Grundelwalken Posted January 11, 2012 Posted January 11, 2012 Well, Katherine, I agree with much of what you say. However, you acknowledge that society devalued and mistreated women (as a society-wide problem) but only acknowledge that some women have taken feminism too far. What I am arguing is that the pendulum has swung to the point where men are devalued (and traditional women) today just as "society-wide" as women were in the past. I can provide examples, but it would probably be little more than whining. I really think the dismissal and devaluation of true manhood (and traditional womanhood) is a cultural norm - society wide - if that makes sense. That doesn't mean universal, just widespread.Just my humble opinion Coming late to the discussion. One example of men being devalued is The Simpsons. Just a pet peeve. M W
Calm Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 Coming late to the discussion. One example of men being devalued is The Simpsons. Just a pet peeve. M WTV is horrible at portraying men. You either have the idiot, often fat guy as in the Simpsons, who is always trying to get away with stuff or he's ultra cool, all wise, physically perfect, etc. Rare is there an example that would not look out of place in one's neighbourhood.
bluebell Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 Coming late to the discussion. One example of men being devalued is The Simpsons. Just a pet peeve. M WI agree. T.V. is horrible in the way they portray men. Just look at most sitcoms: the man is usually an overweight, lazy, idiot while the wife is thin , capable, and overbearing.
Jeff K. Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 One of my favorite shows was "Home Improvement", it was kind and had a nice message, but also devalued the strength of fatherhood in a family and the wisdom of a father.
katherine the great Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 But some men ARE doafs and their wives are more capable.
Jeff K. Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 Can you name a sitcom where the wife is a "doaf"?
Duncan Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 Can you name a sitcom where the wife is a "doaf"?Oh ! I know this one! "Roseanne" or "My Name is Earl"
katherine the great Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 I can't name a real life couple where the wife is a doaf. However, I can name quite a few where the wife is a b!(@h and that side is most definitely shown in most of these women. It's a good comic set up and it works.
Duncan Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 I can't name a real life couple where the wife is a doaf. However, I can name quite a few where the wife is a b!(@h and that side is most definitely shown in most of these women. It's a good comic set up and it works.I think I read something about Jaime Presly not liking to portray women in the hussie/floosie type role but with the economy as it is you can't be terribly picky when picking roles, so hopefully she can get onto more serious roles
Jeff K. Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 (edited) My point being that I have not seen a sitcom where there is a positive role for the husband. In fact if you switched roles between the husbands and wives in the sitcom, there would be a plethora of protests regarding the degrading portrayel of women. Edited January 12, 2012 by Jeff K.
katherine the great Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 My point being that I have not seen a sitcom where there is a positive role for the husband. In fact if you switched roles between the husbands and wives in the sitcom, there would be a plethora of protests regarding the degrading portrayel of women.That's because sitcoms are supposed to be funny. There's nothing funny about a well behaved, intelligent, revered father.
Calm Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 Oh ! I know this one! "Roseanne" or "My Name is Earl""Raising Hope" but then everyone appears to be in that sitcom.I don't usually watch sitcoms, just catch them now and again when other people are watching them. The original sitcoms of husband and wife teams seem all based on the idiot wife and understanding husband routine though (I love Lucy, George Burns) and then they got into a more balanced format (Father Knows Best, Leave it to Beaver) and now it's the idiot husband, wise wife variation that's popular. The last really balanced sitcom I know of (remembering I have probably missed most of them for the past 30 years since I began to have significant input into what we were watching on the tube) was the Cosby Show.
Calm Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 It's a good comic set up and it works.Wouldn't it be equally as funny to make the wife an idiot and the husband being the rescuer, etc? It certainly got the ratings in the past. So why aren't both types of setup used today?
Calm Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 There's nothing funny about a well behaved, intelligent, revered father.Was Bill Cosby as Dr. Huxtable not considered well behaved and intelligent even if not revered by his kids (though I got the impression he was revered by others).
katherine the great Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 Wouldn't it be equally as funny to make the wife an idiot and the husband being the rescuer, etc? It certainly got the ratings in the past. So why aren't both types of setup used today?It is a reflection of our generation.
katherine the great Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 Was Bill Cosby as Dr. Huxtable not considered well behaved and intelligent even if not revered by his kids (though I got the impression he was revered by others).The Cosby Show was a very rare gem of a show--seemingly impossible to duplicate
Duncan Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 Was Bill Cosby as Dr. Huxtable not considered well behaved and intelligent even if not revered by his kids (though I got the impression he was revered by others).he was as was the dad on "Danger Bay"
Calm Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 he was as was the dad on "Danger Bay"Never saw it. Don't even remember it.
katherine the great Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 Maybe I'm thinking of different shows than you guys are, but I'm thinking of Raymond and Tim Taylor and possibly Doug Heffernan. They are kind of doafy, but still very lovable, and they have very healthy relationships with their wives. They are really kind of exaggerated versions of real people. Their wives are great, but can be total nags and bee_otches. The humor works.
Calm Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 It is a reflection of our generation.A sad reflection then since we do have evidence that one can make a decent comedy with both parents being intelligent (the sitcoms of the Leave it to Beaver, Father Knows Best, Hazel, even Brady Bunch era).One has to wonder how much it is an actual reflection of this generation and how much of it is a promotion by those producing them. What caused the change from the previous generation of balanced parents in the first place?
Duncan Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 Never saw it. Don't even remember it.Well Paint me pink and call me pinkie!!!!!!!!!!! Danger Bay was a Canadian Classic 80's show! the environmentalist Dad and his two kids save all these things, aw man !!!http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5_BaJpUMRZ4
Calm Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 (edited) Well Paint me pink and call me pinkie!!!!!!!!!!! Danger Bay was a Canadian Classic 80's show! the environmentalist Dad and his two kids save all these things, aw man !!!We didn't get up to Canada until 1990 (and we didn't have Disney Channel before that). It sounds familiar now. I don't think it was a sitcom though, wasn't it a drama kind of like Flipper and Skippy the Bush Kangaroo? Even dramas today have intelligent parents occasionally. Edited January 12, 2012 by calmoriah
Duncan Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 (edited) a good dad was Alan Thicke on "Growing Pains" a Psychiatrist, bit of a twit here and there . Sanford and Son was always a hoot, at least he had a business and a good son! Edited January 12, 2012 by Duncan
Duncan Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 (edited) We didn't get up to Canada until 1990 (and we didn't have Disney Channel before that). It sounds familiar now. I don't think it was a sitcom though, wasn't it a drama kind of like Flipper and Skippy the Bush Kangaroo?yeh kinda, it was on after school so comedy..drama type bit of both. The dad on what is the heck name of that show...kid dynomite!!!! from the '70's. Hardworking guy, both he and his wife were good for each other. Canadian TV in the 80's was the BEST! then it has been a slow leak ever since Edited January 12, 2012 by Duncan
katherine the great Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 One has to wonder how much it is an actual reflection of this generation and how much of it is a promotion by those producing them. What caused the change from the previous generation of balanced parents in the first place?Apparently feminism.
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