Church Marketing Business

[TruthSeeker24]

Am I the only person concerned about businesses making profit off of Mormonism? For example, I heard a radio advertisement this morning where the marketer was advertising baptism and missionary gifts. Isn't that kind of like Solomon's Temple during the life of Christ? Thoughts?

[ERayR]

Am I the only person concerned about businesses making profit off of Mormonism? For example, I heard a radio advertisement this morning where the marketer was advertising baptism and missionary gifts. Isn't that kind of like Solomon's Temple during the life of Christ? Thoughts?

As long as they don't start claiming to be a church authorized source I see nothing wrong. People are going to buy their gifts from somebody and if one is to be in that market advertising makes sense. I don't know of any place these gifts (baptism, missionary, scriptures, bar mitzva, etc., etc.) are given away free.

It would also be quite tacky to hang advertising posters in the churchs and temples and I would have trouble with that.

[treehugger]

Am I the only person concerned about businesses making profit off of Mormonism? For example, I heard a radio advertisement this morning where the marketer was advertising baptism and missionary gifts. Isn't that kind of like Solomon's Temple during the life of Christ? Thoughts?

you are not alone in this. The main thing I do not like about Utah and a few other places is people using Church affiliation for personal gain. I view these types of businesses as no better than the money changers and others who Christ tossed out of the Temple. And the commercialization of Gospel ordinances is just despicable.

[ERayR]

you are not alone in this. The main thing I do not like about Utah and a few other places is people using Church affiliation for personal gain. I view these types of businesses as no better than the money changers and others who Christ tossed out of the Temple. And the commercialization of Gospel ordinances is just despicable.

Do you also think it is wrong for the church to be in the business of selling scriptures, lesson manuals, baptism and temple clothing, music, teaching art, etc.? Who would you suggest to supply the needs in these areas?

Edited to add: What is your opinion of organizations such as F.A.I.R. or F.A.R.M.S. or Deseret Book?

Edited May 9, 2012 by ERayR

[TruthSeeker24]

Do you also think it is wrong for the church to be in the business of selling scriptures, lesson manuals, baptism and temple clothing, music, teaching art, etc.? Who would you suggest to supply the needs in these areas?

I have no problem with it as long as it is ONLY for the price of printing, making the clothes, ect. My issue arises when it becomes for gain. For example, I have no problem with the Distribution Center because everything is sold for the price of printing and the workers aren't working for money. But there are several other places that DO sell for profit. For example, Seagull Bookstore and other places sell little vials of olive oil for giving blessings. The needs should be provided by the Church, by use of tithing maybe? I don't want to say for certain because I fear it isn't my place to say.

[cinepro]

Do you also think it is wrong for the church to be in the business of selling scriptures, lesson manuals, baptism and temple clothing, music, teaching art, etc.? Who would you suggest to supply the needs in these areas?

Edited to add: What is your opinion of organizations such as F.A.I.R. or F.A.R.M.S. or Deseret Book?

The bigger question is whether or not the Church should subsidize these materials, or sell them at break-even or for profit.

As for the other stuff (Moroni Christmas Tree-Toppers, "Settlers of Zarahemla" board games, "Wait, It's Worth It!" chastity talks on CD for the youth etc.), what could be the problem?

If I decide I want to buy a book to read, why should I not be able to buy books about the Church instead of the latest John Grisham novel? If I am attending a baptism and want to buy a gift for the baptisee, why shouldn't I be able to select from trinkets and chotchkees most appropriate for the occasion? If I want to put artwork up in my living room, why shouldn't I be able to select artwork that depicts Church history or other LDS-related themes?

This isn't a matter of spirituality, it's one of economics. People make and sell this stuff because LDS want to buy it. And there's nothing wrong with that (nor, can I see, a better alternative).

[ERayR]

I have no problem with it as long as it is ONLY for the price of printing, making the clothes, ect. My issue arises when it becomes for gain. For example, I have no problem with the Distribution Center because everything is sold for the price of printing and the workers aren't working for money. But there are several other places that DO sell for profit. For example, Seagull Bookstore and other places sell little vials of olive oil for giving blessings. The needs should be provided by the Church, by use of tithing maybe? I don't want to say for certain because I fear it isn't my place to say.

I don't know nor do I care what you do for a living but are you willing to make your services/products available at the cost of production and forgo any profit or if you are working for a paycheck are you willing to make your services available at no cost?

What makes you think the Distribution Center workers do not work for money? The have to pay rent, buy groceries, food, clothing and education for their families. Believe it or not profit is not a dirty word. What is wrong with baptism gifts, missionary gifts, ordination gifts and CTR jewelry? Why should they be provided out of tithing funds?

