Tanyan Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 Cherub thanks for sharing, [Hey that kind of goes together]. The word Trinity may describe your god to you but which Trinity Model do you Favor/Follow, Psychological Western, Eastern, Economic, Essential, Social, Modalistic, ?. True the Totality of his Nature/Essence cannot be comprehended but much can be Known of Him, John 17:3. From my undrstanding of the word "Know" in John 17:3 is to intimatley know someone on its highest level. Peace to you and yours. Tanyan.
hooberus Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 Tanyan, which Trinity Model do you Favor/Follow?: Polytheistic, Tritheistic, Monotheistic, Henotheistic, Psychological Western, Eastern, Economic, Essential, Social, Sabellian/Modalistic, Lectures on Faith, Blake Ostler, other?
Cherub Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 True the Totality of his Nature/Essence cannot be comprehended but much can be Known of Him, John 17:3. From my undrstanding of the word "Know" in John 17:3 is to intimatley know someone on its highest level. Peace to you and yours. Tanyan. I concede that you are correct. While you and I do indeed know God, we cannot know everything about His nature because we cannot yet understand all of it, some which is beyond our comprehension.I am confident that the Trinity is the nature of God.But I concede their are many factors involved which I won't understand until I am with Him. I do look forward to that day. Imagine all the questions that will finally be answered!
Paul Osborne Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 Johnny,Jesus told the weeping Mary to touch him not because he had not yet gone to his Father. Don't you find that to be strange? What would Jesus go and do with his Father other than embrace him and converse with him about the victory? Father and Son in a holy, divine, loving embrace - two exalted, glorified Beings. Isn't that why Jesus told Mary to hold off? The Father was deserving of seeing Jesus first and feel his resurrected body in person.Is it not so that Jesus came down to his apostles as a resurrected Man? Is it not so that he went up as a resurrected Man and will come back in the same manner and the same Person?It is odd that you think the Father is anything less than a glorified Man when his Son Jesus is so much like his Father in everyway we have been told. Does the Bible tell you what Jesus did with his Father when he ascended to heaven to greet him? Please give me what you think. How is it when the Son stands in the very presence of the Father before the of angels, he could be anything but a Divine Man? What do you expect? Will you be there someday?So many questions for you, Johnny - and what really can you say? When you come to realize the truth of this matter as Mormonism has declared; how will you take it? How will you take it when your preexistence memory is restored and you have to deal with the fact that you blew your chances of accepting the fulness of the gospel? You are here on this earth in the most raw form, having only minimal intelligence - and you must decide who you really are when away from the presence of God. You're blowing it, Johnny. But it's not too late. You can come to Mormonism if you let the Spirit in and hearken to God's will rather than the traditions of men.Paul O
Fiat Lux Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 Jesus told the weeping Mary to touch him not because he had not yet gone to his Father. Don't you find that to be strange? What would Jesus go and do with his Father other than embrace him and converse with him about the victory? Father and Son in a holy, divine, loving embrace - two exalted, glorified Beings. Isn't that why Jesus told Mary to hold off? The Father was deserving of seeing Jesus first and feel his resurrected body in person.But Paul... Jesus invites Thomas to touch him just a few verses later.Jhn 20:27
LDS4EVER Posted December 2, 2004 Author Posted December 2, 2004 As an engineer the Mormon teaching that the Son of God is God does not sense to me because this is like saying that the Moon is the ultimate source of the light which simply not true. As an engineer the Mormon teaching the Son of God became God does not sense to me because this it like saying the Moon can became the Sun which simply is not true.As an engineer, you also should know that the Moon is not the Son of the Sun so your analogy doesn't make sense. However, just as you are the Son of your Father and you human just as your Father, it makes sense to believe that the Son of God is also a God. And since John and Thomas both testify that Jesus is God, it is also biblical.
