Jacob 2:30

[inquiringmind]

This question is for Mormons (RLDS, Temple Lot, etc.) who believe the BOM condemnes polygamy (at any time, and under all circumstances.)

If that's true, what does Jacob 2:30 mean?

For if I will, saith the Lord of Hosts, raise up seed unto me, I will command my people; otherwise they shall hearken unto these things.

[webbles]

I'm not one of those groups, but one argument against the normal LDS reading can be found at http://restorationbookstore.org/articles/nopoligamy/jsfp-vol1/chp18.htm. The true interpretation to them is:

For if I will, saith the Lord of hosts, raise up [righteous] seed unto me, I will command my people [the Lord will be their commander—He will give them commandments to obey]: otherwise [if the Lord is not their commander; or they do not obey His commandments], they shall hearken unto these things [they shall practice the sins of polygamy].

Basically, the "these things" in that scripture aren't talking about monogamy but instead about polygamy.

Edited to bold the "modifications" to the scripture that the other website makes.

Edited August 7, 2011 by webbles

[Sevenbak]

This question is for Mormons (RLDS, Temple Lot, etc.) who believe the BOM condemnes polygamy (at any time, and under all circumstances.)

If that's true, what does Jacob 2:30 mean?

For if I will, saith the Lord of Hosts, raise up seed unto me, I will command my people; otherwise they shall hearken unto these things.

It means exactly what it says.

From the journal of Joseph Smith... sure sounds like Jacob 2:10 to me:

In the afternoon, rode to the prairie to show some of the brethren some land. Evening, at home, and walked up and down the streets with my scribe. Gave instructions to try those persons who were preaching, teaching, or practicing the doctrine of plurality of wives; for, according to the law, I hold the keys of this power in the last days; for there is never but one on earth at a time on whom the power and its keys are conferred; and I have constantly said no man shall have but one wife at a time, unless the Lord directs otherwise. (Oct. 5, 1843.) DHC 6:46.

[inquiringmind]

It means exactly what it says.

From the journal of Joseph Smith... sure sounds like Jacob 2:10 to me:

In the afternoon, rode to the prairie to show some of the brethren some land. Evening, at home, and walked up and down the streets with my scribe. Gave instructions to try those persons who were preaching, teaching, or practicing the doctrine of plurality of wives; for, according to the law, I hold the keys of this power in the last days; for there is never but one on earth at a time on whom the power and its keys are conferred; and I have constantly said no man shall have but one wife at a time, unless the Lord directs otherwise. (Oct. 5, 1843.) DHC 6:46.

Are the keys to sealing plural marriages the only keys that are held by only one man on earth (at any one given time)?

[Sevenbak]

Are the keys to sealing plural marriages the only keys that are held by only one man on earth (at any one given time)?

Keys can be delegated and given to another, but only by the servant that holds the keys.

[Scott Lloyd]

Are the keys to sealing plural marriages the only keys that are held by only one man on earth (at any one given time)?

Joseph was referring to all the priesthood keys, not just those pertaining to eternal marriage. (I said eternal marriage here, not plural marriage, because plural marriage is only ever a temporary condition specifically commanded by God. Otherwise its practice is an abomination.)

[inquiringmind]

Keys can be delegated and given to another, but only by the servant that holds the keys.

But what specific keys are held (to delegate, or not delegate) by only one man at a time?

Edited August 7, 2011 by inquiringmind

[Calm]

Perhaps this article will help answer your questions: http://lds.org/ensign/2005/10/keys-of-the-priesthood?lang=eng

[K-2]

It means exactly what it says.

From the journal of Joseph Smith... sure sounds like Jacob 2:10 to me:

In the afternoon, rode to the prairie to show some of the brethren some land. Evening, at home, and walked up and down the streets with my scribe. Gave instructions to try those persons who were preaching, teaching, or practicing the doctrine of plurality of wives; for, according to the law, I hold the keys of this power in the last days; for there is never but one on earth at a time on whom the power and its keys are conferred; and I have constantly said no man shall have but one wife at a time, unless the Lord directs otherwise. (Oct. 5, 1843.) DHC 6:46.

Most of the words you have bolded are not in the original journal entry of Joseph Smith, but were added after his death. The original does say "no man shall have but one wife" though.

