danielwoods Posted March 28, 2014 Posted March 28, 2014 http://godsnotdeadthemovie.com Just wondering if anyone has seen it and what they thought. I loved the movie. I mentioned it to a couple of my friends (LDS) and they hadn't even heard of it. One said they wanted to see it. Just wondering if anyone had seen it, or are planning on seeing it and your thoughts?
Popular Post The Nehor Posted March 28, 2014 Popular Post Posted March 28, 2014 To be fair He was dead for a while but He got better. 11
Buzzard Posted March 28, 2014 Posted March 28, 2014 Hadn't heard of it. Maybe I'll rent the movie when my Evangelical friends rent "Singles Ward".
Kenngo1969 Posted March 28, 2014 Posted March 28, 2014 To be fair He was dead for a while but He got better. As will we all, Nehor. As will we all. 1
mfbukowski Posted March 29, 2014 Posted March 29, 2014 (edited) Perhaps those who have no idea what Nietzsche was saying should not comment on it. Joseph Smith said that all churches were an "abomination" and taught false doctrines about who God was. To me, that says he is "dead" because he is forgotten in our lives and that Christianity worshiped a false idol. Funny, I would think that was consistent with the idea of the need for a Restoration. Nehor is exactly right- he WAS dead, and now truth belief has been restored. So yes, the god that Nietzsche was talking about IS dead. You know how EV's say we worship a different God? They are right! The old one is dead. Edited March 29, 2014 by mfbukowski 2
mfbukowski Posted March 29, 2014 Posted March 29, 2014 Hadn't heard of it. Maybe I'll rent the movie when my Evangelical friends rent "Singles Ward". That's it- it's EV propaganda. No real professor would teach like that. I know of many atheists who see religion and belief in God as a completely rational choice- just not one they agree with. No one schooled in philosophy today in any real university would teach that- there is no basis for attacking students beliefs that way. I can imagine some yahoo in some backwoods junior college doing that, but not anyone who would be taken seriously. The mere ignorance of other positions than that of atheism would disqualify him as a professor, in my opinion. The question of God is very complex. It's just a David and Goliath thing, with the little EV kid taking on the big hairy atheist and winning. Yawn. 1
mormonnewb Posted March 29, 2014 Posted March 29, 2014 Perhaps those who have no idea what Nietzsche was saying should not comment on it. Joseph Smith said that all churches were an "abomination" and taught false doctrines about who God was. To me, that says he is "dead" because he is forgotten in our lives and that Christianity worshiped a false idol. Funny, I would think that was consistent with the idea of the need for a Restoration. Nehor is exactly right- he WAS dead, and now truth belief has been restored.Lucky for God, we Mormons were able to come to His rescue. I'll pray for Him that we never go into apostasy.You know, I once thought that the whole "one true church" thing was a tad arrogant. However, the idea that God owes His very life (or at least, well being) to OUR correct knowledge of Him. Well, as we always say, "As man so believes, God is. And if God is lucky, Mormons will come along to revive Him."
mfbukowski Posted March 29, 2014 Posted March 29, 2014 (edited) "As man so believes, God is."No, God is actually evil and pours it down on us just for fun. He is made of green cheese and lives on the dark side of the moon. That's how he "really" is. Unfortunately if God is other than what man believes, we are in real trouble because he can't communicate with us, or worse, doesn't want to. Regardless he becomes irrelevant in our lives. So yes, God IS what man believes- generally. Some beliefs work better than others. Certainly a vague God who is transcendent and cannot hear and answer prayers is not only dead, he never existed. If he did, he would be some Platonic Form floating around and wouldn't care about little worms like you and me. THAT is the god Nietzsche said was dead- and he was right. Edited March 29, 2014 by mfbukowski
mfbukowski Posted March 29, 2014 Posted March 29, 2014 AND we do believe that his kingdom increases though us. A family is not a family without children. So yes, in a sense, God and man are all in this together. IN FACT GOD IS MAN. That is the flip side of what Nietzsche did NOT imagine. He was only half right
barbarbar Posted March 29, 2014 Posted March 29, 2014 That's it- it's EV propaganda. No real professor would teach like that. I know of many atheists who see religion and belief in God as a completely rational choice- just not one they agree with. No one schooled in philosophy today in any real university would teach that- there is no basis for attacking students beliefs that way. I can imagine some yahoo in some backwoods junior college doing that, but not anyone who would be taken seriously. The mere ignorance of other positions than that of atheism would disqualify him as a professor, in my opinion. The question of God is very complex. It's just a David and Goliath thing, with the little EV kid taking on the big hairy atheist and winning. Yawn.
