teddyaware

Somewhat understandably, marineland is confusing Moses’ account of God and the angels weeping over the wicked antediluvians, and the Doctrine and Covenants 76 account of the heavens weeping over the loss of fallen Lucifer and the sons of perdition. When comparing the 2 accounts, we see that they significantly differ due to the fact that the wicked antediluvians of Moses 7 have not committed the unpardonable sin and will eventually be afforded the opportunity to accept the gospel, repent and be released from the spirit prison. Meanwhile, Lucifer and the sons of perdition, are those who have steadfastly refused to repent and be redeemed until it’s everlastingly too late. This last group are those of who will remain “filthy still” (unforgiven). But it’s fascinating to contemplate that the heavens even wept bitterly over the loss of Lucifer and the sons of perdition — a powerful witness that underscores the great reality that God really does deeply love even his most hardened enemies.

Apart from Christ’s infinite and eternal atoning sacrifice, which is the greatest example of how it’s possible to truly love even one’s bitterest enemies, Moses 7 provides what I believe is the next greatest example of how it’s possible to love one’s enemies in a salutary manner that can even set the stage for eventual reconciliation, healing and the salvation of those who were once the most implacable enemies of God. What we learn in this most amazing and wonderful chapter of scripture is that the spiritual gift that enables the followers of Christ to truly love their enemies is the ability to see beyond the angry, insulting and aggressive exteriors of the enemies of Christ by means of a gift that empowers them to clearly see that the enemies of truth and righteousness are, in reality, inwardly miserable, existing in their own private hell of spiritual and emotional alienation. For those who possess the greatest capacity for spiritual insight into the actual condition of the hearts and minds of those who say that they don’t want to be saved, there is not only a refusal to hate the enemies of God, but they’re filled with such overwhelming sympathy and compassion for these tortured souls that the greatest desire of their hearts is to provide them with a an escape route that enables them to find eventual peace, safety and redemption through Jesus Christ, and the gospel of his all embracing and undying love. Among the following most enlightening verses, please take especial note of verse 41 wherein the man Enoch is gifted with the same insight into the condition of the human heart that God himself possesses, after which Enoch is enabled to understand and love his earthly enemies who remained on the earth with the same intense emotional pain and redeeming love experienced by God and the holy hosts of heaven. 28 And it came to pass that the God of heaven looked upon the residue of the people, and he wept; and Enoch bore record of it, saying: How is it that the heavens weep, and shed forth their tears as the rain upon the mountains? 29 And Enoch said unto the Lord: How is it that thou canst weep, seeing thou art holy, and from all eternity to all eternity? 30 And were it possible that man could number the particles of the earth, yea, millions of earths like this, it would not be a beginning to the number of thy creation; and thy curtains are stretched out still; and yet thou art there, and thy bosom is there; and also thou art just; thou art merciful and kind forever; 31 And thou hast taken Zion to thine own bosom, from all thy creations, from all eternity to all eternity; and naught but peace, justice, and truth is the habitation of thy throne; and mercy shall go before thy face and have no end; how is it thou canst weep? 32 The Lord said unto Enoch: Behold these thy brethren; they are the workmanship of mine own hands, and I gave unto them their knowledge in the day I created them; and in the Garden of Eden, gave I unto man his agency; 33 And unto thy brethren have I said, and also given commandment, that they should love one another, and that they should choose me, their Father; but behold, they are without affection, and they hate their own blood; 34 And the fire of mine indignation is kindled against them; and in my hot displeasure will I send in the floods upon them, for my fierce anger is kindled against them. 35 Behold, I am God; Man of Holiness is my name; Man of Counsel is my name; and Endless and Eternal is my name also. 36 Wherefore, I can stretch forth mine hands and hold all the creations which I have made; and mine eye can pierce them also, and among all the workmanship of mine hands there has not been so great wickedness as among thy brethren. 37 But behold, their sins shall be upon the heads of their fathers; Satan shall be their father, and misery shall be their doom; and the whole heavens shall weep over them, even all the workmanship of mine hands; WHEREFORE SHOULD NOT THE HEAVENS WEEP, SEEING THESE SHALL SUFFER? 38 But behold, these which thine eyes are upon shall perish in the floods; and behold, I will shut them up; a prison have I prepared for them. 39 And that (Christ) which I have chosen hath pled before my face. Wherefore, he suffereth for their sins; inasmuch as they will repent in the day that my Chosen shall return unto me, and until that day they shall be in torment; 40 Wherefore, for this shall the heavens weep, yea, AND ALL THE WORKMANSHIP OF MINE HANDS (meaning all of us should weep for those without Christ). 41 And it came to pass that the Lord spake unto Enoch, and told Enoch all the doings of the children of men; wherefore Enoch knew, and looked upon their wickedness, and their misery, and wept and stretched forth his arms, and his heart swelled as wide as eternity; and his bowels yearned; and all eternity shook. (Moses 7)

The first female missionaries of the church were called in the year 1898, 19 years prior to the vision of Joseph F Smith that became Doctrine and Covenants 138. This surely means that President Smith was well aware of the valuable labors provided by the sister missionaries of the church. Therefore the presumption that the language of verse 57 amounts to a blanket assertion that women will not be participating in the missionary effort in the spirit world is just what I said, nothing more or less than a presumption on your part. After all, why wouldn’t the faithful missionary sisters of this dispensation also continue their labors in the great world of the spirits of the dead?

