Can An Individual Be Exalted

[mercyngrace]

ldsfaqs,

You wrote: You should also note, that those who are like this, will not end up in the highest Kingdom of the Celestial Kingdom. They simply aren't worthy of it.

Can you provide a reference for this statement? D&C 132 says quite specifically that they "shall be gods". Are you suggesting that all in the CK are gods but that some gods are better than others?

Thanks,

MnG

[rpn]

Haven't read the other posts, and perhaps this isn't what you meant. But the answer is of course. There will be a whole lot of very righteous people born and raised in the millennium, AFTER the first resurrection is complete. All of those people absolutely can gain exaltation.

[jo1952]

The thread title is the question. Please give more than a yes/no response. I'm interested in your reasoning and authoritative sources if you have any.

Thanks,

MnG

Hi Mercyngrace:

I think it is possible that Daniel is not going to be brought forth in the first resurrection(s). In Daniel's prophecies it does not appear that he knew about the Atonement. He also admits to not understanding one of the prophecies he is given.

Dan 12:8 And I heard, but I understood not: then said I, O my Lord, what shall be the end of these things?

Dan 12:9 And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end.

BTW, I believe that all the understanding that was "closed up and sealed" is now being revealed in these latter days as the end times are practically upon us.

At any rate, it does not sound like Daniel goes to Abraham's bosom. Also, if he did not understand about the Atonement, then he would not have died in Christ. I believe other OT Prophets did understand. I'm thinking that God perhaps has a purpose (if I am interpreting this correctly) in bringing Daniel forth after the first resurrection(s) so that those who are physically alive at that time, as well as others who have been resurrected, will be able to specifically witness Daniel's resurrection as he is the Prophet who prophesied the very day Jesus would enter the City of Jerusalem - which is the day now recognized as Palm Sunday.

Dan 12:13 But go thou thy way till the end be: for thou shalt rest, and stand in thy lot at the end of the days.

Regards,

jo

[mfbukowski]

I do not think that one can be sealed in the new and everlasting covenant by the Holy Spirit of promise only in this life. D&C 76:53 doesn’t specify when it must occur, only that it must occur in order to come forth in the first resurrection and be exalted. So I think the verse applies to those who received it in this life and did not break the covenant, and to those who received it later in the spirit world before the resurrection.With regards to its connection with the first resurrection, it does not apply to those who were thus sealed but did things that merit their waiting to come forth until the next resurrection.

But one can have their calling and election made sure here- second endowment and all that.

[BCSpace]

I believe the Atonement of Christ has the power to save everyone into the kingdom of Heaven. The question is to what degree and that seems to be determined wholly on one's own merits even to the point of rejecting the Atonement altogether and not inheriting any degree of glory (sons of Perdition). I think murderers can and should repent and such seems to have efficacy (Revelation 9:21), but 1 John 3:15 seems to preclude a murderer from being able to attain exaltation.

As may have already been mentioned, David was guilty of murder (indirectly) and did not attain exaltation. He did commit adultery, but there seems not be a preclusion of exaltation based on that sin as long as one repents. It seems apparent that an unrepentant murderer will receive a Telestial glory.

Edited July 24, 2011 by BCSpace

[Rob Osborn]

Exactly.

The reason I ask is because depending on your reading of the D&C there is a possible conflict on this issue. D&C 76 says that those in the Celestial kingdom are those who come forth in the first resurrection. D&C 132 says that even if you don't come forth in the first resurrection, you can still achieve godhood.

I was just curious as to whether others had given the issue any thought.

This too has confused me as to it's meaning. It appears that there is some discrepency with our doctrine on the matter. Perhaps this was a period where the doctrine was evolving.

[ldsfaqs]

ldsfaqs,

You wrote: You should also note, that those who are like this, will not end up in the highest Kingdom of the Celestial Kingdom. They simply aren't worthy of it.

Can you provide a reference for this statement?

No, not specifically, it's only clearly implied by all the related doctrine/scripture.

D&C 132 says quite specifically that they "shall be gods". Are you suggesting that all in the CK are gods but that some gods are better than others?

Of course.... There is the Most High God, the Father, Jesus Christ, who's also God, and everyone else who are also Gods, but certainly not to the level of "God".

This is basic LDS theology that all who are of God, live with God, etc. are also "gods". There would be no reason to call the Father the "Most High God", if there weren't other Gods, and if there weren't other levels of gods. Christ also called us gods.

Thanks,

MnG

You welcome.

[mercyngrace]

No, not specifically, it's only clearly implied by all the related doctrine/scripture.

ldsfaqs,

If it were clearly implied, I wouldn't have asked for a reference.

