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Temples in Jerusalem?


nuclearfuels

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So first off, I'm kind of a prepper nothing major, just think about how quickly chaos might brake out.

Anyway, chatting with a friend (major, major prepper) and he told me a few things he's read recently:

1- The Jews in Israel have already cut and arranged all necessary stones to build a Temple (which is ready ot be built; not built currently) since a red heifer was born and the Sons of Levi will be able to offer again an offering unto the Lord in righteousness. https://www.breakingisraelnews.com/82957/rare-red-heifer-eligible-third-temple-offering-discovered-mexico/ - 

“This is the statute of the law that the Lord has commanded: Tell the people of Israel to bring you a red heifer without defect, in which there is no blemish, and on which a yoke has never come.” Numbers 19:2 (The Israel Bible™) 

2- This one is a stretch even by the major prepper's admission: the BYU Jerusalem Center could be converted to an active LDS Temple with nothing more than a dedication under the proper authority.  (As I've never been there, I'm not sure but I trust the vetting experts on this forum will guide me)

 

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2 hours ago, nuclearfuels said:

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1- The Jews in Israel have already cut and arranged all necessary stones to build a Temple (which is ready ot be built; not built currently) since a red heifer was born and the Sons of Levi will be able to offer again an offering unto the Lord in righteousness. https://www.breakingisraelnews.com/82957/rare-red-heifer-eligible-third-temple-offering-discovered-mexico/ - 

“This is the statute of the law that the Lord has commanded: Tell the people of Israel to bring you a red heifer without defect, in which there is no blemish, and on which a yoke has never come.” Numbers 19:2 (The Israel Bible™) 

2- This one is a stretch even by the major prepper's admission: the BYU Jerusalem Center could be converted to an active LDS Temple with nothing more than a dedication under the proper authority.  (As I've never been there, I'm not sure but I trust the vetting experts on this forum will guide me)

The primary organization preparing to build and staff that Jewish temple to come is the Temple Institute -- https://www.templeinstitute.org/main.htm .

When built it will have daily animal sacrifice, and it will not be the BYU Jerusalem Center.  The Jews would not allow that.

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2 hours ago, nuclearfuels said:

So first off, I'm kind of a prepper nothing major, just think about how quickly chaos might brake out.

Anyway, chatting with a friend (major, major prepper) and he told me a few things he's read recently:

1- The Jews in Israel have already cut and arranged all necessary stones to build a Temple (which is ready ot be built; not built currently) since a red heifer was born and the Sons of Levi will be able to offer again an offering unto the Lord in righteousness. https://www.breakingisraelnews.com/82957/rare-red-heifer-eligible-third-temple-offering-discovered-mexico/ - 

“This is the statute of the law that the Lord has commanded: Tell the people of Israel to bring you a red heifer without defect, in which there is no blemish, and on which a yoke has never come.” Numbers 19:2 (The Israel Bible™) 

2- This one is a stretch even by the major prepper's admission: the BYU Jerusalem Center could be converted to an active LDS Temple with nothing more than a dedication under the proper authority.  (As I've never been there, I'm not sure but I trust the vetting experts on this forum will guide me)

 

Since after his atoning sacrifice and resurrection the Savior said he will no lomger accept amy further animal sacrifices, it’s hard to imagine how Jews who do not hold the true and legitimate priesthood power are somehow going to be able to perform animal sacrifices IN RIGHTEOUSNESS in a non-LDS Jerusalem Temple. 

19 And ye shall offer up unto me no more the shedding of blood; yea, your sacrifices and your burnt offerings shall be done away, for I will accept none of your sacrifices and your burnt offerings. (3 Nephi 9)

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3 hours ago, Bobbieaware said:

Since after his atoning sacrifice and resurrection the Savior said he will no lomger accept amy further animal sacrifices, it’s hard to imagine how Jews who do not hold the true and legitimate priesthood power are somehow going to be able to perform animal sacrifices IN RIGHTEOUSNESS in a non-LDS Jerusalem Temple. 

19 And ye shall offer up unto me no more the shedding of blood; yea, your sacrifices and your burnt offerings shall be done away, for I will accept none of your sacrifices and your burnt offerings. (3 Nephi 9)

Nice suggestion, but you failed to ask who the Lord was speaking to on that occasion, and which exceptions might apply.  Here we have the true low down from the LDS D&C Student Manual:

Quote

Joseph Smith himself said:

“It is generally supposed that sacrifice was entirely done away when the Great Sacrifice [i.e.,] the sacrifice of the Lord Jesus was offered up, and that there will be no necessity for the ordinance of sacrifice in the future; but those who assert this are certainly not acquainted with the duties, privileges and authority of the Priesthood, or with the Prophets.