[cinepro]

I have no problem with it as long as it is ONLY for the price of printing, making the clothes, ect. My issue arises when it becomes for gain. For example, I have no problem with the Distribution Center because everything is sold for the price of printing and the workers aren't working for money. But there are several other places that DO sell for profit. For example, Seagull Bookstore and other places sell little vials of olive oil for giving blessings. The needs should be provided by the Church, by use of tithing maybe? I don't want to say for certain because I fear it isn't my place to say.

Seagull doesn't sell "little vials of olive oil". They sell little vials that someone can put olive oil in. The Elder is responsible for procuring the oil and blessing it himself.

The vial itself is not a holy artifact. And there isn't just one way to carry oil around. So the opportunity to manufacture and sell "vials" encourages innovators to think of new and better oil-containers, which allows priesthood holders to have a choice among different containers at different prices.

The Church does sell a vial for $.40, so there is a less expensive option. But it has several design problems. It allows light in, which makes the oil spoil more quickly. It may be too large to conveniently carry in a pocket day after day (for those who give lots of blessings). So there is definitely room for improvement, and it's good that there are many other options.

It should also be noted that the Church does provide required materials for free, such as lesson manuals. And I've always been reimbursed for expenses related to my callings as a teacher or in Scouts (except for the uniform).

And most buildings have a place where members can get scriptures and other materials for free. It's called the "Lost and Found".

Edited May 9, 2012 by cinepro

[ERayR]

The bigger question is whether or not the Church should subsidize these materials, or sell them at break-even or for profit.

As for the other stuff (Moroni Christmas Tree-Toppers, "Settlers of Zarahemla" board games, "Wait, It's Worth It!" chastity talks on CD for the youth etc.), what could be the problem?

If I decide I want to buy a book to read, why should I not be able to buy books about the Church instead of the latest John Grisham novel? If I am attending a baptism and want to buy a gift for the baptisee, why shouldn't I be able to select from trinkets and chotchkees most appropriate for the occasion? If I want to put artwork up in my living room, why shouldn't I be able to select artwork that depicts Church history or other LDS-related themes?

This isn't a matter of spirituality, it's one of economics. People make and sell this stuff because LDS want to buy it. And there's nothing wrong with that (nor, can I see, a better alternative).

Yes, my point exactly. Well maybe not exactly but still my point and I agree with you. And these things are not going to be available unless someone can make and sell them at a profit. Advertising is part of the process.

[cinepro]

Yes, my point exactly. Well maybe not exactly but still my point and I agree with you. And these things are not going to be available unless someone can make and sell them at a profit. Advertising is part of the process.

And when it comes to advertising Church stuff, you could make the argument that things are quite a bit better than they used to be...

Edited May 9, 2012 by cinepro

[ERayR]

And when it comes to advertising Church stuff, you could make the argument that things are quite a bit better than they used to be...

Cool. I remember when one could buy garments at (I think it was)at J.C. Penny Stores in Idaho. Then there were church run or sponsored garment stores(open two days a week in Twin Falls ID). Then they were closed and you had to go to the Deseret Industries complex and now online.

[bluebell]

I personally don't have a problem with people using their talents to support themselves financially, even when those talents are expressed in a church setting or with a church motiff.

If i think something is tacky, then i just don't buy it.

[MorningStar]

Seagull doesn't sell "little vials of olive oil". They sell little vials that someone can put olive oil in. The Elder is responsible for procuring the oil and blessing it himself.

The vial itself is not a holy artifact. And there isn't just one way to carry oil around. So the opportunity to manufacture and sell "vials" encourages innovators to think of new and better oil-containers, which allows priesthood holders to have a choice among different containers at different prices.

The Church does sell a vial for $.40, so there is a less expensive option. But it has several design problems. It allows light in, which makes the oil spoil more quickly. It may be too large to conveniently carry in a pocket day after day (for those who give lots of blessings). So there is definitely room for improvement, and it's good that there are many other options.

It should also be noted that the Church does provide required materials for free, such as lesson manuals. And I've always been reimbursed for expenses related to my callings as a teacher or in Scouts (except for the uniform).

And most buildings have a place where members can get scriptures and other materials for free. It's called the "Lost and Found".

My husband has an oil vial that also has a mini flashlight on it! He loves it.

[treehugger]

Do you also think it is wrong for the church to be in the business of selling scriptures, lesson manuals, baptism and temple clothing, music, teaching art, etc.? Who would you suggest to supply the needs in these areas?

Edited to add: What is your opinion of organizations such as F.A.I.R. or F.A.R.M.S. or Deseret Book?

Wow, histrionic there much; I will be sure to ignore it in the future.

