Church takes public position on the transgender law

[Duncan]

Just now, Bernard Gui said:

One does not have to be anyphobic in order to be uncomfortable sharing a stall. 

same as me, I was changing in the Temple change room some years ago and this man was lecturing me about this isn't a change room and like, um ,why are their lockers here then you bozo? he was watching me change, and as I say I have nothing to hide but you know other people may not like people looking at them changing

[carbon dioxide]

36 minutes ago, Tacenda said:

I would feel fine, honestly. It's the homophobes ad transgenderphobes that scare me.

It is rare to find them however.  There are true homophobes out there but most alleged ones simply are people who do not like homosexuality or agree with it.  Transgenderphobes are probably even harder to find.  I am an old school guy.  Male is male and female is female.  I refuse to call boys girls and girls boys because someone thinks in their mind they are the opposite sex.  I would rather die than give into this stuff.

Edited February 18, 2017 by carbon dioxide

[carbon dioxide]

29 minutes ago, Duncan said:

I don't care who uses the facilities next to me or follows me in or anything-I don't look and I have nothing to be ashamed of  when my son was small I went into the washroom with him and just waited, in case he needed help. People should be concerned about their kids and washrooms but go in with them or wait outside

As long as they announce it.  There are people who don't want to use the restroom with these people or want to be a part of this process to legitimize it.  They have a right to at least opt out and leave the bathroom. 

[Bernard Gui]

Quote

 Are there laws that clearly prohibit discrimination against transgender people? 

Yes. Our state anti-discrimination law, known as the Washington Law Against Discrimination (WLAD), clearly prohibits discrimination because of “gender expression or identity.” 

The WLAD protects people from discrimination based on gender expression or actual or perceived gender identity in the following areas: 

• Public accommodations (i.e., places that serve the public), including restaurants, hotels, and public schools.......

 What does “gender expression or identity” mean under the law? 

As defined in the WLAD, “gender expression or identity” means “having or being perceived as having a gender identity, self-image, appearance, behavior, or expression, whether or not that gender identity, self-image, appearance, behavior, or expression is different from that traditionally associated with the sex assigned to that person at birth.”1 Under this definition, transgender individuals are protected by the WLAD from discrimination based on their transgender status. 

 Do laws prohibiting discrimination based on “sex” protect transgender people? 

Yes. The U.S. Court of Appeals for the Ninth Circuit – whose jurisdiction includes Washington – has made clear that transgender people are protected from sexual harassment and discrimination based on their gender expression or identity under the federal Title VII law, which prohibits discrimination in employment. The U.S. Court of Appeals for the Fourth Circuit has held that transgender people are protected from sexual harassment and discrimination based on their gender expression or identity under the federal Title IX law, which prohibits discrimination based on sex in education programs or activities that receive federal funding. In May 2016, the U.S. Department of Justice (DOJ) filed a lawsuit against North Carolina asserting that a state law that requires public agencies to deny transgender people access to gender-segregated facilities based on their gender identity violates federal civil rights laws, including Title VII and Title IX. 

Several federal agencies have expanded protections for transgender people across the nation. In 2012, the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC) – the agency responsible for enforcing anti-discrimination provisions under Title VII – held that federal law prohibits discrimination against transgender employees. In 2014, DOJ also announced that Title VII protects people from discrimination based on gender identity, including transgender status. The U.S. Department of Labor (DOL) adopted a similar view and has recently proposed regulations explicitly clarifying protections for transgender workers. The U.S. Department of Housing and Urban Development (HUD) declared in 2012 that housing discrimination based on gender nonconformity violates the federal Fair Housing Act and adopted regulations prohibiting discrimination on the basis of gender expression or identity in federally funded housing programs. Under the federal Title IX education law, the U.S. Department of Education (ED) affirmed in 2014 that public and private schools receiving federal funding may not discriminate against transgender students. In May 2016, DOJ and ED issued a joint guidance letter reiterating that Title IX protects transgender people from discrimination.2 

 Does the U.S. Constitution protect transgender people from discrimination? 

Yes. In 2011, the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Eleventh Circuit became the first federal court to recognize that discrimination on the basis of transgender identity violates the Equal Protection Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment. In this ruling the court stated that sex discrimination encompasses discrimination on the basis of gender identity or expression. 

