Membership Without The Temple.

[thesometimesaint]

Several passages in various Mormon scriptures describe God as always being God.

The Book of Mormon (in Mosiah 3:5) - "The Lord Omnipotent who reigneth, who was, and is

from all eternity to all eternity, shall come down from heaven among the children of

men, and shall dwell in a tabernacle of clay, and shall go forth amongst men, working

mighty miracles, such as healing the sick, raising the dead, causing the lame to walk,

the blind to receive their sight, and the deaf to hear, and curing all manner of

diseases".

"And God spake unto Moses, saying; behold, I am the Lord God Almighty, and Endless is

my name; for I am without beginning of days or end of years; and is not this endless?"

(Moses 1:3).

"For I know that God is not a partial God, neither a changeable being; but he is

unchangeable from all eternity to all eternity" (Moroni 8:18).

"By these things we know that there is a God in heaven, who is infinite and eternal,

from everlasting to everlasting the same unchangeable God, the framer of heaven and

earth, and all things which are in them” (D&C 20:17).

"Blessed be the Lord God of Israel from everlasting, and to everlasting. Amen, and

Amen” (Ps. 41:13; 90:2; 93:2).

Joseph Smith may have started well, but then he began teaching a god that was not the

"everlasting to everlasting" God. "It is necessary we should understand the character

and being of God and how He came to be so; for I am going to tell you how God came

to be God. We have imagined and supposed that God was God from all eternity. I will

refute that idea, and take away the veil, so that you may see" (History of the Church,

volume 6).

I have heard from my conversations with Mormons that there is diversity on this matter.

Some believe God is an exalted man while others are not quite sure.

Regards,

Jim

Incorrect; we believe and teach that God is eternal, and is an exalted man. We further believe and teach that we are eternal, and through the Atonement of Christ can become like God.

[theplains]

You are not Mormon then?

No. I go to another church. But we believe the Bible is the Word of God and

share some common beliefs as you.

Perhaps I should learn to keep my own counsel?

My only counsel is the scriptures and the Holy Spirit. Any teaching not supported

by scripture I would consider as speculation.

I don't believe in anything being eternal personally.

Latter-day Saints teach that you are an eternal being. Once termed an intelligence, you

were then formed into a spirit child of Heavenly Mother and Father (Jesus Christ being

the first child). These spirits then progressed in the spirit world before coming to

earth. Jesus Christ was special in that he progressed all the way into becoming a God

in the spirit world somehow. The identity of the Holy Ghost is unknown. LDS teachings

does not indicate whether he is another spirit brother of Jesus, who also progressed

into becoming a god, or whether he is always God who was the first member of the

Godhead, later joined by Heavenly Father (who became a God), then joined by Jesus. Or

he may have been a special creation of the Father who also progressed into a God.

However if Heavenly Father is eternal, my questioning will not bother him because

he will not change, but I surely will.

The Mormon teaching of Heavenly Father has him making a major change. He is an eternal

being, but he is not the Eternal God. He is taught to be an exalted man, who with his

wife (the D&C mentions him being polygamous) that he married on some other world, changed

into a God and Goddess. They then went to create and populate some other world (our

planet Earth).

That my mind can not grasp the magnificence of God/

LDS theology does not grasp the magnificence of the God who has always been God. This

is the God we worship however. Islam has a similar teaching about the eternal nature

of God.

I sit in these rooms, void of guidance save what I can find in my own prayers,

or readings.

May the Holy Spirit will guide you into worshipping the true God, not the man-made

version of Him.

My own Bishop recently informed me I can have husband. Friends persuaded me to

remove my wedding ring. I wonder what will happen now.

Well, according to LDS teachings, the only way for you to become a Goddess yourself one

day is to marry in the Temple. Jesus taught that marriage is not for everyone. We can

serve God even by remaining like a eunuch. I was married before, now divorced. As a

single person, you definitely have more abilities to serve Him in other ways.

Before you take off your wedding ring, see if you can be reconciled to your husband.

It sounds like there is still some love between you.

Thanks,

Jim

[Calm]

The Mormon teaching of Heavenly Father has him making a major change. He is an eternal

being, but he is not the Eternal God. He is taught to be an exalted man, who with his

wife (the D&C mentions him being polygamous) that he married on some other world, changed

into a God and Goddess. They then went to create and populate some other world (our

planet Earth).

LDS theology does not grasp the magnificence of the God who has always been God. This

is the God we worship however. Islam has a similar teaching about the eternal nature

of God.

May the Holy Spirit will guide you into worshipping the true God, not the man-made

version of Him.

You shouldn't take upon yourself telling us our own teachings unless we've confirmed you've taught them correctly. So far you still haven't gotten a good portion of it right, add in way too much of your own speculation.

[EllenMaksoud]

No. I go to another church. But we believe the Bible is the Word of God and

share some common beliefs as you.

My only counsel is the scriptures and the Holy Spirit. Any teaching not supported

by scripture I would consider as speculation.