“The offering of sacrifice has ever been connected and forms a part of the duties of the Priesthood. It began with the Priesthood, and will be continued until after the coming of Christ, from generation to generation. …

These sacrifices, as well as every ordinance belonging to the Priesthood, will, when the Temple of the Lord shall be built, and the sons of Levi be purified, be fully restored and attended to in all their powers, ramifications, and blessings. This ever did and ever will exist when the powers of the Melchizedek Priesthood are sufficiently manifest; else how can the restitution of all things spoken of by the Holy Prophets be brought to pass. It is not to be understood that the law of Moses will be established again with all its rites and variety of ceremonies; this has never been spoken of by the prophets; but those things which existed prior to Moses’ day, namely, sacrifice, will be continued.” (Teachings, pp. 172–73.)

President Joseph Fielding Smith further explained that “we are living in the dispensation of the fulness of times into which all things are to be gathered, and all things are to be restored since the beginning. Even this earth is to be restored to the condition which prevailed before Adam’s transgression. Now in the nature of things, the law of sacrifice will have to be restored, or all things which were decreed by the Lord would not be restored. It will be necessary, therefore, for the sons of Levi, who offered the blood sacrifices anciently in Israel, to offer such a sacrifice again to round out and complete this ordinance in this dispensation. Sacrifice by the shedding of blood was instituted in the days of Adam and of necessity will have to be restored.

The sacrifice of animals will be done to complete the restoration when the temple spoken of is built; at the beginning of the millennium, or in the restoration, blood sacrifices will be performed long enough to complete the fulness of the restoration in this dispensation. Afterwards sacrifice will be of some other character.” (Doctrines of Salvation, 3:94.)

Notes and Commentary for Doctrine and Covenants 128:24 contains additional insights into what else might be included in the offering of the sons of Levi.  https://www.lds.org/manual/doctrine-and-covenants-student-manual/sections-10-to-20/section-13-the-restoration-of-the-aaronic-priesthood?lang=eng .

 

Edited by Robert F. Smith
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I'm sorry, but I have to say it. If the Jews build a temple and perform animal sacrifices in it fine. If there are to be animal sacrifices in an LDS temple , I hope it is a one time only symbolic event. To my Western sensitiveness , there would be nothing LESS spiritually uplifting than the sounds and smells of hundreds of animals slaughtered and burned. I watched a video of a current Jewish sacrifice of dozens of chickens on a feast day ( can't remember which one) . Pandemonium !

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10 hours ago, Robert F. Smith said:

Nice suggestion, but you failed to ask who the Lord was speaking to on that occasion, and which exceptions might apply.  Here we have the true low down from the LDS D&C Student Manual:

 

In our temples today, we are told sacrifice by the shedding of blood ended with he great and final blood sacrifice of Jesus Christ, the only blood sacrifice that has any actual power to atone, redeem and save. Alma calls the blood sacrifice of Christ the great and last sacrifice no less than four times in the following verses:

10 For it is expedient that there should be a great and last sacrifice; yea, not a sacrifice of man, neither of beast, neither of any manner of fowl; for it shall not be a human sacrifice; but it must be an infinite and eternal sacrifice.

11 Now there is not any man that can sacrifice his own blood which will atone for the sins of another. Now, if a man murdereth, behold will our law, which is just, take the life of his brother? I say unto you, Nay.

12 But the law requireth the life of him who hath murdered; therefore there can be nothing which is short of an infinite atonement which will suffice for the sins of the world.

13 Therefore, it is expedient that there should be a great and last sacrifice, and then shall there be, or it is expedient there should be, a stop to the shedding of blood; then shall the law of Moses be fulfilled; yea, it shall be all fulfilled, every jot and tittle, and none shall have passed away.

