What Did Jesus Inherit From God The Father?

[bluebell]

I know what the LDS teaching is on the subject, so i'm specifically wondering about the Catholic/protestant doctrine.

 

The NT (Romans 8:17) says that Jesus is an heir to God the Father and that when we are saved we become joint heirs with Him.

 

What did Jesus inherit from God the Father?

[DarkScythe]

I know what the LDS teaching is on the subject, so i'm specifically wondering about the Catholic/protestant doctrine.

 

The NT (Romans 8:17) says that Jesus is an heir to God the Father and that when we are saved we become joint heirs with Him.

 

What did Jesus inherit from God the Father?

 

 

Everything within This Universe is one thing. Anything outside this universe, I have no clue.

[CCRW]

Good looks

[bluebell]

Everything within This Universe is one thing. Anything outside this universe, I have no clue.

 

Wasn't it His already though?

[danielwoods]

I know what the LDS teaching is on the subject, so i'm specifically wondering about the Catholic/protestant doctrine.

 

The NT (Romans 8:17) says that Jesus is an heir to God the Father and that when we are saved we become joint heirs with Him.

 

What did Jesus inherit from God the Father?

 

In the bible, Jesus speaks from or is referenced from two different points of view, which represents his two natures. 

 

Jesus said, "Before Abraham was, I AM". This statement isn't from the perspective of Jesus as a human, because he was only born about 30 years earlier. This statement represents Jesus making a statement of himself as God almighty. Another time Jesus says, "My God, My God, why have you forsaken me?" This statement obviously isn't from the perspective of his divinity, but his humanity. So, it's important to understand the perspective the passage in question is speaking from. 

 

Jesus is an heir and we are joint heirs as adopted in to God's family as humans. In this phrase, it can only be talking about Jesus the man, and the heir is a reference to resurrection and eternal life. Because Jesus as God almighty has no need for anything, for "By him all things were created, in heaven and on earth…"

[bluebell]

Jesus is an heir and we are joint heirs as adopted in to God's family as humans. In this phrase, it can only be talking about Jesus the man, and the heir is a reference to resurrection and eternal life. Because Jesus as God almighty has no need for anything, for "By him all things were created, in heaven and on earth…"

 

Ok, thanks for explaining that.  I understand what you are saying.

 

On a tangent it makes me wonder, why, in your belief, is resurrection necessary?  Why was Christ resurrected and why are we resurrected-what purpose does it serve?

[danielwoods]

Ok, thanks for explaining that.  I understand what you are saying.

 

On a tangent it makes me wonder, why, in your belief, is resurrection necessary?  Why was Christ resurrected and why are we resurrected-what purpose does it serve?

 

Interesting question. 

 

I think it goes back to the beginning when death first entered the universe. All creation was effected by the decision of Adam and Eve. And now all creation awaits the redemption or resurrection. "For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive." Which is interesting, Jesus said "I AM the resurrection and the life" which is sort of redundant, resurrection technically is and can only be life. I think of it this way. Life on Earth now is not what it will be. We are alive, but we are dying at a slower rate than we are regenerating cells to keep us alive, which by definition means we are still alive (breathing). In our resurrection bodies, our bodies won't be dying at all. No decay. Which is rather difficult for us to imagine in our state, but we will be connected directly to the source of life, without the interference of Sin. 

 

In essence, resurrection is life as God intended it to be. 

[bluebell]

 

Interesting question. 

 

I think it goes back to the beginning when death first entered the universe. All creation was effected by the decision of Adam and Eve. And now all creation awaits the redemption or resurrection. "For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive." Which is interesting, Jesus said "I AM the resurrection and the life" which is sort of redundant, resurrection technically is and can only be life. I think of it this way. Life on Earth now is not what it will be. We are alive, but we are dying at a slower rate than we are regenerating cells to keep us alive, which by definition means we are still alive (breathing). In our resurrection bodies, our bodies won't be dying at all. No decay. Which is rather difficult for us to imagine in our state, but we will be connected directly to the source of life, without the interference of Sin. 

 

In essence, resurrection is life as God intended it to be. 

 

Thanks.  