Latter-day Saints teach that you are an eternal being. Once termed an intelligence, you

were then formed into a spirit child of Heavenly Mother and Father (Jesus Christ being

the first child). These spirits then progressed in the spirit world before coming to

earth. Jesus Christ was special in that he progressed all the way into becoming a God

in the spirit world somehow. The identity of the Holy Ghost is unknown. LDS teachings

does not indicate whether he is another spirit brother of Jesus, who also progressed

into becoming a god, or whether he is always God who was the first member of the

Godhead, later joined by Heavenly Father (who became a God), then joined by Jesus. Or

he may have been a special creation of the Father who also progressed into a God.

The Mormon teaching of Heavenly Father has him making a major change. He is an eternal

being, but he is not the Eternal God. He is taught to be an exalted man, who with his

wife (the D&C mentions him being polygamous) that he married on some other world, changed

into a God and Goddess. They then went to create and populate some other world (our

planet Earth).

LDS theology does not grasp the magnificence of the God who has always been God. This

is the God we worship however. Islam has a similar teaching about the eternal nature

of God.

May the Holy Spirit will guide you into worshipping the true God, not the man-made

version of Him.

Well, according to LDS teachings, the only way for you to become a Goddess yourself one

day is to marry in the Temple. Jesus taught that marriage is not for everyone. We can

serve God even by remaining like a eunuch. I was married before, now divorced. As a

single person, you definitely have more abilities to serve Him in other ways.

Before you take off your wedding ring, see if you can be reconciled to your husband.

It sounds like there is still some love between you.

Thanks,

Jim

I'm no longer going to say that every individual in every other church is apostate; only that most in my old Ev denomination were. I've too much other theology in my head, though it is my "intention" is to get LDS theology correct. They have, after all become most Christ like of anyone in my experience, and I will follow them as closely as possible.

Oh, a starkers bonkers, totally insane, part of me would return without hesitation, though I suspect that my "love" is a manifestation of "Stockholm Syndrome".

[rpn]

Complicated thoughts, and difficult to sort out experiences, can create that little naysayer on one's shoulder. The trick is to get one's hand on the iron rod through baptism by those with authority, and keep it there as we wander through tough things.

[theplains]

You shouldn't take upon yourself telling us our own teachings unless we've confirmed you've taught them correctly. So far you still haven't gotten a good portion of it right, add in way too much of your own speculation.

Let me know which aspects you believe I have taught incorrectly and I will attempt to provide

references.

Thanks,

Jim

[MorningStar]

People mean well. Just tell them that you will go when you are ready.

[thesometimesaint]

No. I go to another church. But we believe the Bible is the Word of God and

share some common beliefs as you.

My only counsel is the scriptures and the Holy Spirit. Any teaching not supported

by scripture I would consider as speculation.

Latter-day Saints teach that you are an eternal being. Once termed an intelligence, you

were then formed into a spirit child of Heavenly Mother and Father (Jesus Christ being

the first child). These spirits then progressed in the spirit world before coming to

earth. Jesus Christ was special in that he progressed all the way into becoming a God

in the spirit world somehow. The identity of the Holy Ghost is unknown. LDS teachings

does not indicate whether he is another spirit brother of Jesus, who also progressed

into becoming a god, or whether he is always God who was the first member of the

Godhead, later joined by Heavenly Father (who became a God), then joined by Jesus. Or

he may have been a special creation of the Father who also progressed into a God.

The Mormon teaching of Heavenly Father has him making a major change. He is an eternal

being, but he is not the Eternal God. He is taught to be an exalted man, who with his

wife (the D&C mentions him being polygamous) that he married on some other world, changed

into a God and Goddess. They then went to create and populate some other world (our

planet Earth).

LDS theology does not grasp the magnificence of the God who has always been God. This

is the God we worship however. Islam has a similar teaching about the eternal nature

of God.

May the Holy Spirit will guide you into worshipping the true God, not the man-made

version of Him.

Well, according to LDS teachings, the only way for you to become a Goddess yourself one

day is to marry in the Temple. Jesus taught that marriage is not for everyone. We can

serve God even by remaining like a eunuch. I was married before, now divorced. As a

single person, you definitely have more abilities to serve Him in other ways.

Before you take off your wedding ring, see if you can be reconciled to your husband.

It sounds like there is still some love between you.

Thanks,

Jim

Jesus is the Word. The Bible is part of the word of God.

The Bible teaches we are to live by every word the proceeds from the mouth of God.

The Bible teaches that we are all Gods. But there is only one God with which we have anything to do with.

The Holy Ghost is a member of the Godhead. We pray to God the Father; In the name of God the Son; By the power of the God the Holy Ghost.

God is the Father of Jesus.

Jesus is the first son of God. He acts under the direct authority of his/our Father. As such he has authority over all of us.

God the Father has always been God. We through God the Son can become like God the Father. Muslims as well as Jews reject Jesus as a member of the Godhead. The LDS fully accept and believe Jesus is a member of the Godhead.