14 And behold, this is the whole meaning of the law, every whit pointing to that great and last sacrifice; and that great and last sacrifice will be the Son of God, yea, infinite and eternal.  (Alma 37

The passage in 3 Nephi 9, wherein the Lord himself proclaims his atoning sacrifice brought to an end sacrifice by the shedding of blood, goes on to say that the Lord still requires sacrifice of his people, just not sacrifice by the shedding of blood. And nowhere in D&C Section 128 is animal blood sacrifice specifically mentioned. In fact, the only ordinance of the gospel that is discussed throughout that entire section is the bloodless sacrificial ordinance of baptism. As you know, in the ordinance of baptism the initiate is ritually slain and buried and then brought forth from symbolic death in the likeness of the resurrection of the dead. And though baptism is a priesthood ordinance of sacrifice, it is not a sacrifice that requires the shedding of actual blood. Therefore the sacrifice in righteousness that the sons of Levi will yet make is very likely going to be their own baptisms, by which they will become redeemed members of record of the Church of Jesus Christ, and also their baptisms for the dead, by which their ancestors will be offered salvation. Is not this interpretation more in keeping with the letter, spirit and specific context of D&C 128? If 128 extends a call for the Levites to perform animal sacrifices, that call comes “out of the blue” for the entire section is focused like a laser on baptism for the dead.

And let’s also remember in 3 Nephi 9, when the Lord says he still requires a form of sacrifice of his people, the sacrifice that he requires is the sacrifice of a broken heart and a contrite spirit that leads to baptism and forgiveness, not sacrifices by the shedding of blood.

It’s also true that with their acceptance of the gospel the sons of Levi will once again be empowered to officiate in the temple. But while the sacrificial ordinances they will perform in the latter-day temples clearly point to the shedding of Christ’s atoning blood, both in Gethsemane and on Golgotha, any shedding of blood occurs only symbolically. So while one might rightly say that the symbolic shedding of blood is strongly suggested in our present-day temple ordinances, in fact there is no actual blood shed. 

I belive it’s likely that Elder Smith made too much of the Levite sacrifice mentioned in 128, not realizing it was simply pointing to the day when the Jews will become fully-converted and participating members of the Restored Church. Do you believe the offering in righteousness the Latter-Day Saints (not the sons of Levi) are commanded to make in the same verse is also a blood sacrifice of animals?

24 Behold, the great day of the Lord is at hand; and who can abide the day of his coming, and who can stand when he appeareth? For he is like a refiner’s fire, and like fuller’s soap; and he shall sit as a refiner and purifier of silver, and he shall purify the sons of Levi, and purge them as gold and silver, that they may offer unto the Lord an offering in righteousness. Let us, therefore, as a church and a people, and as Latter-day Saints, offer unto the Lord an offering in righteousness; and let us present in his holy temple, when it is finished, a book containing the records of our dead, which shall be worthy of all acceptation. (D&C 128)

If the interpretation of blood animal sacrifice in verse 24 is going to remain consistent, am I to assume that at some time in the future every Latter-Day Saint is going to have to offer the blood sacrifice of an animal? But if the offering in righteousness the Latter-Day Saints are commanded to make in verse 24 is not a blood sacrifice of animals, why assume the sacrifice in righteousness the sons of Levi are required to make in the very same verse is the blood sacrifice of an animal? To me, it appers quite obvious that the offering in righteousness required of the Latter-Day Saints in verse 24 pertains to the vicarious work of salvation for the dead. If this is true, then why wouldn’t the expression “offering in righteousness” mean the same thing for the sons of Levi?

Edited by Bobbieaware
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6 hours ago, Bobbieaware said:

In our temples today, we are told sacrifice by the shedding of blood ended with he great and final blood sacrifice of Jesus Christ, the only blood sacrifice that has any actual power to atone, redeem and save. Alma calls the blood sacrifice of Christ the great and last sacrifice no less than four times in the following verses:

...............................The passage in 3 Nephi 9, wherein the Lord himself proclaims his atoning sacrifice brought to an end sacrifice by the shedding of blood, goes on to say that the Lord still requires sacrifice of his people, just not sacrifice by the shedding of blood. And nowhere in D&C Section 128 is animal blood sacrifice specifically mentioned. In fact, the only ordinance of the gospel that is discussed throughout that entire section is the bloodless sacrificial ordinance of baptism. As you know, in the ordinance of baptism the initiate is ritually slain and buried and then brought forth from symbolic death in the likeness of the resurrection of the dead. And though baptism is a priesthood ordinance of sacrifice, it is not a sacrifice that requires the shedding of actual blood. Therefore the sacrifice in righteousness that the sons of Levi will yet make is very likely going to be their own baptisms, by which they will become redeemed members of record of the Church of Jesus Christ, and also their baptisms for the dead, by which their ancestors will be offered salvation. Is not this interpretation more in keeping with the letter, spirit and specific context of D&C 128? If 128 extends a call for the Levites to perform animal sacrifices, that call comes “out of the blue” for the entire section is focused like a laser on baptism for the dead.

