Faith?

[blueglass]

Prospection is human.  "homo prospectus" Doc&Cov88:11 And the light which shineth, which giveth you light, is through him who enlighteneth your eyes, which is the same light that quickeneth your understandings;

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/19/opinion/sunday/why-the-future-is-always-on-your-mind.html

What best distinguishes our species is an ability that scientists are just beginning to appreciate: We contemplate the future. Our singular foresight created civilization and sustains society. It usually lifts our spirits, but it’s also the source of most depression and anxiety, whether we’re evaluating our own lives or worrying about the nation. 

[Atheist Mormon]

On 8/12/2018 at 12:12 PM, changed said:

 

One generic answer to any question, and the saving grace for any soul - is "just have faith".  

I no longer have faith, and the entire subject of faith now confuses me. My actions and beliefs are the result of experience, background, observations, reasonable expectations.  People go through traumatic life events with and without faith in G-d, and the results are about the same.  

I used to have "faith", it was a nice comforting idea - then I did not receive any real support from anyone inside the church, did not receive support from G-d, no guidance from the Holy Spirit to protect me or my children - I tried the experiment - I read the scriptures every day, I attended the temple, I gave up my career because I was supposed to be a stay-at-home mom, I did everything I was supposed to do, and I was cursed for it, my children were abused for it.  I experimented on the words, and the result of the experiment was - no support, no help - no guidance - no protection - I gave myself away, I gave an I gave and I gave, and got nothing back in return for it, was actually harmed by it... 

Faith??  I am supposed to have faith??  

So I ask you, what is faith?

I could write this 20 yrs ago word by word....Then I quit lamenting and trusted the only true friend & ally I had....Myself......

[Sunday21]

On 8/12/2018 at 2:09 PM, bluebell said:

Speaking for myself, I've noticed that the hardest time for me to have faith is when it seems like God did not stop something bad from happening to me or my family.  When I thought about that, it helped me to see that my idea of what faith is and what it actually is was not the same thing.

I was (and still very much sometimes still am) operating as if faith was the power that was going to protect me and my loved ones from suffering.  Faith was my insurance policy.  Something bad is headed my way + apply faith = bad thing averted.  I understood in theory that bad things were a part of life, but in application i was behaving as if trying to obey God and do what He asked of me was my payment/guarantee for a life free of serious trials.  A few trials were o.k. but obviously nothing really hard or really painful.

Now I understand better (ironically because of trials) that faith is trust in God, whatever comes.  Faith is believing that God is real and loves me, not only when bad things are happening to other people, but also when they happen to me.  There are still days when i seriously struggle with it.  

 

This is a lesson that I need to learn!

[nuclearfuels]

On 8/12/2018 at 1:12 PM, changed said:

 

One generic answer to any question, and the saving grace for any soul - is "just have faith".  

I no longer have faith, and the entire subject of faith now confuses me. My actions and beliefs are the result of experience, background, observations, reasonable expectations.  People go through traumatic life events with and without faith in G-d, and the results are about the same.  

I used to have "faith", it was a nice comforting idea - then I did not receive any real support from anyone inside the church, did not receive support from G-d, no guidance from the Holy Spirit to protect me or my children - I tried the experiment - I read the scriptures every day, I attended the temple, I gave up my career because I was supposed to be a stay-at-home mom, I did everything I was supposed to do, and I was cursed for it, my children were abused for it.  I experimented on the words, and the result of the experiment was - no support, no help - no guidance - no protection - I gave myself away, I gave an I gave and I gave, and got nothing back in return for it, was actually harmed by it... 

Faith??  I am supposed to have faith??  

So I ask you, what is faith?

I'm sorry this happened to you and your family.

If my parents had been converts to the Catholic church or any other religion, I doubt that would change the fact that all of my siblings have chemical imbalances/disabilities; parents got divorced when we were young; a step-family brought in abuse, etc.  Staying away from toxic people even if you're related to them is a healthy, normal, boundary-setting thing to do. Not against the gospel at all.

Buddha said that: When the student is ready, the teacher will appear. 

1 Corinthians 10:13 King James Version (KJV)

¹³ There hath no TRIAL taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be TRIED above that ye are able; but will with the TRIAL also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it. (caps are mine)

Since you have demonstrated a LOT of faith already (had 3 children, left your job, etc.), the next lessons God has for you will be harder and require more faith, more forgiving, more reliance on and drawing from the Atonement.  

