Mississippi Bishop Resigns from the Pulpit

[InCognitus]

2 hours ago, Diamondhands69 said:

 

“6. Plural marriage

The following information is provided to help you address questions class members may have about the practice of plural marriage. This topic should not be the focus of the lesson.”

That looks like what i was referring to. Not bad memory for being about 25 years ago. 

So your memory is actually horrible.  You took something positive from the manual, which included good resources for discussion on polygamy and put a negative spin on it.  

[Diamondhands69]

4 minutes ago, InCognitus said:

So your memory is actually horrible.  You took something positive from the manual, which included good resources for discussion on polygamy and put a negative spin on it.  

Ok- thanks for your opinion

[Calm]

3 hours ago, Tacenda said:

course I've heard the essays are even more difficult to find these days, not sure how true since I'm lazy and don't want to see about it. I do know that when the essays first came about many that shared about it, were in trouble by the local leaders. 

There are more topics, but I am finding it much easier to find things since they changed their search function.  I typed in plural marriage and the first thing that came up was the Gospel Topic essay on it, even without it narrowed to “topics and questions”, so I really don’t understand why they are saying it’s harder.

You can also easily choose what type of content you want to search, including just the topics.

The only way I can see it being harder is more and more material is being added, so just randomly stumbling across a specific page might take more time, but seriously, I wanted to throw a party when I noticed the updated search function on the Church’s website.  Anyone who is complaining must not have tried it anytime recently.

Edited January 22, 2024 by Calm

[Diamondhands69]

1 hour ago, Duncan said:

Which has been TWICE in General Conference, one by Elder Golden and Elder Cook. in 2021 Conference. I guess being from a "power Mormon family" you are too busy basking in the glow of your own light not to notice that. Besides of which it was done by then Pres. Ballard in 2016, were you too busy eating at Dunkin Donuts not to notice? I thought you weren't active so who really cares what you think anyways

Golden: “Now I quote for a moment from the Church’s Gospel Topics under the heading “Second Coming of Jesus Christ”:”

this def doesn’t count

Cook: looks like a miss here too. No mention of GTE in either 2021 conf talks by cook

 

ballard: if referencing the ensign article in 2016 there is a mention of them. The article is directed at CES not the membership at large. The article is a prime candidate for TLDR and the mention is at least two thirds way in. It is mentioned at least so I give you credit for unearthing that one. The other two… well I can’t find anything so CFR on cook and golden

Basking in what glow? I have made it perfectly clear the religious social situation I am in sucks. even a hardliner like you would hate that life. 
 

I sleep through most of conference as does my family. They may be hardliners but they get bored easily too. It is BORING

 

Edited January 22, 2024 by Diamondhands69

[JustAnAustralian]

3 minutes ago, Diamondhands69 said:

Cook: looks like a miss here too. No mention of GTE in either 2021 conf talks by cook

You must have missed this one

Quote

Peace and agency are intertwined as essential elements of the plan of salvation. As described in the Gospel Topics article “Agency and Accountability,” “Agency is the ability and privilege God gives us to choose and to act for ourselves.

2021–October, Quentin L. Cook, Personal Peace in Challenging Times

 

[InCognitus]

22 minutes ago, Diamondhands69 said:

27 minutes ago, InCognitus said:

So your memory is actually horrible.  You took something positive from the manual, which included good resources for discussion on polygamy and put a negative spin on it.  

Ok- thanks for your opinion

Remember, your claim was "There were explicit instructions in the teachers manual not to discuss polygamy."  The actual statement said no such thing, and in fact the manual provided several resources on how to address questions on polygamy.  Your retelling of what you remember in this situation is not reliable.  Could you possibly consider revisiting some of the things that bug you about the church from the past and see if your memory has betrayed you in other ways?  You might be surprised what you find.

[Calm]

Quote

Very little has been revealed about Mother in Heaven, but what we do know is summarized in a gospel topic found in our Gospel Library application.⁹ Once you have read what is there, you will know everything that I know about the subject. I wish I knew more. You too may still have questions and want to find more answers. Seeking greater understanding is an important part of our spiritual development, but please be cautious. Reason cannot replace revelation.

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/general-conference/2022/04/36renlund?lang=eng#p6

And if people actually use all the material provided for personal study, they will be directed to the Topics in footnotes such as these.  The Church has spent a lot of money putting this material online, making it easily accessible to anyone doing more than just glancing at conference talks.  I highly doubt they put all this effort and resources into this and pushing the personal study aspect because they don’t care whether or not members use it….

