One God or many gods, the times and all the glories

[telnetd]

Come Follow Me is discussing Doctrine and Covenants 121–123 this week.

Some questions about these verses.

Doctrine and Covenants 121:28: "... A time to come in the which nothing shall be 
withheld, whether there be one God or many gods, they shall be manifest".

At the time of this petition or prayer from Joseph Smith (March 1839), why were the 
Latter-day Saints in doubt as to the number when 1 Corinthians 8:5-6 says "For though 
there be that are called gods, whether in heaven or in earth, (as there be gods many, 
and lords many,) But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, 
and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him"?

Were their doubts alleviated when they learned about an infinite regression of Gods
and their potential for exaltation to Godhood?

Doctrine and Covenants 121:30-31: "... And also, if there be bounds set to the 
heavens or to the seas, or to the dry land, or to the sun, moon, or stars—All the 
times of their revolutions, all the appointed days, months, and years, and all the 
days of their days, months, and years, and all their glories, laws, and set times, 
shall be revealed in the days of the dispensation of the fulness of times".

What is the difference between the colored items?   Does "all their glories" mean
a number greater than 3?

Assuming we are in this dispensation now and it ends when Jesus returns, why is it 
necessary for God to give us such information during this period?

[teddyaware]

18 hours ago, telnetd said:

Come Follow Me is discussing Doctrine and Covenants 121–123 this week.

Some questions about these verses.

Doctrine and Covenants 121:28: "... A time to come in the which nothing shall be 
withheld, whether there be one God or many gods, they shall be manifest".

At the time of this petition or prayer from Joseph Smith (March 1839), why were the 
Latter-day Saints in doubt as to the number when 1 Corinthians 8:5-6 says "For though 
there be that are called gods, whether in heaven or in earth, (as there be gods many, 
and lords many,) But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, 
and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him"?

Were their doubts alleviated when they learned about an infinite regression of Gods
and their potential for exaltation to Godhood?

Doctrine and Covenants 121:30-31: "... And also, if there be bounds set to the 
heavens or to the seas, or to the dry land, or to the sun, moon, or stars—All the 
times of their revolutions, all the appointed days, months, and years, and all the 
days of their days, months, and years, and all their glories, laws, and set times, 
shall be revealed in the days of the dispensation of the fulness of times".

What is the difference between the colored items?   Does "all their glories" mean
a number greater than 3?

Assuming we are in this dispensation now and it ends when Jesus returns, why is it 
necessary for God to give us such information during this period?

These verses are simply testifying that the time is going to come when all the mysteries of God and his kingdom are going to be laid bare with full clarity and comprehensive detail in a manner that will go far beyond than the rudimentary way the mysteries of God were understood.at the time of the writing of Section 121. It’s the simple concept that the day is going to come when God unveils a much more complete revelation of the truths of his kingdom than we now possess.  These verses are pointing to the day when the prophecies like the following prophesy of the Prophet Nephi are going to be fulfilled:

10 But the words which are sealed (the sealed and thus far untranslated portion of the Book of Mormon) he shall not deliver, neither shall he deliver the book. For the book shall be sealed by the power of God, and the revelation which was sealed shall be kept in the book until the own due time of the Lord, that they may come forth; for behold, they reveal all things from the foundation of the world unto the end thereof.

11 And the day cometh that the words of the book which were sealed shall be read upon the house tops; and they shall be read by the power of Christ; and all things shall be revealed unto the children of men which ever have been among the children of men, and which ever will be even unto the end of the earth. (2 Nephi 27)

Edited October 23, 2025 by teddyaware

[The Nehor]

Spoilers: Eru-Iluvatar is reali. Also Azathoth.

[Nofear]

1 hour ago, The Nehor said:

Spoilers: Eru-Iluvatar is reali. ...

Since Tolkien conceived of the world of Middle-earth as being the same planet as this earth, in Tolkien's mind the God he worshiped and Erū Ilúvatar would be the same entity.

Edited October 23, 2025 by Nofear

[Navidad]

2 hours ago, The Nehor said:

Spoilers: Eru-Iluvatar is reali. Also Azathoth.

Have you read "On Fairy Stories, by Tolkien?" Everyone should read that forty-page essay/speech.

[JVW]

4 hours ago, The Nehor said:

Spoilers: Eru-Iluvatar is reali. Also Azathoth.

I saw a Dan McLellan video recently in which he makes a wild statement. Apparently, back when the Israelites adopted El as their God, El was the God over a pantheon of 70 gods and He assigned Jehovah, as one of the 70 gods, to be the God of Israel. El also had a wife Asherah according to McLellan. What an interesting idea.

[The Nehor]

2 hours ago, JVW said:

I saw a Dan McLellan video recently in which he makes a wild statement. Apparently, back when the Israelites adopted El as their God, El was the God over a pantheon of 70 gods and He assigned Jehovah, as one of the 70 gods, to be the God of Israel. El also had a wife Asherah according to McLellan. What an interesting idea.

That is not a wild statement. It is the accepted historical reality. Not sure if you were joking there. I assume you were.

Yahweh was originally a polytheistic storm deity. Then someone (Josiah?) tried to make the Yahweh cult the sole religion. Then someone wrote up a kind of vassal contract with God (Deuteronomy). Then they lost the given land and Judaism spent a lot of time trying to figure out what it meant to be a vassal of a God who gave them a promised land when the land wasn’t held by them anymore.

He started out in opposition to another storm deity Baal. Yahweh won. Eventually El and Yahweh basically fused together.

Here is a good video tracking what we know about the origins of Yahweh within the polytheism of the time. Long but worth it.

 

Also the prophets of Israel and Judah were not anything like modern apostles and prophets. They were more into ecstatic trances and mysticism and there is evidence they used mind-altering substances.

Edited October 24, 2025 by The Nehor

[Navidad]

I would respectfully suggest that saying there is a "the accepted historical reality" within the huge Biblical Archaeology and history community is like saying "The King James Bible is the "accepted version" of the Bible in world-wide Christianity. The reality is so much more complex than what such a reductionist statement calls for. Minimalists and maximalists debate each other as do Evangelicals and Fundamentalists, as do Roman and Eastern Catholics and on and on. Scholars like William Dever were attacked from all sides as too this or too that. Conservatives mock scholarology (David Otis Fuller), while scholars dismiss whoever is not in their particular school of scholarship, Biblical or otherwise. Just my .02 cents.