Stargazer Posted January 3, 2014 Posted January 3, 2014 Perhaps you may remember the little flap earlier this week about Mitt Romney's adopted grandchild and the denizens of the Melissa Hart Perry show mocking the family Christmas photo with all of the Romney's grandchildren. In case you missed it, here it is: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T8o_Znziy4I Now, Perry has since apologized for her remarks, and so on, but my question is just tangentially related to it. This morning on the way to work I was listening to a local talk show on KTTH in Seattle, and since the conservative talk show host Michael Medved is based on that station, he regularly pitches in on the David Boze local show in the morning. They were discussing this Melissa Hart Perry episode, and Medved spoke up favorably about Mormons in general, and happened to note that the fastest growth of the LDS church is occurring in West Africa -- I suppose he said this as a kind of counterpoint to the expressed racism evident in the Perry show segment. Now, WITHOUT going into the Perry show segment in question (this is being addressed in other quarters so we needn't jump in here), are Michael Medved's remarks about the growth of the Church in West Africa accurate, or is he incorrect on this?
Duncan Posted January 3, 2014 Posted January 3, 2014 yes, http://ldschurchgrowth.blogspot.ca/2013/12/top-five-encouraging-lds-missionary-and.html i know here in Canada they are stuffing missionaries into our wards and frankly there are too many missionaries here, wish they would send them to high growth areas
why me Posted January 3, 2014 Posted January 3, 2014 It seems that it is true. This should not surprise. For those of us who defend the lds on the internet we seem led to believe by exmormons and critics that the church is losing members by droves and droves. Not exactly true. I remember when the ban was lifted the holy ghost was very active and many african americans were joining the church. For example this appeared in the ensign at the time: The reaction of different Church members varied, as one might expect. Some called the bishop and expressed concern. Others asked questions. Generally, however, they wanted to accept the will of the Lord and do what was right. A member of the high council summed up the attitudes of many when he said, “I have lived in the South all of my life. I’ve held prejudices. Now the Prophet and the Lord have asked me to change my views and practices. I’ll certainly go along with it, support it, and sustain it.” He spent his family home evening talking with his family about how they could follow the intent of the Lord’s manifestation. Two weeks later things began to happen—The meetinghouse for the Albany, Georgia, First and Second Wards was dedicated. Among the many nonmembers attending the dedicatory services was Alice Moultrie, a friend from work who had responded to our invitation to attend. “It was a wonderful meeting,” Alice reflected the next day at work. “The people were so friendly. Even though I was just about the only black person there, I felt right at home. I feel something drawing me there.” That something, of course, was the Holy Ghost. In the ensuing weeks as Alice was taught by the missionaries and the members, she received many powerful manifestations from the Holy Spirit regarding the truthfulness of the gospel. She accepted the baptismal challenge and the day finally came when she was led by the hand into the waters of baptism. As she took her place in the baptismal font, her eyes grew wide and she exclaimed softly, “So this is the baptismal font!” The meaning of her comment was not understood by others until after the meeting had concluded. “I had seen that font before in a type of vision,” she shared with us later. “I saw myself in the water and every other detail of the font’s interior exactly as it is. When I stood in the water and looked up, I realized the Lord had shown me my baptism before it happened.” Soon after her baptism Alice was called to be the secretary of the ward Sunday School organization. More recently, because of her warm spirit and her burning testimony, she has been called to be a stake missionary. Although she was the first black convert in our ward, she did not have the distinction very long of being the only black member. In the twelve months following Alice’s baptism in late August of 1978, some forty black brothers and sisters were baptized in the Albany area—and their numbers have continued to grow. A heavy outpouring of the Spirit has accompanied each conversion. Here are some examples: 1. Herbert and Mildred Samuels were baptized just a few weeks after Alice Moultrie. The first black elder to be ordained in the Albany First Ward, he became a dynamic stake missionary with an intense love for others. Sister Samuels is a counselor in the Primary and adds much to the ward with her gifted soprano voice. Their temple marriage took on added significance when Brother Samuels died in a tragic car accident in the summer of 1980. 