Edited January 22, 2024 by Calm

[Duncan]

52 minutes ago, Diamondhands69 said:

Cfr both instances members were told to read the GTEs

From Elder Golden

"

Now I quote for a moment from the Church’s Gospel Topics under the heading “Second Coming of Jesus Christ”:

“When the Savior comes again, He will come in power and glory to claim the earth as His kingdom. His Second Coming will mark the beginning of the Millennium.

“The Second Coming will be a fearful, mournful time for the wicked, but it will be a day of peace for the righteous. The Lord declared:

“‘They that are wise and have received the truth, and have taken the Holy Spirit for their guide, and have not been deceived—verily I say unto you, they shall not be hewn down and cast into the fire, but shall abide the day.

“‘And the earth shall be given unto them for an inheritance; and they shall multiply and wax strong, and their children shall grow up without sin unto salvation.

“‘For the Lord shall be in their midst, and his glory shall be upon them, and he will be their king and their lawgiver’ (Doctrine and Covenants 45:57–59).”"

"For those who have eyes to see, ears to hear, and hearts to feel, more than ever before we are required to confront the reality that we are getting ever closer to the Second Coming of Jesus Christ."

From Elder Cook

"As described in the Gospel Topics article “Agency and Accountability,” “Agency is the ability and privilege God gives us to choose and to act for ourselves.” Thus, agency is at the heart of the personal growth and experience that bless us as we follow the Savior."

Glad you agree that Pres. Ballard said we need to read them, but then why would the brethren come out with the GTE and not want the members to read and why not read as per Pres. Ballard's counsel? do you need to be compelled in all things?

[Diamondhands69]

32 minutes ago, JustAnAustralian said:

You must have missed this one

 

Nope I didn’t miss. The article agency and accountability is not one of the “gospel topics essays” in question. These are:

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/gospel-topics-essays?lang=eng
 

see the church soft roll out works. Even you don’t know what they are. 

[Diamondhands69]

33 minutes ago, InCognitus said:

Remember, your claim was "There were explicit instructions in the teachers manual not to discuss polygamy."  The actual statement said no such thing, and in fact the manual provided several resources on how to address questions on polygamy.  Your retelling of what you remember in this situation is not reliable.  Could you possibly consider revisiting some of the things that bug you about the church from the past and see if your memory has betrayed you in other ways?  You might be surprised what you find.

Ok. I admitted above my memory wasn’t so perfect and I acknowledged your post was what I recall basically. After 25 years I feel that isn’t to shabby. Not far off. 
 

now if you want to keep dwelling on it go on and write soliloquy after soliloquy.. suits me just fine. I’m moving on. 

[Diamondhands69]

33 minutes ago, Duncan said:

From Elder Golden

"

Now I quote for a moment from the Church’s Gospel Topics under the heading “Second Coming of Jesus Christ”:

“When the Savior comes again, He will come in power and glory to claim the earth as His kingdom. His Second Coming will mark the beginning of the Millennium.

“The Second Coming will be a fearful, mournful time for the wicked, but it will be a day of peace for the righteous. The Lord declared:

“‘They that are wise and have received the truth, and have taken the Holy Spirit for their guide, and have not been deceived—verily I say unto you, they shall not be hewn down and cast into the fire, but shall abide the day.

“‘And the earth shall be given unto them for an inheritance; and they shall multiply and wax strong, and their children shall grow up without sin unto salvation.

“‘For the Lord shall be in their midst, and his glory shall be upon them, and he will be their king and their lawgiver’ (Doctrine and Covenants 45:57–59).”"

"For those who have eyes to see, ears to hear, and hearts to feel, more than ever before we are required to confront the reality that we are getting ever closer to the Second Coming of Jesus Christ."

From Elder Cook

"As described in the Gospel Topics article “Agency and Accountability,” “Agency is the ability and privilege God gives us to choose and to act for ourselves.” Thus, agency is at the heart of the personal growth and experience that bless us as we follow the Savior."

Glad you agree that Pres. Ballard said we need to read them, but then why would the brethren come out with the GTE and not want the members to read and why not read as per Pres. Ballard's counsel? do you need to be compelled in all things?

Neither one of those quotes are from the “gospel topics essays”

 

these are the GTEs. The church has done a great job keeping them from you too lol. 

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/gospel-topics-essays?lang=eng

 

as for agreeing about Ballard. I only agreed he mentioned them. He directed the CES instructors to become familiar with them. That article was not directed at the general membership of the church although they are available to the membership. 

Edited January 22, 2024 by Diamondhands69

[Duncan]

2 minutes ago, Diamondhands69 said:

Neither one of those quotes are from the “gospel topics essays”

 

these are the GTEs. The church has done a great job keeping them from you too lol. 