I've often asked my wife about this - why would we want to spend eternity with a God who gives us the trial of a broken arm, and after we overcome it and learn what He wants us to learn, he breaks our back.  

But where you are headed, to physically live with God and His Son, requires you become like Them, so after you pass one trial, another harder one is usually on the way.  I believe this is part of eternal progression.

 

[changed]

On 8/22/2018 at 9:25 PM, nuclearfuels said:

I'm sorry this happened to you and your family.

If my parents had been converts to the Catholic church or any other religion, I doubt that would change the fact that all of my siblings have chemical imbalances/disabilities; parents got divorced when we were young; a step-family brought in abuse, etc.  Staying away from toxic people even if you're related to them is a healthy, normal, boundary-setting thing to do. Not against the gospel at all.

Buddha said that: When the student is ready, the teacher will appear. 

1 Corinthians 10:13 King James Version (KJV)

¹³ There hath no TRIAL taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be TRIED above that ye are able; but will with the TRIAL also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it. (caps are mine)

Since you have demonstrated a LOT of faith already (had 3 children, left your job, etc.), the next lessons God has for you will be harder and require more faith, more forgiving, more reliance on and drawing from the Atonement.  

I've often asked my wife about this - why would we want to spend eternity with a God who gives us the trial of a broken arm, and after we overcome it and learn what He wants us to learn, he breaks our back.  

But where you are headed, to physically live with God and His Son, requires you become like Them, so after you pass one trial, another harder one is usually on the way.  I believe this is part of eternal progression.

 

 

I work with some who have PTSD, work with some military vets etc.  I know people who were taken beyond their limits.  Those who kill themselves were taken beyond their limits.  Many people do not escape - drown refugees, physical handicaps etc.  We all die in the end.  I'm just not sure I trust everything in the Bible anymore.  

[nuclearfuels]

On 8/24/2018 at 6:37 PM, changed said:

 

I work with some who have PTSD, work with some military vets etc.  I know people who were taken beyond their limits.  Those who kill themselves were taken beyond their limits.  Many people do not escape - drown refugees, physical handicaps etc.  We all die in the end.  I'm just not sure I trust everything in the Bible anymore.  

I never trusted everything in the Bible.  Early GA's thought it wasn't worht the paper it was printed on due to the mistranslations, omissions, etc.

[changed]

58 minutes ago, nuclearfuels said:

I never trusted everything in the Bible.  Early GA's thought it wasn't worht the paper it was printed on due to the mistranslations, omissions, etc.

In the end we all come to only trust our own experiences and conscience.  If there is a loving God, I suppose the point is for everyone to think for themselves, define themselves, discover truths for themselves... better to discover for yourself than read it out of a book.

[Meerkat]

2 hours ago, nuclearfuels said:

I never trusted everything in the Bible.  Early GA's thought it wasn't worht the paper it was printed on due to the mistranslations, omissions, etc.

Quite a bit of it can be trusted, in my opinion.  Some people find Christ in the Bible.  Others pray, and He reveals Himself to them.  Throughout history, many of God's children had no scriptures.  But they called out to God, and He poured His love out to them in a way never to be forgotten-- in a way that convinced them Jesus' Redemption is real.  

1 hour ago, changed said:

In the end we all come to only trust our own experiences and conscience.  If there is a loving God, I suppose the point is for everyone to think for themselves, define themselves, discover truths for themselves... better to discover for yourself than read it out of a book.

Is there any other way?  Some people gain that knowledge early.  Others later.  I think they need to want it with an abundance of desire and meekness.  I believe God gives each of us that opportunity sooner or later.  It's our choice.  I don't think judging GA's opinions of the Bible is helpful.  Knowing God and Jesus Christ is deeply personal and available, in my opinion. I would be knocking until God answered, as He promised He would in Matthew 7:7-8:

"7 ¶ Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you:
            8 For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened."

That was my experience, unworthy as I was.  God really came through for me, and it's been a wonderful life.  Best of luck to you, Changed.  I believe God will do the same for you.  Be patuuent with Him, as He has been with you (and people like me.)

[mfbukowski]

On 8/25/2018 at 8:14 PM, changed said:

In the end we all come to only trust our own experiences and conscience.  If there is a loving God, I suppose the point is for everyone to think for themselves, define themselves, discover truths for themselves... better to discover for yourself than read it out of a book.

We are here to organize our own universe from matter unorganized.