2. Mark and Ada Clark’s conversion to the Church was especially significant to us since he, like Alice Moultrie, was a colleague at work. He had impressed us for some time as being an “unbaptized Mormon,” but procrastination had prevented us from asking him the golden questions. Success often creates boldness, however; and in the light of the missionary success our ward was having, the approach to Mark was rather blunt. “Mark, you need to learn more about the Mormon church!” Because of the friendship we shared he was not offended, and he agreed to meet with one of us in our home to receive the missionary discussions. Within two weeks, it was apparent Mark and Ada would be baptized. They were doing all the right things. Their questions in the discussion were thoughtful and spirited. They prayed often about the message of the gospel. They studied the Book of Mormon and the pamphlets they received and struggled until they understood what they had read. After meeting with them and the missionaries for the third discussion, we received a strong impression that 11 January 1979 (the date they had been preparing for since the first meeting) was indeed to be the night of their baptism. When Satan began placing obstacles in the Clarks’ path that final week, it would have been easy to have given in to their request to “hold off on the baptism for a little while.” But the Spirit prompted us to hold firm, and so we did. We both went to visit with Mark just two hours before his scheduled baptism to bear our witness and to answer his questions. The Spirit was very strong as we all knelt to pray. Following prayer, Mark rose to his feet and asked simply, “What do we need to bring for tonight?” Later that evening he and his wife were baptized. Subsequently they, too, have been sealed in the temple. Mark is presently elders quorum president in Green Bay, Wisconsin. 3. Jim and Lawanda Coston joined the Church after being friendshipped and after receiving the discussions in the home of a recent convert in the ward. After baptism, Jim commented that he had lost the desire to engage in his usual social activities. His family had taken on added significance and he desired to spend the majority of his time with them. In time, Jim was called to be a counselor in the elders quorum presidency, and Lawanda was called to serve with the Young Women. Then, early this year, Jim was presented to be one of the counselors in the bishopric. Such outpourings of the Spirit have brought new excitement to the Church in the Albany area, and our love for one another has increased. One member, who had admitted earlier that he was finding it difficult to accept the impact of the revelation, remarked how the Spirit had influenced him while helping the missionaries teach a black family. “I felt the Spirit very strongly,” he said. “My eyes were opened. I know now how badly the Lord wants all of his children to be a part of his Church.” His words had a familiar ring of the Apostle Peter after teaching Cornelius’s household: “While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word. “And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost. “For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter, “Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?” (Acts 10:44–47.) As time progressed and black brothers and sisters have entered the Church, we have learned that an increased capacity to love does not come about by sermons from the pulpit or through directives in a priesthood quorum. It comes as a result of serving together, in such activities as pulling corn on the welfare farm, jointly teaching with the missionaries, sacrificing together to make a Church activity just a bit better, or just being friends. The Saints in Albany have experienced something akin to what Peter and Cornelius experienced, and we feel strongly that our latter-day prophet is repeating the message found in the tenth chapter of Acts [Acts 10], namely: 1. There are many righteous persons on the face of the earth who have not had the gospel preached to them. 2. Many such individuals have been spiritually prepared, or are being spiritually prepared, for the messengers who will bring the glad tidings of the restoration of the gospel. 3. A revelation from God has come to the Lord’s anointed spokesman declaring that the fulness of the gospel should now be taken to people who previously (according to the Lord’s timetable) had not been included in full proselyting activities. 4. Members of the Church must overcome any prejudices and cultural patterns we might have in order to extend a true hand of friendship and fellowship to all individuals of all races, cultures, and tongues. 5. Rapid growth, far greater than that seen in past years, will accompany the Church as we follow the will of the Lord. Because of our experiences in Georgia, we have felt the Spirit of the Lord in abundance. The formula is sweet but well known: in inviting our brothers and sisters to join us in the gospel fold, we’ve found ourselves entering anew. http://www.lds.org/l...a____&hideNav=1 How to rationalize such manifestations of the spirit that occurred after the ban was lifted? I don't think that revisionism works in this case. Were the members both black and white suffering from delusion? Was the Holy Ghost wrong? I do believe that we are seeing the same now in africa. 1
omni Posted January 3, 2014 Posted January 3, 2014 I've heard this too and in fact I've heard the retention rate is much greater in Africa. Which makes on wonder why we continue to have 50 missions in Europe and Japan which are experiencing anemic growth and only 27 in Africa with is experiencing rapid growth.
