Can I Support Marijuana Legalization Without Violating The Word Of Wisdom?

[Duncan]

That's actually another reason to make it legal. If you're buying it at a store, you have better quality control--usually.

I have a joke but I fear of getting the boot! haha!

[Kemara]

that's if you buy from a store but if you grow your own or buy from a farmer or something. I am not addicted to apples and I have never heard of apple addiction

So then its not really about the government in effect paying for us to have the problem, and its notreally about options because anyone can grow their own cannabis just as easily as anyone can grow apples, its really about cannabis being addictive. Legal medications are addictive, meat is addictive, sex is addictive, nicotene is addictive, alcohol is addictive, fast food is addictive.

P.S. Buying from a farmer is pretty much the same as buying from a store, its not the store that uses atrazine its the farmer.

[Duncan]

So then its not really about the government in effect paying for us to have the problem, and its notreally about options because anyone can grow their own cannabis just as easily as anyone can grow apples, its really about cannabis being addictive. Legal medications are addictive, meat is addictive, sex is addictive, nicotene is addictive, alcohol is addictive, fast food is addictive.

P.S. Buying from a farmer is pretty much the same as buying from a store, its not the store that uses atrazine its the farmer.

that's good then because I don't buy from a farmer , just from Safeway-if that bothers you

Edited November 28, 2012 by Duncan

[Kemara]

that's good then because I don't buy from a farmer , just from Safeway-if that bothers you

Safeway gets them from the farmer.

[Duncan]

Safeway gets them from the farmer.

I have been eating apples my whole life and I am not dead nor sick or anything, I don't get what the issue is with atrazine

Edited November 28, 2012 by Duncan

[slamarwi]

First of all, the answer to this discussion is no. Supporting a concept does not necessarily mean that you consume and/or abuse the substance and therefore the word of wisdom.

With that out of the way, support doesn't show very good judgement either. (I apologize in advance for the studies referenced on this post but I believe they are necessary to dispel some of the myths being perpetuated.)

There are several misconceptions about marijuana use in this discussion that I would like to shed some light on.

First, smoking marijuana is deleterious to one's health, period. There may be some beneficial side effects such as lessened interoccular pressure or nausea suppression but that does not inhibit lung and tissue toxicity along with the potentially detrimental brain disorders that can frequently occur among chronic marijuana users.

Adolescent bullying,

cannabis

use and emerging psychotic experiences: a longitudinal general population study.

http://psychcentral.com/lib/2012/cannabis-may-cause-schizophrenia-like-brain-changes/

Impulsivity, attention, memory, and decision-making among adolescent

marijuana

users.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23138434

Chronic toxicology of cannabis

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19586351

Second, there are ways of using various cannabinoids in tablet or capsule form similar to other prescription medications, and are much more dose appropriate (if marijuana happens to be your drug of choice and you are truly interested in legalization).

Third, marijuana in the year 2012 is not the marijuana of 1972. Depending upon the chemotype, and methods used in growing, processing and ingesting, the THC (active constituent) content of cannabis can be very significant. Though there is some controversy concerning THC levels, a quote from the Medical Marijuana journal states:

"The national average of marijuana's THC content in 1978 was 1.37%, in 1988 it was 3.59%, in 1998 4.43%, and in 2008 8.49%" This publication is a relatively unbiased source and helps us understand potency differences and potential physiological activity.

Fourth, whether you call it dependence or addiction, cannabis creates withdrawal symptoms . I have cited one study but there are dozens of additional references. I think the fact that there is so much opposition to this claim among users, actually helps substantiate and validate this notion.

Quantifying the clinical significance of cannabis withdrawal. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23049760

Fifth making drugs more widely available does not reduce the incidence of use. Most often, the increased presence of a substance (service etc.) provides validity and acceptance to the population at large - especially the youth.

Sixth the judicial and penal systems of the US are ill-equipped to deal with the problem of drug use /abuse and reform is absolutely warranted.

I don't have all the answers. I do know that alcohol and tobacco use are generally evil, many pharmaceuticals are regularly abused and the human race will always find ways to self-medicate and recreate. It is our responsibility to use the substances and technologies we've been given in an appropriate manner.