We have no doctrine as to what we will be doing for eternity. But it is a fair assumption that we will be doing more than just sitting on a cloud, strumming a harp, singing eternally the praises to God. Personnally I can't think of a more boring, damning post mortal existence.

The Holy Ghost has directed me to the one true, and living Church on the face of the earth. That is why I joined his Church, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, 42 years ago and haven't looked back.

It is never a good idea to tell others what they believe. At best it is rude, and condescending. Otherwise it is often wrong, and just displays a profound ignorance of the beliefs of others.

[theplains]

It is never a good idea to tell others what they believe. At best it is rude, and condescending. Otherwise it is often wrong, and just displays a profound ignorance of the beliefs of others.

I extend the same invitation to you as I did to Calmoriah ... let me know which aspects you

believe I have taught incorrectly and I will attempt to provide references.

Regards,

Jim

[Calm]

I don't think debating about what my beliefs are fits with Social Hall, if you were just asking questions and not interpreting them for me that would be different.

[Skylla]

Correct. No debate in Social Hall.

Skylla

[thesometimesaint]

I extend the same invitation to you as I did to Calmoriah ... let me know which aspects you

believe I have taught incorrectly and I will attempt to provide references.

Regards,

Jim

Already done. Read my post.

[boulder257]

Jesus is the Word. The Bible is part of the word of God.

The Bible teaches we are to live by every word the proceeds from the mouth of God.

The Bible teaches that we are all Gods. But there is only one God with which we have anything to do with.

The Holy Ghost is a member of the Godhead. We pray to God the Father; In the name of God the Son; By the power of the God the Holy Ghost.

God is the Father of Jesus.

Jesus is the first son of God. He acts under the direct authority of his/our Father. As such he has authority over all of us.

God the Father has always been God. We through God the Son can become like God the Father. Muslims as well as Jews reject Jesus as a member of the Godhead. The LDS fully accept and believe Jesus is a member of the Godhead.

We have no doctrine as to what we will be doing for eternity. But it is a fair assumption that we will be doing more than just sitting on a cloud, strumming a harp, singing eternally the praises to God. Personnally I can't think of a more boring, damning post mortal existence.

The Holy Ghost has directed me to the one true, and living Church on the face of the earth. That is why I joined his Church, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, 42 years ago and haven't looked back.

It is never a good idea to tell others what they believe. At best it is rude, and condescending. Otherwise it is often wrong, and just displays a profound ignorance of the beliefs of others.

I bolded the part I have a question about. My question is whether LDS view the Godhead in the same way that most Christian denominations do as in one being, or are the they three seperate, distinct beings?

Edited August 15, 2013 by boulder257

[rpn]

LDS do not believe in trinitarian godhood. We believe in God the Eternal Father, His Son Jesus Christ, and in the Holy Ghost --- all distinct beings, who together have the same purpose. Mormon.org has a place to ask questions about our faith.

[thesometimesaint]

I bolded the part I have a question about. My question is whether LDS view the Godhead in the same way that most Christian denominations do as in one being, or are the they three seperate, distinct beings?

LDS don't believe in the Trinity as understood in the nominal Christian way. Ours is the Biblical Godhead. Three separate and distinct beings completely united in goals.

[Calm]

Sometimes we are described as Social Trinitarians, they are one in purpose, in unity of heart and mind as spoken of in the Bible. Our 'trinity' is a united community.

[JamesBYoung]

A person should have no problem with telling another person, when asked a question that is not appropriate to the person's position of authority, "thanks and do not, until tell you otherwise, bring this up again."

[ChristKnight]

I bolded the part I have a question about. My question is whether LDS view the Godhead in the same way that most Christian denominations do as in one being, or are the they three seperate, distinct beings?

 

Latter-day Saints do not believe in the traditional or creedal concept of the Trinity.  Quite simply, LDS believe that the Godhead is composed of the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost, three separate persons/beings (these words are used interchangeably) united in purpose.  The Son and the Holy Ghost are subordinate to the Father, and are sons of God the Father, as we all are (well, daughters too ), with Christ/Jehovah being the literal Firstborn Son, and the Only Begotten in the flesh. 

 

However, in my opinion, I see the LDS Godhead and the traditional Trinity as being closer to each other than either side tends to believe, especially when we understand how certain words are being used, such as "being" or "substance".  For example, when you say that "most Christian denominations do as in one being", many people would probably read that to mean "the same person", which is incorrect (Trinitarians don't use "being" and "person" interchangeably).  LDS and Trinitarians both believe that the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost are distinct from each other; they are not each other, nor are they melded together, a three headed person, etc.  The LDS view also benefits from originating in an English speaking world, which makes it a lot more understandable to us than the Trinity which was formally defined in a Greek/Latin speaking universe (and therefore why it is important to understand what these words like "being" and "essence" are talking about, since it may not be the same as how we use them in everyday language).

 

I also appreciate that both LDS and Catholic/Orthodox writers and leaders have referred to the Trinity/Godhead as a Family, united in Love.  I believe Joseph Smith also said that the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost came together in a covenant relationship.  

 

Hope that helps!