I tend to doubt that the Church has commercialized Preisthood ordinances; which means I tend to doubt that the commercial truthseeker heard was a commercial from the Church.

[TruthSeeker24]

Thank you for your thoughts.

[Calm]

Am I the only person concerned about businesses making profit off of Mormonism? For example, I heard a radio advertisement this morning where the marketer was advertising baptism and missionary gifts. Isn't that kind of like Solomon's Temple during the life of Christ? Thoughts?

No one is required to buy these things in order to fully participate in the LDS spiritual or ritual life, unlike what was going on in the Temple during the life of Christ.

[treehugger]

for an example of modern day money changers and dove sellers, google "lds realestate agents", I have even seen adverts along the lines of "Trusted LDS Attorney". Being LDS has nothing with the quality or trustworthiness of a provided service. And those who wear their religion on their business selve for the sake of profit are exactly the kind of businesses I know to avoid.

[Calm]

Moneychangers and dovesellers provided a required service for participate in temple rites.

Just by your own claim that you choose to avoid these businesses, you have demonstrated that they are not a modern day version of moneychangers etc.

They may be hypocrites attempting to use their Church connections to make money, but the moneychanger isn't a good analogy to do it, imo.

[bluebell]

for an example of modern day money changers and dove sellers, google "lds realestate agents", I have even seen adverts along the lines of "Trusted LDS Attorney". Being LDS has nothing with the quality or trustworthiness of a provided service. And those who wear their religion on their business selve for the sake of profit are exactly the kind of businesses I know to avoid.

I wouldn't go so far as to compare them to modern day money changers (since, as Cal has said, those services were necessary to participate in needed rituals and buying a home from an lds agent isn't, and i would imagine that many such people are very nice and sincere) but i admit that i do think it's kind of creepy and makes LDS seem, in my opinion, too exclusive and cliquish.

[cinepro]

No one is required to buy these things in order to fully participate in the LDS spiritual or ritual life, unlike what was going on in the Temple during the life of Christ.

Just so I'm clear, the "requirement" at the time was that you had to provide an animal for sacrifice, right? So you either brought your own animal, or you bought one when you were there. And if you traveled from a region with a different currency, you had to get your money exchanged for the local currency. Hence, the need for "moneychangers".

If that is true, what was Jesus protesting exactly?

[ERayR]

for an example of modern day money changers and dove sellers, google "lds realestate agents", I have even seen adverts along the lines of "Trusted LDS Attorney". Being LDS has nothing with the quality or trustworthiness of a provided service. And those who wear their religion on their business selve for the sake of profit are exactly the kind of businesses I know to avoid.

No they are not modern day money changers in the biblical sense. They are not desecrating the temples.

Add: The money changers (as I understand) were those who traded commercial currency for temple currency at a high rate of exchange.

Edited May 9, 2012 by ERayR

[cinepro]

No one is required to buy these things in order to fully participate in the LDS spiritual or ritual life, unlike what was going on in the Temple during the life of Christ.

To be entirely clear, it should be acknowledged that there is a modern requirement for 10% of your income to be given to the Church before you can go to the Temple.

[Freedom]

I would rather see someone making a living selling mormon focused products than, for example, alcohol, immodest clothing, vulgar music or violent video games. Although we make fun of the merchandise, we buy it when ever we are in Utah.

[Calm]

Just so I'm clear, the "requirement" at the time was that you had to provide an animal for sacrifice, right? So you either brought your own animal, or you bought one when you were there. And if you traveled from a region with a different currency, you had to get your money exchanged for the local currency. Hence, the need for "moneychangers".

If that is true, what was Jesus protesting exactly?

Without looking up the scripture, my memory says that the businesses were allowed within the temple walls by the priests (and that may have been because they had been bribed which would have been a true desecration of their calling as it was allowing a desecration of the temple by doing so) and thus disrupted/desecrated the spiritual environment. The businesses could just have been performed outside of the temple, but might not have been so profitable having to purchase store space or whatever as well as not having a 'captive' audience.

I don't remember anything about it being wrong they made a profit off of the required transactions or not, but that is certainly possible. More likely I would suspect it would be making an inordinate profit as God has said elsewhere a labourer is worthy of his hire, if the sellers were making a living by providing the service, that would be one thing, if they were taking advantage of those who came to the temple to rip them off with inflated prices and were able to do so because the priests gave them sanction to do so or even appointed them as the only ones allowed to provide this service, thus not allowing for any competition to drive prices down to a fairer exchange....that would be something completely different.

Edited May 9, 2012 by calmoriah

[jcake]

I, too, find adds for "LDS Real Estate Agents, etc. extremely off-putting. And if I, being lds, feel that way, I can only imagine what non-lds persons must think of it.

Good grief!