Eternal Progression

[Russ]

Alright, one more time.

I would like an answer to my post here: http://www.mormonapologetics.org/index.php...mp;p=1208364650

I responded to your post by asking you what information you'd like me to consider.

[LifeOnaPlate]

When the wolf comes asking you what you believe, convert him. Convince him.

I, the wolf (in your eyes), am already convinced that Eternal Progression isn't biblical nor is it Christian.

You're admittedly fighting an uphill battle.

That won't stop me from asking if you believe the following:

I'm curious why you were reading Achieving a Celestial Marriage, Church Education System, Department of Seminaries and Institutes of Religion, Salt Lake City, Utah 1976.

[Zakuska]

He might as well have read the Bible...

Rev 21

7 He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.

[jkfrost]

It appears that you have your answer posted by yourself, a quote from one of our prophets...

Why were you asking this question on eternal life again if you already knew from a better source then us the answer?

BTW - DOS is one of my three favorite books.

[Russ]

I'm curious why you were reading Achieving a Celestial Marriage, Church Education System, Department of Seminaries and Institutes of Religion, Salt Lake City, Utah 1976.

"Convince us of our errors of Doctrine, if we have any, by reason, by logical arguments, or by the Word of God and we will ever be grateful for the information and you will ever have the pleasing reflections that you have been instruments in the hands of God of redeeming your fellow beings." LDS Apostle, Orson Pratt - The Seer, p. 15

"I say to the whole world, receive the truth, no matter who presents it to you. Take up the Bible, compare the religion of the Latter-day Saints with it, and see if it will stand the test." 2nd LDS president, Brigham Young - Journal of Discourses, Vol. 16, p. 46

"I think a full, free talk is frequently of great use; we want nothing secret nor underhanded, and for one I want no association with things that cannot be talked about and will not bear investigation." 3rd LDS President, John Taylor - Journal of Discourses, Vol. 20, p. 264

Are we okay?

[Calm]

I responded to your post by asking you what information you'd like me to consider.

I thought it was obvious that it was the correction of the message by George Albert Smith.

[Russ]

It appears that you have your answer posted by yourself, a quote from one of our prophets...

Why were you asking this question on eternal life again if you already knew from a better source then us the answer?

BTW - DOS is one of my three favorite books.

Because I want to know what YOU believe.

Why are you asking me to repeat the answer I've given previously?

[Russ]

I thought it was obvious that it was the correction of the message by George Albert Smith.

Would you please reference the citation.

I'll be happy to revise my website if the citation provides testimony to the contrary.

I may add a comment to the revision.

[busybee]

When the wolf comes asking you what you believe, convert him. Convince him.

I, the wolf (in your eyes), am already convinced that Eternal Progression isn't biblical nor is it Christian.

You're admittedly fighting an uphill battle.

That won't stop me from asking if you believe the following:

I have no desire to convince or convert you. Conversion comes by the Spirit to those who are truly seeking truth. When you are ready to listen to the still small voice that is the Spirit you will be ready to hear the truth. Until then, all the convincing in the world on my part, is an excersize in futility

[jkfrost]

Because I want to know what YOU believe.

Why are you asking me to repeat the answer I've given previously?

You already know what I believe - we have discussed it several times on the C- site.

I believe what JFS said in the quote that you gave.

Joint heirs with Jesus in the kingdom of God the Father, kings and priests unto the most high God, his offspring.

Rom 8:17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ;

if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

Rom 8:18 For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy

to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us.

Rev 1:6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father;

to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.

Act 17:29 Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God,

we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold,

or silver, or stone, graven by art and man's device.

Some have no choice but to divide the Human God into two natures

If they did not do that they would have a human God or should I say

a "Man of Holiness" the same species as God the Father.

It is called the Hypostatic union -

the reason for the name is because when they

get together and see each other they are shocked ( hypo static )

The idea of two natures is Skitso and absurd a (non)doctrine.

[Flyonthewall]

My 4th grade daughter was having some trouble with her math homework - adding and subtracting fractions. I showed her some Discrete Mathmatics problems I was doing and she looked at me with a screwed up face and said "That doesn't make any sense". She then went around telling her freinds that her dad was trying to do math with letters. In her view, she was correct, because there was nothing like it in her math book at school.

I could have taken the time and explained to her that the letters I was trying to do math on, represented some numbers, and that when added, subtracted, multiplied and divided in certain algebraic formulas, they would produce correct answers. I thought better of it, because she did not understand the underlying mathmatical principals, the foundation needed to understand the math I was working on.

