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The Kolob Theorem


hagoth7

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I'm only five pages into this book and am blown away so far.

Has anyone else read this? If so, what were your impressions?

Wondering if any others are thinking it has any correlation to the concept of Jacob's Ladder?

To the concept of gathering and scattering?

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I have read the book several times so far, and I find his ideas to be very interesting.

What I am grateful for, is that while some of his ideas may seem out there at first, he doesn't declare them to be doctrine or the truth God has told him to share in the book for us all to accept. He presents his thoughts, and then leaves it to us to pray concerning the truth of those things by the power of the Holy Ghost.

Having said that, I do think he is on the right track. I've always been of the mindset that Heavenly Father's plan operates within science, so to speak, His is a house of order. Whether or not we understand the details of that science is irrelevant to the truth of it, imo. I think most of us would tend to think that a galaxy seems too small to be the domain of Heavenly Father, and in the past I would absolutely agree. However, when we really begin to ponder over how truly vast even a galaxy is...it, to me at least, seems more plausible.

I really like his book.

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We now know that the Milky Way Galaxy is a barred spiral galaxy with two spiral arms. In the last couple of years we have also learned that it is much much larger than previously thought, in fact its a monster. For many years we beleived the Milky Way was destined to be swallowed up by the Andromeda galaxy in a galactic collision - now we know the Milky Way is actually the more massive galaxy, and quite recently, we discovered the the Milky Way is right now in the process of devouring another galaxy in a collision. Since its a barred spiral, the Milky Way doesn't look like Andromeda. And what of our relative position in this very large galaxy? We are about 1/3 of the way out and just about in the middle of galactic plane - Celestial Kingdom territory by the Kolob Theorem. We aren't on the galactic outskirts as so many people believe.

The center of our Galaxy is occupied by Sagittarius A, a super massive black hole with a gravitational field so strong that it tears apart stars and spreads the hot matter from those stars into an accretion disk that spirals down into the black hole, releasing massive amounts of gamma rays and xrays in the process.

When Andromeda is viewed in the infrared which can penetrate the dust then the three regions disappear, Andromeda is not segregated into three zones.

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...a neat idea but untestable.

Perhaps it's very testable.

He cites D&C 121:28-29, which says there would be:

"A time to come in the which nothing shall be withheld, whether there be one God, or many gods, they shall be manifest.

All thrones and dominions, principalities and powers, shall be revealed and set forth upon all who have endured valiantly for the gospel of Jesus Christ."

If I'm reading that accurately, when the realities of God's work begin to unfold for you in rapid succession, when every request for knowledge or light is rapidly supplied, that would appear to serve as notice that you have been valiant in the testimony of Jesus Christ.

Is that not accurate?

Is that not testable?

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"A time to come in the which nothing shall be withheld, whether there be one God, or many gods, they shall be manifest.

All thrones and dominions, principalities and powers, shall be revealed and set forth upon all who have endured valiantly for the gospel of Jesus Christ."

Methinks an initiatory session might help.

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"A time to come in the which nothing shall be withheld, whether there be one God, or many gods, they shall be manifest.

All thrones and dominions, principalities and powers, shall be revealed and set forth upon all who have endured valiantly for the gospel of Jesus Christ."

And I'll add this - with the belief that those within hearing range have been valiant:

I have reason to believe that Satan has been supplanted. And that instead of a prison, the gates of his dominion have been flung wide.

And that his kingdom is only being held in dominion until the time that all kingdoms will be united under our God and his Christ.

Is that testable?

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Incidentally, there is a star named Qlb, aka Kochab. It is 126 light years away. In the time of Abraham, this star appeared to people on Earth to orbit very close to the celestial north pole, or the one spot in the sky that did not appear to move when viewed from Earth and around which all bodies in the sky appeared rotate. The celestial north pole is also the spot of sky to which the pyramid shafts that conduct Pharaoh's soul to heaven were pointed. The Egyptians of Abraham's time apparently beleived that since everything appeared to orbit this spot of sky that was where the throne of God was. Qlb is the star's ancient Arabic name. If indeed this is the star that Abraham called Kolob then it is a galactic neighbor. Sagitarius A by contrast is 20,000 light years away.

Due to procession of the Earth's spin the celestial north pole has shifted a bit so that now it points to very near Polaris.

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STATEMENT OF THE KOLOB THEOREM

All the creations of our God, Heavenly Father, are located in the sublime and orderly limits of the Milky Way Galaxy. God sits enthroned in the center of the galaxy, in the “midst of all things,” (Doctrine and Covenants 88:13) and controls all the kingdoms His hands have made.

I would actually endorse this view. Still perusing the book and expect to disagree with a great deal (for example I find little evidence that the earth is literally sentient). But, thought I'd post the basic thesis of the book for those that are unfamiliar with what is being mentioned.
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Corollary 1 of the Kolob Theorem: In addition to Godâ??s throne, the celestial worlds of Heavenly Father, and indeed the total

celestial kingdom, are in the glorious hub, or central region of our Milky Way Galaxy.

Supports:

Scriptural: Examples such as D&C 88:13 and 88:41. The terms being in the midst or having all things round about him need not be interpreted as a spatial literal any more than saying we have the whole world at our fingertips need be a literal interpretation of having internet access. But, one can adopt that position. Not much of a support, however. Similarly with his Abraham interpretations.

