bluebell Posted November 28, 2012 Posted November 28, 2012 I know it's a never-ending battle between which pro or anti marijuana studies are accurate or authentic but the following video does present something that makes perfect sense to me. The human body is natually made to process alcohol whearas it is not equipped to process the chemicals found in marijuana consumption. The chemicals are retained in the body long after the high affect receeds and it can cause psychological damage to the consumer. Also, the video points out something that ironically you're doing: making a pro-drug argument based on presemuptions as to the affects of the drug and not upon the constitutionality of fighting drugs. It is of my opinion that if marijuana is planted, harvested, processed, sold, and consumed entirely within a state than the federal government has no busieness cracking down upon it. It is a state issue. If a state legalizes / decriminalizes it, than so be it. If a state restricts its possession and distribution, than so be it. I'll worry about what my state does with it, not what others do unless, of course, I care to travel to that state.Now, if marijuana crosses state lines at any point than, yes, the federal government does have the constitutional authority to deal with it. And I say keep it illegal. I for one am not for legalizing, nor decriminalizing marijuana since I think it will worsen the heavy cost on society. The criminals behind the drug trade will still be criminals and procure criminal activity, that consumption will *increase* if marijuana is legalized / decrinimalized, and that the cost will shift from a criminal problem to that of physchological / physiological problems.No, Weed Isn't "Harmless"To be honest, i'm really not concerned with the constitutionality of the issue. I'm just giving my opinion on the substance, as compared to other legalized recreational drugs in the country. I don't believe marijuana is harmless, but i do believe it's less harmful than alcohol, and since that's legal, i don't see a reason for marijuana not to be.
bluebell Posted November 28, 2012 Posted November 28, 2012 I'd say that alcohol is more addicting than marijuana though marijuana destroys the body much more than does alcohol.I'm thinking about more than just the effects on the body. I'm thinking of the violence and problems that come from people drinking. Legal or not, most of the ills of this world are, in my opinion, related to alcohol use. I don't see that being an issue with marijuana.
Kemara Posted November 28, 2012 Posted November 28, 2012 (edited) ....and you have no one to help you if something goes wrong? i.e. you baked your cake now eat it!Why would there be no help? As you have stated we all pay taxes. The alcohol consumer pays as much tax as the McDonalds consumer who pays as much tax as the people who consume food containing insecticides who pay as much tax as the consumer of over the counter pain medication and as much tax as any other person who does things that lead to problems. Edited November 28, 2012 by Kemara
bluebell Posted November 28, 2012 Posted November 28, 2012 What are the benefits to using MJ that you can't get elsewhere? What is the point of doing MJ or any drug?It's not really about a point. I don't believe there is any point to drinking alcohol, but i don't believe making it illegal would solve anything. The U.S. tried and it was a big disaster. Same with tobacco. It seems like, if a country is comfortable making those toxic and problem-causing drugs legal, then what is their reasoning against legalizing marijuana? Can they logically make one? I don't believe so.
canard78 Posted November 28, 2012 Posted November 28, 2012 I feel the same way you do, Mark. I'm not a pot head, but I am concerned that the enforcement of these anti-marijuana laws are more destructive than legalizing the stuff, particularly if there is a medical reason for taking it.I have a related question. Would a Mormon be violating the Word of Wisdom if he or she ingested marijuana that had been prescribed by a bona fide doctor to treat a medical condition?Good question. A friend was asked by his Dr to start having a glass of wine a week for health reasons. I'm guessing a bishop would say no to both if asked in a TR interview.
changed Posted November 28, 2012 Posted November 28, 2012 If taxpayers are going to be paying for everyone's healthcare, I guess taxpayers should be worried about everyone's health.
Duncan Posted November 28, 2012 Posted November 28, 2012 (edited) Why would there be no help? As you have stated we all pay taxes. The alcohol consumer pays as much tax as the McDonalds consumer who pays as much tax as the people who consume food containing insecticides who pay as much tax as the consumer of over the counter pain medication and as much tax as any other person who does things that lead to problems.I don't want it to be legal because basically the Gov't is paying for us to have a problem Edited November 28, 2012 by Duncan
DavidB Posted November 28, 2012 Posted November 28, 2012 Supporting the legalization of marijuana does not violate the word of wisdom, it is debatable whether the consumption of legal marijuana violates the word of wisdom.