Know Your Rights: A Guide for Transgender People in Washington | 4 

Although the U.S. Supreme Court has not ruled on this issue, it is the ACLU’s position that the U.S. Constitution’s guarantee of equality protects individuals from being treated differently (i.e., discriminated against or mistreated) because of their gender expression or identity. The First Amendment, which bars the government from censoring speech or expression, protects people’s right to dress (an important form of personal expression) in a way that is consistent with their gender identity. And the Due Process Clause recognizes and protects individuals’ interests in determining and expressing their gender through personal appearance and mannerisms. 

 Does the law protect a transgender person’s right to use the restroom consistent with their gender identity? 

Yes. The WLAD specifically protects against discrimination in employment and places of public accommodation, including public schools, based on one’s gender expression or identity. The Washington State Human Rights Commission (HRC) – the state agency responsible for enforcing the WLAD – issued regulations in 2015 clarifying that the WLAD protects the right of transgender individuals to use restrooms and other gender-segregated facilities consistent with their gender identity. 

Federal agencies have determined that federal civil rights law protect a transgender person’s right to use restrooms and other gender-segregated facilities consistent with their gender identity. In 2015, the U.S. Department of Education determined that an Illinois school district violated the federal Title IX law by denying a transgender student access to a gender-appropriate locker room. A federal appeals court has also held that schools that bar students from using gender identity-appropriate restrooms discriminate based on sex in violation of Title IX. As mentioned above, in May 2016, the U.S. Department of Justice and U.S. Department of Education issued a joint guidance letter reiterating that Title IX protects transgender people from discrimination and requires schools to allow transgender students to access sex-segregated facilities consistent with their gender identity. The U.S. Department of Justice has also filed a lawsuit against North Carolina asserting that a state law that requires public agencies to deny transgender people access to gender-segregated facilities based on their gender identity violates federal civil rights laws, including Title VII and Title IX. 

Additional support for the rights of transgender students in public schools to use restrooms consistent with their gender identity may be found in the state Office of Superintendent of Public Instruction (OSPI) guidelines to school districts. These guidelines, which relate to the elimination of discrimination in public schools, state that school districts should allow students to use the restrooms consistent with their gender identity consistently asserted at school. The guidelines also state that any student who has a need or desire for increased privacy should be provided access to an alternative restroom, such as a staff or health office restroom, but that no student should be required to use an alternative restroom just because they are transgender or gender nonconforming. 

 Are there laws that specifically protect transgender students from discrimination? 

Yes. Washington law protects transgender students in public schools from discrimination, intimidation, bullying, and harassment. Since provisions of the WLAD took effect in 2006, the nondiscrimination policies of Washington public schools have included gender expression and identity. In 2010, the 

Know Your Rights: A Guide for Transgender People in Washington | 5 

Washington Legislature passed a law requiring that public school policies protect transgender students from bullying and harassment. 

If you are being harassed, intimidated, or bullied in school, keep a record of each incident and report them to your principal or counselor. To talk to someone outside of your school or to get more information on strategies to stop harassment, call the Safe Schools Coalition at 1-877-723-3723 or visit www.safeschoolscoalition.org/help_harassed.html 

Additionally, the WLAD and the Office of Superintendent of Public Instruction (OSPI) require public school officials to allow transgender students to wear clothing that matches their gender identity (including at proms), call transgender students by the appropriate name and pronoun, provide transgender students with access to safe and appropriate restrooms and locker rooms (or appropriate alternative places in which to change for gym class), and accommodate transgender athletes. For transgender students participating in interscholastic athletics in public schools, OSPI regulations direct school districts to follow policies set forth by the Washington Interscholastic Activities Association (WIAA), which state that students should be allowed to participate in physical education and athletic activities in a manner that is consistent with their gender identity.3 

Further, the U.S. Department of Education clarified in 2014 that under Title IX of the Education Amendments of 1972, public schools and private schools that receive federal funding may not discriminate against transgender students on the basis of their gender expression or identity. In 2015, the U.S. Department of Education determined that an Illinois school district violated the federal Title IX law by denying a transgender student access to a gender-appropriate locker room. A federal appeals court has also held that schools that bar students from using gender identity-appropriate restrooms discriminate based on sex in violation of Title IX. As mentioned above, in May 2016, the U.S. Department of Justice and U.S. Department of Education issued a joint guidance letter reiterating that Title IX protects transgender people from discrimination and requires schools to allow transgender students to access sex-segregated facilities consistent with their gender identity. The U.S. Department of Justice has also filed a lawsuit against North Carolina asserting that a state law that requires public agencies to deny transgender people access to gender-segregated facilities based on their gender identity violates federal Title IX law. 

