One woman speaker

[Rain]

It's not a Utah thing. It is a ward or stake thing. I've been in many Utah meetings where women were last. 

I always choose to go first rather than last if I have a choice. Too often the last speaker is left with a couple of minutes or less and if I was asked to give a 10-15 minute talk I don't want to be cutting everything out at the last minute.

Edited April 19, 2017 by Rain

[rongo]

19 hours ago, Rain said:

It's not a Utah thing. It is a ward or stake thing.

It might not only be a ward or stake thing, but rather, dependent on the particular speaking line-up for that Sunday. For example, I've had couples speak where the wife is by far the better speaker (and can be counted on to speak for at least 15-20 minutes) and the husband is going to be lucky to give a youth speaker-length talk. It's a no-brainer that the wife bats clean-up on that particular Sunday. 

Sometimes it just depends.

Interesting to me was our former stake presidency's focus on the presiding authority always saying something at the end (and nobody speaking after the presiding officer, including the man conducting to give the closing song and prayer). When Bishop Burton was at our stake conference and the 2nd counselor turned the time over to him at the end of the meeting, he politely waved him on and had him close out the meeting. I really liked that. There is no one way that many things have to be done, and this includes most aspects of how meetings are run.

[Rain]

33 minutes ago, rongo said:

It might not only be a ward or stake thing, but rather, dependent on the particular speaking line-up for that Sunday. For example, I've had couples speak where the wife is by far the better speaker (and can be counted on to speak for at least 15-20 minutes) and the husband is going to be lucky to give a youth speaker-length talk. It's a no-brainer that the wife bats clean-up on that particular Sunday. 

Sometimes it just depends.

Interesting to me was our former stake presidency's focus on the presiding authority always saying something at the end (and nobody speaking after the presiding officer, including the man conducting to give the closing song and prayer). When Bishop Burton was at our stake conference and the 2nd counselor turned the time over to him at the end of the meeting, he politely waved him on and had him close out the meeting. I really liked that. There is no one way that many things have to be done, and this includes most aspects of how meetings are run.

I was thinking more if this is done every single week.  If you never see a woman speak last in a ward you attend every week I don't think it is often going to be like you were suggesting.

It would be interesting to see how often it does happen. 

[HappyJackWagon]

1 minute ago, Rain said:

I was thinking more if this is done every single week.  If you never see a woman speak last in a ward you attend every week I don't think it is often going to be like you were suggesting.

It would be interesting to see how often it does happen. 

Our Stake had a requirement that a M. Priesthood holder be the final speaker. It was a hold-over idea from a very good and devout SP, but one that had to change. After he was released the process continued in the stake, not  purposefully, but because it's what people had known for 10 years. W either didn't know any different or we didn't remember.

When I was bishop, around year 3 I started mixing it up where sometimes a man would speak last, sometimes a woman. You wouldn't believe the amount of push-back I got for that. Same thing goes with the order of male/females praying. For some reason it had been a rule that a M. Priesthood holder open every meeting but a woman could say the benediction. Changing these cultural norms (or idiosyncrasies) can be really hard and takes time. Now that I've been released for a couple of years the trend continues where there is no hard rule about who speaks or prays in any particular order. It has become normalized.

Just remember, women didn't pray in sacrament meeting until the 1970's. It's hard to overcome our own cultural bias

 

[rongo]

3 minutes ago, HappyJackWagon said:

Same thing goes with the order of male/females praying. For some reason it had been a rule that a M. Priesthood holder open every meeting but a woman could say the benediction.

Weird. I have never had anyone say anything or bat an eye at our randomly-gendered prayer order (sometimes women pray first, sometimes last. Sometimes two women pray. Sometimes two men). 

[Rain]

3 minutes ago, HappyJackWagon said:

Our Stake had a requirement that a M. Priesthood holder be the final speaker. It was a hold-over idea from a very good and devout SP, but one that had to change. After he was released the process continued in the stake, not  purposefully, but because it's what people had known for 10 years. W either didn't know any different or we didn't remember.

When I was bishop, around year 3 I started mixing it up where sometimes a man would speak last, sometimes a woman. You wouldn't believe the amount of push-back I got for that. Same thing goes with the order of male/females praying. For some reason it had been a rule that a M. Priesthood holder open every meeting but a woman could say the benediction. Changing these cultural norms (or idiosyncrasies) can be really hard and takes time. Now that I've been released for a couple of years the trend continues where there is no hard rule about who speaks or prays in any particular order. It has become normalized.

Just remember, women didn't pray in sacrament meeting until the 1970's. It's hard to overcome our own cultural bias

 

Oh, I know.  My husband and I sometimes say to each other "You can change the doctrine, but DON'T change the tradition."

And no, the two of us don't believe the doctrine really changes though many will argue that one with me.   

[Thinking]

On 4/3/2017 at 10:39 AM, stemelbow said:

Why?  just why?  Hasn't the Church tried to show that it's wanting to improve on getting a woman's voice involved?  Now this?

Come on.

Did the Church just reveal its cards by not really caring what women have to say and whether they contribute? 

Kate Kelly was scheduled to speak, but she cancelled.

[rongo]

1 minute ago, Thinking said:

Kate Kelly was scheduled to speak, but she cancelled.

She was miffed that active Mormons didn't donate enough to her gofundme for a new laptop . . .