An abysmally uninformed response. In case you’re unaware, the scriptures set forth several reasons why someone could be excommunicated, but inactivity isn’t one of them.

In this instance, the phrase “according to” is being used as a preposition, which means that the phrase in question can be rendered as “in conformity with men in the flesh,” (and that means all men in the flesh). God’s infinite and eternal love, justice and mercy cannot allow him to countenance any form of unfairness or arbitrariness with regard to the final outcomes within his perfect plan of salvation, and this is why the conversion of spirits to the gospel of Christ in the spirit world is viewed by him exactly as if these spirits had been converted to Christ while in the flesh. It’s only fair. The torments and horrors of an everlasting hell are so unimaginably severe that God, in his perfect love, will do virtually anything in righteousness and leave no stone unturned in order to bring salvation to his beloved children in one of his three kingdoms of heavenly glory. I’m often baffled why so many non-LDS Christians seem to be more comfortable believing in an unfair, arbitrary and callous God than in allowing themselves to consider the glorious possibility that he’s far more fair minded than they had supposed. It’s like they’re insisting, “No! I don’t want to believe in a God who’s that merciful and fair minded because I like the idea of an all-powerful being who can do whatever he wants because nobody has the power to stop him!” I recently heard a wise and observant fellow say that when someone says they love a God who’s rash, hasty and lacking in compassion in his judgements it amounts to a form of cosmic Stockholm Syndrome.

The lie that engaging in spirited and even intense political debate is a form of punishable violence is the cause of the problem. “Don’t tell me that biological men who identify as women can’t compete on women’s sports teams or we will shut you up with laws against ‘hate speech,’ and if that doesn’t work we’ll utilize more potent methods of shutting you up!”

The idea and the image of being crucified with Christ is not a new one. It comes straight out of the New Testament. And not coincidentally, it’s the veritable theme of the higher ordinances of the gospel. 6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin. (Romans 6) 20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me. (Galatians 2) 24 And they that are Christ’s have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts. (Galatians 5) 27 And whosoever doth not bear his cross, and come after me, cannot be my disciple. (Luke 14) And there are at least 8 more verses of scripture based on the theme.

Exactly! But the most astonishing disclosure concerning the the righteous dead in the spirit world is found in 2 Nephi 9: 7 Wherefore, it must needs be an infinite atonement—save it should be an infinite atonement this corruption could not put on incorruption. Wherefore, the first judgment which came upon man must needs have remained to an endless duration. And if so, this flesh must have laid down to rot and to crumble to its mother earth, to rise no more. 8 O the wisdom of God, his mercy and grace! For behold, if the flesh should rise no more our spirits must become subject to that angel who fell from before the presence of the Eternal God, and became the devil, to rise no more. 9 And our spirits must have become like unto him, and we become devils, angels to a devil, to be shut out from the presence of our God, and to remain with the father of lies, in misery, like unto himself; yea, to that being who beguiled our first parents, who transformeth himself nigh unto an angelof light, and stirreth up the children of men unto secret combinations of murder and all manner of secret works of darkness. 10 O how great the goodness of our God, who prepareth a way for our escape from the grasp of this awful monster; yea, that monster, death and hell, which I call the death of the body, and also the death of the spirit. (2 Nephi 9) It’s no wonder the righteous in the spirit world consider their state to be a form of bondage akin to the chains of hell! Without the resurrection of the body to deliver them out of the fallen state, a condition that continues in the spirit world after the death of the body, even the most righteous and faithful of spirits would eventually be drawn down into despair and despondency, and plunge forever into spiritual death.

As the saying goes, anything is possible. 😄 But your last paragraph demonstrates that you get my point. But I believe the answer to the question is probably as simple and straightforward as saying that the millions of exalted individuals who suffered untimely deaths, who would have fully embraced the Lord and his gospel had they been permitted to tarry, will actually get the chance to prove who and what they are in real time by their response to the gospel message when it’s offered to them after death. Ultimately, I think it’s reasonable to believe that the reason why these individuals will be exalted is much more tied to the way they live the gospel in the spirit world rather than just examining their hearts and behaviors as they were while they tarried in the flesh without a knowledge of the gospel. In fact, there’s really no need to to bestow eternal blessings and rewards based on projections of future receptiveness and behaviors due to the fact that the dead who receive the gospel after the death of the mortal body have more than ample opportunity to manifest their love, faith, loyalty and obedience to the Lord in the spirit world; son much so that their acts in the spirit world are treated and regarded exactly as if they had received and lived the gospel in the flesh, for the Apostle Peter tells us that are judged as if they are still living in the flesh. Therefore projections about future behaviors are mostly unneeded and unnecessary. My point is that the Lord created a system of salvation and exaltation in which men will be judged by their actual works, not by mere projections of likely future attitudes and behaviors based on the sentiments and behaviors of those in the flesh who knew nothing about the true church and gospel of Christ prior to death. The bottom line is that I believe it’s more than likely that the reason why Alvin entered into his exaltation was determined not just by the attitudes and behaviors he exhibited prior to death, but even more so by his devoted and faithful response to the restored gospel in the spirit world. I’ll conclude by saying I don’t believe there will be any who arrived at the years of accountability who will be able to protest it’s unfair that some didn’t have to prove their worthiness within the framework of the gospel’s crucible of adversity, because all will be given ample opportunity to prove their worthiness to obtain the fullness of celestial glory by their actual acts, works that will clearly and undeniably manifest the truth of who and what they really are.

