filovirus Posted December 4, 2015 Posted December 4, 2015 Can't seem to find an answer to these questions. Any recommendations on where to look or insight is welcome. Is the spirit world considered part of the second estate? If it is , would mortal life be considered "second estate part 1" and the spirit world "second estate part 2"? Or is the spirit world not part of the second estate? I've always understood that those who keep their second estate will receive exaltation. Many people won't have the opportunity to accept the Gospel until the spirit world. We are to obey the laws and ordinances of the Gospel. The ordinances carry on through the spirit world, but obviously many parts of the Law do not. Law of chastity. Law of tithing. Law of the fast. Word of Wisdom. Many others. Are those in the spirit world under a different set of laws while waiting for the resurrection? Some laws that can only be lived in the spirit world? How do they prove obedience in the spirit world?
JAHS Posted December 4, 2015 Posted December 4, 2015 For some if they get their chance here it ends at death. For others it ends after they get the chance in the spirit world. 1
JLHPROF Posted December 4, 2015 Posted December 4, 2015 (edited) 24 minutes ago, filovirus said: Is the spirit world considered part of the second estate? If it is , would mortal life be considered "second estate part 1" and the spirit world "second estate part 2"? Or is the spirit world not part of the second estate? I've always understood that those who keep their second estate will receive exaltation. Many people won't have the opportunity to accept the Gospel until the spirit world. Our second estate ends when our third estate begins. Estate has several meanings: the things that a person owns/left by someone who has died a large piece of land with a large house on it social standing or rank especially of a high order a social or political class Which one we view as relating to "first estate", "second estate", etc always points to how we label our estates. By considering the spirit world our first estate and this earth our second estate you are connecting it to #2 a location (spirit world/earth/Celestial Kingdom), or perhaps by focusing on our #4 "bodies" (spirit/mortal/resurrected) it is a condition. Perhaps we could use number 1 and each estate can be an inheritance or family, or number 3 and it can be an office or membership or even group progression. The applications open up many ideas. 24 minutes ago, filovirus said: We are to obey the laws and ordinances of the Gospel. The ordinances carry on through the spirit world, but obviously many parts of the Law do not. Law of chastity. Law of tithing. Law of the fast. Word of Wisdom. Many others. Are those in the spirit world under a different set of laws while waiting for the resurrection? Some laws that can only be lived in the spirit world? How do they prove obedience in the spirit world? Why wouldn't those laws carry on in some form? And perhaps obedience is proven by obedience to the higher laws that DO apply. Edited December 4, 2015 by JLHPROF 1
Tony Frank Posted December 4, 2015 Posted December 4, 2015 (edited) 43 minutes ago, filovirus said: Can't seem to find an answer to these questions. Any recommendations on where to look or insight is welcome. Is the spirit world considered part of the second estate? If it is , would mortal life be considered "second estate part 1" and the spirit world "second estate part 2"? Or is the spirit world not part of the second estate? I've always understood that those who keep their second estate will receive exaltation. Many people won't have the opportunity to accept the Gospel until the spirit world. We are to obey the laws and ordinances of the Gospel. The ordinances carry on through the spirit world, but obviously many parts of the Law do not. Law of chastity. Law of tithing. Law of the fast. Word of Wisdom. Many others. Are those in the spirit world under a different set of laws while waiting for the resurrection? Some laws that can only be lived in the spirit world? How do they prove obedience in the spirit world? We had our first estate when we were spirits with our Heavenly Father in the celestial kingdom. As a result of the War in Heaven, Satan did not keep his first estate. Our second estate is having a body here on earth. The earth will be an eternal inheritance of those who have lived worthy of a celestial glory, and those who receive celestial glory are the ones who "keep their second estate." In Abraham 3:26 & 28, "And they who keep their first estate shall be added upon [They will be added upon by getting bodies.]; and they who keep not their first estate shall not have glory in the same kingdom with those who keep their first estate [Satan and his angels will not receive a kingdom of glory]; and they who keep their second estate shall have glory added upon their heads for ever and ever . . . . And the second was angry [that would be Satan who was angry], and kept not his first estate; and, at that day, many followed after him. It has never been revealed what it is like to "live according to God in the spirit" after someone accepts the Gospel in the spirit world, and it has never been revealed what it is like to preach the gospel in the spirit world. But Joseph Smith did say, “When you climb up a ladder, you must begin at the bottom, and ascend step by step, until you arrive at the top; and so it is with the principles of the gospel—you must begin with the first, and go on until you learn all the principles of exaltation. But it will be a great while after you have passed through the veil before you will have learned them. It is not all to be comprehended in this world; it will be a great work to learn our salvation and exaltation even beyond the grave.” Edited December 4, 2015 by Tony Frank