barbarbar Posted March 29, 2014 Posted March 29, 2014 That's it- it's EV propaganda. No real professor would teach like that. I know of many atheists who see religion and belief in God as a completely rational choice- just not one they agree with. No one schooled in philosophy today in any real university would teach that- there is no basis for attacking students beliefs that way. I can imagine some yahoo in some backwoods junior college doing that, but not anyone who would be taken seriously. The mere ignorance of other positions than that of atheism would disqualify him as a professor, in my opinion. The question of God is very complex. It's just a David and Goliath thing, with the little EV kid taking on the big hairy atheist and winning. Yawn.My thoughts exactly when I saw the trailer.
The Nehor Posted March 29, 2014 Posted March 29, 2014 "God is dead. God remains dead. And we have killed him. Yet his shadow still looms. How shall we comfort ourselves, the murderers of all murderers? What was holiest and mightiest of all that the world has yet owned has bled to death under our knives: who will wipe this blood off us? What water is there for us to clean ourselves? What festivals of atonement, what sacred games shall we have to invent? Is not the greatness of this deed too great for us? Must we ourselves not become gods simply to appear worthy of it?"Yeah, not really saying what many think it means.
Bikeemikey Posted March 29, 2014 Posted March 29, 2014 "God is dead. God remains dead. And we have killed him. Yet his shadow still looms. How shall we comfort ourselves, the murderers of all murderers? What was holiest and mightiest of all that the world has yet owned has bled to death under our knives: who will wipe this blood off us? What water is there for us to clean ourselves? What festivals of atonement, what sacred games shall we have to invent? Is not the greatness of this deed too great for us? Must we ourselves not become gods simply to appear worthy of it?"Yeah, not really saying what many think it means.Thanks for the quote. I've always loved reading it!
mfbukowski Posted March 30, 2014 Posted March 30, 2014 "God is dead. God remains dead. And we have killed him. Yet his shadow still looms. How shall we comfort ourselves, the murderers of all murderers? What was holiest and mightiest of all that the world has yet owned has bled to death under our knives: who will wipe this blood off us? What water is there for us to clean ourselves? What festivals of atonement, what sacred games shall we have to invent? Is not the greatness of this deed too great for us? Must we ourselves not become gods simply to appear worthy of it?" Yeah, not really saying what many think it means.Read that last sentence again and think of exaltation. Yes he was bitter, but he understood that because man is God, the old god is indeed dead. Indeed the idea that we can become gods is what kills the false god without body parts or passions who is everywhere and nowhere simultaneously. I stand by my earlier statement.
mfbukowski Posted March 30, 2014 Posted March 30, 2014 Read that last sentence again and think of exaltation. Yes he was bitter, but he understood that because man is God, the old god is indeed dead. Indeed the idea that we can become gods is what kills the false god without body parts or passions who is everywhere and nowhere simultaneously. I stand by my earlier statement.Here's a quote from Jonathan Edwards I got from another thread: Here is some preaching from Jonathan Edwards. A popular revivalist and relevant contemporary of Joseph Smith. He was best known perhaps for his sermon that every early American schoolchild had read: “Sinners in the Hands of an Angry God.” He told his audience: The wrath of God is like great waters that are dammed for the present. . . . The God that holds you over the pit of hell, much as one holds a spider, or some loathsome insect over the fire, abhors you. And, for the unregenerate, he continued: When God beholds the ineffable extremity of your case, and sees your torment to be so vastly disproportioned to your strength, and sees how your poor soul is crushed, and sinks down, as it were, into an infinite gloom; he will have no compassion upon you . . . ; there shall be no moderation or mercy.1 THAT is the god Nietsche knew.