And in like manner, you come along with your understanding of arithmetic, and demand to know calculus, without first understanding the principals it is based on.

As I said before, lets start with this: We believe in God, the Eternal Father, and in His son Jesus Christ, and in the Holy Ghost.

[Mark Beesley]

I'd do it anyway. I'd do it so that the atheist might hear. We have nothing to fear.

Well, ya know something Russ, that's the difference between you and an athiest. An athiest might hear because he would listen. There is virtually no chance that you will hear because you won't listen.

Give my regards to my friends at Concerned Christians. And tell Bob hi too!

[Russ]

It appears that you have your answer posted by yourself, a quote from one of our prophets...

Why were you asking this question on eternal life again if you already knew from a better source then us the answer?

BTW - DOS is one of my three favorite books.

Does your theology exclude single people from eternal salvation?

[Russ]

Well, ya know something Russ, that's the difference between you and an athiest. An athiest might hear because he would listen. There is virtually no chance that you will hear because you won't listen.

Give my regards to my friends at Concerned Christians. And tell Bob hi too!

Why the hatred, mbeesley?

[Mark Beesley]

Why the hatred, mbeesley?

Where do you get hatred from my post? I'll tell you where. You don't listen. Further proof you don't listen--you've been begging for two day. LDS Christians have no interest in fueling your website. But you just won't listen.

Love,

LDSNinja

[Russ]

My 4th grade daughter was having some trouble with her math homework - adding and subtracting fractions. I showed her some Discrete Mathmatics problems I was doing and she looked at me with a screwed up face and said "That doesn't make any sense". She then went around telling her freinds that her dad was trying to do math with letters. In her view, she was correct, because there was nothing like it in her math book at school.

I could have taken the time and explained to her that the letters I was trying to do math on, represented some numbers, and that when added, subtracted, multiplied and divided in certain algebraic formulas, they would produce correct answers. I thought better of it, because she did not understand the underlying mathmatical principals, the foundation needed to understand the math I was working on.

And in like manner, you come along with your understanding of arithmetic, and demand to know calculus, without first understanding the principals it is based on.

As I said before, lets start with this: We believe in God, the Eternal Father, and in His son Jesus Christ, and in the Holy Ghost.

Thank you. I majored in math in high school.

Are you saying that Eternal Progression is above understanding if one isn't Mormon?

[jkfrost]

Does your theology exclude single people from eternal salvation?

I believe you know the answer to this question already as well - why are you asking it again?

Everyone worthy single will have the opportunity to be sealed ( married for eternity ) during the millenium

if they want the blessings of exaltation.

Elder Dallin H. Oaks of the Quorum of the Twelve counseled:

â??We know that many worthy and wonderful Latter-day Saints currently lack the ideal opportunities and essential requirements for their progress. Singleness, childlessness, death, and divorce frustrate ideals and postpone the fulfillment of promised blessings. In addition, some women who desire to be full-time mothers and homemakers have been literally compelled to enter the full-time workforce. But these frustrations are only temporary. The Lord has promised that in the eternities no blessing will be denied his sons and daughters who keep the commandments, are true to their covenants, and desire what is right.

â??Many of the most important deprivations of mortality will be set right in the Millennium, which is the time for fulfilling all that is incomplete in the great plan of happiness for all of our Fatherâ??s worthy children. We know that will be true of temple ordinances. I believe it will also be true of family relationships and experiencesâ? (in Conference Report, Oct. 1993, 101; or Ensign, Nov. 1993, 75).

Elder Richard G. Scott of the Quorum of the Twelve counseled: â??If you are single and havenâ??t identified a solid prospect for celestial marriage, live for it. Pray for it. Expect it in the timetable of the Lord. Do not compromise your standards in any way that would rule out that blessing on this or the other side of the veil. The Lord knows the intent of your heart. His prophets have stated that you will have that blessing as you consistently live to qualify for it. We do not know whether it will be on this or the other side of the veil. But live for it. Pray for itâ? (in Conference Report, Apr. 1999, 33; or Ensign, May 1999, 27).

[Russ]

Where do you get hatred from my post? I'll tell you where. You don't listen. Further proof you don't listen--you've been begging for two day. LDS Christians have no interest in fueling your website. But you just won't listen.

Love,

LDSNinja

Ninja, you've gone by so many different names that it's hard to keep up.

I'm listening now.