 

I just wondered why protestants and Catholics believe that God wants (or wanted if talking about the garden of eden before the fall) His creation to have physical bodies.  A physical body obviously isn't necessary, in your belief system, and has no advantage over a spiritual body so i wondered if you had any doctrine that explained why He bothered with physical bodies at all.

 

Talking about 'the resurrection and the life,'-in LDS doctrine, the difference is the difference between immortality and life eternal.  Both can mean the same thing obviously, but in this context one (resurrection) overcomes the physical death that adam and eve brought in the world, and the other (eternal life) overcomes the spiritual death that adam and eve brought into the world.

[The Nehor]

Receding hairline. Thanks dad.

[danielwoods]

Thanks.  

 

I just wondered why protestants and Catholics believe that God wants (or wanted if talking about the garden of eden before the fall) His creation to have physical bodies.  A physical body obviously isn't necessary, in your belief system, and has no advantage over a spiritual body so i wondered if you had any doctrine that explained why He bothered with physical bodies at all.

 

 No specific doctrinal references that I know of. But let's look at this for a second. 

 

1 Cor. 15:45 So it is written: “The first man Adam became a living being”; the last Adam, a life-giving spirit. 46 The spiritual did not come first, but the natural, and after that the spiritual. 47 The first man was of the dust of the earth; the second man is of heaven."

 

A couple of things. First is your question, why bother with physical bodies? The answer (in my opinion) has to do with his plan of progression and learning for us. Second, is the clear indication of origins. We originated as dust and became a living being at that point, we didn't exist in any form before that point. We are from the Earth. This verse contrasts Christ, as being from above or heaven and is a life-giving spirit. 

 

 

Talking about 'the resurrection and the life,'-in LDS doctrine, the difference is the difference between immortality and life eternal.  Both can mean the same thing obviously, but in this context one (resurrection) overcomes the physical death that adam and eve brought in the world, and the other (eternal life) overcomes the spiritual death that adam and eve brought into the world.

I'm not sure I understand how these two can be separated, and how resurrection overcomes physical death? Jesus overcame death and provides this redemption, as I'm sure you'd agree, it not "resurrection" that provides it, but Jesus does. The same with "spiritual death", what is that exactly in your view?

[VideoGameJunkie]

A throne

[bluebell]

 

 No specific doctrinal references that I know of. But let's look at this for a second. 

 

1 Cor. 15:45 So it is written: “The first man Adam became a living being”; the last Adam, a life-giving spirit. 46 The spiritual did not come first, but the natural, and after that the spiritual. 47 The first man was of the dust of the earth; the second man is of heaven."

 

A couple of things. First is your question, why bother with physical bodies? The answer (in my opinion) has to do with his plan of progression and learning for us. Second, is the clear indication of origins. We originated as dust and became a living being at that point, we didn't exist in any form before that point. We are from the Earth. This verse contrasts Christ, as being from above or heaven and is a life-giving spirit. 

 

 

 

 

Ok.

 

I'm not sure I understand how these two can be separated, and how resurrection overcomes physical death? Jesus overcame death and provides this redemption, as I'm sure you'd agree, it not "resurrection" that provides it, but Jesus does. The same with "spiritual death", what is that exactly in your view?

 

 

Yes, of course resurrection is provided by the Atonement of Jesus Christ, just as eternal life (salvation) is.  Sorry if i wasn't clear about that.

 

It is thru resurrection that Jesus provides our physical redemption and thru suffering for our sins and dying on the cross that Jesus provides our spiritual redemption.  This is what I mean.

 

When adam fell two deaths entered the world-physical death (the separation of our bodies and our spirits) and spiritual death (the separation of us from God).  Since the fall caused two deaths, the Atonement had to overcome two deaths.  Resurrection makes us immortal (our spirits and bodies return together and will never be separated again) and salvation reunites us with God (we will live in His kingdom).

 

In my theology, this is why resurrection is important.  This is one of the reasons why we are resurrected.  It is what has to happen to fix the consequences of the Fall.  

[teddyaware]

 

 No specific doctrinal references that I know of. But let's look at this for a second. 

 

1 Cor. 15:45 So it is written: “The first man Adam became a living being”; the last Adam, a life-giving spirit. 46 The spiritual did not come first, but the natural, and after that the spiritual. 47 The first man was of the dust of the earth; the second man is of heaven."