Duncan Posted November 28, 2012 Posted November 28, 2012 (edited) It's not really about a point. I don't believe there is any point to drinking alcohol, but i don't believe making it illegal would solve anything. The U.S. tried and it was a big disaster.Same with tobacco.It seems like, if a country is comfortable making those toxic and problem-causing drugs legal, then what is their reasoning against legalizing marijuana? Can they logically make one? I don't believe so.you have the ATF and it's regulated but yeah still problems and all. I see places like Mexico they are killing themselves over drug control and it's no different with pick your poison, who controls what drug. Can something be done about it, I think there shouldn't be a country that makes it comfortable Edited November 28, 2012 by Duncan
DavidB Posted November 28, 2012 Posted November 28, 2012 The problem with word of wisdom debates, is that just about everything a human can consume is addictive to someone or could cause harm to someone. At one time red m&ms caused cancer, does that mean any member who ate a red mm violated the word of wisdom?Dihydrogen Monoxide can kill but we are told to consume 64oz of it a day.
Duncan Posted November 28, 2012 Posted November 28, 2012 The problem with word of wisdom debates, is that just about everything a human can consume is addictive to someone or could cause harm to someone. At one time red m&ms caused cancer, does that mean any member who ate a red mm violated the word of wisdom?Dihydrogen Monoxide can kill but we are told to consume 64oz of it a day.we pat ourselves on the back for keeping the WOW yet we open the door for scams on all kinds that effect our bodies-shark cartilage, online pharmacy (a member in my stake has on it's only a matter of time before the RCMP kick down his door) etc. if people want to sell it then blow their brains out but there should be regulations but it's about control of their healthcare rather then giving it over to a doctor-of which I am comfortable with and I follow their suggestions and do what they ask
Kemara Posted November 28, 2012 Posted November 28, 2012 I don't want it to be legal because basically the Gov't is paying for us to have a problem Its already happening, should we make those things illegal?
blackstrap Posted November 28, 2012 Posted November 28, 2012 If taxpayers are going to be paying for everyone's healthcare, I guess taxpayers should be worried about everyone's health.And therein lies the rub with universal health care. When the govt mandates health care it can and probably should decide what behaviors lead to good and bad health outcomes and regulate accordingly. If your premiums(taxes) reflected your lifestyle , it might work better, but that is anathema.
Duncan Posted November 28, 2012 Posted November 28, 2012 Its already happening, should we make those things illegal?make MJ and other addicting drugs illegal! i don't get why people do drugs though, what is missing in their lives that they are trying to fill with drugs?
blackstrap Posted November 28, 2012 Posted November 28, 2012 Are you now or have you ever been a........... I was actually asked this question at the US border many years ago. I thought it odd seeing as I was an obvious redneck.Actually had a red neck from haying.
Kemara Posted November 28, 2012 Posted November 28, 2012 (edited) make MJ and other addicting drugs illegal! i don't get why people do drugs though, what is missing in their lives that they are trying to fill with drugs? No, if the problem with cannabis being made legal is that the government is in effect paying for us to have the problem then surely anything at all that can cause problems should be illegal. Cannabis, other addictive drugs and other illegal products are not the only things that cause problems. Many legal products and activities cause problems so I dont see the validity of your argument. Referring to just health problems we know that McDonalds causes problems, we know alcohol causes problems, we know insecticides causes problems, we know fast cars cause problems, we know lack of exercise causes problems. Should these things be controlled and/or made illegal because in effect the government is paying for us to have these problems? Should the government expand its usurption of our bodies to mandate minimum exercise time so as to avoid having this very real societal problem?I am not a drug user, I wouldnt smoke cannabis even if it was legal, and I, like you, dont get why people do drugs, but by zeus almighty that is none of my business and it should not be the governments business. Edited November 28, 2012 by Kemara
Duncan Posted November 28, 2012 Posted November 28, 2012 No, if the problem with cannabis being made legal is that the government is in effect paying for us to have the problem then surely anything at all that can cause problems should be illegal. Cannabis, other addictive drugs and other illegal products are not the only things that cause problems. Many legal products and activities cause problems so I dont see the validity of your argument. Referring to just health problems we know that McDonalds causes problems, we know alcohol causes problems, we know insecticides causes problems, we know fast cars cause problems, we know lack of exercise causes problems. Should these things be controlled and/or made illegal because in effect the government is paying for us to have these problems? Should the government expand its usurption of our bodies to mandate minimum exercise time so as to avoid having this very real societal problem?I am not a drug user, I wouldnt smoke cannabis even if it was legal, and I, like you, dont get why people do drugs, but by zues almighty that is none of my business and it should not be the governments business.but we aren't talking about other substances we are talking about Marijuana and it's use. I agree with you for your second paragraph! By the Beard of Zeus!!!