What do you believe?

Do you believe you'll become a God over another planet and that you'll procreate spirit-children who will take on physical bodies to inhabit your planet or planets?

[LifeOnaPlate]

Why the hatred, mbeesley?

This is ridiculous. Your distortions and mockery of LDS worship is disgusting and you come here acting the pious exemplar.

It reminds me of something Uncle Chick told me:

I noticed you took no time responding to my post earlier.

Thank you. I majored in math in high school.

Are you saying that Eternal Progression is above understanding if one isn't Mormon?

There are majors in High School?

[ssbn623]

LifeOnaPlate,

I know there are majors in high school. I graduated with a drum major.

Russ didn't actually SAY he graduated from high school. Right Russ?

[Russ]

This is ridiculous. Your distortions and mockery of LDS worship is disgusting and you come here acting the pious exemplar.

It reminds me of something Uncle Chick told me:

I noticed you took no time responding to my post earlier.

There are majors in High School?

I'm asking you to clarify LDS doctrine.

[Flyonthewall]

Thank you. I majored in math in high school.

Are you saying that Eternal Progression is above understanding if one isn't Mormon?

What I am saying is, that you don't believe or understand the basics that eternal progression is based on, so why try to explain the concept...you are not ready for itl.

Your main goal is to ridicule and mock things that we consider sacred. What motivation is that for us to help you in your quest?

Matthew 7:6 my friend.

[Russ]

LifeOnaPlate,

I know there are majors in high school. I graduated with a drum major.

Russ didn't actually SAY he graduated from high school. Right Russ?

Hmmm. Hate mail. Let's love on each other.

It's obvious that I disagree with LDS theology.

That doesn't mean we have to resort to condescension.

Let's please all turn over a new leaf and examine LDS theology.

What I am saying is, that you don't believe or understand the basics that eternal progression is based on, so why try to explain the concept...you are not ready for itl.

Your main goal is to ridicule and mock things that we consider sacred. What motivation is that for us to help you in your quest?

Matthew 7:6 my friend.

My main goal is to compare and contrast biblical theology against LDS theology.

May I ask you if you believe you'll become a God over another world?

[LifeOnaPlate]

Hmmm. Hate mail. Let's love on each other.

It's obvious that I disagree with LDS theology.

That doesn't mean we have to resort to condescension.

Let's please all turn over a new leaf and examine LDS theology.

My main goal is to compare and contrast biblical theology against LDS theology.

Here's my answer: Do I believe it is possible to become creator of another world? Yes. What about having a "continuation of seeds". Yes. Do I know all the details? No. Many of the details? No. Will God always be my God? Yes. Will I ever pass him? No. Will he bring me up as a son of God and joint-heir with Christ? That is my hope.

End of story.

[Russ]

I believe you know the answer to this question already as well - why are you asking it again?

Everyone worthy single will have the opportunity to be sealed ( married for eternity ) during the millenium

if they want the blessings of exaltation.

Elder Dallin H. Oaks of the Quorum of the Twelve counseled:

â??We know that many worthy and wonderful Latter-day Saints currently lack the ideal opportunities and essential requirements for their progress. Singleness, childlessness, death, and divorce frustrate ideals and postpone the fulfillment of promised blessings. In addition, some women who desire to be full-time mothers and homemakers have been literally compelled to enter the full-time workforce. But these frustrations are only temporary. The Lord has promised that in the eternities no blessing will be denied his sons and daughters who keep the commandments, are true to their covenants, and desire what is right.

â??Many of the most important deprivations of mortality will be set right in the Millennium, which is the time for fulfilling all that is incomplete in the great plan of happiness for all of our Fatherâ??s worthy children. We know that will be true of temple ordinances. I believe it will also be true of family relationships and experiencesâ? (in Conference Report, Oct. 1993, 101; or Ensign, Nov. 1993, 75).

Elder Richard G. Scott of the Quorum of the Twelve counseled: â??If you are single and havenâ??t identified a solid prospect for celestial marriage, live for it. Pray for it. Expect it in the timetable of the Lord. Do not compromise your standards in any way that would rule out that blessing on this or the other side of the veil. The Lord knows the intent of your heart. His prophets have stated that you will have that blessing as you consistently live to qualify for it. We do not know whether it will be on this or the other side of the veil. But live for it. Pray for itâ? (in Conference Report, Apr. 1999, 33; or Ensign, May 1999, 27).

Thanks for the quote.

What is a "worthy single?"