Zakuska Posted January 31, 2016 Posted January 31, 2016 During the millenium christ will reign personally on the earth. Quote During the Millennium the Savior will reign personally on the earth. 1. The millennial government is under the administration of the Savior and His righteous Saints (see Isaiah 2:1–4; Micah 4:2–3; Joel 3:16–17; D&C 43:29–30; 45:59; Revelation 5:10;20:4, 6; D&C 133:25). 2. The Millennium will be righteous Israel’s day with the Savior, during which He will make all things known to them (see Zechariah 2:11; D&C 101:32–34; 121:26–32; 2 Nephi 30:16–18; Isaiah 11:9). 3. Not everyone will have a knowledge of the living God and belong to His Church when the Millennium begins (seeMicah 4:5). 4. During the Millennium, all those living on the earth will eventually know the Lord and will join His Church (seeJeremiah 31:31–34; D&C 84:98). https://www.lds.org/manual/doctrines-of-the-gospel-student-manual/chapter-37-the-millennium-and-the-glorification-of-the-earth?lang=eng
Jim Stiles Posted January 31, 2016 Posted January 31, 2016 6 hours ago, Anakin7 said: . And which Bible are you referring to ?, which anchient or modern version ?. In His Eternal Debt/Grace Anakin7 For a change, how about the JST?
Jim Stiles Posted January 31, 2016 Posted January 31, 2016 4 hours ago, Vance said: News flash! Trinitarian isn't even monotheistic either. Yes, it is. Normal Trinitarian Christianity is considered to be a monotheistic religion. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monotheism#Christianity
Jim Stiles Posted January 31, 2016 Posted January 31, 2016 4 hours ago, Vance said: Zeph 3:14 ¶ Sing, O daughter of Zion; shout, O Israel; be glad and rejoice with all the heart, O daughter of Jerusalem. 15 The Lord hath taken away thy judgments, he hath cast out thine enemy: the king of Israel, even the Lord, is in the midst of thee: thou shalt not see evil any more. 16 In that day it shall be said to Jerusalem, Fear thou not: and to Zion, Let not thine hands be slack. 17 The Lord thy God in the midst of thee is mighty; he will save, he will rejoice over thee with joy; he will rest in his love, he will joy over thee with singing. 18 I will gather them that are sorrowful for the solemn assembly, who are of thee, to whom the reproach of it was a burden. 19 Behold, at that time I will undo all that afflict thee: and I will save her that halteth, and gather her that was driven out; and I will get them praise and fame in every land where they have been put to shame. 20 At that time will I bring you again, even in the time that I gather you: for I will make you a name and a praise among all people of the earth, when I turn back your captivity before your eyes, saith the Lord. Is that not during the millennium? Off the top of my head, it seems that this Old Testament prophecy was either fulfilled in the first advent of Christ Jesus or will be fulfilled in the eternal state.
thesometimesaint Posted January 31, 2016 Posted January 31, 2016 36 minutes ago, Jim Stiles said: Yes, it is. Normal Trinitarian Christianity is considered to be a monotheistic religion. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monotheism#Christianity Ask a Jew or a Muslim about that. 1
Jim Stiles Posted January 31, 2016 Posted January 31, 2016 2 hours ago, thesometimesaint said: Either the Apostles passed down their authority as per the Bible, or it was lost in the Apostasy. Protestants don't have a theological leg to stand on. Yes we do. What we don't do is tell them they are going to Hell. You haven't presented a cogent argument against LDS theology. Joseph Smith never claimed to be free of "troubling incidences". Just the opposite, but he was a good man trying to do what he thought God told him to do. The LDS don't stand or fall on the "troubling incidences" of Joseph Smith Jr. or of Simon bar Jonah. No. The office of Apostle was never intended to last beyond the lifetimes of the original 11 plus Mattias. The apostles in those denominations that claim to have apostles have not received their authority from one of the 12 nor are they an eyewitness to the resurrected Christ. The only theological leg that the LDS church stands on is the testimony of Joseph Smith Jr. Prove that his testimony is not acceptable, and it all falls down. Jesus told people that they were going to hell. Quote Matthew 23:23-36 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone. Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel. Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye make clean the outside of the cup and of the platter, but within they are full of extortion and excess. Thou blind Pharisee, cleanse first that which is within the cup and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also. Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness. Even so ye also outwardly appear righteous unto men, but within ye are full of hypocrisy and iniquity. Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye build the tombs of the prophets, and garnish the sepulchres of the righteous, And say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets. Wherefore ye be witnesses unto yourselves, that ye are the children of them which killed the prophets. Fill ye up then the measure of your fathers. Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell? Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city: That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar. Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation. Formal Cogent Argument Against LDS Theology #1 http://opc.org/confessions.html Formal Cogent Argument Against LDS Theology #2 The above scriptural quote mentions hell as the destination of the wicked. It makes no mention of the telestial kingdom. Pastor John Piper writes in Life As a Vapor, p. 19-21: Quote I can’t keep eternity out of my mind. Life is short and eternity is long. Very long. It is a long time to regret a wasted life. The testimony of Joseph Smith Jr. Fraud conviction: http://www.utlm.org/newsletters/no68.htm Notes from the bench warrant: http://mormonthink.com/QUOTES/js1826.htm
Jim Stiles Posted January 31, 2016 Posted January 31, 2016 4 minutes ago, thesometimesaint said: Ask a Jew or a Muslim about that. Muslim and Jews do not consider Trinitarian Christianity to be monotheistic. Everyone else does though.