Two honest questions for which I personally don’t have a definitive answers: Let’s suppose Alma the Younger died of shock when the rebuking angel first appeared to him. If this intelligent young man, who had been diligently taught the gospel of Jesus Christ by his inspired father, experienced the exact kind of private hell ordeal after death that he endured while lingering near death, would the fulness of salvation in the celestial kingdom have been denied him? If the answer is yes, what do you think it is about death that causes all hope for complete repentance and obtaining the fullness of salvation to be lost?

The righteous in paradise are not subjected to the “chains of hell.” Rather, they are subjected to the “chains of death” because the spirit world is an extension ofthe fallen state, the full deliverance from which can only can only be effectuated by means of a glorious resurrection from the dead. The expressions “chains of death” (physical death) and “chains of hell” are not synonymous. Yet it is verily true that even the righteous in paradise view the separation of their spirits from their bodies to be a form of bondage that can only come to an end through the resurrection of the body. Truly, even the righteous dead in paradise yearn to be delivered from all the effects of the fall, including the bondage of physical death. 50 For the dead (the dead in paradise) had looked upon the long absence of their spirit from their bodies as a bondage. 51 These the Lord taught, and gave them power to come forth, after his resurrection from the dead, to enter into his Father’s kingdom, there to be crowned with immortality and eternal life, (Doctrine and Covenants 138) Also, one of the great illuminating blessings found Doctrine and Covenants 138 is the revelation that the wicked and rebellious antediluvians of Noah’s day, referred to by the Apostle Peter, are used as representative prime examples of all the rebellious, unrighteous and unsaved spirits in the spirit prison, who will, sooner or later, be retaught the gospel by the Lord’s authorized representatives that they might be delivered from the chains of hell, if they so choose. Please note that the following passages refer to the rebellious dead in general, not just to the wicked of Noah’s day. 10 For for this cause was the gospel preached also to them that are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit. (1 Peter 4:6.) and… 30 But behold, from among the righteous, he organized his forces and appointed messengers clothed with power and authority, and commissioned them to go forth and carry the light of the gospel to them that were in darkness, even toallthe spirits of men; and thus was the gospel preached to the dead.even to all the spirits of men; and thus was the gospel preached to the dead. (Doctrine and Covenants 138)

As a consequence of the fact that Jesus Christ (God) was born as a helpless baby on earth, and afterward grew to maturity — all the while learning obedience by the things which he suffered — he was finally required to prove his courage, humility, faith and loyalty to his Father by overcoming his own immense fears and his own extreme reluctance to partake of bitter cup of the atoning sacrifice. As a consequence, I don’t find it at all surprising that God the Father himself was also required to prove himself worthy of the right to rulership at another time and place in eternity, in the same way Jesus had to prove himself worthy. After all, the life and acts of Jesus Christ prove that God can be required to face unimaginably difficult tests of faith and devotion. And as the saying goes, if it can be proven beyond doubt that something actually happened at least once before, it shouldn’t be at all surprising if the same thing happens again. Jesus Christ wasn’t automatically born worthy to have the right to sit down on the right hand of God, but was required to prove himself worthy to obtain that supreme honor. To deny the truth of these incontrovertible facts is to assert that Jesus was an impeccable automaton without free will, rendering the atoning sacrifice akin to a virtual reality computer program. In fact, by his own testimony Jesus Christ revealed that way he drew inspiration and resolve to face his own great personal challenges and tests of faith was through the realization that he was only being asked to do what the Father himself had succeeded in doing before him. One of the things I love about the theology of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints is that God the Father is, in reality, a great conquering hero, a being endowed with free will who faced head on the worse that the forces of spiritual darkness and evil could throw at him, but against seemingly impossible odds came off infinitely and eternally triumphant! Your God is good because he has no choice no choice but to be what he is. Meanwhile, the God of the Latter-Day Saints, both the Father and the Son, proved themselves worthy by voluntarily taking upon themselves very real weaknesses that required them to muster great faith and courage, thereby proving themselves to be truly worthy of all honor, adoration and glory. And again, this comes as no surprise to we Latter-Day Saints because why would God the Father require such great sacrifices and tests of devotion of his Son if he never had to to face and triumph over the same kinds of great tests himself? It’s never been a strong and admirable position to occupy when someone requires another to do difficult things that the issuer of the commandment isn’t fully willing and able to face and triumph over himself… 18 Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God. 19 Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise. (John 5)

