VideoGameJunkie Posted January 3, 2016 Posted January 3, 2016 I have cousins and an uncle that I know won't make it to the Celestial Kingdom unless they seriously repent and are forgiven in the spirit world, so they'll throw off their eternal families.
salgare Posted January 3, 2016 Posted January 3, 2016 3 minutes ago, VideoGameJunkie said: I have cousins and an uncle that I know won't make it to the Celestial Kingdom unless they seriously repent and are forgiven in the spirit world, so they'll throw off their eternal families. Reminds me of five year old, on the provided stool at the pulpit during a Fast and Testimony meeting proclaiming "I know the Church is True" 2
VideoGameJunkie Posted January 3, 2016 Posted January 3, 2016 15 minutes ago, salgare said: Reminds me of five year old, on the provided stool at the pulpit during a Fast and Testimony meeting proclaiming "I know the Church is True" So the people saying they know in fast and testimony meeting at church don't really know?
JLHPROF Posted January 3, 2016 Posted January 3, 2016 19 minutes ago, VideoGameJunkie said: I have cousins and an uncle that I know won't make it to the Celestial Kingdom unless they seriously repent and are forgiven in the spirit world, so they'll throw off their eternal families. I am positive we will be shocked by who make exaltation and who doesn't. I am also positive that the vast majority won't for the simple reason they aren't willing to do what is needed, not because they are wicked or sinful. It won't be the things we do wrong that keep us from reaching our potential, God provided a payment and atonement to account for those. It will be the requirements we aren't willing to fulfill by our own agency.
VideoGameJunkie Posted January 3, 2016 Posted January 3, 2016 1 minute ago, JLHPROF said: I am positive we will be shocked by who make exaltation and who doesn't. I am also positive that the vast majority won't for the simple reason they aren't willing to do what is needed, not because they are wicked or sinful. It won't be the things we do wrong that keep us from reaching our potential, God provided a payment and atonement to account for those. It will be the requirements we aren't willing to fulfill by our own agency. Which requirements won't people fulfill by their own agency? Like not wanting to be sealed in the temple?
JLHPROF Posted January 3, 2016 Posted January 3, 2016 1 minute ago, VideoGameJunkie said: Which requirements won't people fulfill by their own agency? Like not wanting to be sealed in the temple? That's the most famous one.
VideoGameJunkie Posted January 3, 2016 Posted January 3, 2016 Just now, JLHPROF said: That's the most famous one. Well I want to be, just haven't found the right girl yet so hopefully that happens. I was always worried it'd be our sins that keep us from exaltation after we've made covenants in the temple.
JLHPROF Posted January 3, 2016 Posted January 3, 2016 2 minutes ago, VideoGameJunkie said: I was always worried it'd be our sins that keep us from exaltation after we've made covenants in the temple. Some of my favorite quotes on salvation/exaltation. Joseph Smith "Our heavenly Father is more liberal in His views, and boundless in His mercies and blessings, than we are ready to believe or receive; and at the same time more terrible to the workers of iniquity, more awful in the executions of His punishments, and more ready to detect in every false way, than we are apt to suppose Him to be... " "If you do not accuse each other, God will not accuse you. If you have no accuser you will enter heaven. . . . What many people call sin is not sin; I do many things to break down superstition, and I will break it down." "A religion that does not require the sacrifice of all things never has power sufficient to produce the faith necessary unto life and salvation. "
Calm Posted January 3, 2016 Posted January 3, 2016 (edited) 58 minutes ago, salgare said: You have children and grandchildren right Calm? They are going with him, right? Meaning what exactly? I am thinking you misunderstood the point of my post. Btw, doctrinally speaking children remain sealed to both parents. If parents are divorced but are both deemed templeworthy, there is no teaching the father is the one who gets priority. Or the mother for that matter. Once a child has been sealed, no resealing is done that I am aware of even if a parent is excommunicated, a temple cancelation is done or anything else. Edited January 3, 2016 by Calm 1
Tacenda Posted January 3, 2016 Author Posted January 3, 2016 (edited) Just a tidbit, on the treatment of women by PH holders. It's the little things...like tonight I got grief for wanting to go to a wedding reception of a girl I babysat when she was a child. So right before going in while still in the vehicle, I was writing on the card, struggling because I was being pressured to hurry, then before you know it the passenger door is opened and the freezing air comes in, talk about insensitive or being treated as a child or lorded over. Maybe that's not the definition of lording over, but you get the idea. Because I wasn't moving fast enough, my significant other forces the issue by opening the door to the cold to hurry me. Basically not much respect. Edited January 3, 2016 by Tacenda edit to add
VideoGameJunkie Posted January 3, 2016 Posted January 3, 2016 5 minutes ago, JLHPROF said: Some of my favorite quotes on salvation/exaltation. Joseph Smith "Our heavenly Father is more liberal in His views, and boundless in His mercies and blessings, than we are ready to believe or receive; and at the same time more terrible to the workers of iniquity, more awful in the executions of His punishments, and more ready to detect in every false way, than we are apt to suppose Him to be... " "If you do not accuse each other, God will not accuse you. If you have no accuser you will enter heaven. . . . What many people call sin is not sin; I do many things to break down superstition, and I will break it down." "A religion that does not require the sacrifice of all things never has power sufficient to produce the faith necessary unto life and salvation. " So what's the recipe and pathway to avoiding Heavenly Father's wrath and receiving exaltation?
