Creation, the fall, and broken relationships

[theplains]

I subscribe to a monthly devotional and here are some recent ones for May 8 and 9.  The theme is the creation,
the fall, and broken relationships. What do you feel are the key aspects where LDS theology differs from other
Christian groups?  As a side note, I don't think anyone really knows if the forbidden fruit was an apple.

Thanks,
Jim

 

[RevTestament]

Well, as a matter of doctrine, I believe the Church does not view the fall as an evil thing to be avoided. It was a "necessary" thing if man were to become like God. See Gen 3:22. Other Christians normally see that as some kind of devilish, evil aspiration, even though God commands man to be perfect.

Other points I would not say are necessarily points of doctrine. I believe the woman is representative of the Church in this "temple rite." The Church is formed from the rib of Adam. Christ humbled Himself to endure the sin of man, so in this sense ate of the tree, and as we partake of the sacrament, we are acknowledging that our life comes from Him, and through this we become one flesh with Him - His body and blood. This is represented in Adam's rib being used to form Eve. Thus, despite our sin and falling "first" the condescension and love of Christ prevents our enduring death. 

I believe the idea of the fruit being an apple, comes from the similarity of the Latin word for apple with the Latin word for evil. The word evil in the tree's name in Latin is mali (Genesis 2:17). The word apple in other places is mala. However, it is just "fruit" in Genesis. 

The story is the gospel in a nutshell, and I believe goes much deeper than most modern Christians conceive of it. They tend to read it in very literal terms, and miss its great spiritual import in favor of shallow doctrines such as original sin.

Edited May 10, 2018 by RevTestament

[Maidservant]

3 hours ago, theplains said:

I subscribe to a monthly devotional and here are some recent ones for May 8 and 9.  The theme is the creation,
the fall, and broken relationships. What do you feel are the key aspects where LDS theology differs from other
Christian groups?  As a side note, I don't think anyone really knows if the forbidden fruit was an apple.

Thanks,
Jim

 

 

Hi.  Just some notes.  I really loved when I found out that in the past in some traditions, the fruit was considered a pomegranate (which is also called an apple in some languages).  My point isn't to switch out another fruit, since I think it is symbolic; but that the pomegranate IS a highly sacred and symbolic fruit in many cultures (I once wrote about this), and so I find it super cool that it might meant to have made it into the Adam and Eve story.

I also wanted to say 'wow' on a good catch in the second sermon, since I hadn't ever noticed before, but that the command not to eat the fruit was given to Adam, not Eve.  I'll have to check the records, but wow I want to ponder on that for a while!

[MormonMason]

2 hours ago, Maidservant said:

 

Hi.  Just some notes.  I really loved when I found out that in the past in some traditions, the fruit was considered a pomegranate (which is also called an apple in some languages).  My point isn't to switch out another fruit, since I think it is symbolic; but that the pomegranate IS a highly sacred and symbolic fruit in many cultures (I once wrote about this), and so I find it super cool that it might meant to have made it into the Adam and Eve story.

I also wanted to say 'wow' on a good catch in the second sermon, since I hadn't ever noticed before, but that the command not to eat the fruit was given to Adam, not Eve.  I'll have to check the records, but wow I want to ponder on that for a while!

For some early traditions (by at least c. AD 150), particularly those of the Syriac Christian communities, it was the fig (and the little worms that often hide therein).

Edited May 11, 2018 by MormonMason

[bluebell]

His take on the fall and Gen. 3:16 is really interesting.  I had never considered that verse from the perspective that he is placing it-that the man ruling over woman (and all of the heartache that historically has come to the weaker sex) is a consequence of the fall and not the way that God set things up.

I have pondered many times why the world has to be like it is for women, why we are (historically) so abused and used by men and why God did not give us some kind of power or ability (not supernatural but biological) that could even things out a bit more and make it more difficult for women to be a victim.  This is an interesting answer to that question.

[Maidservant]

1 hour ago, MormonMason said:

For some early traditions (by at least c. AD 150), particularly those of the Syriac Christian communities, it was the fig (and the little worms that often hide therein).

Which is even wilder, because that means that the fig leaves that they were using had come from the tree of knowledge of good and evil (which had figs), so that adds a whole other dimension to ponder too!

[MormonMason]

51 minutes ago, Maidservant said:

Which is even wilder, because that means that the fig leaves that they were using had come from the tree of knowledge of good and evil (which had figs), so that adds a whole other dimension to ponder too!

Indeed.  The tree of knowledge and good and evil was convenient to where they were standing at the moment their eyes were opened.  It would be a simple matter to grab some leaves and make some aprons from that tree.

[theplains]

On 5/10/2018 at 10:25 PM, MormonMason said:

Indeed.  The tree of knowledge and good and evil was convenient to where they were standing at the moment their eyes were opened.  It would be a simple matter to grab some leaves and make some aprons from that tree.

According to Eve ... "But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said,  Ye shall not
eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die."

Eating from the forbidden tree was disobedience in itself. But if what you say is true, then Adam and Eve created
another mistake by using the leaves from the same forbidden tree to cover their nakedness.  In essence, these 
aprons are also forbidden.

Jim

[Jeanne]

2 hours ago, theplains said:

According to Eve ... "But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said,  Ye shall not
eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die."

Eating from the forbidden tree was disobedience in itself. But if what you say is true, then Adam and Eve created
another mistake by using the leaves from the same forbidden tree to cover their nakedness.  In essence, these 
aprons are also forbidden.

Jim

I am pretending I am someone who has never been a member....does any of this sound silly to anybody?? 

[jcake]

I have read that word which was  translated to "over" in the Genesis 3:16 passage, appears many times in the Old Testament. Every other time it was translated as "with".  Why the exception with Genesis:16?  Could it be cultural impact on the translation?  I'm grateful for the Article of Faith stating the we believe the Bible as far as it its translated correctly.

Edited May 12, 2018 by jcake