Prior to Doctrine and Covenants 138 being added to the Standard Works in 1978, I was quite familiar with the contents of Joseph F Smith’s vision because the things taught therein intrigued and fascinated me. I clearly remember thinking to myself that if Joseph F Smith’s vision were ever to be added to the scriptures that it would be a real doctrinal game changer, due to the fact that its disclosures of God’s mercy and grace definitely go beyond what was is found in Doctrine and Covenants 76. Consider the following: 18 While this vast multitude waited and conversed, rejoicing in the hour of their deliverance from the chains of death, the Son of God appeared, declaring liberty to the CAPTIVES who had been faithful; (how interesting to refer to the spiritual existence in paradise as a form of captivity from which souls longed to be liberated?) 30 But behold, from among the righteous, he organized his forces and appointed messengers, clothed with power and authority, and commissioned them to go forth and carry the light of the gospel to them that were in darkness, even to all the spirits of men; and thus was the gospel preached to the dead. (note here how the gospel is preached “to all the spirits of men.” Prior to 1978 I remember wondering to myself why, according to Joseph F Smith, the unalloyed gospel is preached to the spirits of all the dead when, at least up to that point, I thought the eventual inheritors of the telestial kingdom ended up in the spirit prison (hell) because they refuse to receive and accept of the gospel message, yet here they are being taught the gospel of Jesus Christ that they rejected?) 31 And the chosen messengers went forth to declare the acceptable day of the Lord and proclaim liberty to the captives who were bound, even unto all who would repent of their sins and receive the gospel. (now it appears the only way to escape confinement in the spirit prison and to eventually inherit a kingdom of glory is to receive the gospel?) 32 Thus was the gospel preached to those who had died in their sins, without a knowledge of the truth, or in transgression having rejected the prophets. (now I’m thinking thatvthe only way to be able to harmonize the Book of Mormon’s “day of this life” with Joseph F Smith’s vision is to expand the timeframe of the “day of this life” to include the time spent in the spirit world after death and prior to the resurrection?) 33 These were taught faith in God, repentance from sin, vicarious baptism for the remission of sins, the gift of the Holy Ghost by the laying on of hands, (really?! those who rejected the gospel message in the flesh, who are cast down to hell after death as a consequence of their willful rebellion, are taught the actual gospel of Jesus Christ, not some booby prize version of the gospel, including its saving ordinances?!) 34 And all other principles of the gospel that were necessary for them to know in order to qualify themselves that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit. (so now it’s starting to look to me that the Book of Mormon is actually correct — there really is no other way to inherit one of the Father’s heavenly mansions of glory other than to accept Jesus Christ and his gospel! Jesus Christ really is the only name under heaven whereby men can be saved, and none are exempt) 35 And so it was made known among the dead, both small and great, the unrighteous as well as the faithful, that redemption had been wrought through the sacrifice of the Son of God upon the cross. (Yup, looks to me like the only way anyone can be saved in any of the kingdoms of heavenly glory is to accept Jesus Christ and his gospel!) 36 Thus was it made known that our Redeemer spent his time during his sojourn in the world of spirits, instructing and preparing the faithful spirits of the prophets who had testified of him in the flesh; 37 That they might carry the message of redemption unto all the dead, unto whom he could not go personally, because of their rebellion and transgression, that they through the ministration of his servants might also hear his words. (Now I’m getting it! Those members who think the gospel and its redeeming ordinances are only for the inheritors of the celestial kingdom are in error! And now I see that the Book of Mormon and the Doctrine and Covenants really do harmonize beautifully!) 57 I beheld that the faithful elders of this dispensation, when they depart from mortal life, continue their labors in the preaching of the gospel of repentance and redemption, through the sacrifice of the Only Begotten Son of God, among those who are in darkness and under the bondage of sin in the great world of the spirits of the dead. 58 The dead who repent will be redeemed, through obedience to the ordinances of the house of God, (there’s the necessity for the saving gospel ordinances again!) 59 And after they have paid the penalty of their transgressions, and are washed clean, shall receive a reward according to their works for they are heirs of salvation. (And to cap it all off, this verse makes it clear that the sufferings of the wicked in the spirit prison do not enable them to atone for their own sins, which is why the inheritors of the telestial kingdom must ultimately be “washed clean,” a most definite reference to the saving ordinance of baptism for the remission of sins!) Yet as clear as all of this is to me, most reject out of hand what I believe to be perfectly obvious because they’ve become so accustomed to seeing things the way they’ve always understood them that they find it impossible to receive what I believe to be glorious further light and knowledge. Go figure…

It’s truly astonishing to me how there appear to be some who desperately need to believe the doctrine of Christ is unjust, unmerciful and grossly unfair. But then it all makes sense when I read the following words of wisdom from the prophet Alma. 11 And they that will harden their hearts, to them is given the lesser portion of the word until they know nothing concerning his mysteries; and then they are taken captive by the devil, and led by his will down to destruction. Now this is what is meant by the chains of hell (Alma 12)

