2014 Pew Forum Report On Religion In America

[thesometimesaint]

3DOP:

 

You are correct that we are to attend our local Wards. The problem I see for the Saints is that if we don't have a thick skin, life in a small Ward can feel very constrained. There really is no alternative of finding another Ward more to our liking. The good thing is there are no lifetime callings at the Ward level so we are guaranteed some change every few years.

 

P:s. My Bishop was recently released and is now a Sunday School teacher, 

Edited May 16, 2015 by thesometimesaint

[carbon dioxide]

 I'd much rather have nominal LDS in my ward than non-nominal.

 

What is called "nominals" in that article would be those who are LDS in name only.  So they are non-believing inactives.  A ward full of those would make a quiet ward on Sunday.  But I suppose that would be a good thing if you have a calling.  Get a teaching job and you show up for class and nobody is there.

Edited May 16, 2015 by carbon dioxide

[Teancum]

Honestly, the whole "non-Christian" schitck resides mostly in Protestant Christianity. At the academic level, Mormons are usually considered a Christian group, albeit one with very different and heterodox beliefs.

The Catholic Church does not accept Mornonism as a valid Christian Church.

http://www.truthandgrace.com/Catholiconmormon.htm

[rodheadlee]

The Catholic Church does not accept Mornonism as a valid Christian Church.

http://www.truthandgrace.com/Catholiconmormon.htm

Won't they be surprised?

[Teancum]

Won't they be surprised?

Why?

[DBMormon]

My thought is that these two don't seem to be congruent especially in light of growth in past decades

Some have asserted that more members are leaving the Church today and that there is more doubt and unbelief than in the past. This is simply not true. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints has never been stronger. The number of members removing their names from the records of the Church has always been very small and is significantly less in recent years than in the past.24 The increase in demonstrably measurable areas, such as endowed members with a current temple recommend, adult full-tithe payers, and those serving missions, has been dramatic. Let me say again, the Church has never been stronger. But, “remember the worth of souls is great in the sight of God.”25 We reach out to everyone.

V.S.

Mormons go from 1.7 to 1.6 % of u.s population

That is almost a 1% decrease and in light of growth claimed in recent decades that seems like a drastic reverse in growth to a standstill if not a small decrease

[carbon dioxide]

My thought is that these two don't seem to be congruent especially in light of growth in past decades

Some have asserted that more members are leaving the Church today and that there is more doubt and unbelief than in the past. This is simply not true. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints has never been stronger. The number of members removing their names from the records of the Church has always been very small and is significantly less in recent years than in the past.24 The increase in demonstrably measurable areas, such as endowed members with a current temple recommend, adult full-tithe payers, and those serving missions, has been dramatic. Let me say again, the Church has never been stronger. But, “remember the worth of souls is great in the sight of God.”25 We reach out to everyone.

V.S.

Mormons go from 1.7 to 1.6 % of u.s population

That is almost a 1% decrease and in light of growth claimed in recent decades that seems like a drastic reverse in growth to a standstill if not a small decrease

Depends on how one looks at it.  It is possible for the numbers of LDS members to increase while decrease in percentage of total population. 

[DBMormon]

Depends on how one looks at it.  It is possible for the numbers of LDS members to increase while decrease in percentage of total population. 

sure.  but now your just trying to save face by saying you kissed your sister.  it might give you something to say, but everyone around is still chuckling.

[DBMormon]

it also doesn't account for what Elder Cook said which is based on pure numbers and unless members are drifting away in complete silence when they didn't before the conclusions seem skewed

[carbon dioxide]

it also doesn't account for what Elder Cook said which is based on pure numbers and unless members are drifting away in complete silence when they didn't before the conclusions seem skewed

It does not but the fact that the number has gone down from 1.7 to 1.6 many not be relevant to what he was talking about.  I personally don't care little about the numbers.  There is over 7 billion people in the world so fighting over a million LDS members here or there is trivial in terms of the total population. The Church is very small and will continue to be very small unless God himself decides to do something radically different to boast the numbers up. 