It is the ACLU’s position that discrimination or harassment directed at transgender students in public schools may violate the Equal Protection Clause of the federal Constitution, under which we think schools should be held responsible for protecting transgender students from harassment on an equal basis with all other students; the First Amendment, which we think should protect the right of students to dress in accordance with their gender expression or identity; and the Due Process Clause, which we think should protect students’ liberty interest in their personal appearance.

Source: ACLU of Washington State.

 

This is one troubling part for me:

Quote

Our state anti-discrimination law, known as the Washington Law Against Discrimination (WLAD), clearly prohibits discrimination because of “gender expression or identity.” 

The WLAD protects people from discrimination based on gender expression or actual or perceived gender identity

And more:

Quote

NOTES ON WORDS AND PHRASES USED 

Terminology used to discuss gender expression and identity varies within transgender communities and has changed over time. To respect every individual’s right to self-identify as they choose, the term(s) preferred by an individual should always be used. For clarity, here is a general list of common words and phrases used in this guide and elsewhere: 

Transgender: A broad term for people whose gender identity, expression, or behavior is different from those typically associated with their assigned sex at birth. Some people prefer the term “trans,” an abbreviation for “transgender.” Please note: “Transgender” is correctly used as an adjective, not a noun – thus, “transgender people” is appropriate, but “transgenders” is often viewed as disrespectful. Use of the term as a past-tense verb – for instance, “transgendered” – is also often viewed as disrespectful. “Transsexual” is an older term for people whose gender identity is different from their assigned sex at birth and who seek to transition from male to female or female to male. Many people do not use or prefer the term “transsexual” because of its overly clinical association. 

Gender Expression: The way a person represents or expresses one’s gender identity to others, often through behavior, clothing, hairstyle, and/or voice or body characteristics. 

Gender Identity: A person’s internal sense of being male, female, or something else. Please note: Because gender identity is internal, a person’s gender identity is not necessarily visible to others. 

Sex: The classification of people as male or female based on a combination of bodily characteristics, including chromosomes, hormones, internal and external reproductive organs, and features that appear during puberty. 

Know Your Rights: A Guide for Transgender People in Washington | 17 

Gender Non-Conforming: A term for individuals whose gender expression is different from social expectations of masculinity and femininity. Please note: Not all gender non-conforming people identify as transgender, and not all transgender people are gender non-conforming. This term is not a synonym for “transgender.” 

(Gender) Transition: The time when a person begins living as the gender with which they identify rather than the gender they were assigned at birth, which often includes changing one’s first name, using new pronouns, and dressing and grooming differently. Transitioning may or may not also include medical and legal aspects, such as changing official documents (e.g., driver’s license) to reflect one’s gender identity, taking hormones, or having surgery. The exact steps involved in transition vary from person to person. 

Sex or Gender Confirmation Surgery: Surgical procedures that may be part of gender transition. Gender confirmation surgery may involve a wide variety of different procedures, including those sometimes referred to as “top surgery” (breast augmentation or removal) and “bottom surgery” (genital alteration). These surgeries are medically necessary for some people, but not all people want, need, or can have surgery as part of their transition. Please note: This term is preferable to the commonly used phrase “sex reassignment surgery,” which incorrectly suggests that all transgender people need surgery to “reassign” their sex before their gender identity can be respected. Many people consider “sex change surgery” and “sex change operation” to be derogatory terms. 

Gender Dysphoria: The formal medical diagnosis given to transgender individuals as a prerequisite for certain types of transition-related medical care. Please note: Formerly known as “Gender Identity Disorder,” this diagnostic term was revised to better characterize the experiences of transgender individuals and remove the negative connotations of “disorder.” 

Transgender Woman: A transgender person who currently identifies as a woman (see also “MTF”). 

MTF: A person who transitions from “male-to-female,” meaning a person who was assigned male at birth but identifies and lives as a female (see also “Transgender Woman”). 

Transgender Man: A transgender person who currently identifies as a man (see also “FTM”). 

FTM: A person who transitions from “female-to-male,” meaning a person who was assigned female at birth but identifies and lives as a male (see also “Transgender Man”). 