Let’s cut to the heart of the matter. Here’s the problem: The reason why you’re confused on the most glorious principle of the preaching of the gospel to the dead (both to those who never had the chance to accept Christ while in the flesh, and also to those who previously rejected the gospel while in the body) is because you apparently don’t understand that the Book of Mormon, as we now have it, contains only the lesser portion of the teachings of the gospel of Jesus Christ, and that the deeper doctrinal teachings of Christ were deliberately left out of Mormon’s abridgment. You’re appear to be approaching the Book of Mormon as if it’s a complete and definitive record that presents all the teachings of the gospel, including the deeper mysteries, but the fact is that the inverse is true. You see, the Prophet Mormon was pointedly commanded by the Lord to leave out of his abridgment the deeper teachings of the gospel of Christ — such as the great program preaching the gospel to the dead and the glorious doctrine of eternal marriage — with the promise that if the gentiles of the latter-days receive the Book of Mormon’s more basic and fundamental presentation of the gospel message with joy, gratitude and faith then he would reveal the deeper doctrines of truth to the Gentiles (us). And the Lord kept his promise when he revealed the deeper, more comprehensive teachings of the gospel when he revealed Doctrine and Covenants Sections 76, 88. 128 and 138. 1 And now it came to pass that when Jesus had told these things he expounded them unto the multitude; and he did expound all things unto them, both great and small. 2 And he saith: These scriptures, which ye had not with you, the Father commanded that I should give unto you; for it was wisdom in him that they should be given unto future generations. 3 And he did expound all things, even from the beginning until the time that he should come in his glory. —yea, even all things which should come upon the face of the earth, even until the elements should melt with fervent heat, and the earth should be wrapt together as a scroll, and the heavens and the earth should pass away; and… 8 And these things have I written, which are a lesser part of the things which he taught the people; and I have written them to the intent that they may be brought again unto this people from the Gentiles, according to the words which Jesus hath spoken. 9 And when they shall have received this, which is expedient that they should have first, to try their faith, and if it shall so be that they shall believe these things then shall the greater things be made manifest unto them. 10 And if it so be that they will not believe these things, then shall the greater things be withheld from them, unto their condemnation. 11 Behold, I was about to write them, all which were engraven upon the plates of Nephi, but the Lord forbade it, saying: I will try the faith of my people. 12 Therefore I, Mormon, do write the things which have been commanded me of the Lord. And now I, Mormon, make an end of my sayings, and proceed to write the things which have been commanded me. (3 Nephi 26) Your second stumbling block is it seems you refuse to believe that in God’s eyes of mercy the death of mortal body won’t occur until the gospel is no longer preached to the dead and vicarious temple work for the dead comes to an end. Until then, God views and judges the spirits of the deceased as if they’re still alive in the flesh. 6 For for this cause was the gospel also preached to them that are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit. (1 Peter 4) Once you’re able to get doctrinally “unstuck,” you’ll be able to fully understand and rejoice exceedingly in the following words of truth: 30 But behold, from among the righteous, he organized his forces and appoint messengers clothed with power and authority, and commissioned them to go forth and carry the light of the gospel to them that were in darkened, even to all the spirits of men; and thus was the gospel preached to the dead. 31 And the chosen messengers went forth to declare the acceptable day of the Lord and proclaim liberty to the captives who were bound, even unto all who would repent have their sins and receive the gospel. 32 Thus was the gospel preached to those who had died in their sins, without a knowledge of the truth, or in transgression, having rejected the prophets. (Doctrine and Covenants 138)

Because if bowing the knee in humble acceptance of Jesus Christ as personal Lord and Savior is required for entry into either of the two the lower two kingdoms of heavenly glory, it then goes without saying that the same conformity to eternal law is required for entry into one of the three degrees of glory within the celestial kingdom. As an aside, it may be surprising to some but there is next to nothing that can be found anywhere in the scriptures or in writings of the latter-day prophets and apostles that explains the nature of the three degrees of glory within in the celestial kingdom and how they differentiate from each other. All we actually have on the subject is the following disclosures found in Doctrine and Covenants Sections 131 and 129. 1 In the celestial glory there are three heavens or degrees; 2 And in order to obtain the highest, a man must enter into this order of the priesthood [meaning new and everlasting covenant of marriage]; 3 And if he does not, he cannot obtain it. 4 He may enter into the other, but that is the end of his kingdom; he cannot have an increase. (Doctrine and Covenants 131) and… 1 There are two kinds of beings in heaven, namely: Angels, who are resurrected personages, having bodies of flesh and bones— 2 For instance, Jesus said: Handle me and see, for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have. 3 Secondly: the spirits of just men made perfect, they who are not resurrected, but inherit the same glory. (Doctrine and Covenants 129) Based on the very limited information that can be gleaned from the above passages, the best I can deduce on the matter is that those who obtain the highest degree of glory within the celestial kingdom are the sealed and eternally married heavenly kings and queens. The next degree is obtained by those who are worthy of a celestial glory, but who, for undisclosed reasons, did not enter into the new and everlasting covenant of eternal marriage, and are therefore single. And the last degree of glory within the celestial kingdom appears to be a glorious temporary condition obtained by the most righteous spirits of the dead, for they are permitted to leave the precincts of paradise and enter the celestial glory while they await the even greater glory they will receive in the resurrection. The above reasoning represents my best attempt to flesh out the differences between the three degrees of glory within the celestial kingdom, but my perspective is subject to change when further light and knowledge on is given on the subject.

Any confusion on this point is Immediately dispelled when it’s understood that the expression “the day of this life,” as employed in the Book of Mormon, is referring to the fallen state, a condition that begins at birth, persists in the spirit world after death, and finally comes to an end at the time of the bodily resurrection into immortality. The Apostle Peter underscored this important doctrinal principal when he revealed that it’s God’s will that the gospel be preached to the spirits of the dead, to the end that said spirits will be judged by their response to the gospel message in the spirit world as if they heard it while still in the flesh. It’s a real eye opener when one reads Doctrine and Covenants 138 and learns that even the righteous spirits in paradise consider their condition there to be a form of spiritual imprisonment from which they deeply yearn to be liberated. Why exactly do the righteous spirits in paradise consider themselves to be in confinement in a spiritual prison? The answer lies in the fact until they obtain freedom from the fallen state through the resurrection into immortality, even the spirits in paradise are still in a fallen, probationary state, a condition that continues until the prison doors are thrown open by means of the resurrection. 50 For the dead (the righteous in paradise) had looked upon the long absence of their spirits from their bodies as a bondage. 51 These the Lord taught, and gave them power to come forth, after his resurrection from the dead, to enter into his Father’s kingdom, there to be crowned with immortality and eternal life, (Doctrine and Covenants 138)