Jim Stiles Posted January 31, 2016 Posted January 31, 2016 2 hours ago, Zakuska said: During the millenium christ will reign personally on the earth. https://www.lds.org/manual/doctrines-of-the-gospel-student-manual/chapter-37-the-millennium-and-the-glorification-of-the-earth?lang=eng Nothing about the millennium is a heaven or hell issue. However, most of the cited verses from the Bible refer to the eternal state.
busybee Posted January 31, 2016 Posted January 31, 2016 2 hours ago, Jim Stiles said: Jesus told people that they were going to hell. You are not He.
busybee Posted January 31, 2016 Posted January 31, 2016 9 hours ago, Jim Stiles said: God speaks to man through God the Son. And God does this through the Word, the Bible. So I guess this scripture is redundant then: Amos 3:7 7 Surely the Lord God will do nothing, but he revealeth his secret unto his servants the prophets. Be careful not to add or subtract from the Bible.
JLHPROF Posted January 31, 2016 Posted January 31, 2016 4 hours ago, Jim Stiles said: Muslim and Jews do not consider Trinitarian Christianity to be monotheistic. Everyone else does though. So a few million people get on your case about being polytheistic...that must be so annoying for you.
thesometimesaint Posted January 31, 2016 Posted January 31, 2016 (edited) 6 hours ago, Jim Stiles said: Muslim and Jews do not consider Trinitarian Christianity to be monotheistic. Everyone else does though. The Apostles didn't either. SEE John 17. BTW The Apostleship was to last a very long time. Ephesians 4:11-13 King James Version (KJV) 11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; 12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: 13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ: Edited January 31, 2016 by thesometimesaint
Anakin7 Posted January 31, 2016 Posted January 31, 2016 8 hours ago, Jim Stiles said: For a change, how about the JST? How about the 100 + other versions ?. In His Eternal Debt Grace Anakin7
Stormin' Mormon Posted January 31, 2016 Posted January 31, 2016 8 hours ago, Jim Stiles said: Muslim and Jews do not consider Trinitarian Christianity to be monotheistic. Everyone else does though. Muslim and Jews do not consider Trinitarian Christianity to be monotheistic. Trinitarian Christians do though. Fixed it for you.
Jim Stiles Posted January 31, 2016 Posted January 31, 2016 9 hours ago, busybee said: So I guess this scripture is redundant then: Amos 3:7 7 Surely the Lord God will do nothing, but he revealeth his secret unto his servants the prophets. Be careful not to add or subtract from the Bible. Read Hebrews 1 again. He speaks to us through his Son.
Jim Stiles Posted January 31, 2016 Posted January 31, 2016 10 hours ago, busybee said: You are not He. So did Peter: Quote Acts 8:9-20 But there was a certain man, called Simon, which beforetime in the same city used sorcery, and bewitched the people of Samaria, giving out that himself was some great one: To whom they all gave heed, from the least to the greatest, saying, This man is the great power of God. And to him they had regard, because that of long time he had bewitched them with sorceries. But when they believed Philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women. Then Simon himself believed also: and when he was baptized, he continued with Philip, and wondered, beholding the miracles and signs which were done. Now when the apostles which were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent unto them Peter and John: Who, when they were come down, prayed for them, that they might receive the Holy Ghost: (For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.) Then laid they their hands on them, and they received the Holy Ghost. And when Simon saw that through laying on of the apostles' hands the Holy Ghost was given, he offered them money, Saying, Give me also this power, that on whomsoever I lay hands, he may receive the Holy Ghost. But Peter said unto him, Thy money perish with thee, because thou hast thought that the gift of God may be purchased with money. And he did it against those who had incorrect philosophical notions.