Queer: A term used to refer to lesbian, gay, bisexual, and often also transgender people. Some use queer as an alternative to “gay” in an effort to be more inclusive. Depending on the user, the term has either a derogatory or an affirming connotation, as many have sought to reclaim the term that was once widely used in a negative way. 

Genderqueer: A term used by some people who identify as neither entirely male nor entirely female. Please note: This term is not a synonym for “transgender.” 

Two-Spirit: A term that refers to historical and current First Nations people whose bodies simultaneously manifest both masculine and feminine spirits. This term is used by some people in Native American LGBT communities to honor their heritage and provide an alternative to Western labels of gay, lesbian, bisexual, or transgender.

Here in Washington, several YMCAs have opened their dressing rooms to whomever wants to use them, and have declared they will not challenge anyone who chooses to use a room opposite their apparent gender,

which leaves open the question of how do we determine if the man standing next to your daughter in the dressing room is or is not what he appears to be, since you can't ask him/her.

 

It's a strange world in which we live.

[Duncan]

Just now, carbon dioxide said:

As long as they announce it.  There are people who don't want to use the restroom with these people or want to be a part of this process to legitimize it.  They have a right to at least opt out and leave the bathroom. 

and this is what people are worried about? must be a nice life!

[Duncan]

Just now, Bernard Gui said:

Source: ACLU of Washington State.

 

This is one troubling part for me:

And more:

Here in Washington, several YMCAs have opened their dressing rooms to whomever wants to use them, and have declared they will not challenge anyone who chooses to use a room opposite their apparent gender,

which leaves open the question of how do we determine if the man standing next to your daughter in the dressing room is or is not what he appears to be, since you can't ask him/her.

 

It's a strange world in which we live.

don't transgendered people already have had the surgery? what would make that more uncomfortable then seeing a nekkid stranger?

[MormonVideoGame]

10 hours ago, Kenngo1969 said:

 Maybe not, but how that issue is addressed sure as heck can have more than an incidental impact on a religion 

How? Is it a sin for a man to use the women's restroom? Is it a sin for a gay man to use the men's restroom? 

10 hours ago, Kenngo1969 said:

Obergefell v. Hodges, the decision of the United States Supreme Court which legalized gay marriage nationwide, will eventually have a pernicious effect, not only on the traditional family, but on religious liberty

No one is going to force you to allow gays to use your restroom or the restrooms of your church building. Law makers always make exceptions for religious organizations that are acting as religious organizations. Laws won't affect a church project or practice when "its purpose is the inculcation of religious beliefs ".  

Edited February 18, 2017 by MormonVideoGame

[Bernard Gui]

9 minutes ago, Duncan said:

don't transgendered people already have had the surgery? what would make that more uncomfortable then seeing a nekkid stranger?

Quote

Our state anti-discrimination law, known as the Washington Law Against Discrimination (WLAD), clearly prohibits discrimination because of “gender expression or identity.” 

The WLAD protects people from discrimination based on gender expression or actual or perceived gender identity

 

 What does “gender expression or identity” mean under the law? 

As defined in the WLAD, “gender expression or identity” means “having or being perceived as having a gender identity, self-image, appearance, behavior, or expression, whether or not that gender identity, self-image, appearance, behavior, or expression is different from that traditionally associated with the sex assigned to that person at birth.”1 Under this definition, transgender individuals are protected by the WLAD from discrimination based on their transgender status. 

See anything here about surgery? Even if you simply perceive yourself as another gender, the law applies. How do you determine if someone perceives something?

Would someone with just a perception follow through with making the surgical/chemical transitions?

Edited February 18, 2017 by Bernard Gui

[MormonVideoGame]

Can someone please explain "We do not believe it just to mingle religious influence with civil government" - D&C Section 134

and  "My kingdom is not of this world." - John 18:36 

Is there any evidence in the scriptures that god wants gentile countries to have religious-based  laws?  

Edited February 18, 2017 by MormonVideoGame

[Duncan]

Just now, Bernard Gui said:

See anything here about surgery?

or anything about them being a threat to society?

[Bernard Gui]

2 minutes ago, Duncan said:

or anything about them being a threat to society?

Can you come up with a scenario that might be objectionable? I can.