I suppose the easiest way to help non-members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints to understand the principle of the necessity of having to follow the living prophets in order to be saved is to ask them the following simple question: Would you consider a man who professed himself to be a Christian during the Apostolic Period to be a true follower of Christ if he rejected the Apostle Peter as the resurrected Christ’s chosen leader of his church on earth? Simple as that. As to the other part of your question: from a Latter-Day Saint perspective, Doctrine and Covenants 138 makes it clear that entry into the lower kingdoms of heavenly glory is only made possible by obeying the gospel message declared by God’s duly authorized prophets who are assigned to teach and preach the gospel of Jesus Christ to the spirits of the dead who are sojourning in the spirit world. It will come as a surprise to many Latter-Day Saints to hear that entry into the terrestrial and telestial kingdoms of glory is made possible only if the spirits of the dead accept and follow the counsel of the Lord’s prophets in the spirit world, but Doctrine and Covenants 138 leaves no room for doubt on this matter. I don’t know how you’ll feel about this, but I personally take great solace in the fact that by the time of the final judgement there won’t be a single individual who will not know and understand the power and blessings of the gospel of Jesus Christ, and that it’s only the sons of perdition who will reject Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior! I can’t for the life of me imagine how a God of true love, justice and mercy could possibly do it any other way! 28 And I wondered at the words of Peter—wherein he said that the Son of God preached unto the spirits in prison, who sometime were disobedient, when once the long-suffering of God waited in the days of Noah—and how it was possible for him to preach to those spirits and perform the necessary labor among them in so short a time. 29 And as I wondered, my eyes were opened, and my understanding quickened, and I perceived that the Lord went not in person among the wicked and the disobedient who had rejected the truth, to teach them; 30 But behold, from among the righteous, he organized his forces and appointed messengers clothed with power and authority, and commissioned them to go forth and carry the light of the gospel to them that were in darkness, even to all the spirits of men; and thus was the gospel preached to the dead. 31 And the chosen messengers went forth to declare the acceptable day of the Lord and proclaim liberty to the captives who were bound, even unto all who would repent of their sins and receive the gospel. 32 Thus was the gospel preached to those who had died in their sins, without a knowledge of the truth, or in transgression having rejected the prophets. (Doctrine and Covenants 138) Further… 35 And so it was made known among the dead, both small and great, the unrighteous as well as the faithful, that redemption had been wrought through the sacrifice of the Son of God upon the cross. (Doctrine and Covenants 138) and finally… 57 I beheld that the faithful elders of this dispensation, when they depart from mortal life, continue their labors in the preaching of the gospel of repentance and redemption, through the sacrifice of the Only Begotten Son of God, among those who are in darkness and under the bondage of sin in the great world of the spirits of the dead. (Doctrine and Covenants 138) How absolutely wonderful!!

The reason why the faithless attempt to minimize the suffering of Christ’s atoning sacrifice is because, in their carnality, they’re only able to view the Lord’s holy offering with temporal eyes. But the fact is that the Lord’s atoning sacrifice of suffering exists outside of time because it’s infinite and eternal in nature, meaning that when viewed with spiritual eyes it’s understood that in the eye’s of God the Father the sacrifice continues to go on forever into the past and forever into the future. In actuality, the Lord’s atoning sacrifice was his initiation into the realm of the eternal Godhood, where the suffering of the great atoning sacrifice goes on forever, ever clear, ever acute and ever present within his holy omniscient memory. The price Christ paid to become one with God is to enter a holy realm where one experiences and feels and the suffering of the atoning sacrifice as an ever present reality. The following verses of scripture powerfully demonstrate that with God and heaven suffering for sin is an ever present reality. 27 And Enoch beheld angels descending out of heaven, bearing testimony of the Father and Son; and the Holy Ghost fell on many, and they were caught up by the powers of heaven into Zion. 28 And it came to pass that the God of heaven looked upon the residue of the people, and he wept; and Enoch bore record of it, saying: How is it that the heavens weep, and shed forth their tears as the rain upon the mountains? 29 And Enoch said unto the Lord: How is it that thou canst weep seeing thou art holy, and from all eternity to all eternity? The Lord answers Enoch’s question and then allows Enoch himself to be experientially initiated into the holy realm where God’s infinite and eternal suffering for sin is an ever present reality… 35 Behold, I am God; Man of Holiness is my name; Man of Counsel is my name; and Endless and Eternal is my name, also. 36 Wherefore, I can stretch forth mine hands and hold all the creations which I have made; and mine eye can pierce them also, and among all the workmanship of mine hands there has not been so great wickedness as among thy brethren. 37 But behold, their sins shall be upon the heads of their fathers; Satan shall be their father, and misery shall be their doom; and the whole heavens shall weep over them, even all the workmanship of mine hands; wherefore should not the heavens weep, seeing these shall suffer? 38 But behold, these which thine eyes are upon shall perish in the floods; and behold, I will shut them up; a prison have I prepared for them. 39 And that (Christ) which I have chosen hath pled before my face. Wherefore, he suffereth for their sins; inasmuch as they will repent in the day that my Chosen shall return unto me, and until that day they shall be it torment; 40 Wherefore, for this shall the heavens weep, yea, and all the workmanship of mine hands. 41 And it came to pass that the Lord spake unto Enoch, and told Enoch all the doings of the children of men; wherefore Enoch knew, and looked upon their wickedness, and their misery, and wept and stretched forth his arms, and his heart stretched as wide as eternity; and his bowels yearned; and all eternity shook. (Moses 7) The atoning sacrifice of Christ is an ever present, infinite and eternal reality.