 

A couple of things. First is your question, why bother with physical bodies? The answer (in my opinion) has to do with his plan of progression and learning for us. Second, is the clear indication of origins. We originated as dust and became a living being at that point, we didn't exist in any form before that point. We are from the Earth. This verse contrasts Christ, as being from above or heaven and is a life-giving spirit. 

 

 

I'm not sure I understand how these two can be separated, and how resurrection overcomes physical death? Jesus overcame death and provides this redemption, as I'm sure you'd agree, it not "resurrection" that provides it, but Jesus does. The same with "spiritual death", what is that exactly in your view?

 

In the following verses (also from 1 Corinthians 15), I'm wondering if you believe Paul is speaking of the man Adam in the fallen state or of the man Adam while in the paradisiacal state prior to the fall?

 

42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:

Do you believe Adam in his pre-fallen state was "sown in corruption?"

43 It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:

Do you believe Adam in his pre-fallen state was "sown in dishonor" and "weakness?"

44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

Do you believe Adam's pre-fall body was a "natural body?"

 

And again...

 

 47 The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.

Do you believe Paul's use of the term "earthy" refers to Adam in his pre-fallen paradisiacal state or in his post-fallen mortal state?  

[3DOP]

I know what the LDS teaching is on the subject, so i'm specifically wondering about the Catholic/protestant doctrine.

 

The NT (Romans 8:17) says that Jesus is an heir to God the Father and that when we are saved we become joint heirs with Him.

 

What did Jesus inherit from God the Father?

 

It might be easier to answer what Jesus did NOT inherit? Everything except fatherhhood, the only reason for which the Father is revealed to be greater. Remember when Philip asked Jesus to "show us the Father"? Philip, he that seeth me seeth the Father also. How sayest thou, shew us the Father?

Edited April 22, 2015 by 3DOP

[danielwoods]

Ok.

 

 

Yes, of course resurrection is provided by the Atonement of Jesus Christ, just as eternal life (salvation) is.  Sorry if i wasn't clear about that.

 

It is thru resurrection that Jesus provides our physical redemption and thru suffering for our sins and dying on the cross that Jesus provides our spiritual redemption.  This is what I mean.

 

When adam fell two deaths entered the world-physical death (the separation of our bodies and our spirits) and spiritual death (the separation of us from God).  Since the fall caused two deaths, the Atonement had to overcome two deaths.  Resurrection makes us immortal (our spirits and bodies return together and will never be separated again) and salvation reunites us with God (we will live in His kingdom).

 

In my theology, this is why resurrection is important.  This is one of the reasons why we are resurrected.  It is what has to happen to fix the consequences of the Fall.  

 

Ok. I think I understand what you are saying. 

[Paloma]

I know what the LDS teaching is on the subject, so i'm specifically wondering about the Catholic/protestant doctrine.

 

The NT (Romans 8:17) says that Jesus is an heir to God the Father and that when we are saved we become joint heirs with Him.

 

What did Jesus inherit from God the Father?

 

Jesus inherited us.

 

His eternal purpose is to provide redemption for us;  to bring us to the Father;  and to live with us, and have us live with Him and the Father eternally. " He endured the cross, despising the shame, for the joy set before Him.".  (Heb. 12:2)

 

John 6: 37-39 talks about 'all those the Father has given Him';  and John 10:28 says: " I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand."

 

Throughout the Bible, there's a constant theme of our being a precious possession to God and of His treasuring us and rejoicing over us.

 

We are joint heirs with Him, and he with us, in that we are united with Him in His sufferings and in His death and resurrection and glorification.  So that all that He enjoys through His sonship with the Father  (including a loving, close relationship;  the freedom to know and be known, and to appreciate the Father's goodness;  the power to live obediently and bear fruit as in "I am the vine and you are the branches ..." and so much more) belong to us as well, both in this life and for eternity.   

[bluebell]

Jesus inherited us.

 

His eternal purpose is to provide redemption for us;  to bring us to the Father;  and to live with us, and have us live with Him and the Father eternally. " He endured the cross, despising the shame, for the joy set before Him.".  (Heb. 12:2)

 

John 6: 37-39 talks about 'all those the Father has given Him';  and John 10:28 says: " I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand."