Stars: Dr. Hilton is somewhat confused about stars and sizes. He wants Kolob to the be the largest and oldest of the stars and so sets himself up for a contradicting scenario. The largest stars are the ones that die the soonest. He cites Epsilon Aurigae as a nice big star but it is also a star that is about to die. There is more that could be said, but suffice it to say that Dr. Hilton really needed somebody with some understanding of astronomy to edit his research and argument here. Fatally flawed and contradictory.

Black Hole: It is indeed true that there appears to be a supermassive black hole near the center of the Milky Way (Sagittarius A*). But asks, 'Could a black hole also be called â??Kolobâ??' I'll have to read more, but it also doesn't look like he understands black holes. Kolob can't be a black hole and a star. And yet, he wants to cite the core of the galaxy as the center and cause of the rotation with Kolob as the fixed center. Contradictory - a color entirely impossible from the pigments he has available to him.

Nofear's Conclusion: Whether or not corollary 1 is true or false, Dr. Hilton's support is fatally flawed and even contradictory to his claims of the corollary. His argument needs to be redone entirely.

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Perhaps it's very testable.

He cites D&C 121:28-29, which says there would be:

"A time to come in the which nothing shall be withheld, whether there be one God, or many gods, they shall be manifest.

All thrones and dominions, principalities and powers, shall be revealed and set forth upon all who have endured valiantly for the gospel of Jesus Christ."

If I'm reading that accurately, when the realities of God's work begin to unfold for you in rapid succession, when every request for knowledge or light is rapidly supplied, that would appear to serve as notice that you have been valiant in the testimony of Jesus Christ.

Is that not accurate?

Is that not testable?

Been there, done that. Got the T-shirt. Didn't get the Kolob Theorem verified.

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I find it hard to imagine that God's kingdom is so local, though vast. I also find it hard to believe that there are places in the universe we can know about that are not part of God's kingdom. I have not read the book, and don't know if he is saying that, but that is what I am inferring from the posts. My personal theory is that there are multiple universes, and that in principle we cannot know about anything that is not part of God's kingdom. So this whole universe at least is "his"

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I find it hard to imagine that God's kingdom is so local, though vast. I also find it hard to believe that there are places in the universe we can know about that are not part of God's kingdom. I have not read the book, and don't know if he is saying that, but that is what I am inferring from the posts. My personal theory is that there are multiple universes, and that in principle we cannot know about anything that is not part of God's kingdom. So this whole universe at least is "his"
Yeah. That's a pretty common idea. Unfortunately, I find it one that really doesn't have any underpinnings other than some kind of hunch. Perhaps you might share what you mean by "multiple universes"?

Given some simple numerical approximations, the Milky Way is amble and enough for any reasonable supposition of concurrent mortal worlds. Does run into some difficulty when we start talking infinite regression, but that's a universal problem (pun intended) of any particular model.

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Does this theory have a celestial kingdom with a god at the center of every galaxy?
That's Corollary 12 of Dr. Hilton's theorem. I haven't read it yet to comment on it.
COROLLARY 12: Deities in addition to Eloheim

The un-numbered billions of external galaxies beyond our Milky Way are not the creations of Eloheim, but each has its own deity, its own celestial kingdom in its fiery core, with terrestrial and telestial kingdoms round about. Perhaps galaxies, in turn, cluster and revolve about ever higher centers.

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While at BYU, the daughter of Mark Eubank (former KUTV & KSL meteorologist) was in our stake and arranged for him to speak at a fireside. I felt like I was watching the weather report for an hour. At the end of his talk he told us his theory about the location of Kolob. :P

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I'm only five pages into this book and am blown away so far.

Has anyone else read this? If so, what were your impressions?

Wondering if any others are thinking it has any correlation to the concept of Jacob's Ladder?

To the concept of gathering and scattering?

hagoth7,

RE: "The Kolob Theorem: A Mormon's View of God's Starry Universe",

If you feel blown away after five pages, wait till you get to the passages where:

- We learn that God resides at the center of the galaxy. (In point of fact, there is a massive black hole at the center of our galaxy from which no light or matter can escape. So, if God needs light or matter to get his work done, he is apparently out of luck.)

- We learn that thoughts travel faster than light (Oh, really?)

- We are assured that, "The terrestrial and telestial kingdoms are located in successive concentric, doughnut-shaped rings, round about the celestial kingdom or central hub of the galaxy; that our sun and earth are now located in the outer or telestial ring of the Milky Way galaxy. (Now that one makes sense.)

What I want to know is how any educated rational person can put the slightest credence in this fantastical, anti-science nonsense.

How can anyone who adheres to this fantasy, or even considers this kind of thinking as reflective of Mormon doctrine in any way, claim that Mormonism and science are not diametrically opposed?

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I seriously doubt it. But galaxy interactions are definitely very common and so I fully agree with your implied statement that any galactic model of the domains of exalted beings would have to accommodate it. Even though I personally am partial to the idea of galactic domains, I confess I haven't spent to the time to think about the kinks such as galactic interactions, finite stars vs. unending kingdoms, and such. On a to-do list.
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I'm only five pages into this book and am blown away so far.

Has anyone else read this? If so, what were your impressions?

Wondering if any others are thinking it has any correlation to the concept of Jacob's Ladder?

To the concept of gathering and scattering?

I saw this online and read through it. As I recall, the claim is that the throne of God is at the center of the Milky Way galaxy. I don't remember the specifics of the work. I would have to go back and read it again.

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