[Thinking]

If the purpose of commanding plural marriage is to raise up seed, how are polyandry and platonic sealings justified?

[Sevenbak]

Most of the words you have bolded are not in the original journal entry of Joseph Smith, but were added after his death. The original does say "no man shall have but one wife" though.

To be fair and add another level of complexity to what is considered by some to be a cut and dry issue, the diary entry was actually done by Willard Richard's, one of Joseph's scribes. He was alive when the change was made.

[erichard]

But what specific keys are held (to delegate, or not delegate) by only one man at a time?

Hi,

I will give you my convictions about Priesthood keys.

The Gospel covenant requires all men to esteem their brother as themselves. (D&C 38:24-25)

Those who receive the Melchizedek Priesthood (MP) correctly (the power of the Holy Ghost must be in the one who ordains --D&C 20:60) must all the more esteem their brethren in the MP as themselves.

For instance, one brother is not "greater and holier" than others in the MP because of an important office he may hold in the Priesthood.

ALL the "keys of the Priesthood" restored at the time of Joseph Smith are given to the body of faithful MP holders as a group. Then by revelation, one among that group is called to hold and exercise those keys as a servant for the entire body.

But if he fails and falls away, then the keys remain with the body of MP holders, and another faithful holder can be called and given those keys.

It is like me handing you a set of keys, and you take it with your hand. Your hand then "holds" the keys and can use them for the benenfit of all your body, but it is fair to say that your entire body "has" all those keys.

Thus, even the lowliest Elder in the church, if he has been ordained correctly and is faithful, "has" ALL the Keys of the MP.

And according to President Young-- who claimed many times he gained all his understanding of the gospel from the Prophet Joseph-- if every member of the MP fell away except one faithful Elder, that one Elder could completely restore the entire church organization and offices. But not without revelation.

It is true that D&C 132:7 states that only one man on the earth at a time holds the keys of eternal sealings. But it is also true that those keys can only be given to a man "by revelation". So it is vital to know who has revelation and not just who is claiming keys.

Richard

Edited August 7, 2011 by erichard

[Joseph Antley]

But Joseph and his wives didn't raise up seed....

[Cobalt-70]

I'm not one of those groups, but one argument against the normal LDS reading can be found at http://restorationbo...vol1/chp18.htm. The true interpretation to them is:

"For if I will, saith the Lord of hosts, raise up [righteous] seed unto me, I will command my people [the Lord will be their commander—He will give them commandments to obey]: otherwise [if the Lord is not their commander; or they do not obey His commandments], they shall hearken unto these things [they shall practice the sins of polygamy]."

Basically, the "these things" in that scripture aren't talking about monogamy but instead about polygamy.

Edited to bold the "modifications" to the scripture that the other website makes.

That interpretation is not grammatically sound. The use of the word shall means this is a commandment, not merely a prediction. If it had been the word will, then their interpretation might make more sense.

[Robert F. Smith]

That interpretation is not grammatically sound. The use of the word shall means this is a commandment, not merely a prediction. If it had been the word will, then their interpretation might make more sense.

The comments in Jacob 2:22-33 must be taken in the context of 2:34, and 3:5 (which was corrected to correspond to the singular "father" of the manuscript evidence in 1981, and which makes the context apply to Lehi and his people only).

[Robert F. Smith]

This question is for Mormons (RLDS, Temple Lot, etc.) who believe the BOM condemnes polygamy (at any time, and under all circumstances.)

If that's true, what does Jacob 2:30 mean?

For if I will, saith the Lord of Hosts, raise up seed unto me, I will command my people; otherwise they shall hearken unto these things.

The RLDS are now known as the "Community of Christ." I'm not sure that the Community of Christ actually condemns polygyny for a couple of reasons: (1) the RLDS Chruch Historian (Richard P. Howard) published a detailed article in their official journal some years back explaining to the faithful that Joseph Smith had practiced polygyny -- contrary to what they they had been taught up till that time, and (2) I would not be surprised if the Community of Christ were to begin accepting polygynous members in their foreign missions where polygyny is legal, just as they have accepted homosexuals generally within their church (along with ordination of women) -- all part of a trajectory familiar on the American national scene.