johnny Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 LDS4EVER writesAs an engineer, you also should know that the Moon is not the Son of the Sun so your analogy doesn't make sense. However, just as you are the Son of your Father and you human just as your Father, God is spirit ... those begotten from God are spirit.John 36 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.it makes sense to believe that the Son of God is also a God. I still do not understand how you are using the word "God", so could you answer some questions so I can better understand your words?Can God glorify?Can the Son of God glorify?Can God die?Can the Son of God die?And since John and Thomas both testify that Jesus is God, it is also biblical. Jesus is divine(God), but Jesus is not the source of divinity(God).What do you mean when you say "Jesus is God"?The Strong's defination of "Godhead" is divine.
johnny Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 Paul Osborne writes, Jesus told the weeping Mary to touch him not because he had not yet gone to his Father. Don't you find that to be strange? No it is not strange. This passage reveals his body was not yet glorified.What would Jesus go and do with his Father other than embrace him and converse with him about the victory?The Bible does not reveal that Jesus "embraced" his Father.Father and Son in a holy, divine, loving embrace - two exalted, glorified Beings. Isn't that why Jesus told Mary to hold off? Jesus told Mary to hold off because Jesus did not yet have a glorified body. The Bible does not reveal that the Father has a glorified BodyThe Father was deserving of seeing Jesus first and feel his resurrected body in person.Jesus had to ascend to the Father to receive his glorified body.Is it not so that Jesus came down to his apostles as a resurrected Man? Is it not so that he went up as a resurrected Man and will come back in the same manner and the same Person?Jesus is a resurrected Man. Jesus will return as a resurrected man.It is odd that you think the Father is anything less than a glorified Man when his Son Jesus is so much like his Father in everyway we have been told. Does the Bible tell you what Jesus did with his Father when he ascended to heaven to greet him? Isn't odd that Jesus does not say his father is a glorified Man.Isn't odd that the apostles of Jesus did not say that the Father is a glorified Man.The Bible tells us that Jesus is at the right hand of the Father which reveals that Jesus is exalted, it does not reveal that the Father has a "right hand".Please give me what you think. How is it when the Son stands in the very presence of the Father before the of angels, he could be anything but a Divine Man? What do you expect? Will you be there someday?Again Jesus is a divine man. With God's grace I will be in the presence of the Father someday.So many questions for you, Johnny - and what really can you say? I can say that the Bible does not reveal that the Father is a resurrected man.When you come to realize the truth of this matter as Mormonism has declared; how will you take it? The truth of the matter is that the Father is a not resurrected man.How will you take it when your preexistence memory is restored and you have to deal with the fact that you blew your chances of accepting the fulness of the gospel? Man did not preexist.You are here on this earth in the most raw form, having only minimal intelligence - and you must decide who you really are when away from the presence of God. You're blowing it, Johnny. But it's not too late. I have decided I am an adopted son God by the grace of God.You can come to Mormonism if you let the Spirit in and hearken to God's will rather than the traditions of men.Why would I come to a religion whose teachings are not consistent with what the Bible reveals?
Tanyan Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 Same Eternal/Round Criticism Responce posts Ad infinentum !.
johnny Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 Tanyan writes,Same Eternal/Round Criticism Responce posts Ad infinentum !. Is God infinite?Does infinite have bounds?
