Large Ward Vs Smaller Branch

[Wants2know]

I really have to find a large ward around here to visit just to see what it's like. One of the Brethren came up to my husband during priesthood last week and asked him if we could take our 3 year old daughter out of the chapel and into the kitchen during sacrament meeting when she wanted to snack on crackers, because sometimes we can't get every single crumb she leaves and he has to look out for the church and it's "ant" problem. Luckily, he did not mention this to me because I'm not sure how I would have handled it. Hubby is much more diplomatic. Hubby told me about it after church and we had dinner with friends that night and it came up, and I just had to remind myself that his heart was probably good intentioned, and he doesn't have children etc. And… I forgot about it. Well, apparently, this brother went to one of the counselors to address how my husband was indifferent to his concerns, and the counselor apparently, basically told him this gentleman to "back off" and not address it again (according to his wife who handles mutual with my husband). The counselors wife addressed this with my husband just to "check" and make sure we weren't totally offended, which was very thoughtful, but I can't help but think the entirety of the event is ludicrous to begin with. I've been told it's different in larger wards where there are many children having a smorgasbord of snacks in the back of the chapel, coloring, crying etc…. and that smaller wards (about 80 attendees weekly) don't get to enjoy that… we have maybe 6 children under 6. Any one have any similar experiences that are going to normalize this for me? On the other hand, there have been members who have said how much they enjoy my daughters chatter, as they miss the sound of children's banter from bigger sacarment meetings. I still love my branch and the people… I just have nothing to compare it to.

[Saints Alive]

Never heard of anything quite to the magnitude of your story but, I have been in small wards most of the time I have been in the church. The only thing that comes close is once a bishop asked that we limit our snacks to small children and small, dry snacks. It was only a problem because some families were basically bringing small picnic lunches for anyone in the family under 18.

[Kenngo1969]

By no means am I minimizing your concerns. That said, the reality is that whether you're in a large ward or a small branch ... people are people wherever you go. (In fact, arguably, small branches may be worse in this regard because the fewer people there are, the more likely it is that a larger proportion of them will know about your business.) Perhaps you might consider this an opportunity to develop (to demonstrate) charity on your part. Barring the most exceptional of circumstances (which require the approval both of the bishop where you reside and the bishop of the ward you would like to attend, as well as of the president of the stake where you reside and the stake where you would like to attend) you attend the ward and stake where you reside. It's easiest to love our ward and stake members when we choose them, and more of a challenge to do so when we don't ... which is exactly why this policy exists.

Personally, I have found that when someone offends me, s/he, more often than not, is completely unaware of having done so. If I don't let the perceived slight go, the only one it hurts is me. And I'm a fool if I insist on taking offense where none was intended, and the only time I'm an even bigger fool is when I take offense where it is intended.

I wish you well.

[rpn]

So now you know to bring a small vacuum, get the vacuum from the member's janitor closet, or a damp paper to clean up any mess (or try cheerios which will fit entirely into the mouth, or grapes that have no crumbs at all to leave behind. Please don't be offended. If it hasn't been your turn yet to clean the church building (this rotates and in big wards you may not get a turn in a year, most of us do it twice a year but sometimes members don't realize they've been given that opportunity), then you probably don't know that members are completely in charge of cleaning up everything, and that it is much easier when each family cleans up after themselves.

[Pahoran]

I really have to find a large ward around here to visit just to see what it's like.  One of the Brethren came up to my husband during priesthood last week and asked him if we could take our 3 year old daughter out of the chapel and into the kitchen during sacrament meeting when she wanted to snack on crackers, because sometimes we can't get every single crumb she leaves and he has to look out for the church and it's "ant" problem.  Luckily, he did not mention this to me because I'm not sure how I would have handled it.  Hubby is much more diplomatic.  Hubby told me about it after church and we had dinner with friends that night and it came up, and I just had to remind myself that his heart was probably good intentioned, and he doesn't have children etc.  And… I forgot about it.  Well, apparently, this brother went to one of the counselors to address how my husband was indifferent to his concerns, and the counselor apparently, basically told him this gentleman to "back off" and not address it again (according to his wife who handles mutual with my husband).  The counselors wife addressed this with my husband just to "check" and make sure we weren't totally offended, which was very thoughtful, but I can't help but think the entirety of the event is ludicrous to begin with.  I've been told it's different in larger wards where there are many children having a smorgasbord of snacks in the back of the chapel, coloring, crying etc…. and that smaller wards (about 80 attendees weekly) don't get to enjoy that… we have maybe 6 children under 6.  Any one have any similar experiences that are going to normalize this for me?  On the other hand, there have been members who have said how much they enjoy my daughters chatter, as they miss the sound of children's banter from bigger sacarment meetings.  I still love my branch and the people… I just have nothing to compare it to.

