddesess....The same teaching applies to men. Why did you leave that part out? Edited March 12, 2012 by Scott Lloyd
apostate1 Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 If anyone would like to discuse LDS teachings, history or doctrines my e-mail address is [don't post personal e-mail addresses or other identifying information on the discussion board]
Scott Lloyd Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 (edited) If anyone would like to discuse LDS teachings, history or doctrines my e-mail address is [don't post personal e-mail addresses or other identifying information on the discussion board]I have put a CFR (call for references) and a question to you. Do you intend to ignore them?CFR means you have to document your assertions. Edited March 13, 2012 by Ares
Scott Lloyd Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 Joseph Smith said:"Here, then, is eternal life—to know the only wise and true God; and you have got to learn how to be Gods yourselves, and to be kings and priests to God, the same as all Gods have done before you, namely, by going from one small degree to another, and from a small capacity to a great one; from grace to grace, from exaltation to exaltation, until you attain the resurrection of the dead, and are able to dwell in everlasting burnings, and to sit in glory as do those who sit enthroned in everlasting power. . . .They shall be heirs of God and joint heirs with Jesus Christ. What is it? To inherit the same power, the same glory and the same power, the same glory and the same exaltation, until you arrive at the station of a God, and ascend the throne of eternal power, the same as those who have gone before. What did Jesus do? "Why; I do the things I saw my Father do when worlds came rolling into existence. My Father worked out his kingdom with fear and trembling, and I must do the same; and when I get my kingdom, I shall present it to my Father, so that he may obtain kingdom upon kingdom, and it will exalt him in glory. He will then take a higher exaltation, and I will take his place, and thereby <a class="search_hit" href="#m_55">become exalted myself."(Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith 344-348)Sounds like he is saying that we will be a God (Capital G) able to do everything our God has done. So even though Joseph Smith said this is it just his opinion and therefore not a church doctrine?To whom are you addressing this question? Who here has contradicted what Joseph Smith said in this quote?
altersteve Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 I generally agree. But I would say the early Christians had it right when they said that family life was a more accurate representation of God's provident care than the celebate life. In other words, we are well on the way to understanding what Godhood is because we are practicing it right now.I agree that we are "on the way" to coming to a fuller understanding of exaltation. But we don't yet have that understanding.I disagree. Where we are going is the point entirely. And knowing God is a requirement for eternal life.What misses the point, I meant to say, is to say anything specific about exaltation. There is something far more about becoming like God than we realize. But this is just my opinion. You are free to believe as you wish and to share those beliefs, and I will defend your right to do so. 1
altersteve Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 If anyone would like to discuse LDS teachings, history or doctrines my e-mail address is [don't post personal e-mail addresses or other identifying information on the discussion board] If you're such an expert on it, why not discuss it here?
apostate1 Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 CFRThe same teaching applies to Mormon men. Why did you leave that part out?Yes Mormon men must be married to achive Celestrial Godhood.... also, a Mormon Male can become sealed to many wifes that is why LDS Women who have not been married, or for faithful LDS Women who have not been married to either a none LDS or husband who's is LDS but not worthy can be sealed to a worthy LDS Man in the temple and become his celestrial wife.....
altersteve Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 Yes Mormon men must be married to achive Celestrial Godhood.... also, a Mormon Male can become sealed to many wifes that is why LDS Women who have not been married, or for faithful LDS Women who have not been married to either a none LDS or husband who's is LDS but not worthy can be sealed to a worthy LDS Man in the temple and become his celestrial wife.....CFR means you have to cite your source, not repeat what you just said.