JAHS Posted December 4, 2015 Posted December 4, 2015 (edited) 21 minutes ago, JAHS said: For some if they get their chance here it ends at death. For others it ends after they get the chance in the spirit world. To add to what I said, here's Daniel H. Ludlow's opinion on the subject: "The scriptures and the prophets of this dispensation have referred to our present condition—a combination of spirit body and physical mortal body—as being part of our second estate. This estate began when our spirit body and physical mortal body came together initially, and it ends at the resurrection when our spirit body and our immortal physical body come together, never to be separated again. Our second estate does not end with our physical temporal death; it ends with our resurrection. Therefore, our next major phase of existence—the postmortal spiritual existence—is part of our second estate" (SELECTED WRITINGS OF DANIEL H. LUDLOW: GOSPEL SCHOLARS SERIES) So he argues that it continues into the spirit world for everyone regardless of whether they had a chance or not. However it doesn't quite fit with scriptures like: "For behold, this life is the time for men to prepare to meet God; yea, behold the day of this life is the day for men to perform their labors." (Alma 34: 32) For those who have had the chance to receive the Gospel in this life. Edited December 4, 2015 by JAHS 1
JLHPROF Posted December 4, 2015 Posted December 4, 2015 15 minutes ago, Tony Frank said: We had our first estate when we were spirits with our Heavenly Father in the celestial kingdom. As a result of the War in Heaven, Satan did not keep his first estate. Our second estate is having a body here on earth. The earth will be an eternal inheritance of those who have lived worthy of a celestial glory, and those who receive celestial glory are the ones who "keep their second estate." In Abraham 3:26 & 28, "And they who keep their first estate shall be added upon [They will be added upon by getting bodies.]; and they who keep not their first estate shall not have glory in the same kingdom with those who keep their first estate [Satan and his angels will not receive a kingdom of glory]; and they who keep their second estate shall have glory added upon their heads for ever and ever . . . . And the second was angry [that would be Satan who was angry], and kept not his first estate; and, at that day, many followed after him. You raise a couple of interesting questions (highlighted for ease): 1. Which Celestial Kingdom are you referring to? Because the Celestial Kindgom in which we will dwell will be this earth when it receives its resurrection. So did we start out in God's Celestial Kingdom before inheriting our own? (D&C 88:17-20/TPJS 181) 2. If only those who receive a Celestial glory keep their "second estate", then second estate cannot refer to the physical body gained here on earth - because the Telestial and Terrestrial are also resurrected with their physical bodies, only less light. So what is the "second estate"? What do the Celestial get to keep that the other kingdoms don't, because it's not physical bodies?
filovirus Posted December 4, 2015 Author Posted December 4, 2015 This is what I found in the Miracle of Forgiveness by Spencer W. Kimball: “Life was to be in three segments or estates: premortal, mortal, and immortal. The third stage would incorporate exaltation—eternal life with godhood—for those who would fully magnify their mortal lives. Performance in one estate would vitally affect the succeeding estate or estates. If a person kept his first estate, he would be permitted the second or the mortal life as a further period of trial and experience. If he magnified his second estate, his earth experience, eternal life would await him. To that end men go through the numerous experiences of earth life—‘to see if they will do all things whatsoever the Lord their God shall command them.’" So, according to this and the Ludlow quote above, the spirit world would fall into the "second estate". But many people kept their first estate in mortal life. I guess I am looking at this concept as time constant. If I look at it as an inheritance type of view, the it would incorporate both mortal and spirit world life.
filovirus Posted December 4, 2015 Author Posted December 4, 2015 54 minutes ago, JLHPROF said: Why wouldn't those laws carry on in some form? And perhaps obedience is proven by obedience to the higher laws that DO apply. It seems to me that those laws are mortal life related. Overcoming the tendencies and cravings of a body.
strappinglad Posted December 4, 2015 Posted December 4, 2015 If the second estate ends with the resurrection then the second estate has ended for many since Christ's resurrection. We know that many of those who lived righteous lives before Christ have now attained godhood, such as Abraham. We are told in Matt 27:52-53 that many of the saints arose right after Christ did. I do wonder who they were,whether they were ancient Saints or more recent ones. I think those who are now resurrected dwell apart from the ' spirit world ' ,though they surely must be able to visit for teaching etc. One thing, those who report NDEs almost universally refer to ' heaven ' as " home " .