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/gospel-topics-essays?lang=eng

is your back hurting from moving the goalposts from Pres. Ballard? it must be!

• "Master the content of the Gospel Topics essays."
• https://rsc.byu.edu/vol-17-no-3-2016/study-faith
• " “know the content in these essays like you know the back of your hand.”
• https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/church/news/help-build-unwavering-faith-in-students-lives-elder-ballard-tells-ces-teachers?lang=eng
•  
• "The church has done a great job keeping them from you too"

you've really outdone yourself not looking for them being used and said over the pulpit, keeping yourself hidden

[Emily]

3 hours ago, Diamondhands69 said:

I’m thinking it would be very entertaining to see the reactions on people’s faces when they learn Joseph as a 37 year old was marrying 14 year old girls, other mens wives while they were on a mission, mother and daughter duos. Sister duos, getting married to two sisters with Emma’s consent who he was already married to etc. 

Ahh, so we finally get to the truth of your posts. Your intent is not to seek education, enlightenment or intellectual discourse, but rather to spread what you believe would be chaos, confusion and ultimately abandonment of faith. 

And you claim to have been actively attending church meetings in the last couple of years. Why? 

Do you just sit around every week, hoping someone will say something to upset the other members of the ward? 

Sadly, your chances of achieving this questionable idea of entertainment around the subject of plural marriage are slim. 

If the members in class have taken Seminary and Institute or read almost any academic book on church history, they will already be well aware of 18th century marriage practices and the various ways the Saints attempted to incorporate plural marriage into their culture. They might be rather surprised by your negative take on the subject, but the history buff members will be rolling their eyes at your limited grasp of the subject.

You may run across the occasional member who missed the CES courses. These members might furrow their brows, then turn to one of the history buffs asking for further explanation. They might even launch into their own research on the subject. But members whose faith is secure would not react in the manner you hope.

Therefore, your plural marriage "bombshells" would only hurt those members who are already struggling with their faith and no longer trust that God will have answers for them, if they ask.

Chances are, these members are already skipping meetings, but if you manage to successfully target one of them, your toxic take on the subject could successfully add further injury to a wounded soul. You might even strike the fatal blow. The blow that will send them down the same path that you seem to traveling. And perhaps they will also adopt the questionable behavior of hanging out in church meetings, carrying bags of popcorn, waiting for a chance to upset their neighbors. 

But I really don't understand how the thought of any of that could sound entertaining. Did you also enjoy bullying vulnerable children in your elementary school years? 

---------------

Oh, on the subject of plural marriage... I've talked to my husband about this, and I actually have a list of requirements ready to go if it's ever reinstated.

Wife number two will need to be a night person so she can keep him company while I go to bed early. She has to love cooking big dinners on Sunday, because I don't. And it would be nice if she liked sweeping and mopping. Neither my husband or I like that particular chore. I could use some help with the gardening, so a gardener would be good. It would also be great if she was musical. We could sing or play duets together. 

I'm actually very enthusiastic about the idea...my husband a bit less so. I manage to upset his routines on a pretty regular basis and another woman would just be extra chaos for him. But he could probably get used to it. 😁

Edited January 22, 2024 by Emily

[Diamondhands69]

Well that is two in a row… members of this board who do not know what the gospel topics essays are. 
 

The church has done a bang up job making sure everyone knows about them lol 

 

https://www.Mormon*******.***/portfolio-items/elder-steven-e-snow-lds-gospel-topics-essays-not-advertisex/

 

[Duncan]

9 minutes ago, Diamondhands69 said:

That article was not directed at the general membership of the church although they are available to the membership. 

 

distinction without a difference

 

[Duncan]

1 minute ago, Diamondhands69 said:

Well that is two in a row… members of this board who do not know what the gospel topics essays are. 
 

The church has done a bang up job making sure everyone knows about them lol 

 

https://www.Mormon*******.***/portfolio-items/elder-steven-e-snow-lds-gospel-topics-essays-not-advertisex/

 

two people constitute the church now? how delusional are you?

[Diamondhands69]

7 hours ago, Duncan said:

is your back hurting from moving the goalposts from Pres. Ballard? it must be!

• "Master the content of the Gospel Topics essays."
• https://rsc.byu.edu/vol-17-no-3-2016/study-faith
• " “know the content in these essays like you know the back of your hand.”
• https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/church/news/help-build-unwavering-faith-in-students-lives-elder-ballard-tells-ces-teachers?lang=eng
•  
• "The church has done a great job keeping them from you too"

you've really outdone yourself not looking for them being used and said over the pulpit, keeping yourself hidden

This isn’t general conference… it is an address to CES. That said I did acknowledge he mentioned them. But the comment is to then CES instructors. No one heard this talk cept the folks that teach seminary and institute. 
 

despite the talk being given, even you still don’t know what the gospel topics essays are. He failed at his mission if your knowledge of the GTEs is any indicator of the success of the delivery of the message. 

