Law Of Chastity And Same-Sex Behavior

[ALarson]

 I said that you and I both know homosexusl behavior is a sin and that the Spirit is withdrawn from the relationship part of asking for help in your sinful relationship.

It's extremely presumptuous of you to state conclusively what someone else knows.

 

It appears that even within the state of Utah, your views are no longer held by many.  Here's a link to poll results conducted by Survey USA and published today:

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/news/57391605-78/marriage-sex-percent-state.html.csp

 

I believe the numbers will just continue to grow regarding those who favor civil unions and marriages for gays.

 

As evidence, here's another interesting poll where this was found:

"Last week I released a poll about support for marriage equality in Utah to update a two-year-old study from BYU that has frequently been used as a proof point countering Judge Shelby’s ruling on Amendment 3 in Utah. The first poll found that in two year’s time, 13% of Utahns switched their opinions from only supporting civil unions to supporting full civil marriage equality.

 

Given a choice between civil marriage equality and no legal recognition for LGBT couples, 51.3% of Utahns support full civil marriage equality and 43.7% oppose."

http://blog.davidbbaker.com/2014/01/breaking-majority-of-utahns-support-gay-marriage-new-poll-confirms/

[Ahab]

It's extremely presumptuous of you to state conclusively what someone else knows.

It appears that even within the state of Utah, your views are no longer held by many. Here's a link to poll results conducted by Survey USA and published today:

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/news/57391605-78/marriage-sex-percent-state.html.csp

I believe the numbers will just continue to grow regarding those who favor civil unions and marriages for gays.

As evidence, here's another interesting poll where this was found:

"Last week I released a poll about support for marriage equality in Utah to update a two-year-old study from BYU that has frequently been used as a proof point countering Judge Shelby’s ruling on Amendment 3 in Utah. The first poll found that in two year’s time, 13% of Utahns switched their opinions from only supporting civil unions to supporting full civil marriage equality.

Given a choice between civil marriage equality and no legal recognition for LGBT couples, 51.3% of Utahns support full civil marriage equality and 43.7% oppose."

http://blog.davidbbaker.com/2014/01/breaking-majority-of-utahns-support-gay-marriage-new-poll-confirms/

Polls don't determine whether something is good or evil. Even if the majority of Americans voted to say same sex marriages are good they still would not be good. And the Holy Spirit of God will never condone what is evil.

[Rob Osborn]

It's extremely presumptuous of you to state conclusively what someone else knows.

 

It appears that even within the state of Utah, your views are no longer held by many.  Here's a link to poll results conducted by Survey USA and published today:

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/news/57391605-78/marriage-sex-percent-state.html.csp

 

I believe the numbers will just continue to grow regarding those who favor civil unions and marriages for gays.

 

As evidence, here's another interesting poll where this was found:

"Last week I released a poll about support for marriage equality in Utah to update a two-year-old study from BYU that has frequently been used as a proof point countering Judge Shelby’s ruling on Amendment 3 in Utah. The first poll found that in two year’s time, 13% of Utahns switched their opinions from only supporting civil unions to supporting full civil marriage equality.

 

Given a choice between civil marriage equality and no legal recognition for LGBT couples, 51.3% of Utahns support full civil marriage equality and 43.7% oppose."

http://blog.davidbbaker.com/2014/01/breaking-majority-of-utahns-support-gay-marriage-new-poll-confirms/

But Californiaboy knows that homosexual behavior is a sin, he has stated such. He is arguing for same sex marriage as a justification so that his behavior will no longer be sinful.

[MichelleD]

Polls don't determine whether something is good or evil. Even if the majority of Americans voted to say same sex marriages are good they still would not be good. And the Holy Spirit of God will never condone what is evil.

My feelings are that these polls are revealing that most people now know or have family members who are gay. Gay people have much more courage and encouragement to be more open about their SSA, so more people (and members of the church) have discarded the old stereo types as they've learned how good most gay people are. They are changing their views and wanting happiness for them just as they are able to enjoy happiness in committed relationships and marriages.