Why do you seem defensive about this?  There's nothing to be offended about.  It's not about you, it's about the crumbs.

Crumbs are impartial, objective realities.  They don't care who drops them; someone still has to clean them up.

I'm in a fairly large ward.  A bunch of children continuously crying is not exactly something to "enjoy," but we accept it with good grace.  When children get loud, parents are expected to take them out to the parents' room.  They give them toys that don't squeak, bang, ring or whistle.  And if they want to give the very young ones something to snack on, then they try not to make it messy.

I agree that asking you to take them out to the kitchen might be a bit much, though.

Regards,

Pahoran

[Calm]

So now you know to bring a small vacuum, get the vacuum from the member's janitor closet, or a damp paper to clean up any mess (or try cheerios which will fit entirely into the mouth, or grapes that have no crumbs at all to leave behind. Please don't be offended. If it hasn't been your turn yet to clean the church building (this rotates and in big wards you may not get a turn in a year, most of us do it twice a year but sometimes members don't realize they've been given that opportunity), then you probably don't know that members are completely in charge of cleaning up everything, and that it is much easier when each family cleans up after themselves.

And some buildings have big issues with bugs and rodents so I suspect that might affect complaints (the guy complaining may have had previous experience elsewhere even if it's not as big of a deal as he claims in your branch). In my old ward, we were instructed not to keep any food in the cupboards due to rodents, which included the danger of them having the hanta virus. They made an exception for the emergency stash in Nursery (in case a parent forgot their turn that week), but that was required to be sealed up tight in a plastic container. In my ward before that, the issue was cockroaches.....

Edited April 27, 2012 by calmoriah

[Wants2know]

For clarity, this post was intended to be more about the variances between large wards and small branches and the social constructs etc. As I said earlier… I'm over it… now. The event just highlighted some things that I either hadn't yet experienced or had overlooked. As far as the ant problem, seriously, a few cheese nip crumbs aren't the cause of the ant problem. No food is ever left in the kitchen. Ever. Not even in the frig. I do my share to clean the church and clean up after my kids. It's not like I'm a slacker. But I'm not carrying a small vacuum with me. That's ridiculous. At the time, it felt like unnecessary drama? Issues for the sake of having an issue? In my business we call it histrionics. Mostly I love the little branch - I know everyone, they know me, they know my kids and I can ask anyone of them at anytime for anything, and they can do the same of me. It's a good feeling. This event was an outlier. And I'm just glad it wasn't me that was addressed first because I likely would have jumped down his throat.. I may have really hurt his feelings or caused a more serious problem. So heavenly father knew what he was doing when he directed this gentleman towards my husband, instead of me….

[Garden Girl]

Good morning, W2K...

Yeah, I'm glad too that he went to dh before you... smiles...

And glad that you've gotten over it generally... the fellow was really overstepping his bounds by asking you to take your daughter into the kitchen to have a snack!! (Most of our parents bring Cherrios or similar in plastic baggies, keeping it simple, and the little ones munch away. And on Saturday mornings when the cleaning teams are there whatever crumbs are vacuumed up, and there aren't that many).

I agree that people are people, and whether in a large ward or small branch you'll probably run across someone like the fellow you mentioned, if not for one thing for another. That is when you need to be able to keep your good heart and not let it get to you. I can't recall the issue, but I did one time respond angrily to a brother, who was also out of line... so I know what you mean. As far as small vs large... you'll find the same issues in either, just smaller or larger.

GG

[Calm]

The dynamics of a small branch are different from a larger ward, if only because it is much easier to get to know everyone relatively well. And this might lead some to be more forward with their complaints or to assume positions of 'authority' that really don't belong to them. But there are often the same type of people in larger wards, you just may not encounter them as frequently since there are more available for them to spread their attentions around thankfully.

I loved the closeness of the small branch I attended in Moscow, but it was frustrating because I wasn't always able to attend due to health reasons and I knew my presence was missed much more than it was back in Canada due to having only one other teacher in Primary and no substitutes available to cover. I think both positive and negative aspects are emphasized in a branch that might not have as much of an effect in a larger one.

[ERMD]

I've served as the bishop of a 600+ member ward for over 2 years. We are in the process of forming a 3rd unit out of the 2 that exist in the area. I have faced the blessings and challenges of a large congregation and am looking forward to facing whatever challenges a smaller (300-ish) congregation brings.

As has been said, people are people. They may just seem more "concentrated" with smaller numbers.