[Bernard Gui]

 

Facebook/ABC News genders:

• Quote

   

  • Agender
  • Androgyne
  • Androgynous
  • Bigender
  • Cis
  • Cisgender
  • Cis Female
  • Cis Male
  • Cis Man
  • Cis Woman
  • Cisgender Female
  • Cisgender Male
  • Cisgender Man
  • Cisgender Woman
  • Female to Male
  • FTM
  • Gender Fluid
  • Gender Nonconforming
  • Gender Questioning
  • Gender Variant
  • Genderqueer
  • Intersex
  • Male to Female
  • MTF
  • Neither
  • Neutrois
  • Non-binary
  • Other
  • Pangender
  • Trans
  • Trans*
  • Trans Female
  • Trans* Female
  • Trans Male
  • Trans* Male
  • Trans Man
  • Trans* Man
  • Trans Person
  • Trans* Person
  • Trans Woman
  • Trans* Woman
  • Transfeminine
  • Transgender
  • Transgender Female
  • Transgender Male
  • Transgender Man
  • Transgender Person
  • Transgender Woman
  • Transmasculine
  • Transsexual
  • Transsexual Female
  • Transsexual Male
  • Transsexual Man
  • Transsexual Person
  • Transsexual Woman
  • Two-Spirit

   

  Makes your head spin.

You can only be Two-Spirit if you are Native American.

Or makes you see dots.

Edited February 18, 2017 by Bernard Gui

[Bernard Gui]

9 minutes ago, MormonVideoGame said:

Can someone please explain "We do not believe it just to mingle religious influence with civil government" - D&C Section 134

and  "My kingdom is not of this world." - John 18:36 

Is there any evidence in the scriptures that god wants gentile countries to have religious-based  laws?  

Could you clarify what you mean by "religious-based laws?"

[Tacenda]

It almost has the feel of the days blacks couldn't use white only restrooms, when we look at the possibility of ward buildings being forced to let transgender people use the restroom.

What I think the church is afraid of is not being allowed to stop a transgender from being baptised or going to the temple. Just like when the church wanted to stop gay marriage. They don't want to be forced into letting SSM happen in temples, IMO.

Mark my words that the church will have a policy or a revelation that transgenders can't be baptised nor their children.

Where is Scott Lloyd when you need him and his time clock? Maybe he'll come on here after his absence. But I don't mean this to be snarky at all, I'm very serious.  

[Bernard Gui]

In our state, the YMCA has declared that transgender people can use the locker room of their choice and that employees and patrons cannot question their presence.

So,

If I am uncomfortable with the situation, my only recourse is to leave or take my child from the room, and that is what has been suggested.

Is this fair?

I have no way to determine the perceived gender of the person standing next to me because I cannot ask and cannot object even if I could determine it.

Does this make sense?

What is the difference (from my point of view) between a person pretending to be transgender who is just getting his/her jollies and a person who is transgender

and just wants to be in a room with people he/she perceives to be like him/her? 

 

This is akin to the Boy Scout dilemma....

A girl who thinks she is a girl cannot join Boy Scouts, but a girl who thinks she is a boy can. In the end, what difference does it make?

 

 

Edited February 18, 2017 by Bernard Gui

[carbon dioxide]

5 minutes ago, Duncan said:

or anything about them being a threat to society?

Transgender people are not a threat to society anymore than a man who believes he is a turtle is a threat to society.  My only problem with transgender people is if there is some expectation on ME to refer to them according to their gender identity verses their biological gender.  They can be whatever they want to be.  I however have a right to not be involved in this.  I have a right not to view them according to their identity.  Gender is not an identity to me.   I have a right to refer to Bruce Jenner as Bruce and not his new name.  I have a right to use a restroom designated for men and not have females use it.  My wife has the right to use a restroom designated for women and not have men use it.  As long as we are not forced to participate, I have no problem with transgender people dressing, acting, and doing what they want in their personal lives.

[carbon dioxide]

3 minutes ago, Bernard Gui said:

This is akin to the Boy Scout dilemma....

A girl cannot join Boy Scouts, but a girl who thinks she is a boy can. In the end, what difference does it make?

Yes and I guess the way to fight this is just let girls in.  Since the scouts are already letting girls into the scouting program just under a different label, might as well not discriminate and let all girls in.

[Bernard Gui]

53 minutes ago, Tacenda said:

It almost has the feel of the days blacks couldn't use white only restrooms, when we look at the possibility of ward buildings being forced to let transgender people use the restroom.