 

 

 

That's a really interesting way to look at it, and in one way it completely makes sense.  Thanks!

[danielwoods]

In the following verses (also from 1 Corinthians 15), I'm wondering if you believe Paul is speaking of the man Adam in the fallen state or of the man Adam while in the paradisiacal state prior to the fall?

 

42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:

Do you believe Adam in his pre-fallen state was "sown in corruption?"

43 It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:

Do you believe Adam in his pre-fallen state was "sown in dishonor" and "weakness?"

44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

Do you believe Adam's pre-fall body was a "natural body?"

 

 1) No, his pre fallen state wasn't corrupt.

 

2) No his pre fallen state wasn't sown in dishonor and weakness.

 

3) Adam's body as described as "natural" refers to his physical body, and yes it is what he had in his pre fallen state.

 

 

And again...

 

 47 

The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.

Do you believe Paul's use of the term "earthy" refers to Adam in his pre-fallen paradisiacal state or in his post-fallen mortal state?

Pre fall. It's a reference to Adam's origin, just as much as the following is a reference to the Lord's origin.

[Paloma]

Another answer I'd give to your question, Bluebell, in addition to what I wrote in my earlier post, is that Jesus inherited His name from the Father.  

 

Here I'm thinking of Hebrews 1:1-4:  "God, who at various times and in various ways spoke in time past to the fathers by the prophets, 2 has in these last days spoken to us by His Son, whom He has appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the worlds; 3 who being the brightness of His glory and the express image of His person, and upholding all things by the word of His power, when He had by Himself[a] purged our[b] sins, sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high,4 having become so much better than the angels, as He has by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they."

 

Do you know the chorus, Jesus, name above all names?  That's what I think of here:

 

Jesus, name above all names
Beautiful Savior, glorious Lord.
Emmanuel, God is with us.
Blessed Redeemer, Living word.

 

So while I think it's true that Jesus inherited names like Saviour, Redeemer, and Glorious Lord, I see from the context of Hebrews 1 (that includes a comparison of Jesus to the angels), that a large part of the meaning here has to do with Jesus fully and finally realizing, growing into and inheriting his name of Son.  

 

Hebrews 1:5 says: " For to which of the angels did He ever say, "Thou art my son, today I have begotten thee"? And again, "I will be a father to him and he shall be a son to me"?"

 

In Romans 1:4, Paul says that Jesus Christ was "declared the Son of God with power by the resurrection from the dead."

 

Jesus has always been the eternal Son of god and He has always been "heir of all things" (Heb. 12:2).  But there's a sense in which he is now declared the Son of God and heir of all things in a new way.  He has now suffered, died and has risen again. At the beginning of Jesus' earthly ministry, God recognized hIm as His Beloved Son during his baptism.  And now there's the final fulfilment of that.  This passage in Hebrews shows us that Jesus, the God-man, now reigns with God the Father, not only by His eternal right as Son of god, but by the right of His obedient life as the Son whereby he's won victory over sin and death.  As Romans 1:4 says, he is the Son of God having manifested that power and right by the resurrection.

 

Jesus has inherited the name of God's Son by fulfilling His eternal purpose of becoming the sacrifice and also leading the way in resurrection for our redemption with God.

Edited April 22, 2015 by Paloma

[bluebell]

 

Jesus has inherited the name of God's Son by fulfilling His eternal purpose of becoming the sacrifice and also leading the way in resurrection for our redemption with God.

 

Another interesting way to look at it!

 

So Jesus gained something personal by performing the Atonement that He did not have previously?

[Paloma]

Another interesting way to look at it!

 

So Jesus gained something personal by performing the Atonement that He did not have previously?

 

Yes, I think so.

 

Or it may be more accurate to say that He realized or actualized it, because there's a sense in which He has always had everything.  (Here the distinction and interdependence of Jesus as God and Jesus as human have a role to play, I think.)  I'm going out now, and don't have time to think further on this right now.  (And I'm not sure how much light I could shed on it, even if I had the time!   )  

Edited April 23, 2015 by Paloma