Condoning the recreational use of marijuana is not living up to that stewardship. That

is what the word of wisdom is all about.

h

et beste - lwiscombe

[slamarwi]

Sorry about the formatting in the post above - lwiscombe

[Kemara]

I have been eating apples my whole life and I am not dead nor sick or anything, I don't get what the issue is with atrazine

As I said previously you have no idea what your dealer is doing with your apples and despite your claim you have no idea the health impacts it is having on you and the same applies to almost all the food you eat and maybe even the water you drink. Again, I dont see the logical consistency of your position.

[Duncan]

As I said previously you have no idea what your dealer is doing with your apples and despite your claim you have no idea the health impacts it is having on you and the same applies to almost all the food you eat and maybe even the water you drink. Again, I dont see the logical consistency of your position.

you brought up atrazine and apples aren't addictive so I don't see what that point was about. Don't do drugs is my whole argument!!

[ERayR]

Its already happening, should we make those things illegal?

Yes, no need to condone it.

[ERayR]

So then its not really about the government in effect paying for us to have the problem, its about the lack of options. Do you eat apples? Believe me you dont know what your dealer did to those apples and you get what you get. Do you know what atrazine is?

Wash them before eating them.

[rpn]

In the 1920's Utah had legislation on the ballot about alcohol that church leaders, from the pulpit urged members to reject. It passed and not by a hair. Of course you may oppose or support any laws that you feel consistent with the gospel of jesus christ and plan of salvation. The word of wisdom says nothing whatever about laws. Heck coffee and tea are legal, though banned by it.

[thesometimesaint]

There is a new petition on We the People, the feature on WhiteHouse.gov where people go to ask the President to let them quit being Americans. This particular petition, however, is not about that. It asks the Obama administration to decline prosecution of federal marijuana laws that conflict with State laws.

While there are other petitions related to the legalization of marijuana being circulated on the website, this one is unique in that it asks the President to take an action which he can do without relying on the Congress to act. If the Attorney General will decline to prosecute marijuana laws in States that have chosen to legalize it, then medical marijuana dispensaries in California, for instance, can re-open without the threat of asset forfeiture and criminal prosecution.

While I personally do not use marijuana, i truly believe that the enforcement of marijuana laws is more destructive to families and personal lives that the use of it ever will be. Do I violate the spirit of the Word of Wisdom, or any other value that I should have as a Latter-day Saint by authoring and urging support for a petition like this?

Please let your Facebook and Twitter friends know that they can support a petition like this and still be a faithful Latter-day Saint.

http://wh.gov/IdjJ

The Feds have legal marijuana available(but very rare). It's a bit of a sticky wicket for any President to say he won't faithfully execute the laws after taking an oath of office to do so. For Saints we do have an Article of Faith that states: We believe in being subject to kings, presidents, rulers, and magistrates, in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law. Functionally speaking we need to get Congress to change any Federal law we disagree with.

[BlueDreams]

First of all, the answer to this discussion is no. Supporting a concept does not necessarily mean that you consume and/or abuse the substance and therefore the word of wisdom.

With that out of the way, support doesn't show very good judgement either. (I apologize in advance for the studies referenced on this post but I believe they are necessary to dispel some of the myths being perpetuated.)

Slamarwi,

I personally am aware that the drug has health consequences. It's not about the health consequences for me. Yes marijuana is addictive and can have withdrawal symptoms, yes, it's changed, and yes it can have adverse effects. But the level isn't much different that of legal drugs like alcohol and cigarettes and in some ways is less severe. So here's a random drug that has similar effects to a number of legal recreational drugs but has a severe artificially created social detriment, entailing jailing and prosecution that is disproportionate to ethnic minorities and those economically disadvantaged (despite the fact that most users don't actually come from said cohort), little means to regulate its use, and a useless money-guzzling drug war. It's deciding between two cons. To me the cons about health are far smaller than the current social impact it has.

With luv,

BD

[ERayR]

The Feds have legal marijuana available(but very rare). It's a bit of a sticky wicket for any President to say he won't faithfully execute the laws after taking an oath of office to do so. For Saints we do have an Article of Faith that states: We believe in being subject to kings, presidents, rulers, and magistrates, in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law. Functionally speaking we need to get Congress to change any Federal law we disagree with.

And petitions are a way to get the attention of Congress. However, that doesn't mean all petitions are created equal

[thesometimesaint]

BlueDreams:

Marijuana isn't addictive. However I'll agree with the rest of your statements.