thesometimesaint Posted January 3, 2014 Posted January 3, 2014 Perhaps you may remember the little flap earlier this week about Mitt Romney's adopted grandchild and the denizens of the Melissa Hart Perry show mocking the family Christmas photo with all of the Romney's grandchildren. In case you missed it, here it is: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T8o_Znziy4I Now, Perry has since apologized for her remarks, and so on, but my question is just tangentially related to it. This morning on the way to work I was listening to a local talk show on KTTH in Seattle, and since the conservative talk show host Michael Medved is based on that station, he regularly pitches in on the David Boze local show in the morning. They were discussing this Melissa Hart Perry episode, and Medved spoke up favorably about Mormons in general, and happened to note that the fastest growth of the LDS church is occurring in West Africa -- I suppose he said this as a kind of counterpoint to the expressed racism evident in the Perry show segment. Now, WITHOUT going into the Perry show segment in question (this is being addressed in other quarters so we needn't jump in here), are Michael Medved's remarks about the growth of the Church in West Africa accurate, or is he incorrect on this? West Africa is bigger than the US and some areas are still too dangerous for us to go to. But overall we're doing quite well in sub-Saharan Africa 1
halconero Posted January 3, 2014 Posted January 3, 2014 I dated a girl from Ghana for a while who told me that her area in West Africa was a mini Utah. 1
Bill “Papa” Lee Posted January 3, 2014 Posted January 3, 2014 yes, http://ldschurchgrowth.blogspot.ca/2013/12/top-five-encouraging-lds-missionary-and.html i know here in Canada they are stuffing missionaries into our wards and frankly there are too many missionaries here, wish they would send them to high growth areasI think the change in age is causing a lot of growing pains we were not ready for as well as a lot of free time for new missionaries.
cdowis Posted January 3, 2014 Posted January 3, 2014 I've heard this too and in fact I've heard the retention rate is much greater in Africa. Which makes on wonder why we continue to have 50 missions in Europe and Japan which are experiencing anemic growth and only 27 in Africa with is experiencing rapid growth. I'm sure the church knows what it's doing. The problem with high growth is that the lack of sufficient leadership, and the church has learned to let it grow at a natural pace. I think they learned their lesson with Chile.
EllenMaksoud Posted January 3, 2014 Posted January 3, 2014 I've heard this too and in fact I've heard the retention rate is much greater in Africa. Which makes on wonder why we continue to have 50 missions in Europe and Japan which are experiencing anemic growth and only 27 in Africa with is experiencing rapid growth.Parts of Africa are really dangerous because of the incursion of radical islamics who don't hesitate at all to behead the kafr (unbeliever). Even in Kenya around Nyeri and Nanuki where I was, the Christians are very Evangelical and active, but the Muslims are present. This would not be an issue but wahabbists from Saudi Arabia seem to have plenty of money. And Islamics have a big stake in Africa, having been there a very long time. It will be interesting to see how this develops.
readstoomuch Posted January 4, 2014 Posted January 4, 2014 I am happy for growth that is sincere and takes root. In the NW we have a missionary set in each ward with small boundaries. They do have time on other hands. If their mindset could be opened to more service they could fill the time. Unfortunately they pine away in their apartment or whatever feeling like failures because there is not enough people to teach. They have to baptize and if they aren't they are failing. How about this-their mission is to help people feel the Holy Spirit and help to create a Zion community where they are?
