All Are Alike Unto God

[tyler90az]

All Are Alike unto God is a group of women who desire changes to be made in the Church.

facebook: https://www.facebook.com/pages/All-Are-Alike-unto-God/269284059856654?ref=stream

Do you think any of their goals are possible? Which ones?

[Storm Rider]

I think some of the goals are already achieved. For example, I have not heard a probing sexual question since I was a teenager from any bishop, stake president, or any other leader.

From reading the link, I think these are women that will not be satisifed with anything until they themselves are become the prophet and the twelve apostles. Their entire concept begins with "me"; what "I" want, what "I" need, what "I" think is necessary, important, and vital. I have never seen any endeavor or objective achieve anything good when it is "me" centered. I reject their entire premise for this single reason.

These people just make me feel sad. They no more understand the Church of Jesus Christ and its teachings than a two year old in a tantrum. (No, I am not saying they are shrill in their statements; it is their focus on "me" that goads.)

[tyler90az]

I think some of the goals are already achieved. For example, I have not heard a probing sexual question since I was a teenager from any bishop, stake president, or any other leader.

From reading the link, I think these are women that will not be satisifed with anything until they themselves are become the prophet and the twelve apostles. Their entire concept begins with "me"; what "I" want, what "I" need, what "I" think is necessary, important, and vital. I have never seen any endeavor or objective achieve anything good when it is "me" centered. I reject their entire premise for this single reason.

These people just make me feel sad. They no more understand the Church of Jesus Christ and its teachings than a two year old in a tantrum. (No, I am not saying they are shrill in their statements; it is their focus on "me" that goads.)

I have to support it for a few of the smaller goals. No other push has come out to make some of those smaller changes. Therefore, I can hope the 15 atleast become aware of the smaller ones. Although people may agree they will not come out and say it.

It is true they are pushing it if they think they will get the Priesthood.

Edited September 25, 2012 by tyler90az

[Mark Beesley]

All Are Alike unto God is a group of women who desire changes to be made in the Church.

facebook: https://www.facebook...6654?ref=stream

Do you think any of their goals are possible? Which ones?

I think it is possible the topic was exhaustively covered in the last thread on this issue that YOU got closed because you couldn't discuss it without resort to inflammatory language.

[Bikeemikey]

I think some of the goals are already achieved. For example, I have not heard a probing sexual question since I was a teenager from any bishop, stake president, or any other leader.

From reading the link, I think these are women that will not be satisifed with anything until they themselves are become the prophet and the twelve apostles. Their entire concept begins with "me"; what "I" want, what "I" need, what "I" think is necessary, important, and vital. I have never seen any endeavor or objective achieve anything good when it is "me" centered. I reject their entire premise for this single reason.

These people just make me feel sad. They no more understand the Church of Jesus Christ and its teachings than a two year old in a tantrum. (No, I am not saying they are shrill in their statements; it is their focus on "me" that goads.)

Im a guy and I support it. What is wrong with the question of a Women being the/a prophet? Perhaps God will one day give the women the phood and then perhaps one day a women will be the prophet.

[tyler90az]

I think it is possible the topic was exhaustively covered in the last thread on this issue that YOU got closed because you couldn't discuss it without resort to inflammatory language.

How it was offensive I do not know... Touch to close to the surface or what?

This is a completely different question then the last thread.

[tyler90az]

Im a guy and I support it. What is wrong with the question of a Women being the/a prophet? Perhaps God will one day give the women the phood and then perhaps one day a women will be the prophet.

I do not see it anytime soon though.

[Tacenda]

Im a guy and I support it. What is wrong with the question of a Women being the/a prophet? Perhaps God will one day give the women the phood and then perhaps one day a women will be the prophet.

In the past there were prophetesses. weren't there? It was probably a divine calling, not any woman could be called one.

[Bikeemikey]

In the past there were prophetesses. weren't there? It was probably a divine calling, not any woman could be called one.

True that... not every man can be a prophet either...

There is no doubt that your church is dominated by a patriarchal leadership structure...