And let’s also remember in 3 Nephi 9, when the Lord says he still requires a form of sacrifice of his people, the sacrifice that he requires is the sacrifice of a broken heart and a contrite spirit that leads to baptism and forgiveness, not sacrifices by the shedding of blood.

It’s also true that with their acceptance of the gospel the sons of Levi will once again be empowered to officiate in the temple. But while the sacrificial ordinances they will perform in the latter-day temples clearly point to the shedding of Christ’s atoning blood, both in Gethsemane and on Golgotha, any shedding of blood occurs only symbolically. So while one might rightly say that the symbolic shedding of blood is strongly suggested in our present-day temple ordinances, in fact there is no actual blood shed. 

I belive it’s likely that Elder Smith made too much of the Levite sacrifice mentioned in 128, not realizing it was simply pointing to the day when the Jews will become fully-converted and participating members of the Restored Church. Do you believe the offering in righteousness the Latter-Day Saints (not the sons of Levi) are commanded to make in the same verse is also a blood sacrifice of animals?

24 Behold, the great day of the Lord is at hand; and who can abide the day of his coming, and who can stand when he appeareth? For he is like a refiner’s fire, and like fuller’s soap; and he shall sit as a refiner and purifier of silver, and he shall purify the sons of Levi, and purge them as gold and silver, that they may offer unto the Lord an offering in righteousness. Let us, therefore, as a church and a people, and as Latter-day Saints, offer unto the Lord an offering in righteousness; and let us present in his holy temple, when it is finished, a book containing the records of our dead, which shall be worthy of all acceptation. (D&C 128)

If the interpretation of blood animal sacrifice in verse 24 is going to remain consistent, am I to assume that at some time in the future every Latter-Day Saint is going to have to offer the blood sacrifice of an animal? But if the offering in righteousness the Latter-Day Saints are commanded to make in verse 24 is not a blood sacrifice of animals, why assume the sacrifice in righteousness the sons of Levi are required to make in the very same verse is the blood sacrifice of an animal? To me, it appers quite obvious that the offering in righteousness required of the Latter-Day Saints in verse 24 pertains to the vicarious work of salvation for the dead. If this is true, then why wouldn’t the expression “offering in righteousness” mean the same thing for the sons of Levi?

It appears that we are talking past each other, Bobbie.  I do not believe that any LDS priesthood will be offering blood sacrifices at all.  I am referring only to the Jewish Temple in Jerusalem, with the lineal descendants of Levi in charge -- a fully Jewish operation, in keeping with Tora (Law of Moses).

When the ashes of a red heifer will be spread on the Temple Mount, I do not know.  When that Jewish Temple will be built, I cannot say.  What is clear from both Zechariah and the D&C is that the Jews will not be converted until the Lord comes to them in person at Mt Olivet, and that will likely take place only after those blood sacrifices have been fully restored.

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10 hours ago, strappinglad said:

I'm sorry, but I have to say it. If the Jews build a temple and perform animal sacrifices in it fine. If there are to be animal sacrifices in an LDS temple , I hope it is a one time only symbolic event. To my Western sensitiveness , there would be nothing LESS spiritually uplifting than the sounds and smells of hundreds of animals slaughtered and burned. I watched a video of a current Jewish sacrifice of dozens of chickens on a feast day ( can't remember which one) . Pandemonium !

There will be no blood sacrifices in LDS temples at all.

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4 hours ago, Robert F. Smith said:

It appears that we are talking past each other, Bobbie.  I do not believe that any LDS priesthood will be offering blood sacrifices at all.  I am referring only to the Jewish Temple in Jerusalem, with the lineal descendants of Levi in charge -- a fully Jewish operation, in keeping with Tora (Law of Moses).

When the ashes of a red heifer will be spread on the Temple Mount, I do not know.  When that Jewish Temple will be built, I cannot say.  What is clear from both Zechariah and the D&C is that the Jews will not be converted until the Lord comes to them in person at Mt Olivet, and that will likely take place only after those blood sacrifices have been fully restored.

