Law22 Posted May 18, 2012 Posted May 18, 2012 D&C 20:73 says:"The person who is called of God and has authority from Jesus Christ to baptize, shall go down into the water with the person who has presented himself or herself for baptism, and shall say, calling him or her by name: Having been commissioned of Jesus Christ, I baptize you in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost. Amen."1. How do LDS determine who has been "called of God" and who has the "authority from Jesus Christ" to baptize? Is this information somewhere else in the D&C?2. Do you agree that the Bible does not expressly answer this question, however, seems to demonstrate that the person doing the baptizing does not have to have any special "authority" other than being a believer?
The Nehor Posted May 18, 2012 Posted May 18, 2012 D&C 20:73 says:"The person who is called of God and has authority from Jesus Christ to baptize, shall go down into the water with the person who has presented himself or herself for baptism, and shall say, calling him or her by name: Having been commissioned of Jesus Christ, I baptize you in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost. Amen."1. How do LDS determine who has been "called of God" and who has the "authority from Jesus Christ" to baptize? Is this information somewhere else in the D&C?A Priest in the Aaronic Priesthood or anyone holding the Melchizedek Priesthood. All doing it must have the person with the keys approve of the baptism (Mission President, Bishop, or Branch President).2. Do you agree that the Bible does not expressly answer this question, however, seems to demonstrate that the person doing the baptizing does not have to have any special "authority" other than being a believer?No. The most prominent example I can think of is in the Bible when an Apostle runs into those who were baptized into the baptism of John the Baptist, probably not John but a professed follower. The apostle didn't consider it valid and baptized them again.
Kenngo1969 Posted May 18, 2012 Posted May 18, 2012 D&C 20:73 says:"The person who is called of God and has authority from Jesus Christ to baptize, shall go down into the water with the person who has presented himself or herself for baptism, and shall say, calling him or her by name: Having been commissioned of Jesus Christ, I baptize you in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost. Amen."1. How do LDS determine who has been "called of God" and who has the "authority from Jesus Christ" to baptize? Is this information somewhere else in the D&C?Articles of Faith 1:5.2. Do you agree that the Bible does not expressly answer this question, however, seems to demonstrate that the person doing the baptizing does not have to have any special "authority" other than being a believer?No. In my view (although I feel safe in saying that I'm far from alone), with all due respect to our devout Protestant brothers and sisters, the "priesthood of all believers" is a Protestant invention. In any event, what the Bible does or doesn't say on any given subject is irrelevant. As you yourself imply by your reference to the Doctrine & Covenants, we're bound by current revelation on any particular subject, not by what the Bible (great though it is) says.
Law22 Posted May 18, 2012 Author Posted May 18, 2012 A Priest in the Aaronic Priesthood or anyone holding the Melchizedek Priesthood. All doing it must have the person with the keys approve of the baptism (Mission President, Bishop, or Branch President).No. The most prominent example I can think of is in the Bible when an Apostle runs into those who were baptized into the baptism of John the Baptist, probably not John but a professed follower. The apostle didn't consider it valid and baptized them again.Can you provide the scriptural references please?
The Nehor Posted May 18, 2012 Posted May 18, 2012 Can you provide the scriptural references please?D&C 20
Avatar4321 Posted May 18, 2012 Posted May 18, 2012 D&C 20:73 says:"The person who is called of God and has authority from Jesus Christ to baptize, shall go down into the water with the person who has presented himself or herself for baptism, and shall say, calling him or her by name: Having been commissioned of Jesus Christ, I baptize you in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost. Amen."1. How do LDS determine who has been "called of God" and who has the "authority from Jesus Christ" to baptize? Is this information somewhere else in the D&C?2. Do you agree that the Bible does not expressly answer this question, however, seems to demonstrate that the person doing the baptizing does not have to have any special "authority" other than being a believer?1) Section 20 outlines a number of offices of the Priesthood and who has authority to baptize.Men are called to the Priesthood the same way Aaron was (Hebrews 5:4). Exodus is pretty clear that God told Moses (The one who had the keys and authority over Israel at the time) to set apart and ordain Aaron by the laying on of hands before the Congregations of Israel.2) And no. as I said before Hebrews specifically states that a man must be called of God as Aaron was and cant take this honor upon himself. The Narrative in the Book of Acts repeatedly shows the necessity of authority in the process of baptism and Giving the Gift of the Holy Ghost. The Gospels are full of instances where Jesus gives His disciples authority. If none was needed, why would He give it to them and why would the writers think that this was vital to know?