Of course.... There is the Most High God, the Father, Jesus Christ, who's also God, and everyone else who are also Gods, but certainly not to the level of "God".

This is basic LDS theology that all who are of God, live with God, etc. are also "gods". There would be no reason to call the Father the "Most High God", if there weren't other Gods, and if there weren't other levels of gods. Christ also called us gods.

Yes but where is it written that all who inhabit the Celestial Kingdom are gods? My question to you was: Are you suggesting that all in the CK are gods but that some gods are better than others?

Please provide a reference if you can.

FWIW, according to McConkie God(s) increase in dominion but they do not "progress" so to suggest a stratification based on anything other than influence and stewardship might be new doctrine. Unless of course, you can provide a reference for that implication also.

[CV75]

But one can have their calling and election made sure here- second endowment and all that.

Absolutely! My point is that the D&C 76:50-70 reference just isn't limited to the requisite exaltation ordinances being received while one is alive, but by proxy when he is dead (baptism, Gift of the Holy Ghost, sealed by the Holy Spirit of promise, etc).

It is interesting to me that these verses distinguish between the resurrection of the just and the first resurrection, with both/either leading to exaltation. Verses 64 and 65 (and 50) speak of having a part in the first resurrection and coming forth in the resurrection of the just. Because those that come forth in the "next" resurrection backslid after being sealed by the Holy Spirit of promise (D&C 132:19, 20), it seems that the resurrection of the just is a term used to identify those who are thus sealed (whether in this life or the next) and did not backslide. Of course, I wouldn't think that someone who receives them in the next life is likely to backslide, but I suppose it is possible.

Edited July 24, 2011 by CV75

[mfbukowski]

FWIW, according to McConkie God(s) increase in dominion but they do not "progress" so to suggest a stratification based on anything other than influence and stewardship might be new doctrine. Unless of course, you can provide a reference for that implication also.

I would suggest that is contradictory, and that he is trying to reconcile the Neoplatonic Christian idea of an unchanging God with a God who progresses through his children.

I have seen remarks to the effect that our Father will always be our "God" regardless of how far we progress- which definitely implies that he will always be as far "above" us in progression as he is now.

As we progress, so does he.

[inquiringmind]

I would suggest that is contradictory, and that he is trying to reconcile the Neoplatonic Christian idea of an unchanging God with a God who progresses through his children.

I have seen remarks to the effect that our Father will always be our "God" regardless of how far we progress- which definitely implies that he will always be as far "above" us in progression as he is now.

As we progress, so does he.

If we have a heavenly gradfather, would he always be our heavenly Father's God (and will we ever get to know him)?

I was told (by a missionary) that Abraham is already exalted.

Is that true?

Does it say that somewhere in D&C?

Also, when were the other Old Testament Saints and Patriarchs resurrected?

If Isaac, Jacob, and Joseph (of Egypt) were resurrected at the same time as Abraham, wouldn't they be exalted too?

Edited July 25, 2011 by inquiringmind

[Nathair/|\]

If we have a heavenly gradfather, would he always be our heavenly Father's God (and will we ever get to know him)?

yes (and not sure but I think so)

I was told (by a missionary) that Abraham is already exalted.

Is that true?

Does it say that somewhere in D&C?

yes

Also, when were the other Old Testament Saints and Patriarchs resurrected?

When Jesus was resurrected. 52And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose, 53And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.

If Isaac, Jacob, and Joseph (of Egypt) were resurrected at the same time as Abraham, wouldn't they be exalted too?

[mfbukowski]

Does it say that somewhere in D&C?

132

37Abraham received ^aconcubines, and they bore him children; and it was accounted unto him for righteousness, because they were given unto him, and he abode in my law; as Isaac also and ^bJacob did none other things than that which they were commanded; and because they did none other things than that which they were commanded, they have entered into their ^cexaltation, according to the promises, and sit upon thrones, and are not angels but are gods.

[inquiringmind]

132

37Abraham received ^aconcubines, and they bore him children; and it was accounted unto him for righteousness, because they were given unto him, and he abode in my law; as Isaac also and ^bJacob did none other things than that which they were commanded; and because they did none other things than that which they were commanded, they have entered into their ^cexaltation, according to the promises, and sit upon thrones, and are not angels but are gods.

Does it say (anywhere) when they entered their exaltation?

Were they amoung those O.T. saints who came out of their graves when Christ was resurrected (and would they have been exalted around the same time, or did they have to wait)?

Edited July 25, 2011 by inquiringmind

[mfbukowski]

Does it say (anywhere) when they entered their exaltation?

Were they amoung those O.T. saints who came out of their graves when Christ was resurrected (and would they have been exalted around the same time, or did they have to wait)?

Battery going- yes to 1

Who knows on the rest!