Tony Frank Posted December 4, 2015 Posted December 4, 2015 (edited) 19 hours ago, JLHPROF said: You raise a couple of interesting questions (highlighted for ease): 1. Which Celestial Kingdom are you referring to? Because the Celestial Kindgom in which we will dwell will be this earth when it receives its resurrection. So did we start out in God's Celestial Kingdom before inheriting our own? (D&C 88:17-20/TPJS 181) 2. If only those who receive a Celestial glory keep their "second estate", then second estate cannot refer to the physical body gained here on earth - because the Telestial and Terrestrial are also resurrected with their physical bodies, only less light. So what is the "second estate"? What do the Celestial get to keep that the other kingdoms don't, because it's not physical bodies? Our Heavenly Father had a glorified Celestial body when we were spirit children in His presence. The Savior rose with a glorified Celestial body three days after His crucifixion. They were and still are in a Celestial Kingdom. This earth will also become a Celestial Kingdom. The second estate is having a body here on earth, but those receiving Telestial and Terrestrial glories will no longer be on earth after the final judgment. The Celestial earth will be for those who receive Celestial glory. The "earth" is the second estate that we keep. Everyone gets a second estate when they come to earth and get a body, but only those worthy of Celestial glory keep their second estate. Edited December 4, 2015 by Tony Frank 1
JLHPROF Posted December 4, 2015 Posted December 4, 2015 14 minutes ago, Tony Frank said: Our Heavenly Father had a glorified Celestial body when we were spirit children in His presence. The Savior rose with a glorified Celestial body three days after His crucifixion. They were and still are in a Celestial Kingdom. This earth will also become a Celestial Kingdom. The second estate is having a body here on earth, but those receiving Telestial and Terrestrial glories will no longer be on earth after thee judgment. The Celestial earth will be for those who receive Celestial glory. The "earth" is the second estate that we keep. Everyone gets a second estate when they come to earth and get a body, but only those worthy of Celestial glory keep their second estate. I don't explicitly disagree with anything here (had to happen eventually ). Although your second point does make me wonder - You claim that the earth is the second estate you get to keep. So what was the first? If I left Heavenly Father's kingdom to come to earth, did I keep my first estate? I don't see how I can keep the earth and another location, and moving on to the third estate will be yet another location. I'm not sure the earth is the second estate. Perhaps you are right though, but if you are then are 3rd estate would have to be the earth we create when we become Gods. But then I'm not sure estates are bodies either. Lucifer and his angels lost their first estate but still have spirit bodies. You state that those in the Telestial and Terrestrial will not have their second estate, but they will have resurrected bodies. I DO think what we consider to be each "estate" guides a lot of our thinking though.I'm not convinced that "estate" is a location or a body. But I think you are right that it is more likely to be a location than a body type.
filovirus Posted December 4, 2015 Author Posted December 4, 2015 I have always believed that "estate" was more of a time issue than a physical location. First estate = Premortal life. Second estate = Mortal probation + Spirit World. Third estate = never really considered it before now. Could estate be another term for covenant? Those who kept their first covenant in the premortal life are able to progress. Those who keep their second covenant in mortal life are able to progress. Will we be making covenants in the C. Kingdom with God and not making them in the lesser kingdoms? 1
JLHPROF Posted December 4, 2015 Posted December 4, 2015 2 minutes ago, filovirus said: I have always believed that "estate" was more of a time issue than a physical location. First estate = Premortal life. Second estate = Mortal probation + Spirit World. Third estate = never really considered it before now. Could estate be another term for covenant? Those who kept their first covenant in the premortal life are able to progress. Those who keep their second covenant in mortal life are able to progress. Will we be making covenants in the C. Kingdom with God and not making them in the lesser kingdoms? Now you're thinking in interesting ways and making me think too! Maybe "estate" means as it does here sometimes - inheritance. Those in premortality who inherited the blessings of mortality. Those in this life who inherit with Christ all that the Father has. Those in future creations who inherit dominions and glories as they progress. Perhaps inheritances are our estates.