These polls are reflecting this and I think that's wonderful.

[Rob Osborn]

I'm with you, Rob, but it's not only about having sexual relations outside of marriage or being immersed in pornography so much as it is not knowing what a wholesome sexual relationship with another person really is. They think they know, but they don't. They think their alternative lifestyle is a good thing, but it isn't. And they think others should condone and approve of their lifestyle as just another way to express their sexual impulses, and even though more and more people in this world are now agreeing with them or at least supporting them by agreeing that what they are doing is okay and acceptable it never id going to be a good thing. Legal, but not good, and it's not even good that it's legal.

There is something definately true about what you are saying that I hadn't thought much about. Before I was married I went out with a girl who for a long time I thought I wanted to marry. At the time I didn't realize what a "wholesome sexual relationship" really was all about. I sinned against what I knew was wrong being driven by passion instead of true wholesome love- the love that the Holy Spirit seals his approval on. I repented of my carnal ways to my bishop and found happiness years later inside of marriage where I now truly enjoy a wholesome sexual relationship with my wife. And I have found that it isn't now about just passion and attraction to sex but something more- something wholesome and pure that I was missing before. I now look at intimacey as a part of my spiritualness and connection with my spouse in honor, purity and peace. And, the blessing now is that I feel the Holy Spirit of promise approves of my behavior within the bonds of marriage. There is a certain peace there that is joyous beyond measure. I truly feel that no homosexual relationship, married or not, can have this same blessing by God.

Edited January 14, 2014 by Rob Osborn

[Danzo]

My feelings are that these polls are revealing that most people now know or have family members who are gay. Gay people have much more courage and encouragement to be more open about their SSA, so more people (and members of the church) have discarded the old stereo types as they've learned how good most gay people are. They are changing their views and wanting happiness for them just as they are able to enjoy happiness in committed relationships and marriages.

These polls are reflecting this and I think that's wonderful.

 

That is odd.

Everyone that I have had a chance to know that were gay were pretty messed up, but my experience is fairly limited (the subject of sexuality just doesn't come up often in polite conversation)

[Rob Osborn]

My feelings are that these polls are revealing that most people now know or have family members who are gay. Gay people have much more courage and encouragement to be more open about their SSA, so more people (and members of the church) have discarded the old stereo types as they've learned how good most gay people are. They are changing their views and wanting happiness for them just as they are able to enjoy happiness in committed relationships and marriages.

These polls are reflecting this and I think that's wonderful.

I see a true genuine shift to be more accepting of the gay community but its in the details that matter. What is it we are accepting? Thats what troubles me. I do support the Church in their openly coming out in support and affection to help those with same gender attraction and those who act upon it. But, at the same time their stance towards the "behavior" part, including marriage has been anything but accepting. And for that I praise the church!

[Rob Osborn]

That is odd.

Everyone that I have had a chance to know that were gay were pretty messed up, but my experience is fairly limited (the subject of sexuality just doesn't come up often in polite conversation)

Every single gay person I know had troubles growing up, came from broken families, spent a lot of time away from their fathers, etc. I do feel that gay people can and do come from good homes but for the most part I feel that homosexuals who are active sexually come from backgrounds that were messed up.

[ALarson]

My feelings are that these polls are revealing that most people now know or have family members who are gay. Gay people have much more courage and encouragement to be more open about their SSA, so more people (and members of the church) have discarded the old stereo types as they've learned how good most gay people are. They are changing their views and wanting happiness for them just as they are able to enjoy happiness in committed relationships and marriages.

These polls are reflecting this and I think that's wonderful.

I agree.  My experience with family members who are gay (and I also work with a few) is that they are some of the finest people I know.

I'm not doubting that others may have experienced something different in their associations and observations.  But the same could be said of heterosexual people you know or are related to as well.  I hate any generalizations of any group of people.