Tanyan Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 Paul Osborne writes, Jesus told the weeping Mary to touch him not because he had not yet gone to his Father. Don't you find that to be strange? No it is not strange. This passage reveals his body was not yet glorified.What would Jesus go and do with his Father other than embrace him and converse with him about the victory?The Bible does not reveal that Jesus "embraced" his Father.Father and Son in a holy, divine, loving embrace - two exalted, glorified Beings. Isn't that why Jesus told Mary to hold off? Jesus told Mary to hold off because Jesus did not yet have a glorified body. The Bible does not reveal that the Father has a glorified BodyThe Father was deserving of seeing Jesus first and feel his resurrected body in person.Jesus had to ascend to the Father to receive his glorified body.Is it not so that Jesus came down to his apostles as a resurrected Man? Is it not so that he went up as a resurrected Man and will come back in the same manner and the same Person?Jesus is a resurrected Man. Jesus will return as a resurrected man.It is odd that you think the Father is anything less than a glorified Man when his Son Jesus is so much like his Father in everyway we have been told. Does the Bible tell you what Jesus did with his Father when he ascended to heaven to greet him? Isn't odd that Jesus does not say his father is a glorified Man.Isn't odd that the apostles of Jesus did not say that the Father is a glorified Man.The Bible tells us that Jesus is at the right hand of the Father which reveals that Jesus is exalted, it does not reveal that the Father has a "right hand".Please give me what you think. How is it when the Son stands in the very presence of the Father before the of angels, he could be anything but a Divine Man? What do you expect? Will you be there someday?Again Jesus is a divine man. With God's grace I will be in the presence of the Father someday.So many questions for you, Johnny - and what really can you say? I can say that the Bible does not reveal that the Father is a resurrected man.When you come to realize the truth of this matter as Mormonism has declared; how will you take it? The truth of the matter is that the Father is a not resurrected man.How will you take it when your preexistence memory is restored and you have to deal with the fact that you blew your chances of accepting the fulness of the gospel? Man did not preexist.You are here on this earth in the most raw form, having only minimal intelligence - and you must decide who you really are when away from the presence of God. You're blowing it, Johnny. But it's not too late. I have decided I am an adopted son God by the grace of God.You can come to Mormonism if you let the Spirit in and hearken to God's will rather than the traditions of men.Why would I come to a religion whose teachings are not consistent with what the Bible reveals? See BOOKS : #1 Biblical Mormonism by Richard Hopkins. 285 pages, Horizon Publishers. #2 How Greek Philosophy Corrupted The Christian Concept Of GOD 464 pages, Same Author and Publisher. These volumes using standard Biblical Sciences Respond/Refute our critics criticisms concerning the Nature of GOD/DIETY. Grace.
Tanyan Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 Johnny, Sorry but your Wearing The Philosophers Robe/Hat again.
johnny Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 Tanyan writes,See BOOKS : #1 Biblical Mormonism by Richard Hopkins. 285 pages, Horizon Publishers. #2 How Greek Philosophy Corrupted The Christian Concept Of GOD 464 pages, Same Author and Publisher. These volumes using standard Biblical Sciences Respond/Refute our critics criticisms concerning the Nature of GOD/DIETY. Grace. Could you highlight the Books for us ... thanks.How is the Christian Concept of God corrupted?The web site below will show how Mormonism is not Biblical.http://comparing-views.com/Johnny, Sorry but your Wearing The Philosophers Robe/Hat again. Sorry but this is what the Bible reveals.
Tanyan Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 OBTAIN THE BOOKS AND READ THEM !. Your like a student in a class that wants to be spoon fed with answers. Do the research and obtain the books and READ THEM.
Fiat Lux Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 Tanyan it seems like you are very familiar with the models, which Trinity Model best describes the Athanasian Creed (Trinitarian Creed)?Tanyan,I don't want this to get buried. Could you answer this? I'm interested in your view.Thank you!
Tanyan Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 Probably/Most Likely The Psychological Western View. Our Catholic Friend David Waltz is currently writing a book on this Topic/Subject and the Various Trinity/Models/Forms will be discussed there. The How, Why, Reason For they came about, the different proponents in Christian History ect... from my understanding. Patience, I am in line to obtain One !. Grace.
Fiat Lux Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 Probably/Most Likely The Psychological Western View. Our Catholic Friend David Waltz is currently writing a book on this Topic/Subject and the Various Trinity/Models/Forms will be discussed there. The How, Why, Reason For they came about, the different proponents in Christian History ect... from my understanding. Patience, I am in line to obtain One !. Grace.Thanks!What are the attributes of the Psychological/Western View?
Fiat Lux Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 Lets wait for that book and see !!!. Peace.You were able to "probably/most likely" classify it. Surely you have a basis for that classification? That's all I'm asking. I don't want you to pre-write DW's book. I'd just like you to elaborate on what you have already said.
Tanyan Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 Its A Mystery not ready to be revealed !, sound familiar ?. Peace.
Fiat Lux Posted December 2, 2004 Posted December 2, 2004 Its A Mystery not ready to be revealed !, sound familiar ?. Peace. So you have no basis for what you said.Thanks for clarifying.
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