Thanks, BlueDreams!

[Calm]

3 hours ago, Bill "Papa" Lee said:

You claim to be 10 years old, and write this so eloquently promoting outright anti-American racism. These "Black" people you speak of are American Citizens, whom you wish to deport to a continent most have never seen. I grew up in Georgia, born in the 50's and know full well what "White Nationalism" means. You are certainly not ten, I doubt the picture you post is your own, unless it was your picture when you were ten. 

PaPa, I think he was just saying explain things in a way that a ten year old could understand, not that he was ten years old.

His picture is of Helmuth Huebner, who wiki calls the youngest opponent ever executed by the Germans of the Third Reich.  An interesting choice if he is not trolling, pushing buttons for the fun of it or for some foolish morality play.

According to his profile, he signed on in 2007.

The earlier posts describe his beliefs as libertarian, with an objection to the government forcing people into morality...little or no laws should be made for drugs, etc.

I am wondering how he thinks 100 million will migrate without being forced to do so or what countries will accept those 100 million without being forced to do so....

And since he exalts rationality, how is this migration going to be paid for without bankrupting the US and many of the countries that would take in the immigrants.

Edited August 15, 2017 by Calm

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Calm said:

PaPa, I think he was just saying explain things in a way that a ten year old could understand, not that he was ten years old.

His picture is of Helmuth Huebner, who wiki calls the youngest opponent ever executed by the Germans of the Third Reich.  An interesting choice if he is not trolling, pushing buttons for the fun of it or for some foolish morality play.

According to his profile, he signed on in 2007.

The earlier posts describe his beliefs as libertarian, with an objection to the government forcing people into morality...little or no laws should be made for drugs, etc.

I am wondering how he thinks 100 million will migrate without being forced to do so or what countries will accept those 100 million without being forced to do so....

And since he exalts rationality, how is this migration going to be paid for without bankrupting the US and many of the countries that would take in the immigrants.

Thank you for the clarification, having not seen others posts (or not aware of doing so) I did have to make some assumptions, something I don't like doing. So forgive me making that leap. As for his suggestions and comments about deporting Americans...which of course Americian Citizens, are not deportated back to the homelands of their ancestries. I am Scot-Irish, but I have never been. I've been to England while living in Germany for a week long Temple trip, which of course I have English blood as well, but that would be like sending me to a world I do not know. My family has been in this great Nation on both parents side since before we were a Nation. My wife's great-great Grandmother is Cherokee, which means a part of her family has probably been here since the last ice age. As for the "how" he speaks of, I have known people like that for my entire 60 years, all that matters is that those they hate, are anywhere but here, despite the cost. So there is nothing rational about such ideas, despite his trying to seem rational. 

[The Nehor]

4 hours ago, Bill "Papa" Lee said:

He is not talking of might have been done (well actually done on a smaller model by President Monroe), he is talking about today. Yes the Civil War would have come earlier, or the slave holders would have murdered them rather than surrender them. Something that many did in the final months of the Civil War, and the very aim of General Forest when he formed the KKK. His mindset and others were, "if I can't have them, then no one will", including their own lives. 

For an example of brutality and also to annoy those who want General Lee to be a tragic hero who opposed slavery, when General Lee invaded Pennsylvania he enslaved free blacks in the path of the army and sent them south. When black Union soldiers were captured by the Confederacy they were officially ordered killed. Lincoln told Davis that if this happened the Union would start killing Confederate POWs. So instead they were used as slave labor, some were returned to former owners, some sold them and split the proceeds, some were killed when they surrendered and the death made to appear as a normal battlefield death.

The POW situation was bad. In the beginning prisoner exchanges were normal but the Confederacy refused to trade black soldiers, considering them property. Lincoln suspended exchanges until they agreed to rescind the policy. This really hurt the Confederacy as they had a MUCH greater need for manpower. Some have suggested Lincoln made the demand to give political cover for not exchanging prisoners to weaken the Confederate army.

Yeah, they were hardened in slavery. They would not give up because someone offered to buy the slaves or let them go.