Scott Lloyd Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 Yes Mormon men must be married to achive Celestrial Godhood....You didn't answer the question. Why did you specify women at first, when the teaching applies to both men and women? That strikes me as slanting, which is a form of dishonesty.And altersteve has correctly pointed out that you have not responded to the CFR.
apostate1 Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 If you're such an expert on it, why not discuss it here? Sure , I would be happy to discuse LDS Teachings doctrins and History here.....
apostate1 Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 You didn't answer the question. Why did you specify women at first, when the teaching applies to both men and women? That strikes me as slanting, which is a form of dishonesty.And altersteve has correctly pointed out that you have not responded to the CFR.It is refreshing to read that you agree that the best that a None Married but worthly LDS Women can do is that of a servant in the Celestrial kingdom...
apostate1 Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 In Mormonism it is a Man,Man's world!.... The LDS Teaching that women must look towards their husbands as their lord is quite reveling.
altersteve Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 It is refreshing to read that you agree that the best that a None Married but worthly LDS Women can do is that of a servant in the Celestrial kingdom...Please answer the question and provide the sources you have been asked to provide.
altersteve Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 In Mormonism it is a Man,Man's world!.... The LDS Teaching that women must look towards their husbands as their lord is quite reveling.Please provide reliable documentation that Mormons believe this.
TAO Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 It is refreshing to read that you agree that the best that a None Married but worthly LDS Women can do is that of a servant in the Celestrial kingdom...Dude... those who didn't have the opportunity to make a choice will have the opportunity later. Those who have the opportunity to make the choice probably won't have that choice again. That's the way God works... he gives us all the opportunities he sees fit for us to have.
TAO Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 (edited) In Mormonism it is a Man,Man's world!.... The LDS Teaching that women must look towards their husbands as their lord is quite reveling.That's from the Bible, don't ya' know? One of the verses it relates to is this one:Ephesians 5:28aHusbands, blove your cwives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;Thus, I don't really see a problem. Two people who serve one another is the ideal marriage =p. Edited March 12, 2012 by TAO
Scott Lloyd Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 (edited) It is refreshing to read that you agree that the best that a None Married but worthly LDS Women can do is that of a servant in the Celestrial kingdom...That's not what I said. Please stop bearing false witness.And you haven't answered why you attempted to cast as oppressive to women a teaching that applies to both women and men.I'm obliged to conclude that distortion is your aim. Edited March 12, 2012 by Scott Lloyd
JAHS Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 To whom are you addressing this question? Who here has contradicted what Joseph Smith said in this quote?Altersteve said in the quote from him I provided:"The idea that we can create worlds or universes and populate them with our own spirit children is not a Church doctrine"My Joseph Smith quote seems to contradict this.
Hamba Tuhan Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 The Newsroom statement perfectly matches my understanding of this topic. If anyone genuinely thinks that this doctrine has not been misrepresented and grotesquely caricatured, I suggest s/he spend a bit more time perusing the 'countercult' section of an evangelical bookshop and/or watch a bit more American TV comedy/news.
altersteve Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 Altersteve said in the quote from him I provided:"The idea that we can create worlds or universes and populate them with our own spirit children is not a Church doctrine"My Joseph Smith quote seems to contradict this.Joseph said nothing about creating worlds and having spirit children in that quote. I suggest reading the entire King Follett sermon so that that portion can be read in the context of the rest of it. Joseph is speaking of becoming one with Jesus Christ, and uses Christ as an example of how Heavenly Father was once like us. He then uses this to explain how we can become like Him. I think it's beautiful. But he's talking about some pretty abstract concepts here that he never had the chance to clarify or expound upon, so we have to be careful when citing him as a source for this. Besides, just because he said something doesn't make it official doctrine.And, furthermore, the Church has specifically said that people ruling over their own planets, while falling short of declaring it false, is speculation:Do Latter-day Saints believe that they will “get their own planet”?No. This idea is not taught in Latter-day Saint scripture, nor is it a doctrine of the Church. This misunderstanding stems from speculative comments unreflective of scriptural doctrine. Mormons believe that we are all sons and daughters of God and that all of us have the potential to grow during and after this life to become like our Heavenly Father (see Romans 8:16-17). The Church does not and has never purported to fully understand the specifics of Christ’s statement that “in my Father’s house are many mansions” (John 14:2).http://www.mormonnew...rmonism-101#C14 1
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