Where the difficulty enters into this discussion for me is trying to wrap my mind around the idea of how some modern Jews are going to be able to make an “offering in righteousness” (a blood letting sacrifice of at least one animal) when those performing the sacrifice do not believe in Christ and worship him with the required clean hands and pure hearts that are needed to enable them to “make an offering in righteousness.”

16 And after they have been scattered, and the Lord God hath scourged them by other nations for the space of many generations, yea, even down from generation to generation until they shall be persuaded to believe in Christ, the Son of God, and the atonement, which is infinite for all mankind—and when that day shall come that they shall believe in Christ, and worship the Father in his name, with pure hearts and clean hands, and look not forward any more for another Messiah, then, at that time, the day will come that it must needs be expedient that they should believe these things. (2 Nephi 25)

Perhaps the confusion here ends with the realization that the prophecy in Zechariah and the prophecy in D&C 128 are speaking of two different events? Could it be that some have mistakenly presumed the two prophecies are speaking of the same event when they are not? 

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1 hour ago, Bobbieaware said:

Where the difficulty enters into this discussion for me is trying to wrap my mind around the idea of how some modern Jews are going to be able to make an “offering in righteousness” (a blood letting sacrifice of at least one animal) when those performing the sacrifice do not believe in Christ and worship him with the required clean hands and pure hearts that are needed to enable them to “make an offering in righteousness.”

Perhaps better questions for you would be: What is righteousness?  Can a Jew be righteous without believing in Jesus Christ as his Messiah?  Joseph Smith believed that a man could be righteous without being Mormon.

Quote

“While one portion of the human race is judging and condemning the other without mercy, the Great Parent of the universe looks upon the whole of the human family with a fatherly care and paternal regard; He views them as His offspring, and without any of those contracted feelings that influence the children of men, causes ‘His sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.’ He holds the reins of judgment in His hands; He is a wise Lawgiver, and will judge all men, not according to the narrow, contracted notions of men, but ‘according to the deeds done in the body whether they be good or evil.’ . . . We need not doubt the wisdom and intelligence of the Great Jehovah.”  TPJS, 218.

Elder Orson F. Whitney in 1928 General Conference:

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“Perhaps the Lord needs such men on the outside of His Church to help it along. They are among its auxiliaries, and can do more good for the cause where the Lord has placed them, than anywhere else.” ... “God is using more than one people for the accomplishment of His great and marvelous work. The Latter-day Saints cannot do it all. It is too vast, too arduous for any one people.”

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..................... (2 Nephi 25)

Perhaps the confusion here ends with the realization that the prophecy in Zechariah and the prophecy in D&C 128 are speaking of two different events? Could it be that some have mistakenly presumed the two prophecies are speaking of the same event when they are not? 

The words to which I refer in D&C 128 and Zechariah are virtually identical.  It seems to me absurd that they would be speaking of separate events.

Romans 11 leaves no doubt that the Jews will accept Jesus Christ as their Messiah, and citing 2 Nephi 25 is merely preaching to the choir.  Your question should be, When?

Edited by Robert F. Smith
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2 hours ago, Robert F. Smith said:

Perhaps better questions for you would be: What is righteousness?  Can a Jew be righteous without believing in Jesus Christ as his Messiah?  Joseph Smith believed that a man could be righteous without being Mormon.

Elder Orson F. Whitney in 1928 General Conference:

The words to which I refer in D&C 128 and Zechariah are virtually identical.  It seems to me absurd that they would be speaking of separate events.

Romans 11 leaves no doubt that the Jews will accept Jesus Christ as their Messiah, and citing 2 Nephi 25 is merely preaching to the choir.  Your question should be, When?

I’m not talking about people conflating D&C 128:24 with the last verse of Malachi 3. I’m talking about those who conflate the Levite offering in righteousness. spoken of D&C 128:24, with the so-called red heifer prophecy.

Verse 24 of D&C 128 calls upon both the purified sons of Levi and the Latter-Day Saints to make offerings in righteousness unto the Lord.   Do you believe the offering in righteousness the Latter-Day Saints are called upon to make is the same kimd of sacrifice the sons of Levi are called upon to make? If not, why not? 