Edited January 22, 2024 by Diamondhands69
Gte

[Duncan]

4 minutes ago, Diamondhands69 said:

Well that is two in a row… members of this board who do not know what the gospel topics essays are. 
 

The church has done a bang up job making sure everyone knows about them lol 

 

https://www.Mormon*******.***/portfolio-items/elder-steven-e-snow-lds-gospel-topics-essays-not-advertisex/

 

from your nonsense, Elder Snow said

"If you haven’t had a chance to look at those essays, we’d enc[o]urage you to do so and share them with your friends."

The hypocrisy of Dehlin and others like him, they want the church to comment on the issues, the membership to know about these issues then the church comes out with something and they don't like it. Well, Dehlin is going bellyup anyways so his opinion is garbage anyways

[Diamondhands69]

3 minutes ago, Duncan said:

 

distinction without a difference

 

There is a difference. No one listens to CES curriculum. BKP also delivered a famous talk to CES which is virtually unknown among members . In this talk he admonished CES instructors to not share the truth about church history if it isn’t faith promoting. If you look up church definitions of lie, lying, integrity etc you will see BKP essentially told the CES instructors to lie to our kids. 
 

 

[Diamondhands69]

3 minutes ago, Duncan said:

from your nonsense, Elder Snow said

"If you haven’t had a chance to look at those essays, we’d enc[o]urage you to do so and share them with your friends."

The hypocrisy of Dehlin and others like him, they want the church to comment on the issues, the membership to know about these issues then the church comes out with something and they don't like it. Well, Dehlin is going bellyup anyways so his opinion is garbage anyways

Uhh did you listen to snow? He said it wasn’t publicized. He said it, not dehlin. 
 

and still. You don’t know what these essays even are . It is really something to come here and act like these got broadcast to the world yet you don’t know what they are. You are a real piece of work. 

Edited January 22, 2024 by Diamondhands69

[Duncan]

3 minutes ago, Diamondhands69 said:

No one heard this talk cept the folks that teach seminary and institute. 

and from the sources that used his talk? You don't know how to read or?

 

4 minutes ago, Diamondhands69 said:

even you still don’t know what the gospel topics essays are

except that I do and you don't know what I know. I watched Pres. Ballard's talk back in 2016. Were you too busy that night? doing what?

 

5 minutes ago, Diamondhands69 said:

He failed at his mission if your knowledge of the agates is any indicator of the success of the delivery of the message. 

this is gobblygook and is meaningless, agates?  Not that I care one iota what you think or think you think but if I don't get something then Pres. Ballard failed? That is so ridiculous

[Duncan]

3 minutes ago, Diamondhands69 said:

There is a difference. No one listens to CES curriculum. BKP also delivered a famous talk to CES which is virtually unknown among members . In this talk he admonished CES instructors to not share the truth about church history if it isn’t faith promoting. If you look up church definitions of lie, lying, integrity etc you will see BKP essentially told the CES instructors to lie to our kids. 
 

 

this is pure delusion, plain and simple. I hope you aren't setting yourself up to be some kind saviour to rescue the church or some other nonsense

I thought you were moving on?

[Duncan]

4 minutes ago, Diamondhands69 said:

Uhh did you listen to snow? He said it wasn’t publicized. He said it, not dehlin. 
 

and still. You don’t know what these essays even are . It is really something to come here and act like these got broadcast to the world yet you don’t know what they are. You are a real piece of work. 

Elder Snow said we are to know the essays and to share it with our friends. You can't handle the truth that exmormons have been lying to you and you eat that Dehlin et al garbage up, I hope you didn't send him any money.

"You are a real piece of work"

There is a lot of that going around

Edited January 22, 2024 by Duncan

[Diamondhands69]

11 minutes ago, Duncan said:

two people constitute the church now? how delusional are you?

Nope but two people who claimed with a lot of confidence that the GTE got mentioned in those talks were flat out wrong. And you are one of em. 
 

neither of you have read them otherwise you would have known right off the topics you cited are not from the infamous essays. 

[Diamondhands69]

5 minutes ago, Duncan said:

except that I do and you don't know what I know. I watched Pres. Ballard's talk back in 2016. Were you too busy that night? doing what?

I already conceded to you twice now that Ballard mentioned them. You just got lucky on that one cuz the other two you confidently cited were not GTEs. You just didn’t know it. Because you don’t even know what the gospel topics essays are.