why me Posted January 4, 2014 Posted January 4, 2014 (edited) I am happy for growth that is sincere and takes root. In the NW we have a missionary set in each ward with small boundaries. They do have time on other hands. If their mindset could be opened to more service they could fill the time. Unfortunately they pine away in their apartment or whatever feeling like failures because there is not enough people to teach. They have to baptize and if they aren't they are failing. How about this-their mission is to help people feel the Holy Spirit and help to create a Zion community where they are?You can play a part in helping them serve. Missionaries know that their missionary service does involve service. Find ways and means to help them serve. I am sure that ward members both young and old need help. You can talk to a local soup kitchen and ask them if they need volunteers etc. Sometimes these young missionaries need a helping hand too in reaching out. Also, I doubt that the missionaries are pining away in their apartment. Even if their meeting book is empty they know that they need to be outside meeting people on the streets, buses, etc. I have two daughters who served missions and so I know what I am speaking of. If these missionaries are home all day doing nothing, they may have a problem. Maybe you can talk with them. Edited January 4, 2014 by why me
Stargazer Posted January 4, 2014 Author Posted January 4, 2014 (edited) I'm sure the church knows what it's doing. The problem with high growth is that the lack of sufficient leadership, and the church has learned to let it grow at a natural pace. I think they learned their lesson with Chile. The leader of one of the first missionary teams called to go to Nigeria, Rendell Mabey, wrote a book about their experiences, titled "Brother to Brother", and described having to put the brakes from time to time on the baptismal rate there because their weren't enough experienced and reliable leaders to handle the load. Now that is a great book to read, if one is interested in the reception that the Church received when missionaries were first sent to black Africa. They had to deal with long lines at the baptismal ponds, multiple non-SLC-recognized LDS congregations (and even districts) who were begging them to come to them to baptize their hundreds of members, and so on. Unfortunately, "Brother to Brother" has been out of print for a long time, and even its sequel, "An African Legacy" is out of print. There's very limited availability for both books. There is an interesting article on part of Mabey's mission in Africa, the first meeting with Anthony Obinna: You Have Come At Last When the first LDS missionaries arrived in Nigeria in 1978, there was very little need for proselytizing. For more than thirty years, Nigerians who had encountered the Church in one way or another had been writing Salt Lake City requesting literature and missionaries. When those missionaries came, they found multiple congregations eager to be baptized virtually the day they arrived. Anthony Obinna had been writing Church headquarters for several years by the time Rendell and Rachel Mabey and Edwin and Janath Cannon sought him out a week after their arrival in Nigeria in November 1978. The two senior missionary couples set off in a cab from Port Harcourt with only a general idea of their destination. Like many in Nigeria, Obinna lived in a numberless house on a nameless street, but the missionaries knew his village, county, and state from the letters he had written. After a three-hour ride including several stops to ask for help, they turned down a road lined with banana and palm trees that ended at a small church. “Near the roof in blue letters were painted the words, ‘Nigerian Latter-Day Saints,’” Rendell Mabey later wrote. He found one set of doors labelled LDS and another labelled Missionary Home. "It was a curious experience encountering the name of our own church," wrote Mabey, "where no missionary had ever before set foot.” The missionaries found the area filled with people, but not Obinna. Upon learning who their visitors were, Obinna’s son went in search of his father while the missionaries explored the church. The Mabeys admired the small chapel with its neat blue door and shutters, then explored the classroom which doubled as an office in the other half of the building. In the classroom, the program for the next day's services were already carefully written up on a blackboard. A copy of the Doctrine and Covenants and several copies of the Book of Mormon were available for student use, and shelves were stacked with old issues of the Ensign and Church News. It took a couple of hours for Obinna, who had built up this place over thirteen years of waiting, to arrive and finally shake hands with someone prepared to bring him the LDS Church in full. An Astonishing Discovery More than a decade earlier, Obinna had a dream in which a man appeared to him and took him to a beautiful building he had never seen before. Obinna was taken inside and shown everything there. Later, the same dream came again. Then, a few years later, during the Nigerian civil war, Obinna was confined to his home for safety. He picked up an old copy of Reader’s Digest and was stunned to see the very building from his dream as the centerpiece of an article about the LDS Church. “I had never before heard the word Mormons,” Obinna wrote. “From the time I finished reading the story, I had no rest of mind any longer. My whole attention was focused on my new discovery. I rushed out immediately to tell my brothers, who were all amazed and astonished to hear the story.”2 It would be another year before the political situation in Nigeria allowed Obinna to get a letter out to the headquarters of the Church, so it