 

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51 minutes ago, Bobbieaware said:

I’m not talking about people conflating D&C 128:24 with the last verse of Malachi 3. I’m talking about those who conflate the Levite offering in righteousness. spoken of D&C 128:24, with the so-called red heifer prophecy.

Sorry.  I misunderstood the point you were making, and you apparently misunderstood me as well.  Zechariah (not Malachi) and the D&C agree that Jesus Christ comes to the Jews at Mt Olivet in their hour of need, at some future time.  There is no sign of their conversion to Christianity by the Mormons.  Only by Christ himself.  Do you know what I am talking about?

51 minutes ago, Bobbieaware said:

Verse 24 of D&C 128 calls upon both the purified sons of Levi and the Latter-Day Saints to make offerings in righteousness unto the Lord.   Do you believe the offering in righteousness the Latter-Day Saints are called upon to make is the same kimd of sacrifice the sons of Levi are called upon to make? If not, why not? 

There are all kinds of sacrificial offerings, but only the Jews will be offering blood sacrifices at their temple in Jerusalem.  D&C 128:24 does not say that the LDS will be offering blood sacrifice.

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16 minutes ago, Robert F. Smith said:

Sorry.  I misunderstood the point you were making, and you apparently misunderstood me as well.  Zechariah (not Malachi) and the D&C agree that Jesus Christ comes to the Jews at Mt Olivet in their hour of need, at some future time.  There is no sign of their conversion to Christianity by the Mormons.  Only by Christ himself.  Do you know what I am talking about?

There are all kinds of sacrificial offerings, but only the Jews will be offering blood sacrifices at their temple in Jerusalem.  D&C 128:24 does not say that the LDS will be offering blood sacrifice.

Yes I do understand what you’re talking about. 

There is nothing specific in D&C 128:24 to indicate the offering in righteousness commanded of the Latter-Day Saints will be any different in nature than the offering in righteousness commanded of the sons of Levi. And if what you say about the offering commanded of the Latter-Day Saints is true, it’s proof positive that there is more than one way for holders of the priesthood to make acceptable sacrificial offerings to the Lord.

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1 hour ago, Bobbieaware said:

Yes I do understand what you’re talking about. 

There is nothing specific in D&C 128:24 to indicate the offering in righteousness commanded of the Latter-Day Saints will be any different in nature than the offering in righteousness commanded of the sons of Levi. And if what you say about the offering commanded of the Latter-Day Saints is true, it’s proof positive that there is more than one way for holders of the priesthood to make acceptable sacrificial offerings to the Lord.

Correct, and you may have noticed that the  normal interpretation of D&C 128:24 is that of sacrifice of time and effort in genealogical work and in the ordinances which are provided the dead by proxy.  No one would suggest blood sacrifice if the Brethren had not insisted upon it.  In what context?  The only one which makes any sense:  Levites serving the tribe of Judah (Jews) making traditional blood sacrifice, just as the Samaritans still do on Mt Gerizim every Passover.

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8 hours ago, Robert F. Smith said:

Correct, and you may have noticed that the  normal interpretation of D&C 128:24 is that of sacrifice of time and effort in genealogical work and in the ordinances which are provided the dead by proxy.  No one would suggest blood sacrifice if the Brethren had not insisted upon it.  In what context?  The only one which makes any sense:  Levites serving the tribe of Judah (Jews) making traditional blood sacrifice, just as the Samaritans still do on Mt Gerizim every Passover.

I just discovered an interesting wrinkle in all this. According to the Seminary Student Manual for the Doctrine and Covenants and Church History, the expression “sons of Levi” in D&C 128:24 means any faithful priesthood holder in today’s LDS Church. In other words, the expression “sons of Levi” means pretty much the same thing as the expression “sons of Moses and of Aaron” does in D&C 84. On page 33, of the aforessaid Seminary Manual it says:

”Today, the expression ‘sons of Levi’ is used to characterize all those in the Church who faithfully receive the Priesthood and become ‘sons of Moses and of Aaron.’”

If the above statement is correct, the commanded offering in righteousness is the salvative work done in our temples for both the living and the dead. And when D&C 128:24 speaks of the sons of Levi being purged and refined by the Lord like gold and silver, it is speaking of priesthood holders of the LDS Church who are being refined by spiritual fire and the purifying influence of the gift of the Holy Ghost. Therefore, this would mean the sons of Levi mentioned in verse 24 are priesthood holders who believe in and have covenanted Christ, not men who do not believe in Christ. Interesting...