The question is whether or not this is best/gods wishes.

The other question is whether there is a way to understand the priesthood (assuming it to be a males only thing) whilst still providing a greater degree of decision making equality across the genders.

[CV75]

All Are Alike unto God is a group of women who desire changes to be made in the Church.

Do you think any of their goals are possible? Which ones?

“…with God, all things are possible.” Desiring change is one thing, but effectuating change outside the divinely appointed priesthood council structure is not God’s way of doing things. Many of these things are already addressed through priesthood councils.

Even desiring change, to be pleasing to the Lord, must follow spiritual rules governed by the Light of Christ, the Holy Ghost, etc. I don't see the inspiration in some of these desires.

[Saints Alive]

I wouldn't mind seeing female blessings of healing and comfort come back to the main stream. A lot of the their requests are unrealistic.

[CV75]

The other question is whether there is a way to understand the priesthood (assuming it to be a males only thing) whilst still providing a greater degree of decision making equality across the genders.

This is one of the purposes of priesthood councils, though it must be accepted that the decision-making process is gender neutral; decision-confirmation is proper only by the Holy Ghost; and priesthood council presidency is given to males.

[CV75]

I wouldn't mind seeing female blessings of healing and comfort come back to the main stream. A lot of the their requests are unrealistic.

I recall a woman reading from her patriarchal blessing during a sacrament meeting talk that this is a gift of hers.

[TruthSeeker24]

Personally, I believe feminism is a doctrine of Satan. Don't kill me for saying so lol. Who are we to question the organization and structure of the Church?

[Tacenda]

Personally, I believe feminism is a doctrine of Satan. Don't kill me for saying so lol. Who are we to question the organization and structure of the Church?

please....

[Saints Alive]

Personally, I believe feminism is a doctrine of Satan. Don't kill me for saying so lol. Who are we to question the organization and structure of the Church?

That's a bit of an oversimplification I believe. Like anything else feminism can be taken too far. Do you think women should be allowed to vote? It was feminist that got them the right to vote.

[TruthSeeker24]

That's a bit of an oversimplification I believe. Like anything else feminism can be taken too far. Do you think women should be allowed to vote? It was feminist that got them the right to vote.

Well spoken I stand corrected. Thank you for the perspective

[changed]

I agree with the sentiment of "ask and receive" - that if you never ask for anything, or desire it, then you won't get it...Didn't Emma ask for the relief society and then get it? It is good to ask for good things, but there is a difference between asking with the understanding of "never-the-less, not my will, but thine be done", with a willingness to follow the guidance of the priesthood on everything.

I think we should make up a new group - one that asks, but asks reverently, and with the right spirit - where the point of asking is not trying to force our will ahead of God's revealed purposes, or to list all of the inequalities, but instead to ask just in case we are living below our privileges simply because we have not asked... to ask for an increased capacity to serve.

It's a hard thing to know just what to ask for, how to ask for it, but to be sure that after all is said and done, God's will prevailed...

I certainly don't want to get beyond the veil, and then be told "Why didn't you ever ask?"

2 Nephi 32:4... it will be because ye ask not, neither do ye knock; wherefore, ye are not brought into the light, but must perish in the dark.

Edited September 25, 2012 by changed

[wenglund]

All Are Alike unto God is a group of women who desire changes to be made in the Church.

facebook: https://www.facebook...6654?ref=stream

Do you think any of their goals are possible? Which ones?

The better question to me is: Do you think these goals are made more possible by interminable busy-bodies presumptuously minding God's business and seeking to counsel his leaders and Church, or by people taking care of their own business and personally preparing themselves to receive what God thinks best for them and his Church?

In other words, do you think the goals are more possible through pridefully wielding the arm of flesh or by humbly relying on God?

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

[Saints Alive]

The better question to me is: Do you think these goals are made more possible by interminable busy-bodies presumptuously minding God's business and seeking to counsel his leaders and Church, or by people taking care of their own business and personally preparing themselves to receive what God thinks best for them and his Church?