Kemara Posted November 28, 2012 Posted November 28, 2012 but we aren't talking about other substances we are talking about Marijuana and it's use. Your position on cannabis is:I don't want it to be legal because basically the Gov't is paying for us to have a problemWhy then should we not apply this reasoning to all other substances and activities?
Duncan Posted November 28, 2012 Posted November 28, 2012 Your position on cannabis is:Why then should we not apply this reasoning to all other substances and activities?because then other variables come into play. Like with Rotten Ronnies you have options! some form of a health option with salads, subs and you can add in or take out ingredients (i've worked there twice in my life and loved it, 'i'd like a big Mac, no salt, so pickles, a dash of mustard and no sesame seeds please...what took you so long?!...) but you can't do that iwth cannabis, you don't know what your dealer did to it and you get what you get
Darren10 Posted November 28, 2012 Posted November 28, 2012 (edited) As a former pot head, and a really big one at that.. I mean, I could teach a class on impromptu water bong construction.I will say.. I miss it once and again. The first time I got high I managed to extract every Payday candy bar from the dorm snack machine. They were ambrosia. It made sex, jokes, hanging out and lots of other stuff seem better. All that said, I don't think it's "good" for you.I do think my memory and intelligence has suffered from it though. I don't blame my exposure to it for my lack of finishing school, though I think it contributed heavily to it.The first line of Coke or tab of LSD or hallucinogenic mushroom or crank or crystal meth I tried was only after I was high first. When they call it a "gateway" drug. I would agree with them.That said, I don't have an issue with the legalization of it.. as long as they tax the crap out of it while still destroying non-regulated markets on price point. Though, I don't think it would change much. It's more than readily available through illegal pursuits and the general sense of the public is that it's acceptable on some level.Mudcat;Thank you for sharing your experience.As for taxing weed, I think that's precisely what will happen with the legalization of pot, thus moving the market to more illegal means thus returning the nature of buying drugs to it being an illegal venture. So long as people choose to abuse drug use, there will always be an illegal venue to obtain them.The only acceptable choice for society regarding harmful drugs is to choose not to do them. Edited November 28, 2012 by Darren10 2
Nathair/|\ Posted November 28, 2012 Posted November 28, 2012 because then other variables come into play. Like with Rotten Ronnies you have options! some form of a health option with salads, subs and you can add in or take out ingredients (i've worked there twice in my life and loved it, 'i'd like a big Mac, no salt, so pickles, a dash of mustard and no sesame seeds please...what took you so long?!...) but you can't do that iwth cannabis, you don't know what your dealer did to it and you get what you getThat's actually another reason to make it legal. If you're buying it at a store, you have better quality control--usually.
Kemara Posted November 28, 2012 Posted November 28, 2012 because then other variables come into play. Like with Rotten Ronnies you have options! some form of a health option with salads, subs and you can add in or take out ingredients (i've worked there twice in my life and loved it, 'i'd like a big Mac, no salt, so pickles, a dash of mustard and no sesame seeds please...what took you so long?!...) but you can't do that iwth cannabis, you don't know what your dealer did to it and you get what you get So then its not really about the government in effect paying for us to have the problem, its about the lack of options. Do you eat apples? Believe me you dont know what your dealer did to those apples and you get what you get. Do you know what atrazine is?
Darren10 Posted November 28, 2012 Posted November 28, 2012 I'm thinking about more than just the effects on the body. I'm thinking of the violence and problems that come from people drinking. Legal or not, most of the ills of this world are, in my opinion, related to alcohol use. I don't see that being an issue with marijuana.You won't get an argument from me regarding the violence which stems from alcohol.
Darren10 Posted November 28, 2012 Posted November 28, 2012 (edited) Supporting the legalization of marijuana does not violate the word of wisdom, it is debatable whether the consumption of legal marijuana violates the word of wisdom.I don't think there's any debate about it though you bring up a good point in that legalizing marijuana will result in obscuring its harm and its immoral nature in using it. Edited November 28, 2012 by Darren10
Duncan Posted November 28, 2012 Posted November 28, 2012 (edited) So then its not really about the government in effect paying for us to have the problem, its about the lack of options. Do you eat apples? Believe me you dont know what your dealer did to those apples and you get what you get. Do you know what atrazine is?that's if you buy from a store but if you grow your own or buy from a farmer or something. I am not addicted to apples and I have never heard of apple addiction. I fairly certain that MJ problems are worse then atrazine Edited November 28, 2012 by Duncan
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