Edited by Bobbieaware
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Thank you all for responding.

I'm sorry I wasn't clear in my original questions.

Just wondering if there will be two Temples, one Jewish and one LDS, in Jerusalem at the very end of the Last Days.

Seems quite close due to red heifer, Jewish Temple stones having already been cut, labelled, prepared; eclipses 7 years apart, etc.

I understand the Jewish people will not be offering animal sacrifice in LDS Temples.

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3 hours ago, nuclearfuels said:

Thank you all for responding.

I'm sorry I wasn't clear in my original questions.

Just wondering if there will be two Temples, one Jewish and one LDS, in Jerusalem at the very end of the Last Days.

Seems quite close due to red heifer, Jewish Temple stones having already been cut, labelled, prepared; eclipses 7 years apart, etc.

I understand the Jewish people will not be offering animal sacrifice in LDS Temples.

Just one temple in Jerusalem.  At some point, however, after the conversion of the Jewish people, we will see complete fulfillment of Isaiah 2:1-3.  One can assume at that point that LDS, Jewish, Samaritan, and members of the Lost Tribes will be functioning in unison.  But not before what takes place in Zechariah 13:6, 14:4, D&C 45:47-53.

 

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@Bobbieaware and @Robert F. Smith, I see two themes in the scriptures; one is animal sacrifice under the dispensations of Adam through Jacob, and one is animal sacrifice under the dispensation of the Law of Moses. It seems to me that the earlier version carried out under the patriarchal order has not yet been restored, and the later (Mosaic) version was fulfilled in Christ and so would not be restored. It seems to me that animal sacrifice under the patriarchal order was an ordinance much like the sacrament is today, a bona fide remembrance of Christ and not so much a disciplinary "schoolmaster" for those who rejected the higher covenants that Moses originally presented. By converting to the Gospel, the sons of Levi (which I take to be representative of the "least" of the sons of Moses and of Aaron and the seed of Abraham, which the sanctified are, regardless of bloodline) shall be purged that they may offer unto the Lord an offering in righteousness.

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1 hour ago, CV75 said:

@Bobbieaware and @Robert F. Smith, I see two themes in the scriptures; one is animal sacrifice under the dispensations of Adam through Jacob, and one is animal sacrifice under the dispensation of the Law of Moses. It seems to me that the earlier version carried out under the patriarchal order has not yet been restored, and the later (Mosaic) version was fulfilled in Christ and so would not be restored. It seems to me that animal sacrifice under the patriarchal order was an ordinance much like the sacrament is today, a bona fide remembrance of Christ and not so much a disciplinary "schoolmaster" for those who rejected the higher covenants that Moses originally presented. By converting to the Gospel, the sons of Levi (which I take to be representative of the "least" of the sons of Moses and of Aaron and the seed of Abraham, which the sanctified are, regardless of bloodline) shall be purged that they may offer unto the Lord an offering in righteousness.

My opinion tends more toward the Levites offering that blood sacrifice in righteousness before conversion to Christ, the purging of their hearts having taken place already -- under the principles of rabbinic Judaism.

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36 minutes ago, Robert F. Smith said:

My opinion tends more toward the Levites offering that blood sacrifice in righteousness before conversion to Christ, the purging of their hearts having taken place already -- under the principles of rabbinic Judaism.

Malachi wrote in the 2nd century BC, and the rabbinic Judaism tradition did not begin until the 6th century AD. What is the connection between Malachi’s earlier prophecy and the principles of the later tradition? presumably they both have a basis in the even more ancient Oral Torah; what is the purging principle you are referring to?

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2 hours ago, CV75 said:

Malachi wrote in the 2nd century BC, and the rabbinic Judaism tradition did not begin until the 6th century AD. What is the connection between Malachi’s earlier prophecy and the principles of the later tradition? presumably they both have a basis in the even more ancient Oral Torah; what is the purging principle you are referring to?

Rabbinic Judaism began long before the birth of Jesus (who was a Pharisaic rabbi, same as St Paul), even though rabbis were not formally ordained in that early period.  Modern rabbinic Judaism owes most in foundational terms to Rabbi Hillel (an older contemporary of Jesus), and considers itself to be Bet Hillel.  A key part of that tradition is the Oral Torah (the Law), which was codified and placed in writing around 200 A.D., being known as the Mishnah -- which together with extensive commentaries is called the Talmud, and is given Scriptural status.