Zakuska Posted December 4, 2015 Posted December 4, 2015 (edited) Second Estate ends at Our ressurection Romans 8 19 For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God. 20 For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope, 21 Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God. 22 For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now.6 23 And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body. 24 For we are saved by hope: but hope that is seen is not hope: for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for? 25 But if we hope for that we see not, then do we with patience wait for it. Edited December 4, 2015 by Zakuska
JLHPROF Posted December 5, 2015 Posted December 5, 2015 36 minutes ago, Zakuska said: Second Estate ends at Our ressurection Romans 8 19 For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God. 20 For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope, 21 Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God. 22 For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now.6 23 And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body. 24 For we are saved by hope: but hope that is seen is not hope: for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for? 25 But if we hope for that we see not, then do we with patience wait for it. And where does that quote mention our "estates"? You're making assumptions not in evidence again.
Tony Frank Posted December 5, 2015 Posted December 5, 2015 8 hours ago, JLHPROF said: I don't explicitly disagree with anything here (had to happen eventually ). Although your second point does make me wonder - You claim that the earth is the second estate you get to keep. So what was the first? If I left Heavenly Father's kingdom to come to earth, did I keep my first estate? I don't see how I can keep the earth and another location, and moving on to the third estate will be yet another location. I'm not sure the earth is the second estate. Perhaps you are right though, but if you are then are 3rd estate would have to be the earth we create when we become Gods. But then I'm not sure estates are bodies either. Lucifer and his angels lost their first estate but still have spirit bodies. You state that those in the Telestial and Terrestrial will not have their second estate, but they will have resurrected bodies. I DO think what we consider to be each "estate" guides a lot of our thinking though.I'm not convinced that "estate" is a location or a body. But I think you are right that it is more likely to be a location than a body type. As I stated above from the book of Abraham: "And they who keep their first estate shall be added upon [They will be added upon by getting bodies.]; "and they who keep not their first estate shall not have glory in the same kingdom with those who keep their first estate [Satan and his angels did not keep their first estate and will not receive a kingdom of glory, which means they shall not have glory in the same kingdom with those who keep their first estate]; "and they who keep their second estate shall have glory added upon their heads for ever and ever . . . . And the second was angry [that would be Satan who was angry], and kept not his first estate; and, at that day, many followed after him." Life with our Heavenly Father was our first estate. We kept our first estate by supporting His eternal plan of salvation. Satan and his angels did not support the plan and lost their first estate. Earth's final destiny is to become glorified and exalted (D&C 77:1–2; 130:8–9). The earth will become an eternal inheritance of those who have lived worthy of a celestial glory (D&C 88:14–26). They will enjoy the presence of the Father and the Son (D&C 76:62). Hence, those who are worthy of celestial glory "keep their second estate" and "have glory added upon their heads for ever and ever," while those who receive terrestrial or telestial glory do not keep their second estate.
Zakuska Posted December 5, 2015 Posted December 5, 2015 19 hours ago, JLHPROF said: And where does that quote mention our "estates"? You're making assumptions not in evidence again. No assuming needed. Second Estate See this page in the original 1992 publication. Author: Baugh, Alexander L. "Second estate" is a Latter-day Saint term that refers to mankind's mortal existence on this earth. In scripture it occurs only in the writings of Abraham (Abr. 3:26), but the preearth life of spirits is called "their first estate" in Jude 1:6. Latter-day Saints believe that through the process of birth, the spirit children of God who kept their first estate (premortal) enter into their second estate by receiving a physical body with additional opportunities for experience and development. Mortality is then a probationary period in which individuals "prepare to meet God" (Alma 12:24). In the final judgment all mankind will "be judged of their works…which were done by the temporal body in their days of probation" (1 Ne. 15:32; cf. Alma 12:14). All who receive the saving principles and ordinances of the gospel of Jesus Christ (including faith, repentance, baptism, the gift of the Holy Ghost, ordination to the priesthood for men, Endowment, and eternal marriage) and seek to live righteous and useful lives, embracing the fulness of the gospel, will obtain the complete blessings of the Atonement of Jesus Christ. All who had no opportunity to do so during earth life will have it in the postmortal spirit world (1 Pet. 3:18-19;4:6; D&C 138:36-37). Every person who has lived on the earth will be resurrected with perfected corporeal bodies, and those who have kept the commandments will enter into eternal life, and "have glory added upon their heads for ever and ever" (Abr. 3:26). ALEXANDER L. BAUGH http://eom.byu.edu/index.php/Second_Estate