Yes… those who utterly reject the inspired testimonies of the Lord’s prophets that Jesus Christ’s atoning sacrifice for sin is the only way to be forgiven for their sins and be saved, in one of the three heavenly kingdoms of glory, will become sons of perdition. This is why God, in his infinite love and mercy, sends authorized prophets to the spirits prison who rejected the prophets that were sent to them while they were in the flesh on earth, to the end that they might yet be forgiven and saved because he loves them eternally, and is not at all disposed to easily give up on any of his spirit children in spite of their previously hardened hearts and rebellion.That is, unless and until they demonstrate that they’ve deliberately and irrevocably placed themselves beyond God’s grace and mercy, while simultaneously having a full and complete knowledge of the consequences of their choice. This is how the true God of love administers his wonderful and all-encompassing plan of salvation. By the way, why don’t you intensively read and ponder the whole of Doctrine and Covenants 138 with an open mind and the perhaps all the answers you’re seeking will be presented to your heart and mind in crystal clear clarity? But first this… 14 And the arm of the Lord shall be revealed; and the day cometh that they who will not hear the voice of the Lord, neither the voice of his servants neither give heed to the words of the prophets and apostles shall be cut off from among the people (in other words, they will be wholly cast out of the Father’s kingdoms of heavenly glory on the day of final judgement and become sons of perdition); (Doctrine and Covenants 1) and… 38 What I the Lord have spoken, I have spoken, and I excuse not myself; and though the heavens and the earth pass away, my word shall not pass away, but shall all be fulfilled, whether by mine own voice or by the voice of my servants, it is the same. (Doctrine and Covenants 1) Finally, verse 31 of Doctrine and Covenants 138 makes it perfectly clear that the rebellious who rejected the prophets while they sojourned on the earth in the flesh are retaught the gospel in the spirit world in the hope that they will finally soften their hearts (as a consequence of having had to bear the miserable burden of their own sins while in the spirit prison) will, with gratitude, eventually accept Jesus Christ as their atoning Lord and Savior: 31 And the chosen messengers went forth to declare the acceptance day of the Lord (“the acceptable day of the Lord” means the Lord is still extending his arm of mercy to the spirits in prison) and proclaim liberty to the captives who were bound, even unto all who would repent of have their sins and receive the gospel. 32 Thus was the gospel preached to those who had died in their sins, without a knowledge of the truth, or in transgression having rejected the prophets. (Doctrine and Covenants 138) A multiple choice question for you: Why would do you think the Lord wants the gospel to be preached to the spirits of those who once rejected the prophet’s testimonies of Christ while they were in the flesh? 1) Is it because he wants to rub their faces in the sad reality that they “blew it” and they can never be saved? 2) Or is it because he has an infinite and eternal love for them, and, in spite of their former rebellion, he still fervently hopes they will accept him in faith so that he can save them?

It must be miserable living under the false impression that is God a heartless dictator who pushes people around and eternally damns them to an unimaginably cruel hell because nobody has the power the stop him. Doctrine and Covenants 76 makes it abundantly clear that by the time of the final judgement the only individuals who will be in terrible unsaved state spoken of by the Prophet Alma in Alma 42 will be the sons of perdition, for they are the only individuals who will utterly refuse to repent and accept Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior. 32 They are they who are the sons of perdition, of whom I say that it had been better for them never to have been born; 33 For they are vessels of wrath, doomed to suffer the wrath of God, with the devil and his angels in eternity; 34 Concerning whom I have said there is no forgiveness in this world nor in the world to come— 35 Having denied the Holy Spirit after having received it, and having denied the Only Begotten Son of the Father, having crucified him unto themselves and put him to an open shame. 36 These are they who shall go away into the lake of fire and brimstone, with the devil and his angels— 37 And the only ones on whom the second death shall have any power; 38 Yea, verily, the only ones who shall not be redeemed in the due time of the Lord, after the sufferings of his wrath. 39 For all the rest shall be brought forth by the resurrection of the dead, through the triuph and the glory of the Lamb, who was slain, who was in the bosom of the Father before the worlds were made. 40 And this is the gospel, the glad tidings which the voice out of the heavens bore record unto us. (Doctrine and Covenants 76) The scriptures couldn’t be more clear that the probationary state of the fall continues on in the spirit world after death. If not so, God would be no better than the world’s most notorious totalitarian tyrants. The Apostle Peter well understood this most glorious and wonderful principal of salvation being extended to dead who died in there sins, with mercy even being extended to those multitudes who were destroyed in the great flood due to their rebellion. 18 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit: 19 By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison; (1 Peter 4) 20 Which were sometime were disobedient, when once the long suffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water. (1 Peter 3) and… 5 Who (I.e. all of humanity) shall give account to him that is ready to judge the quick and the dead. 6 Forfor this cause (I.e. the inescapable fact the all mankind will be judged) was the gospel preached also to them that are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit. (1 Peter 4) But if it makes you happy to think that the God of perfect love, knowledge, wisdom and mercy somehow created the most unjust and unmerciful horror show imaginable, because, in spite of the mountain of scriptural evidence that says otherwise, you want to continue to believe that the probationary state doesn’t continue after death that’s your prerogative.