Lee described slavery as a moral and political evil and his saying that made some believe he was anti-slavery but he explained that statement:

"I think it however a greater evil to the white man than to the black race, & while my feelings are strongly enlisted in behalf of the latter, my sympathies are more strong for the former. The blacks are immeasurably better off here than in Africa, morally, socially & physically. The painful discipline they are undergoing, is necessary for their instruction as a race, & I hope will prepare & lead them to better things. How long their subjugation may be necessary is known & ordered by a wise Merciful Providence. Their emancipation will sooner result from the mild & melting influence of Christianity, than the storms & tempests of fiery Controversy."

Yeah, he thought that slavery was hurting the white slaveowners the most. Hard to find a more brazen summation of the "White Man's Burden".

[Guest]

1 hour ago, The Nehor said:

For an example of brutality and also to annoy those who want General Lee to be a tragic hero who opposed slavery, when General Lee invaded Pennsylvania he enslaved free blacks in the path of the army and sent them south. When black Union soldiers were captured by the Confederacy they were officially ordered killed. Lincoln told Davis that if this happened the Union would start killing Confederate POWs. So instead they were used as slave labor, some were returned to former owners, some sold them and split the proceeds, some were killed when they surrendered and the death made to appear as a normal battlefield death.

The POW situation was bad. In the beginning prisoner exchanges were normal but the Confederacy refused to trade black soldiers, considering them property. Lincoln suspended exchanges until they agreed to rescind the policy. This really hurt the Confederacy as they had a MUCH greater need for manpower. Some have suggested Lincoln made the demand to give political cover for not exchanging prisoners to weaken the Confederate army.

Yeah, they were hardened in slavery. They would not give up because someone offered to buy the slaves or let them go.

Lee described slavery as a moral and political evil and his saying that made some believe he was anti-slavery but he explained that statement:

"I think it however a greater evil to the white man than to the black race, & while my feelings are strongly enlisted in behalf of the latter, my sympathies are more strong for the former. The blacks are immeasurably better off here than in Africa, morally, socially & physically. The painful discipline they are undergoing, is necessary for their instruction as a race, & I hope will prepare & lead them to better things. How long their subjugation may be necessary is known & ordered by a wise Merciful Providence. Their emancipation will sooner result from the mild & melting influence of Christianity, than the storms & tempests of fiery Controversy."

Yeah, he thought that slavery was hurting the white slaveowners the most. Hard to find a more brazen summation of the "White Man's Burden".

This was constant problem, President Lincoln, in the beginning of the war said he would take back the Southern States with every slave in chains. For the first part of the war, he would send them back if they escaped to the North. General Lee, was not a slave owner, and did not want Virginia to leave the Union. He was offered command of all the Union Army, but followed Virginia into the war. At that time, Federal Law required all slaves who ran from bondage, to be returned. Simply put, racism and white supremacy, was the order of the day. Not sure why you used my thread to single out Lee, we share the same last name, but I am not related to him. Least any think so and taint my family...confused.  So on that note, maybe this "Lee" should retire from the field. 

Edited August 16, 2017 by Bill "Papa" Lee

[The Nehor]

3 minutes ago, Bill "Papa" Lee said:

This was constant problem, President Lincoln, in the beginning of the war said he would take back the Southern States with every slave in chains. For the first part of the war, he would send them back if they escaped to the North. General Lee, was not a slave owner, and did not want Virginia to leave the Union. He was offered command of all the Union Army, but followed Virginia into the war. At that time, Federal Law required all slaves who ran from bondage, to be returned. Simply put, racism and white supremacy, was the order of the day. Not sure why you used my thread to single out Lee, we share the same last name, but I am not related to him. Least any think so and taint my family...confused.  

Lee was a slaveowner. He broke with local tradition and broke up multiple families by hiring parts of families out to other plantations. When Lee took over a plantation in Arlington he nearly caused a slave revolt because they had expected to be freed when their previous master died. Lee came up with a facile interpretation of the will allowing him to retain them for a while until a court forced Lee to release them. When he captured escaped slaves he lacerated them and then washed their backs in brine. His army kidnapped free blacks. He allowed atrocities against captured black soldiers.

After the war he counseled his family not to hire freedmen. He later ran a college complete with a KKK chapter and his punishments for racial crimes on campus were notoriously lax.