[thesometimesaint]

And petitions are a way to get the attention of Congress. However, that doesn't mean all petitions are created equal

True.

[ERayR]

Slamarwi,

I personally am aware that the drug has health consequences. It's not about the health consequences for me. Yes marijuana is addictive and can have withdrawal symptoms, yes, it's changed, and yes it can have adverse effects. But the level isn't much different that of legal drugs like alcohol and cigarettes and in some ways is less severe. So here's a random drug that has similar effects to a number of legal recreational drugs but has a severe artificially created social detriment, entailing jailing and prosecution that is disproportionate to ethnic minorities and those economically disadvantaged (despite the fact that most users don't actually come from said cohort), little means to regulate its use, and a useless money-guzzling drug war. It's deciding between two cons. To me the cons about health are far smaller than the current social impact it has.

With luv,

BD

If you are worried about the current social impact just wait until it is legalized and the stigmas of drug use are removed.

[ERayR]

BlueDreams:

Marijuana isn't addictive.

From personal observation I will have to disagree with that statement.

[Mark Beesley]

What are the benefits to using MJ that you can't get elsewhere? What is the point of doing MJ or any drug?

Only someone who has never used marijuana to get high would ask these questions.

[Mark Beesley]

The Feds have legal marijuana available(but very rare). It's a bit of a sticky wicket for any President to say he won't faithfully execute the laws after taking an oath of office to do so. For Saints we do have an Article of Faith that states: We believe in being subject to kings, presidents, rulers, and magistrates, in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law. Functionally speaking we need to get Congress to change any Federal law we disagree with.

The Executive branch regularly decides which laws to enforce and which ones not to enforce. The oath the President takes says,

i do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully execute the Office of President of the United States, and will to the best of my Ability,to preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States.

So, the oath is to execute the office of the Presidency, not execute the laws. The office of the Presidency, as the Executive branch, includes the prosecution of laws. The prosecution of laws includes the exercise of prosecutorial discretion, i.e. who to prosecute and for what. Prosecutors exercise that discretion all the time. There is nothing sticky about the President deciding not to prosecute Federal laws that conflict with State laws.

[DavidB]

El Presidente has already instructed the DEA and DOJ to not seek out marijuana prosecutions in states where the People have voted to legalize some use of marijuana. The only exception to seeking out prosecutions in these states, is when the DEA or DOJ suspects the marijuana distributor/facility/whathaveyou is in violation of that particular states laws.

[Mark Beesley]

El Presidente has already instructed the DEA and DOJ to not seek out marijuana prosecutions in states where the People have voted to legalize some use of marijuana. The only exception to seeking out prosecutions in these states, is when the DEA or DOJ suspects the marijuana distributor/facility/whathaveyou is in violation of that particular states laws.

Well, in California for instance, some of the US Attorneys have taken an aggressive stance to shut down the medical marijuana dispensaries by threatening the landlords with civil forfeiture of their properties if they continue to lease space to the dispensaries. The dispensaries have all but disappeared in San Diego County, and most now operate as a home delivery system only. The problem with this is apparent. So long as marijuana remains illegal on the federal level, any use of a telephone to order medical marijuana could subject a person to criminal prosecution under RICO, the Racketeering Influenced and Corrupt Organizations Act. So, sure maybe they don't prosecute someone for a marijuana offense, but they prosecute for a RICO offense. I haven't seen this happen yet, but it is a risk anyone takes ordering medical marijuana by phone, e-mail, U.S. Mail, etc. Walking into a medical marijuana dispensary does not carry the same risk.

[Duncan]

Only someone who has never used marijuana to get high would ask these questions.

ha...................ha.............................haw!

[BlueDreams]

From personal observation I will have to disagree with that statement.

It's not on the same line as smoking or alcohol in addiction. most people who smoke it do so on an irregular basis. It's less common for someone to build up a personal need or habit to smoking marijuana:

"Compared to other substances, marijuana is not very addicting. It is estimated that 32% of tobacco users will become addicted, 23% of heroin users, 17% of cocaine users, and 15% of alcohol users. Cocaine and heroin are more physically harmful and nicotine is much more addictive. It is much harder to quit smoking cigarettes than it is to quit smoking pot."

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-teenage-mind/201012/is-marijuana-addictive

With luv,

Bd

Edited November 28, 2012 by BlueDreams