[DBMormon]

It does not but the fact that the number has gone down from 1.7 to 1.6 many not be relevant to what he was talking about.  I personally don't care little about the numbers.  There is over 7 billion people in the world so fighting over a million LDS members here or there is trivial in terms of the total population. The Church is very small and will continue to be very small unless God himself decides to do something radically different to boast the numbers up. 

but is the church as strong as it has ever been in terms of numbers and are less members resigning than ever before?  what say ye?

[rodheadlee]

My thought is that these two don't seem to be congruent especially in light of growth in past decades

Some have asserted that more members are leaving the Church today and that there is more doubt and unbelief than in the past. This is simply not true. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints has never been stronger. The number of members removing their names from the records of the Church has always been very small and is significantly less in recent years than in the past.24 The increase in demonstrably measurable areas, such as endowed members with a current temple recommend, adult full-tithe payers, and those serving missions, has been dramatic. Let me say again, the Church has never been stronger. But, “remember the worth of souls is great in the sight of God.”25 We reach out to everyone.

V.S.

Mormons go from 1.7 to 1.6 % of u.s population

That is almost a 1% decrease and in light of growth claimed in recent decades that seems like a drastic reverse in growth to a standstill if not a small decrease

That is because you are not allowing for the growth of the Church outside the US.

[rodheadlee]

Why?

Well because on the day Christ returns or even on Judgement Day or perhaps when each person dies  they will find out Christ authorized us to do baptisms. I'm sure you know this theology even if you don't believe that the LDS Church is truly Jesus Christ's Church. That He is at the head running His Church through His Prophets and Apostles. Many will be surprised.

[DBMormon]

That is because you are not allowing for the growth of the Church outside the US.

Then why not frankly acknowledge that while worldwide, the church is doing well, in the U.S. We're are stagnant or even declining. Also this ignores that critics have been speaking of growth in the u.s. And other well developed countries where information is widely available?

[Stargazer]

Then why not frankly acknowledge that while worldwide, the church is doing well, in the U.S. We're are stagnant or even declining. Also this ignores that critics have been speaking of growth in the u.s. And other well developed countries where information is widely available?

 

It may be a Book of Mormon scenario, where certain of the Lamanites (e.g. Samuel) had to return to the Nephites to try to get them back to the truth.  Perhaps Church HQ will be moved to, say, Nigeria or Ghana, and they will be sending missionaries HERE to get us straightened out.

[Sleeper Cell]

My thought is that these two don't seem to be congruent especially in light of growth in past decades

Some have asserted that more members are leaving the Church today and that there is more doubt and unbelief than in the past. This is simply not true. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints has never been stronger. The number of members removing their names from the records of the Church has always been very small and is significantly less in recent years than in the past.24 The increase in demonstrably measurable areas, such as endowed members with a current temple recommend, adult full-tithe payers, and those serving missions, has been dramatic. Let me say again, the Church has never been stronger. But, “remember the worth of souls is great in the sight of God.”25 We reach out to everyone.

V.S.

Mormons go from 1.7 to 1.6 % of u.s population

That is almost a 1% decrease and in light of growth claimed in recent decades that seems like a drastic reverse in growth to a standstill if not a small decrease

 

No it isn’t.  

 

According to the guys who actually conducted the poll, the difference between 1.6% and 1.7% is within the margin of error; therefore is not statistically significant.  IOW, the poll shows no change in the percent of adults who self identified as LDS in 2007, and those who self identified as LDS in 2014.

 

Furthermore, according to Pew Research, the 2007 figure was based on am adult population of 227 million, while the 2014 figure was based on an adult population of 245 million.

 

So, even if we ignored the poll’s statistical margin of error, the figures would still show a modest increase, not a decrease:

 

2007 1.7% of 227 million =  3.86 million 

2014 1.6% of 245 million  = 3.92 million

 

If, on the other hand,  we take the pollster's word for it (that there is no statistical difference between 1.6% and 1.7%), and use the lesser of the two for both years:

 

2007 1.6% of 227 million  =  3.6 million

2014 1.6% of 245 million =   3.9 million

 

the poll suggests a growth (in self identifying adults) of 300,000 in the last 7 years.  Noting to write home about, as another poster noted.  But hardly stagnation or a decline, either. More to the point, it is consistent with Elder Cook’s statement.

