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About Paloma

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    Member: Moves Upon the Waters

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  1. Teddyaware, thank you! There's a reason that I find LDS people beautiful, and you've just provided such a sweet and gracious illustration of that.
  2. Thank you for this, mfbukowski. I realize that I haven't communicated as clearly as I'd intended, since you have misunderstood what I've been trying to do and say here. And I won't try to explain further, as I can't be sure that I'll do any better! If I left the impression that I'm trying to puff myself up (though I did try to explain my contribution here through a certain amount of self-description) ... that couldn't be further from the truth. I highly respect the intelligence and depth of knowledge and experience of so many of you on this board. I'm not a strong logical thin
  3. Sorry for intruding, mfbukowski. I'm not sure if you're a "tough crowd" of one, or if I'm failing to come across as I intend, in general. Somehow, I sense there may be a few people who can understand where I'm coming from. But I recognize that message boards are not an easy or clear way to communicate, and then there's the fact that I very seldom contribute to the board, so I really am "unknown". I read much more than I post and there are long periods when I don't access the board at all. When I do read, I find people that I very much like and feel I know somewhat through hav
  4. Teddyaware, I appreciate your giving a specific example of what's available on the internet that teach definitively there's no marriage in heaven. And mfbukowski has given an example ... and I don't doubt that many more could be found online. Obviously, it's there, though, in my opinion, that teaching goes beyond what is clear in Scripture, and beyond what has been part of my own experience, study and training. In entering into this conversation, I've wanted to show you that a living, breathing person with much experience and some credentials, finds the teaching foreign and unfa
  5. "Focus on the Family" is creedal?? And yes, it is a well-known organization. You're right, mfbukowski, that there are too many sects, too many doctrines, etc. Earlier, when I mentioned my familiarity with Protestantism and Anabaptism, I thought to myself about how much I'm steeped in and how much I learn from Catholic and Orthodox mystics and writers. Some of my favourite writers are Peter Kreeft, Henri Nouwen, Richard Rohr, etc. Truth and beauty are found everywhere in the Christian faith, and unfortunately, dogmatism and unfounded teaching can be found too! "Focus on the Fami
  6. I realize that what I said above may come across as more curt than I'd intended (though I don't particularly like the idea that I'm to spend hours doing Google searches when I'd asked you to support an assertion you had made ... somehow, that doesn't quite compute in my brain!). Teddyaware, you had wondered if the lack of teaching about the possibility of marriage and families continuing in heaven, could mean that I believe it may be so. And I'd say that Yes, anything beautiful, true and joy-filled is possible. I do tend to think, especially with the lack of specific teaching, that
  7. Please provide examples of official Christian doctrinal teaching or statements that contradict the idea that earthly relationships (these may include marriages, families, friendships, etc.) continue in heaven. You made that assertion. Please provide documentation.
  8. I really appreciate this article written by Peter Kreeft. I've often thought that when it comes to sex, the core principles of intimacy, other-centredness, sheer pleasure, and delight in the beloved will be part of our eternal joy with God and loved ones in heaven.
  9. Teddyaware, you wrote this in response to Teancum's words: "I wonder how many non LDS Christians you have discussed this with. I can assure you they do believe that family members saved in heaven will maintain some form of familial relationships. Obviously it will be different to them than what the LDS Church believes because they don't believe in eternal procreation like the LDS Church teaches." I do want to say that I understand it's hard to know what non-LDS Christians teach about this subject, as there really isn't any official teaching about it, from my perspective. I know you ref
  10. Yes, to answer the question of this topic, LDS do misrepresent what other people believe about eternal togetherness. And, as has been recognized in the comments here, we all tend to misunderstand and misrepresent others' beliefs. When LDS friends have mentioned their thoughts about "till death do us part" referring to husband and wife not being together after death, I've tried to explain that there's no thought or intention of that by the actual people making those vows. In a non-LDS wedding ceremony, the emphasis is much more on togetherness and permanence than otherwise. "Till d
  11. Two memories come to me when I read this topic ... one from my childhood long before I knew anything about the LDS faith, and another from twenty years ago or so that involves LDS missionaries (and has nothing to do with tithing, but everything to do with finances). The first memory has to do with how appalled my parents were when the Presbyterian minister of our church took it upon himself to do something that was completely uncharacteristic. Never before or after had we known of a minister to expect confirmation of the precise tithing of parishioners. But this fellow had a laser focu
  12. Jesus' person, work and teaching are known to us through the Gospels. Acts and the Epistles continue to flesh out the way that believers are to live out His teaching, while gathering together in community. "Jesus" people like me (ie 'Christians' or 'Christ-followers') take the New Testament very seriously, and definitely do not "reject" it. I also strongly believe in the need for all members of a specific Christian community to respect, honour, and adhere to the guidance of the pastoral leadership/ elders of that community. I think this is generally understood and practiced by believer
  13. Having read this thread so far, I'm hoping it's okay for me to chime in my with my thoughts and comments from my own perspective (which is very similar to that of Navidad). I too am a non-LDS Christian with a very wide background of Christian ministry and experience (now part of a Mennonite church community), who believes that eternal life is equally available for anyone, irrespective of church affiliation, as Jesus alone sees and has the ultimate authority to judge our hearts. I hear the protestations from LDS folk that they are not exclusive, and yet I believe you are, as I understand
  14. I thought it may be helpful to include here a few paragraphs from the Articles of Faith and Doctrine of the church denomination I currently attend and serve (Brethren in Christ) as a means of supporting what Navidad has written about how Protestants in general view the church as a community of believers. While this description is of a congregation ... a visible community assembling and sharing life together ... such a congregation is only one part of the vast wider Body of Christ, consisting of all individuals who have made personal commitment of faith to Jesus Christ as Saviour and Lord (as
  15. Navidad, as a fellow non-LDS Christian, I can see how thoughtfully and carefully you constructed your list of essentials, and I agree with everything you've said here. For a bit of context about myself, I am not a resident nor a citizen of The United States. I have extensive theological education, have been part of an interdenominational, international Missions organization for over three decades (including 15 years as a missionary in Africa), and have spent many years in church leadership and ministry in the Western world. (What I really mean to say here is that I've been around C
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