In other words, do you think the goals are more possible through pridefully wielding the arm of flesh or by humbly relying on God?

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

Not so fast! I think it is perfectly permissible to present your problems and make requests. Now this petition probably goes to far.

[Bikeemikey]

The better question to me is: Do you think these goals are made more possible by interminable busy-bodies presumptuously minding God's business and seeking to counsel his leaders and Church, or by people taking care of their own business and personally preparing themselves to receive what God thinks best for them and his Church?

In other words, do you think the goals are more possible through pridefully wielding the arm of flesh or by humbly relying on God?

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

Cant they be made possible by both?

[changed]

...people taking care of their own business and personally preparing themselves to receive what God thinks best for them and his Church..

I think we are commanded to ask - before we can receive what God thinks is best. What things do you think we should be asking for? and striving for? I think it does need to be a proactive process, we can't just sit back and receive.

(New Testament | John 16:24)

24 Hitherto have ye asked nothing in my name: ask, and ye shall receive, that your joy may be full.

Edited September 25, 2012 by changed

[wenglund]

Not so fast! I think it is perfectly permissible to present your problems and make requests. Now this petition probably goes to far.

Your missing the point--though perhaps not as badly as the petitioners.

The very nature of the request, itself, may well impede the goals from being achieved where best and appropriate, because it may give clear indication that the petitioners are not rightly prepared to receive the request.

For one, the nature of the request fundamentally ignores the essential purpose of the Church and gospel, and gets it exactly backwards. The gospel is all about conforming man to God, and not the other way around. As such, our requests to God, particularly as individual members, ought to be focused on how we, personally, may improve, and not on how we might change God's church to suit our personal human cultural proclivities. By doing the later, we demonstrate just how far we are from being in a rightful position to petition God on behalf of the Church.

For another, not only should the focus be personal (regarding changing ourselves) instead of on the Church, but it should also be on our personal families since the families are not only the fundamental structure of the gospel, but ultimately the end structure for the Church.

I submit that whichever of the stated goals may be achieved, it will likely be through an inevitable transition from the preparatory, ecclesiastical structure of the Church, to a patriarchal or familial structure of the Church, where mothers and wives will be intimately involved in administration and ministration of their respective family/Church.

To me, this transition is unlikely to happen as long as people remain too dependant and too focused upon the ecclesiastical structure at the expense of their own personal progress and the progress of their personal families. And, it is unlikely to happen where pride overshadows humility.

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

[wenglund]

Cant they be made possible by both?

As explained above, I believe the one increases the probabilities while the other impedes the prospects.

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

[Bikeemikey]

Your missing the point--though perhaps not as badly as the petitioners.

The very nature of the request, itself, may well impede the goals from being achieved where best and appropriate, because it may give clear indication that the petitioners are not rightly prepared to receive the request.

For one, the nature of the request fundamentally ignores the essential purpose of the Church and gospel, and gets it exactly backwards. The gospel is all about conforming man to God, and not the other way around. As such, our requests to God, particularly as individual members, ought to be focused on how we, personally, may improve, and not on how we might change God's church to suit our personal human cultural proclivities. By doing the later, we demonstrate just how far we are from being in a rightful position to petition God on behalf of the Church.

For another, not only should the focus be personal (regarding changing ourselves) instead of on the Church, but it should also be on our personal families since the families are not only the fundamental structure of the gospel, but ultimately the end structure for the Church.

I submit that whichever of the stated goals may be achieved, it will likely be through an inevitable transition from the preparatory, ecclesiastical structure of the Church, to a patriarchal or familial structure of the Church, where mothers and wives will be intimately involved in administration and ministration of their respective family/Church.

To me, this transition is unlikely to happen as long as people remain too dependant and too focused upon the ecclesiastical structure at the expense of their own personal progress and the progress of their personal families. And, it is unlikely to happen where pride overshadows humility.

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

Can the petitioners be pointing out that the Church has got in the way of Gospel?

I am assuming that you don't think the Church can make mistakes, right?