RevTestament Posted January 3, 2016 Posted January 3, 2016 8 minutes ago, VideoGameJunkie said: So what's the recipe and pathway to avoiding Heavenly Father's wrath and receiving exaltation? following Christ
VideoGameJunkie Posted January 3, 2016 Posted January 3, 2016 8 minutes ago, RevTestament said: following Christ Billions follow Christ. It's that simple?
salgare Posted January 3, 2016 Posted January 3, 2016 (edited) 29 minutes ago, Calm said: Meaning what exactly? I am thinking you misunderstood the point of my post. Was not the point of your post, that after death, maybe at the time of resurrection you, as a woman, may choose a different Patriarch if you were displeased with the one from mortality? You would need a new Patriarch unless you were good with the lowest servant level of the Celestial right? This is the concept of 7 righteous women to one man right? i.e. there are plenty of other worthy men that will be willing to take you in. Quote Btw, doctrinally speaking children remain sealed to both parents. If parents are divorced but are both deemed templeworthy, there is no teaching the father is the one who gets priority. Or the mother for that matter. This is not my understanding of the Patriarchal Priesthood/Holy order. I believe you are wrong. Quote Once a child has been sealed, no resealing is done that I am aware of even if a parent is excommunicated, a temple cancelation is done or anything else. If I did understanding the point of your post (decide after this life), then no earthly unsealing for you and resealing of the children would make any sense, nor is there any need as this only applies to those "it will sort out in the afterlife" type of deals. Edited January 3, 2016 by salgare
RevTestament Posted January 3, 2016 Posted January 3, 2016 15 minutes ago, RevTestament said: following Christ They follow the teachings of men - "popes" etc Your question specifically mentioned exaltation. And the only way to be exalted is to follow Christ. Others may be forgiven but not exalted. 1
Guest Posted January 3, 2016 Posted January 3, 2016 To the OP...Adam was made Lord over all the earth.... Most Marriage's still, require this, and made the man of the head of the house. So usually the man is made the head of the the household. And the Priesthood (if circumstance allows.
JLHPROF Posted January 3, 2016 Posted January 3, 2016 57 minutes ago, VideoGameJunkie said: Billions follow Christ. It's that simple? 48 minutes ago, RevTestament said: They follow the teachings of men - "popes" etc Your question specifically mentioned exaltation. And the only way to be exalted is to follow Christ. Others may be forgiven but not exalted. The Rev is right. It's not about "accepting Christ", it's about following in his path. And it won't be our sins that keep us from exaltation - they can be forgiven and the price has been paid. It will be our unwillingness to follow the path God laid out through his Son.
VideoGameJunkie Posted January 3, 2016 Posted January 3, 2016 6 minutes ago, JLHPROF said: The Rev is right. It's not about "accepting Christ", it's about following in his path. And it won't be our sins that keep us from exaltation - they can be forgiven and the price has been paid. It will be our unwillingness to follow the path God laid out through his Son. What is that path?
salgare Posted January 3, 2016 Posted January 3, 2016 As per my concerns as to if anything has changed in the indoctrination, and all the claims of no, its all equal ... https://www.lds.org/new-era/2015/12/are-you-a-giver-or-a-getter?lang=eng "How will a temple marriage give me an opportunity to serve my spouse and children?" Sorry sisters, talk of your ideals all you want, here is an example of the reality.
Calm Posted January 3, 2016 Posted January 3, 2016 1 hour ago, salgare said: Was not the point of your post, that after death, maybe at the time of resurrection you, as a woman, may choose a different Patriarch if you were displeased with the one from mortality? Absolutely not.
salgare Posted January 3, 2016 Posted January 3, 2016 (edited) 23 minutes ago, VideoGameJunkie said: What is that path? I'm not clear on this path stuff either. MercyNGrace sent me a talk a long time ago. I can't find it now, but it dealt with the concept of Grace and Works and Salvation verses Exaltation. In a horribly lacking nutshell, it explained how grace gave all salvation, but from their it is required to move beyond this mark and by works secure/gain our exaltation. Is this even close JLH and Rev to this path? Edited January 3, 2016 by salgare
Calm Posted January 3, 2016 Posted January 3, 2016 https://www.lds.org/new-era/2015/08/to-the-point/if-my-parents-were-sealed-in-the-temple-and-then-got-divorced-which-one-am-i-sealed-to?lang=eng
salgare Posted January 3, 2016 Posted January 3, 2016 (edited) 17 minutes ago, Calm said: https://www.lds.org/new-era/2015/08/to-the-point/if-my-parents-were-sealed-in-the-temple-and-then-got-divorced-which-one-am-i-sealed-to?lang=eng Interesting August 2015 a declaration that differs from the doctrine you and I were raised with, and still defies the Patriarchal/Holy Order. Shared custody in heaven, who would have thought? There are horror stories out there about the doctrines of temple divorces and re-sealings to other men in this life that are common which would show this to be a change in doctrine. Do I need to find them and reference them here? eta more to the point of this discussion (women's value compared to men) The way the Holy Order works is all your sons will remain in the Patriarchs lineages, all your daughters are given off to their new Lord's linage. The sealing of daughters to parents is kind of a mass of confusion in this light. Edited January 3, 2016 by salgare
Calm Posted January 3, 2016 Posted January 3, 2016 No, you are wrong. What was there was the same doctrine I was raised with. https://www.lds.org/new-era/1975/12/qa-questions-and-answers?lang=eng If you truly believe that a parental sealing means eternal custody rights, you mightwant to start there for reexamining doctrine. 1
Calm Posted January 3, 2016 Posted January 3, 2016 13 minutes ago, salgare said: The way the Holy Order works is all your sons will remain in the Patriarchs lineages, all your daughters are given off to their new Lord's linage. Cfr this is church doctrine.
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