What I think the church is afraid of is not being allowed to stop a transgender from being baptised or going to the temple. Just like when the church wanted to stop gay marriage. They don't want to be forced into letting SSM happen in temples, IMO.

Mark my words that the church will have a policy or a revelation that transgenders can't be baptised nor their children.

Where is Scott Lloyd when you need him and his time clock? Maybe he'll come on here after his absence. But I don't mean this to be snarky at all, I'm very serious.  

Are you saying that all rest/locker/dressing/privacy rooms should be made open to anyone with no restrictions?

Edited February 18, 2017 by Bernard Gui

[Bernard Gui]

2 minutes ago, carbon dioxide said:

Yes and I guess the way to fight this is just let girls in.  Since the scouts are already letting girls into the scouting program just under a different label, might as well not discriminate and let all girls in.

So, are you saying that all rest/locker/dressing/privacy rooms should be made open to anyone with no restriction, not discriminate and let everyone in?

[Bernard Gui]

7 minutes ago, carbon dioxide said:

Transgender people are not a threat to society anymore than a man who believes he is a turtle is a threat to society.  My only problem with transgender people is if there is some expectation on ME to refer to them according to their gender identity verses their biological gender.  They can be whatever they want to be.  I however have a right to not be involved in this.  I have a right not to view them according to their identity.  Gender is not an identity to me.   I have a right to refer to Bruce Jenner as Bruce and not his new name.  I have a right to use a restroom designated for men and not have females use it.  My wife has the right to use a restroom designated for women and not have men use it.  As long as we are not forced to participate, I have no problem with transgender people dressing, acting, and doing what they want in their personal lives.

But the issue is force....read the Washington ACLU information above.

[carbon dioxide]

4 minutes ago, Bernard Gui said:

So, are you saying that all rest/locker/dressing/privacy rooms should be made open to anyone with no restriction, not discriminate and let everyone in?

No.  Just in regards to scouting.  By letting girls into scouting, at least it does not allow any confusion on the issue that boys and girls are still boys and girls and the transgender can't shift from one to the other.  I am still for restrooms and lockers being based on biological terms.  Not only am I against it but if a transgender does come in the bathroom with me, I will make an issue of it.  I will not be a silent participant in this.  I have rights too.

Edited February 18, 2017 by carbon dioxide

[carbon dioxide]

7 minutes ago, Bernard Gui said:

But the issue is force....read the Washington ACLU information above.

Yes it is force.  That is what makes me angry about it.  I don't care if some guy wants to wear a dress and put on make up. Whatever makes him happy is fine with me.  It just when it is said that I MUST view him as a woman and refer to him as Ms. or Mrs. so and so.  That part I am not going to play along.   I have specific standards of what men and women are.  They are standards that have been universally accepted across cultures and generations of time.  Just because we have entered the 21st century does not mean we should lose are minds and accept things would would not normally accept in the name of acceptance.

[Duncan]

Just now, Bernard Gui said:

Can you come up with a scenario that might be objectionable? I can.

some one attacks the transgendered person or someone claiming to be transgendered tries to molest a child, which is why I suggested a parent goes in there for the kid's safety-that could happen with a fake trans person or a non trans person (I had a branch president who molested his daughter)

[Bernard Gui]

30 minutes ago, carbon dioxide said:

No.  Just in regards to scouting.  By letting girls into scouting, at least it does not allow any confusion on the issue that boys and girls are still boys and girls and the transgender can't shift from one to the other.  I am still for restrooms and lockers being based on biological terms.  Not only am I against it but if a transgender does come in the bathroom with me, I will make an issue of it.  I will not be a silent participant in this.  I have rights too.

My issues with Scouting are privacy....tents, latrines, showers, swimming, etc. It's asking a lot of boys and young men to ignore the obvious in pursuit of some supposed egalitarian agenda. I agree with your take on privacy rights.

Edited February 18, 2017 by Bernard Gui

[Bernard Gui]

9 minutes ago, Duncan said:

some one attacks the transgendered person or someone claiming to be transgendered tries to molest a child, which is why I suggested a parent goes in there for the kid's safety-that could happen with a fake trans person or a non trans person (I had a branch president who molested his daughter)

Those would probably be rare, but certainly possible. I would have issues with being in a locker room with my daughter or wife and a person pretending to be or even believing he was a woman. I would have issues even if I weren't in the room. Would I have to be there for their protection?

Edited February 18, 2017 by Bernard Gui