wasn’t until 1971 that Obinna wrote Salt Lake for instructions. He received several pamphlets and a Book of Mormon, but was told the Church was not organized in Nigeria and that, as of that time, there were not yet plans to do so. “I was totally disappointed,” Obinna recalled, “but the Holy Spirit moved me to continue writing. Many a time in dreams I saw some of the missionaries of the Church discussing matters about the Church.” He continued to write, and while his patience was sometimes tried, he didn’t give up on the testimony that had been kindled inside him. “We are not disencouraged anyhow but shall continue to pursue the practice of our faith which we have found to be true,” he wrote in 1976 in response to another letter urging Obinna to do the best he could on his own for the time being. “We are very optimistic that Our Lord Jesus Christ will make it possible in future for the Church to take more direct action. We are well aware that our faith is being tried. We are doing everything we can to establish the truth among so many of Our Heavenly Father’s children in this part of the world.” Indeed, Obinna taught the gospel to his family and had amassed a congregation of seventy-one members by the time the Mabeys and Cannons arrived five months after President Spencer W. Kimball announced a revelation removing the priesthood restriction that had long been an impediment to missionary work in West Africa. Patience Rewarded When Anthony Obinna arrived to greet the missionaries on that November day in 1978, his demeanor was serious, even thoughtful. Elder Mabey was struck by how “solemn, gentle, and dignified" Obinna was as he entered the small church, “as though an overt display of enthusiasm at such a moment might be almost sacrilegious. Our eyes, however, were moist. We all felt movingly the richness of God’s Spirit.”4 Said Obinna, “It has been a long, difficult wait, but that doesn’t matter now. You have come at last.” Yet even Obinna’s patience had its limits; when Mabey told him there were other congregations the missionaries needed to visit and estimated that it would be six weeks before they could return to perform baptisms, Obinna’s waiting was done. “’No, please,’ he said quietly,” Mabey later wrote. “‘I know that there are many others, but we have been waiting for thirteen years.’ His eyes were filled with longing. ‘Please, if it is humanly possible—go ahead with the baptisms now!’ For a few seconds we merely sat there looking into each other’s eyes. ‘Are most of your people ready?’ I asked at last. Anthony nodded emphatically. ‘Yes—absolutely yes! They know, as I do, that the gospel has been restored, but we must have guidance and direction. Let us baptize those strongest in the faith now and teach the others further.’ The Spirit was very strong, the man’s goodness and testimony clearly evident. ‘In that case,’ I said, ‘we will conduct the baptism as soon as possible.’” The men decided on a date just three days away, and on Tuesday, November 21, 1978, nineteen Nigerians were baptized in the Ekeonumiri River. Anthony Obinna was first. A branch was soon organized for the new converts, with Anthony Obinna as its president, his brothers Francis and Raymond as his counselors, and his wife, Fidelia, as Relief Society president. After many years of waiting and hoping, Obinna penned a different sort of letter to Salt Lake soon after his baptism. “The entire members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints in this part of Nigeria have the pleasure to thank you and the Latter Day Saints throughout the world for opening the door for the Gospel to come to our people in its fullness,” he wrote. “We are happy for the many hours in the Upper Room of the Temple you spent supplicating the Lord to bring us into the fold. We thank our Heavenly Father for hearing your prayers and ours and by revelation has confirmed the long promised day, and has granted the holy priesthood to us, with the power to exercise its divine authority and enjoy every blessings of the temple. … There is no doubt that the Church here will grow and become a mighty centre for the Saints and bring progress enough to the people of Nigeria as it is doing all over the world.” Obinna served faithfully in the Church for many years, and in 1989 was sealed to Fidelia in the temple during a visit to Logan, Utah, where their son was living. Obinna died in 1995, leaving a legacy that was not limited to the dozens of family members to whom he had brought the gospel. “The seed of the gospel which you sowed will grow into a giant tree,” he wrote to Rendell Mabey when his time in Nigeria was nearing its end. “The Church in Nigeria will surprise the world in its growth. The number of baptisms, confirmations, and ordinations you performed in this country show only a beginning.” Edited January 4, 2014 by Stargazer 2
firepatch36 Posted January 5, 2014 Posted January 5, 2014 This is tangentially related, but I found this story to be fascinating and only heard of it a couple of days ago. My father named me Muhammad after the prophet of Islam. He expected me to emerge as a leader among clerics, capable of leading a jihad, or holy struggle, to convert nonbelievers to Islam throughout our entire Nigerian homeland. And though I spent more than two decades striving to fulfill his dream for me, my life took an unexpected turn when I found the gospel of Jesus Christ and joined the LDS Church—a decision that would cost me my family and my freedom.
Stargazer Posted January 6, 2014 Author Posted January 6, 2014 This is tangentially related, but I found this story to be fascinating and only heard of it a couple of days ago. Wow! That is just so cool. Thanks for posting -- I gotta get this book.
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