Doctrine and Covenant 19’s “endless punishment” is a simple concept that’s easy to grasp when it’s understood within the illumination provided by 2 Nephi 9 and the further light and knowledge revealed in Doctrine and Covenants Sections 76 and 138. This is the concept: God’s punishment for sin is indeed endless and never will come to an end UNTIL the individual who’s experiencing that endless punishment for sin accepts Jesus Christ as his personal Savior and repents of his sins. The fate of the sons of perdition provides proof positive that God’s endless punishment for sin really is endless, for the sons of perdition’s suffering for sin never comes to an end, worlds without end. Why? Because they utterly refuse to accept Jesus Christ as their personal Lord and Savior and repent of their sins. Even worse, theirs is not merely an indifferent neglect of the salvation graciously and merciful offered to them by Jesus Christ, but an implacable and unquenchable hatred of God and Christ. As a consequence, for them there actually is no forgiveness nor cessation of suffering for sin because they don’t want to be forgiven, and, as we all know, “God will force no man to heaven” (In this case, heaven means the inheritance of a mansion in any of the three heavenly kingdoms of glory). 32 They are they who are the sons of perdition, of whom I say that it had been better for them never to have been born; 33 For they are vessels of wrath, doomed to suffer the wrath of God, with the devil and his angels in eternity; 34 Concerning whom I have said there is nor forgiveness in this world nor in the world to come— 35 Having denied the Holy Spirit after having received it, and having denied the Only Begotten Son of the Father, having crucified him unto themselves and put him to an open shame. (Doctrine and Covenants 76) So the doctrine of endless punishment is now rendered clear: God’s punishment for sin never does and never will come to an end unless each spirit son and daughter of the Father accepts Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior and sincerely repents of their sins. Doctrine and Covenants 76 reveals that the reason why the suffering for sin of the eventual inheritors of the telestial kingdom of glory will come to an end isn’t because they’ve suffered enough to atone for their own sins (as if man can become his own Savior!), but because the time will come when these will be humbled to the dust by their suffering and bow the knee to God the Father and freely confess unto him that Jesus Christ is their Lord, Savior and Deliverer from hell. 109 But behold, and lo, we saw the glory and the inhabitants of the telestial world, that they were as innumerable as the stars in the firmament of heaven, or as the sand upon the seashore; 110 And heard the voice of the Lord saying: These all shall bow the knee, and every tongue shall confess to him who sits upon the throne forever and ever; (Doctrine and Covenants 76) And what specifically will these confess? The church’s footnote to verse 110 takes us to the following stirring testimony of the Apostle Paul… 9 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name: 10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth; 11 And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father. (Philippians 2)

Your point is a valid one. But I believe CV75 is suggesting a contrast between the gasping and flailing of a drowning man who knows he’s alone in the raging sea without any realistic hope for rescue, as compared to a man who’s desperately drowning in sin and misery but believes in his heart that if he truly wants to be rescued and forgiven bad enough that Almighty God will descend from heaven and keep his promise to rescue and redeem him.

Correct: 30 But behold, from among the righteous, he organized his forces and appointed messengers, clothed with power and authority, and commissioned them to go forth and carry the light of the gospel to them that were in darkness, even to all the spirits of men; and thus was the gospel preached to the dead. 31 And the chosen messengers went forth to declare the acceptable day of the Lord and proclaim liberty to the captives who were bound, even unto all who would repent have their sins and receive the gospel. 32 Thus was the gospel preached to those who had died in their sins, without a knowledge of the truth, or in transgression, having rejected the prophets. (Doctrine and Covenants 138)

Moses chapter 7 makes it clear that all the enemies of God, by whatever names or titles they were then known, were destroyed in the great flood and thereafter banished to the spirit prison (hell) wherein they would suffer for their sins UNTIL the triumphant atoning sacrifice of Jesus Christ mercifully opened the prison doors to allow missionaries to enter therein to preach the gospel and deliver from suffering all those who were willing to exercise faith in Jesus Christ, repent of their sins, and receive forgiveness. 37 But behold, their sins shall be upon the heads of their fathers; Satan shall be their father, and misery shall be their doom; and the whole heavens shall weep over them, even all the workmanship of mine hands; wherefore should not the heavens weep, seeing these shall suffer? 38 But behold, these which thine eyes are upon shall perish in the floods; and behold, I will shut them up; a prison I have I prepared for them. 39 And that (Jesus Christ) which I have chosen hath pled before my face. Wherefore, he suffereth for their sins; inasmuch as they will repent in the day that my Chosen shall return unto me, and until that day they shall be in torment; (Moses 7) and… 30 But behold, from among the righteous, he organized his forces and appointed messengers, clothed with power and authority, and commissioned them to go forth and carry the light of the gospel to them that were in darkness, even to all the spirits of men; and thus was the gospel preached to the dead. 31 And the chosen messengers went forth to declare the acceptable day of the Lord and proclaim liberty to the captives who were bound, even unto all who would repent have their sins and receive the gospel. 32 Thus was the gospel preached to those who had died in their sins, without a knowledge of the truth, or in transgression, having rejected the prophets. (Doctrine and Covenants 138)