Vance Posted January 31, 2016 Posted January 31, 2016 On 1/30/2016 at 1:12 PM, Jim Stiles said: Yet, the moment a non-LDS member presents a cogent argument against LDS theology, the LDS member screams and complains as if he or she were being tortured with the rack or an iron maiden. I saw this post and went back looking for this storied "cogent argument". Didn't find it. So, could you please point it out to me. I would like to see this fabled thing. 3
Jim Stiles Posted January 31, 2016 Posted January 31, 2016 5 hours ago, Anakin7 said: How about the 100 + other versions ?. In His Eternal Debt Grace Anakin7 If you could be bothered to read any of those versions, you would know that they do not differ much in the important things. Even Bart Ehrman was forced to concede that the changes that have been made in the basic text of scripture do not seriously affect the basic dogma of Christianity.
Vance Posted January 31, 2016 Posted January 31, 2016 13 hours ago, Jim Stiles said: Yes, it is. Normal Trinitarian Christianity is considered to be a monotheistic religion. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monotheism#Christianity I see the part about "triune mystery-nature of God" and "trinity", but then again, those, BY DEFINITION are NOT monotheism. So, it is a "mystery" and it is "tri" meaning THREE not "mono" meaning one. Now if you want to FALSELY call it monotheism, you can. It just doesn't mean anything to do so. 2
Vance Posted January 31, 2016 Posted January 31, 2016 13 hours ago, Jim Stiles said: Off the top of my head, it seems that this Old Testament prophecy was either fulfilled in the first advent of Christ Jesus or will be fulfilled in the eternal state. Ignoring the obvious doesn't make it go away. The fact that you won't admit the obvious does say something about you though.
busybee Posted January 31, 2016 Posted January 31, 2016 15 minutes ago, Jim Stiles said: So did Peter: And he did it against those who had incorrect philosophical notions. Well, I will willingly take chastisement from one of the Lord's anointed servants or from the Lord Himself. But I don't have to entertain you and others coming here and condemning me and my fellow brothers and sisters in Christ, to hell. It is not your place or calling to do so.
Jim Stiles Posted January 31, 2016 Posted January 31, 2016 6 hours ago, thesometimesaint said: The Apostles didn't either. SEE John 17. BTW The Apostleship was to last a very long time... No. If the Apostleship was intended to last a long time, then why was one not selected to replace James the brother of John. Quote Acts 12:1-4 Now about that time Herod the king stretched forth his hands to vex certain of the church. And he killed James the brother of John with the sword. And because he saw it pleased the Jews, he proceeded further to take Peter also. (Then were the days of unleavened bread.) And when he had apprehended him, he put him in prison, and delivered him to four quaternions of soldiers to keep him; intending after Easter to bring him forth to the people. The early Ante-Nicene fathers remembered John the Apostle. If they do not remember any attempts to make new Apostles, then why should we believe that Apostles should continue forever? Were the Ante-Nicene fathers all a bunch of liars and frauds? Is it more reasonable to suppose that a group of people working in concert (the Apostolic Fathers) are liars and frauds than it is to believe that one man is a liar and a fraud?
Vance Posted January 31, 2016 Posted January 31, 2016 13 hours ago, Jim Stiles said: No. The office of Apostle was never intended to last beyond the lifetimes of the original 11 plus Mattias. The apostles in those denominations that claim to have apostles have not received their authority from one of the 12 nor are they an eyewitness to the resurrected Christ. Oh, so the apostle Paul wasn't an apostle. And the apostle Barnabas wasn't an apostle. (As in Acts 14:14). So, in Rom 1:1 and 11:13, Paul lied? 1
Vance Posted January 31, 2016 Posted January 31, 2016 Quote When the Presbyterian Church in the United States of America was formed in 1788, it adopted (with minor revisions) the Westminster Confession of Faith, Larger and Shorter Catechisms (1647), as its secondary standards (the Bible itself being the only infallible rule of faith and practice). Officers in the Orthodox Presbyterian Church take a vow to "sincerely receive and adopt" these confessional documents "as containing the system of doctrine taught in the Holy Scriptures." Still looking for that fable "cogent argument". Hey, we all are just ignert mormonz so, you alls are just goin to have ta spoon fedz it to uznins.
Jim Stiles Posted January 31, 2016 Posted January 31, 2016 Quote 1 Clement 58:2 Receive our counsel, and ye shall have no occasion of regret. For as God liveth, and the Lord Jesus Christ liveth, and the Holy Spirit, who are the faith and the hope of the elect, so surely shall he, who with lowliness of mind and instant in gentleness hath without regretfulness performed the ordinances and commandments that are given by God, be enrolled and have a name among the number of them that are saved through Jesus Christ, through whom is the glory unto Him for ever and ever. Amen. Ain't the internet great!
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