JLHPROF Posted December 6, 2015 Posted December 6, 2015 6 hours ago, Zakuska said: No assuming needed. Second Estate See this page in the original 1992 publication. Author: Baugh, Alexander L. "Second estate" is a Latter-day Saint term that refers to mankind's mortal existence on this earth. In scripture it occurs only in the writings of Abraham (Abr. 3:26), but the preearth life of spirits is called "their first estate" in Jude 1:6. Latter-day Saints believe that through the process of birth, the spirit children of God who kept their first estate (premortal) enter into their second estate by receiving a physical body with additional opportunities for experience and development. Mortality is then a probationary period in which individuals "prepare to meet God" (Alma 12:24). In the final judgment all mankind will "be judged of their works…which were done by the temporal body in their days of probation" (1 Ne. 15:32; cf. Alma 12:14). All who receive the saving principles and ordinances of the gospel of Jesus Christ (including faith, repentance, baptism, the gift of the Holy Ghost, ordination to the priesthood for men, Endowment, and eternal marriage) and seek to live righteous and useful lives, embracing the fulness of the gospel, will obtain the complete blessings of the Atonement of Jesus Christ. All who had no opportunity to do so during earth life will have it in the postmortal spirit world (1 Pet. 3:18-19;4:6; D&C 138:36-37). Every person who has lived on the earth will be resurrected with perfected corporeal bodies, and those who have kept the commandments will enter into eternal life, and "have glory added upon their heads for ever and ever" (Abr. 3:26). ALEXANDER L. BAUGH http://eom.byu.edu/index.php/Second_Estate This is all very well, but it doesn't fit some of the descriptions used in scripture. 1. If First Estates were just "Pre-Earth life" then the 1/3 part of the hosts of heaven can't be said to have lost their first estates. They still have them being still in their preearth spirit condition (until the final judgement). 2. Second Estates, the condition we are now on earth having physical bodies. Ok. So if we keep our physical bodies do we keep our second estates? Do only those who are Celestialized keep their second estates? Do only those who inherit this earth as joint heirs (ie Celestialized AND exalted) with Christ keep their second estates? What is the "estate" - the planet? the bodies? the inheritance? the glory? Do we really know? 1
Tony Frank Posted December 6, 2015 Posted December 6, 2015 44 minutes ago, JLHPROF said: This is all very well, but it doesn't fit some of the descriptions used in scripture. 1. If First Estates were just "Pre-Earth life" then the 1/3 part of the hosts of heaven can't be said to have lost their first estates. They still have them being still in their preearth spirit condition (until the final judgement). 2. Second Estates, the condition we are now on earth having physical bodies. Ok. So if we keep our physical bodies do we keep our second estates? Do only those who are Celestialized keep their second estates? Do only those who inherit this earth as joint heirs (ie Celestialized AND exalted) with Christ keep their second estates? What is the "estate" - the planet? the bodies? the inheritance? the glory? Do we really know? Did you ignore my post above? The "first estate" was with our Heavenly Father. 1/3 part of the hosts of heaven lost their first estate when they were thrown out for rejecting the eternal plan of salvation. The earth is the second estate. Its final destiny is to become glorified and exalted (D&C 77:1–2; 130:8–9). The earth will become an eternal inheritance of those who have lived worthy of a celestial glory (D&C 88:14–26). They will enjoy the presence of the Father and the Son (D&C 76:62). Hence, those who are worthy of celestial glory "keep their second estate" and "have glory added upon their heads for ever and ever," while those who receive terrestrial or telestial glory do not keep their second estate.
JLHPROF Posted December 6, 2015 Posted December 6, 2015 Just now, Tony Frank said: Did you ignore my post above? The "first estate" was with our Heavenly Father. 1/3 part of the hosts of heaven lost their first estate when they were thrown out for rejecting the eternal plan of salvation. The earth is the second estate. Its final destiny is to become glorified and exalted (D&C 77:1–2; 130:8–9). The earth will become an eternal inheritance of those who have lived worthy of a celestial glory (D&C 88:14–26). They will enjoy the presence of the Father and the Son (D&C 76:62). Hence, those who are worthy of celestial glory "keep their second estate" and "have glory added upon their heads for ever and ever," while those who receive terrestrial or telestial glory do not keep their second estate. No, I didn't ignore it at all. I agree with your post more than the posts by Zakuska. I think it is more in keeping with scripture. Estate is inheritance to me. Which the 1/3 part lost as you say. Which only the celestial glory receive. Others like to insist it is just a linear progression - premortality/mortality/resurrection 1-2-3. Some like to think it is a matter of location or of kind of body. I am agreeing with you - it is the glory and inheritance received, not the planet or the body.