Garden Girl Posted May 18, 2012 Posted May 18, 2012 (edited) 1. How do LDS determine who has been "called of God" and who has the "authority from Jesus Christ" to baptize? Is this information somewhere else in the D&C?2. Do you agree that the Bible does not expressly answer this question, however, seems to demonstrate that the person doing the baptizing does not have to have any special "authority" other than being a believer?I believe that Acts, Chap 8 gives a very good description of the importance of proper priesthood authority... start at verse 5 where the apostle Philip goes to Samaria and is teaching and baptizing the people. Among the people was a man named Simon who used sorcery to make people think he had power from God (for him it was counterfeit). But as Simon heard Philip preach he also believed and was baptized, and he continued with Philip and wondered at the miracles, etc., performed by Philip.When the apostles who were at Jerusalem heard of Philip's success they sent Peter and John to Samaria, who when they arrived in Samaria prayed for those who had been baptized that they might receive the Holy Ghost ("For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus). Then Peter and John laid their hands on the people and they received the Holy Ghost.And when Simon saw that through Peter and John's laying on of hands the Holy Ghost was given, he offered them money, saying "Give me also this power, that on whomsoever I lay hands, he may receive the Holy Ghost." But Peter said to Simon that his money should perish with him because he thought that the gift of God could be purchased with money.To me these verses clearly illustrate that Philip held the Aaronic Priesthood and had authority to baptize... but it was Peter and John that held the authority of the Melchizedek Priesthood to give the gift of the Holy Ghost, so they had to go up to Samaria from where they were in Jerusalem so that the people who had been baptized by Philip could receive the Holy Ghost from Peter and John by the laying on of hands.GG Edited May 18, 2012 by Garden Girl
bluebell Posted May 18, 2012 Posted May 18, 2012 (edited) Law22, here are some verses in the bible which LDS believe support the notion that authority to do things in God's name must come from Him and cannot just be assumed because one is a 'believer'.he ordained twelve, Mark 3:14By what authority doest thou these things, Mark 11:28gave them power and authority over all devils, Luke 9:1Lord appointed other seventy, Luke 10:1I have chosen you, and ordained you, John 15:16apostles … laid their hands on them, Acts 6:6 (Acts 8:18; Acts 13:3; 1 Tim. 4:14).testify that it is he which was ordained of God, Acts 10:42Paul, an apostle, (not … by man, but by Jesus Christ …), Gal. 1:1ordain elders in every city, as I had appointed, Titus 1:5he that is called of God, as was Aaron, Heb. 5:4A lot of these verses mention being 'ordained' and conferring power through the 'laying on of hands'. This is how LDS believe someone recieves the authority to act in the name of God to be able to baptize. Edited May 18, 2012 by bluebell 1
Buzzard Posted May 18, 2012 Posted May 18, 2012 (edited) One of my favorite one-liners in the New Testament comes in the 19th chapter of Acts, where seeing all the miracles that Paul did, the sons of a Jewish excorsist decided they wanted in on the action and told an evil spirit to come out of a person in the name of "Jesus, whom Paul preacheth". The spirit shot back: "Jesus I know, and Paul I know, but who are ye?" Then the person with the evil spirit leapt up and smacked them around so that they ran away "naked and wounded".To mu mind, this shows pretty clearly that you can't just take it on yourself to perform ordinances. Aside from that, it's a pretty funny mental picture. Edited May 18, 2012 by Buzzard
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