[Hillel2]

http://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2015/05/13/nones-americans-christians-evangelicals-column/27198423/

Makes some good points.

[Hillel2]

Exactly my take on the matter. Ditto for Europe. Most of the folks self-classifying as none would have been happy to have done so 70 years ago but social pressures, practical needs and this world factors were what kept most of the now dissafiliated in the fold.

I don't know that it's such a bad thing. If someone has no connection to a faith, why claim them. Isn't it preferable to be a lot smaller and a lot more genuine?

Perhaps many of those, rather triumphantly announcing the death of religion...not just Christianity...are really celebrating what they see as the end to traditional moralities. They could be mistaken. There is movement in some circles for a creation of a more communal secular moral code (vs. the more widespread tendency towards an individualistic freeforall)

[DBMormon]

It may be a Book of Mormon scenario, where certain of the Lamanites (e.g. Samuel) had to return to the Nephites to try to get them back to the truth.  Perhaps Church HQ will be moved to, say, Nigeria or Ghana, and they will be sending missionaries HERE to get us straightened out.

try telling a 6th generation utahite in the high priest group that he has it all mixed up.... good luck with that

[DBMormon]

 

No it isn’t.  

 

According to the guys who actually conducted the poll, the difference between 1.6% and 1.7% is within the margin of error; therefore is not statistically significant.  IOW, the poll shows no change in the percent of adults who self identified as LDS in 2007, and those who self identified as LDS in 2014.

 

Furthermore, according to Pew Research, the 2007 figure was based on am adult population of 227 million, while the 2014 figure was based on an adult population of 245 million.

 

So, even if we ignored the poll’s statistical margin of error, the figures would still show a modest increase, not a decrease:

 

2007 1.7% of 227 million =  3.86 million 

2014 1.6% of 245 million  = 3.92 million

 

If, on the other hand,  we take the pollster's word for it (that there is no statistical difference between 1.6% and 1.7%), and use the lesser of the two for both years:

 

2007 1.6% of 227 million  =  3.6 million

2014 1.6% of 245 million =   3.9 million

 

the poll suggests a growth (in self identifying adults) of 300,000 in the last 7 years.  Noting to write home about, as another poster noted.  But hardly stagnation or a decline, either. More to the point, it is consistent with Elder Cook’s statement.

 

growth in numbers but slower growth than we have had in decades and based on population we are losing ground where we once were gaining it.  that still says that the number of people joing has decreased significantly and/or the number leaving has increased significantly.  Either way, statistically we are not as strong as we have ever been.  please tell me you get this and are just trying to find a loophole.  You can't seriously think that statistically we are moving along better than we ever have?

[rodheadlee]

It may be a Book of Mormon scenario, where certain of the Lamanites (e.g. Samuel) had to return to the Nephites to try to get them back to the truth.  Perhaps Church HQ will be moved to, say, Nigeria or Ghana, and they will be sending missionaries HERE to get us straightened out.

I hear Tonga is 60% LDS 

[rodheadlee]

try telling a 6th generation utahite in the high priest group that he has it all mixed up.... good luck with that

Too much pride is not a good thing.

[rodheadlee]

Then why not frankly acknowledge that while worldwide, the church is doing well, in the U.S. We're are stagnant or even declining. Also this ignores that critics have been speaking of growth in the u.s. And other well developed countries where information is widely available?

You seem to think the net is not available world wide. Let me tell you I got service in 3rd world anchorages directly to the boat for dirt cheap. 

[DBMormon]

That is because you are not allowing for the growth of the Church outside the US.

i hear you but even that growth is slower than decades pastin the U.S. in terms of baptisms and many more are going inactive after baptism compared to U.S. numbers.  Even in light of outside the U.S. one would be pressed to say the health of the growth "has never been stronger"

 

again this is wanting to defend something that can not logically be defended.

 

For get defending the quote.  Do you think there is less resignations in the church today than in the 1990's?  1980's? how about the 70's?

 

common sense, logic, statistics (more members today and more awareness of troublesome issues), all say otherwise but if our need to bury our head and defend the undefensible is important, please do continue.

[Mystery Meat]

try telling a 6th generation utahite in the high priest group that he has it all mixed up.... good luck with that

 

That's not your job.