RevTestament Posted December 7, 2015 Posted December 7, 2015 On Saturday, December 05, 2015 7:38:32, Tony Frank said: Did you ignore my post above? The "first estate" was with our Heavenly Father. 1/3 part of the hosts of heaven lost their first estate when they were thrown out for rejecting the eternal plan of salvation. The earth is the second estate. Its final destiny is to become glorified and exalted (D&C 77:1–2; 130:8–9). The earth will become an eternal inheritance of those who have lived worthy of a celestial glory (D&C 88:14–26). They will enjoy the presence of the Father and the Son (D&C 76:62). Hence, those who are worthy of celestial glory "keep their second estate" and "have glory added upon their heads for ever and ever," while those who receive terrestrial or telestial glory do not keep their second estate. Hmmm. I see JHLPROF's point - I still think you are assuming a lot. I personally do not believe that our second estate ends at our resurrection, so I cannot agree with you. Yet, I have no specific scripture to prove that point. I believe there are certain things we can do on earth that we cannot do or receive in the spirit world. Hence, for me it is a different estate or third estate. Although it is possible some may skip it. For instance those translated may not ever enter the "spirit world" per se as a spirit. They may not in that sense ever be resurrected either, but simply be perfected. So again I cannot agree that resurrection marks the end of our second estate. So in my view the spirit world is a third possible estate for some to add to their probation. Some such as Moses, however, apparently skip that probation, having met the requirements of the gospel in their second estate while on the earth. Well, those are my thoughts on the issue - the reader is welcome to disagree.
filovirus Posted December 7, 2015 Author Posted December 7, 2015 13 minutes ago, RevTestament said: Hmmm. I see JHLPROF's point - I still think you are assuming a lot. I personally do not believe that our second estate ends at our resurrection, so I cannot agree with you. Yet, I have no specific scripture to prove that point. I believe there are certain things we can do on earth that we cannot do or receive in the spirit world. Hence, for me it is a different estate or third estate. Although it is possible some may skip it. For instance those translated may not ever enter the "spirit world" per se as a spirit. They may not in that sense ever be resurrected either, but simply be perfected. So again I cannot agree that resurrection marks the end of our second estate. So in my view the spirit world is a third possible estate for some to add to their probation. Some such as Moses, however, apparently skip that probation, having met the requirements of the gospel in their second estate while on the earth. Well, those are my thoughts on the issue - the reader is welcome to disagree. My understanding was that Moses was translated, not resurrected. He wasn't resurrected until after Christ, who was the first. Moses had a work still to do, that was accomplished on the Mount of Transfiguration. A passing of his priesthood keys. This could only be done by the laying on of hands. We don't know if a translated body is perfect or not, but we do know it isn't a resurrected body. Since through Christ we can all now be resurrected, I don't believe any will be translated again. Straight to resurrection. This is off the top of my head, so I may be wrong in my understanding.
RevTestament Posted December 7, 2015 Posted December 7, 2015 23 minutes ago, filovirus said: My understanding was that Moses was translated, not resurrected. He wasn't resurrected until after Christ, who was the first. Moses had a work still to do, that was accomplished on the Mount of Transfiguration. A passing of his priesthood keys. This could only be done by the laying on of hands. We don't know if a translated body is perfect or not, but we do know it isn't a resurrected body. Jesus told His apostles there were some standing there who would not taste death. In other words I believe they were translated. A translated body may not be a perfected resurrected body, but it is more than mortal. I don't believe Moses was ever "resurrected." As you say he was translated. At Christ's resurrection He would have not been "resurrected" but perfected. Resurrected in my mind means to return to one's body or returned to life. Moses already abode in life. He did not need his spirit to rejoin his body, but only for his body to become the immortal body promised. To me that is different than "resurrection." Quote Since through Christ we can all now be resurrected, I don't believe any will be translated again. Straight to resurrection. This is off the top of my head, so I may be wrong in my understanding. Yep, you could be: D&C 88:96 And the saints that are upon the earth, who are alive, shall be quickened and be caught up to meet him. 97 And they who have slept in their graves shall come forth, for their graves shall be opened; and they also shall be caught up to meet him in the midst of the pillar of heaven—
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