I think these polls are encouraging especially considering they were done in Utah.

[Rock_N_Roll]

Rob O - I'm not sure who these gay people are you know, but my experience is just the opposite.  My gay family members did not have trouble growing up, did not come from broken families and had very loving fathers who did not spend long periods of time away.  And to echo what ALarson said; these gay people are some of the finest people I know. \

 

PS.  Does anyone know why I cannot quote other posts?  I click the post button, but that does nothing.

 

Thanks

[NEDRA]

I know at least four gay men whose fathers or grandfathers were general authorities. Very loving homes.

[Rob Osborn]

Rob O - I'm not sure who these gay people are you know, but my experience is just the opposite.  My gay family members did not have trouble growing up, did not come from broken families and had very loving fathers who did not spend long periods of time away.  And to echo what ALarson said; these gay people are some of the finest people I know. \

 

PS.  Does anyone know why I cannot quote other posts?  I click the post button, but that does nothing.

 

Thanks

So, are you just making a point that gay people are some of the finest people you know coming from the best of homes or what?

 

I know that homosexuals are more likely to come from unstable or broken family realtionships rather than from good happy stable families with both a Father and Mother active in their childrens development. I testify to that truth in the name of Jesus Christ.

[Ahab]

There is something definately true about what you are saying that I hadn't thought much about. Before I was married I went out with a girl who for a long time I thought I wanted to marry. At the time I didn't realize what a "wholesome sexual relationship" really was all about. I sinned against what I knew was wrong being driven by passion instead of true wholesome love- the love that the Holy Spirit seals his approval on. I repented of my carnal ways to my bishop and found happiness years later inside of marriage where I now truly enjoy a wholesome sexual relationship with my wife. And I have found that it isn't now about just passion and attraction to sex but something more- something wholesome and pure that I was missing before. I now look at intimacey as a part of my spiritualness and connection with my spouse in honor, purity and peace. And, the blessing now is that I feel the Holy Spirit of promise approves of my behavior within the bonds of marriage. There is a certain peace there that is joyous beyond measure. I truly feel that no homosexual relationship, married or not, can have this same blessing by God.

Good, I'm glad to see that you understand what I'm talking about.

Now let's focus on helping others to see what they're missing when they do not know what a wholesome sexual relationship is, even though some may think they have it through any type of sexual relationship that is not wholesome, including same sex marriage.

Edited January 14, 2014 by Ahab

[ALarson]

So, are you just making a point that gay people are some of the finest people you know coming from the best of homes or what?

 

I know that homosexuals are more likely to come from unstable or broken family realtionships rather than from good happy stable families with both a Father and Mother active in their childrens development. I testify to that truth in the name of Jesus Christ.

And, how do you know this?  And, bearing your testimony of this?  I'm starting to believe that you are writing your posts as spoofs as you can't be serious.

 

ALL the people I know who are gay come from very good homes where they received much love.  None of the homes are broken homes.  The ones that are family members (some close and some extended) also all came from very wonderful homes.

Again, I'm sure that some gays come from broken homes but then so do some heterosexuals.  Also, some gays were abused but then so have some heterosexuals been abused. You seem to be trying very hard to reassure yourself that gays are not born gay.  I know that more and more proof is coming out supporting the fact that the great majority with SSA were born with that attraction. Also more and more people are becoming convinced of this and believe it's the truth.  If you would ever actually discuss it openly with anyone who's gay, I'm sure they'll tell you the same thing.  

Edited January 14, 2014 by ALarson

[Ahab]

It doesn't really matter where the unwholesome sexual urges come from. The point is that we should resist unwholesome urges and instead develop wholesome relationships with the people we love. And it is not good, or wholesome, for anyone to have sexual relations with someone of the same sex, or to do anything else that is not good.

[Skylla]

This thread has become too personal.

 

Skylla