 

There are Confederate officers who redeemed themselves. I like Longstreet:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Longstreet#Postbellum_life

[bluebell]

20 hours ago, Tacenda said:

You get out, the Native American Indian was here first. In fact where I live, Utah, was Mexico!

My daughter and two grandsons would be awful sad to see their dad sent to Mexico, since he's Mexican.  

BTW, have you had your DNA checked, you may not be as white as you think you are. America has been considered a melting pot for as long as I remember. You almost sound like Hitler in your post, it's scary. I know this thread will get shut down, maybe on my account. But I just had to state this, and I'm so upset by your words, I can't get my words out as well as I'd like. 

I watched a clip yesterday where people were interviewed about their heritage and they were all very proud and some expressed deep dislike for other areas (these were all European and Asian people, from what I could see).  Then they did DNA tests and it was hilarious to watch these people find out that they weren't 'pure' anything and that a lot of them were a percentage of the nationality that they specifically didn't like.  

[Guest]

50 minutes ago, The Nehor said:

Lee was a slaveowner. He broke with local tradition and broke up multiple families by hiring parts of families out to other plantations. When Lee took over a plantation in Arlington he nearly caused a slave revolt because they had expected to be freed when their previous master died. Lee came up with a facile interpretation of the will allowing him to retain them for a while until a court forced Lee to release them. When he captured escaped slaves he lacerated them and then washed their backs in brine. His army kidnapped free blacks. He allowed atrocities against captured black soldiers.

After the war he counseled his family not to hire freedmen. He later ran a college complete with a KKK chapter and his punishments for racial crimes on campus were notoriously lax.

 

There are Confederate officers who redeemed themselves. I like Longstreet:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Longstreet#Postbellum_life

Once again, why did you use my post to get this ball rolling? There was much more to him and almost every founding Father (who were slave holders), and my position is clear on how I feel about the Civil War and slavery. Just because I am also a "Lee" does not mean I need a lecture. Once again, despite my many studies of the man, I am not related to General Lee, I did not bring him up in any way in the thread. Either way, I love the name my Father gave me when he adopted me, so I will not be changing my name to "Longstreet" or anything else. So again, I write least I be guilty by association for being a "Lee". Wow.

[The Nehor]

7 minutes ago, Bill "Papa" Lee said:

Once again, why did you use my post to get this ball rolling? There was much more to him and almost every founding Father (who were slave holders), and my position is clear on how I feel about the Civil War and slavery. Just because I am also a "Lee" does not mean I need a lecture. Once again, despite my many studies of the man, I am not related to General Lee, I did not bring him up in any way in the thread. Either way, I love the name my Father gave me when he adopted me, so I will not be changing my name to "Longstreet" or anything else. So again, I write least I be guilty by association for being a "Lee". Wow.

I did not quote you because your name is Lee. I would not even know if that is your real name. I quoted you because your post was a springboard to discussions of how the South would not give up their slaves even if reimbursed in some way.

[Guest]

37 minutes ago, The Nehor said:

I did not quote you because your name is Lee. I would not even know if that is your real name. I quoted you because your post was a springboard to discussions of how the South would not give up their slaves even if reimbursed in some way.

So be it, but you truly you "would not even know if that is [my] your real name". Don't know had turned into two replies about General Lee alone. 

[The Nehor]

1 hour ago, Bill "Papa" Lee said:

So be it, but you truly you "would not even know if that is [my] your real name". Don't know had turned into two replies about General Lee alone. 

I felt it related to what you said. It was not an attack on you; it was an attempt to get on a soapbox and scream at the whole world. I am obnoxious that way.

[BlueDreams]

2 hours ago, bluebell said:

I watched a clip yesterday where people were interviewed about their heritage and they were all very proud and some expressed deep dislike for other areas (these were all European and Asian people, from what I could see).  Then they did DNA tests and it was hilarious to watch these people find out that they weren't 'pure' anything and that a lot of them were a percentage of the nationality that they specifically didn't like.  

Do you still have it? I love those sort of videos. THey're so entertaining!

[bluebell]

5 minutes ago, BlueDreams said:

Do you still have it? I love those sort of videos. THey're so entertaining!

I'll look tomorrow and see if I can find it.