The purging or purifying of the Sons of Levi (the priestly tribe of Levi living among the Jews) is spiritual and entails (1) the principle of repentance, which is central to Judaism, and (2) obedience to the commandments.

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52 minutes ago, Robert F. Smith said:

Rabbinic Judaism began long before the birth of Jesus (who was a Pharisaic rabbi, same as St Paul), even though rabbis were not formally ordained in that early period.  Modern rabbinic Judaism owes most in foundational terms to Rabbi Hillel (an older contemporary of Jesus), and considers itself to be Bet Hillel.  A key part of that tradition is the Oral Torah (the Law), which was codified and placed in writing around 200 A.D., being known as the Mishnah -- which together with extensive commentaries is called the Talmud, and is given Scriptural status.

The purging or purifying of the Sons of Levi (the priestly tribe of Levi living among the Jews) is spiritual and entails (1) the principle of repentance, which is central to Judaism, and (2) obedience to the commandments.

Malachi would then be prophesying of repentance and obedience according to the higher, spiritual law by which God fulfilled the law of carnal commandments (the time period he is prophesying about is after the first coming of the Christ). Do yo have some quotes from the Mishnah that lay out these higher principles and how they are to be followed by the sons of Levi in latter days? I'm thinking that Malachi would be prophetically sensing and referring to the ordinances brought into the world by the Christ and other heads of dispensations, which have now been restored, as well as any eternal principles that were carried through the generations orally into his time (and into our time by the Mishnah).

Edited by CV75
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5 hours ago, CV75 said:

Malachi would then be prophesying of repentance and obedience according to the higher, spiritual law by which God fulfilled the law of carnal commandments (the time period he is prophesying about is after the first coming of the Christ). Do yo have some quotes from the Mishnah that lay out these higher principles and how they are to be followed by the sons of Levi in latter days? I'm thinking that Malachi would be prophetically sensing and referring to the ordinances brought into the world by the Christ and other heads of dispensations, which have now been restored, as well as any eternal principles that were carried through the generations orally into his time (and into our time by the Mishnah).

All Israel (Levites, Jews, etc.) is expected to be righteous at all times and in all places.  The best summary of those principles is contained in Mishnaic Tractate 'Abot (Sayings of the Fathers), but principles of righteousness are scattered throughout the Talmud.  You can find 'Abot online at http://virtualreligion.net/iho/aboth.html (Mishna only), and http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/tractate-avot-chapter-1 (with commentary).  Virtually all of the ethical and moral teachings of Jesus can be found in the Talmud.

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7 hours ago, Robert F. Smith said:

All Israel (Levites, Jews, etc.) is expected to be righteous at all times and in all places.  The best summary of those principles is contained in Mishnaic Tractate 'Abot (Sayings of the Fathers), but principles of righteousness are scattered throughout the Talmud.  You can find 'Abot online at http://virtualreligion.net/iho/aboth.html (Mishna only), and http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/tractate-avot-chapter-1 (with commentary).  Virtually all of the ethical and moral teachings of Jesus can be found in the Talmud.

Jesus taught these universal principles of righteousness, and additionally how they can be attained in a fulness through the ordinances. Assuming sacrifice is one of these ordinances and has yet to be restored, the only particular one I can think of that was performed by Israel outside of the Law of Moses (and therefore not subject to being fulfilled and ended in Christ) is the Pascal Lamb for the Passover, which was instituted before and originally carried out without the Levitical priesthood order, though I understand at some point the Levites assumed the role of performing this sacrifice for those presenting their offerings at the temple.

It seems to me that the other requirements for the other animal sacrifices were fulfilled in Jesus’ suffering and death, so Malachi must have been referring to the original version, or the Passover, which I take to be one version of the animal sacrifice performed by the patriarchs. I take the references to the ending of sacrifices in the New Testament and Book of Mormon to pertain to the Law of Moses only, so the Levites could understandably pick up a new role in performing the original and restored ordinance of sacrifice, but they would only be ready to do this once they have received the restored Gospel ordinances, including the temple ordinances

Otherwise, I’m not seeing how in the last days there would be parallel temples and ordinances for gathered Israel, one set for the Levites to perform in a Jewish, Jerusalem temple and another set for the High Priesthood to perform in LDS temples everywhere else.

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