mfbukowski Posted March 30, 2014 Posted March 30, 2014 And then there is this: http://www.mormondialogue.org/topic/59598-imminent-death-of-evangelical-christianity/
danielwoods Posted March 31, 2014 Author Posted March 31, 2014 That's it- it's EV propaganda. No real professor would teach like that. I know of many atheists who see religion and belief in God as a completely rational choice- just not one they agree with. No one schooled in philosophy today in any real university would teach that- there is no basis for attacking students beliefs that way. I can imagine some yahoo in some backwoods junior college doing that, but not anyone who would be taken seriously. The mere ignorance of other positions than that of atheism would disqualify him as a professor, in my opinion. The question of God is very complex. It's just a David and Goliath thing, with the little EV kid taking on the big hairy atheist and winning. Yawn. I guess you weren't aware of all the cases that are just like the movie. http://www.alliancedefendingfreedom.org/home/detail/8843 "Today numerous Christians and student ministries on public tax-funded university and college campuses are experiencing the same crisis of discrimination Josh Wheaton faced in this film – threats, hostility, and unconstitutional policies restricting their religious liberty." And incase you are thinking that this only effects Evangelicals. Think again. Anyone who values the freedom to choose should be interested.
mfbukowski Posted March 31, 2014 Posted March 31, 2014 (edited) I guess you weren't aware of all the cases that are just like the movie.http://www.alliancedefendingfreedom.org/home/detail/8843"Today numerous Christians and student ministries on public tax-funded university and college campuses are experiencing the same crisis of discrimination Josh Wheaton faced in this film – threats, hostility, and unconstitutional policies restricting their religious liberty."And incase you are thinking that this only effects Evangelicals. Think again. Anyone who values the freedom to choose should be interested.You really need to read your own sources and stop making things up. NONE of these are "just like the movie", in fact none of them are ANYTHING like the movie NOT A SINGLE ONE OF THESE IS ABOUT SOMEONE IN A PHILOSOPHY CLASS BEING ATTACKED BY A PROFESSOR. The movie is based on a straw-man argument YES there is horrible discrimination against believers- and just being on these boards is clear enough evidence for anyone. But that is not the point. It is helpful if you actually respond to the argument instead of generating straw man arguments. It hurts your credibility. Edited March 31, 2014 by mfbukowski
danielwoods Posted March 31, 2014 Author Posted March 31, 2014 You really need to read your own sources and stop making things up. NONE of these are "just like the movie", in fact none of them are ANYTHING like the movie NOT A SINGLE ONE OF THESE IS ABOUT SOMEONE IN A PHILOSOPHY CLASS BEING ATTACKED BY A PROFESSOR. The movie is based on a straw-man argument YES there is horrible discrimination against believers- and just being on these boards is clear enough evidence for anyone. But that is not the point. It is helpful if you actually respond to the argument instead of generating straw man arguments. It hurts your credibility. So you've seen the movie and read all the 37 cases? Wow. Fact is the ADF calls them "Related Cases". You're saying they are not? What specific straw man argument are you accusing me of making?
mfbukowski Posted March 31, 2014 Posted March 31, 2014 (edited) So you've seen the movie and read all the 37 cases? Wow. Fact is the ADF calls them "Related Cases". You're saying they are not? What specific straw man argument are you accusing me of making? Yes I read the abstracts of all 37 cases. Not one of them had anything to do with a philosophy class.Incidentally the beta upsilon link doesn't work. That's proof I read all of them. Look up straw man arguments. Edited March 31, 2014 by mfbukowski 1
mfbukowski Posted March 31, 2014 Posted March 31, 2014 (edited) I guess you weren't aware of all the cases that are just like the movie.http://www.alliancedefendingfreedom.org/home/detail/8843 Your claim was that they were just like the movie. Not even one was. Edited March 31, 2014 by mfbukowski
danielwoods Posted March 31, 2014 Author Posted March 31, 2014 Your claim was that they were just like the movie. Not even one was. You are right. No one was in a philosophy class, no one named Josh and on and on... yet they are considered related. I see a correlation, you do not... Not sure it really matters. The point is faith is attacked in secular schools.
Rob Osborn Posted March 31, 2014 Posted March 31, 2014 (edited) Just so people know...My religious beliefs dealing with God and the bible get attacked constantly even by people on these boards. I am of the firm belief that even some good ol LDS are siding with the atheists and attacking those of us who believe in the Creator and that He was essential for life. There are even BYU professors now who do not know where God could possibly fit into nature other than perhaps god is the very result of nature itself! Edited March 31, 2014 by Rob Osborn 1
mfbukowski Posted April 1, 2014 Posted April 1, 2014 You are right. No one was in a philosophy class, no one named Josh and on and on... yet they are considered related. I see a correlation, you do not... Not sure it really matters. The point is faith is attacked in secular schools. Unbelievable.You really cannot see the difference? Read the op please. This thread is about whether or not "God is dead" and what that means. It is not about abortion or gay marriage or any symptoms of immorality. I'm done with you on this thread.
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