I am back... although i am busier than i was before i left

[mfbukowski]

On 3/25/2017 at 6:39 PM, Mike Reed said:

I posted in response to scott lloyd, since he was the one who appeared in my google search to remind me of this forum. Thankfully, many people challenged his claims in my absence, and many of whom I doubt I have ever conversed with. Is Scott Lloyd someone that I should worry about, with regard to my activity here? There were more than a few formal CFR's that moderation never honored. I suspect perhaps yes. I suspect i was previously banned because of my previous exchanges with him. But if that be true, and if you are looking for a replacement for his moderation, i think I will do a far better job.

 

Suggest you get into a gospel topic asap since mods like to classify threads as "personal" and close them.  No bueno.

[mfbukowski]

On 3/25/2017 at 6:35 PM, Mike Reed said:

Among my more recently offered studies is on the topic of "Treasure Seeking and Vicarious Work for the Dead." We have all heard the story about JS and his treasure seeking, which is perceived as an activity (however perceived as superstitious) overwhelmingly perceived as being focused on monetary gain. It wasn't solely focused on that. It was overwhelmingly perceived as a vicarious act... just as it was with regard to freeing the gini otherwise trapped in the bottle... otherwise trapped until he granted three wishes... the conception among treasure seekers was very similar: that many of the spirit guardians were trapped in a quasi-limbo state, until the treasure was retrieved. masses for the dead, prayers for the dead, and even a proxy baptism/sacrifice was performed on a rooster (to trick the devilish guardian who demanded a christian be sacrificed), in their behalf. There are also old traditions held among these "necromantic" (i put it in quotes, because these were pious efforts held by those who believed in pious traditions) treasure seekers... which speak, especially in Irish/Scottish lore of raising the dead in order to baptize them.

 

Yes I have heard of that- we fairly recently had a thread about an individual who saw himself as a "mentor" to Joseph who had some of those opinions- and this individual had been looking for buried treasure on the hill Cumorah using spiritual guides as I recall, but he then actually named Joseph as the one who would eventually find the treasure.

Unfortunately I do not remember what thread that was OR the name of the individual- I would betcha that Calm who knows all  would know exactly what I am talking about.

Have you heard about that?

As I recall there was some implication that this individual might have been transformed into "Moroni" - along the line of Ann Taves' views on how things and people can be made "special" and "sacred" through religious experience.

Sound familiar at all?

Anybody out there able to point to that thread??

Edit- here is the Taves paper but not quite what I was looking for

http://www.religion.ucsb.edu/wp-content/uploads/B-6-Golden-Plates-Numen.pdf

 

Edited March 27, 2017 by mfbukowski

[Calm]

Perhaps this?

 

[Garden Girl]

On 3/25/2017 at 6:35 PM, Mike Reed said:

 We have all heard the story about JS and his treasure seeking, which is perceived as an activity (however perceived as superstitious) overwhelmingly perceived as being focused on monetary gain. It wasn't solely focused on that. It was overwhelmingly perceived as a vicarious act...

I've really never understood all the negativity in regard to JS being a "treasure seeker."   It wasn't unheard of generally.  I grew up in a state that was flooded with thousands of treasure seekers... it was called the "Gold Rush of '49."  Part of a romanticized history with towns such as Rough and Ready, Nevada City, Placerville, Grizzly Flats... my husband and I owned property in Nevada City, CA,  right smack dab in the heart of Gold Country at the foot of the Sierra... I do understand, however, some criticism of JS if he was trying to use his spiritual gifts to try and find treasure... 

GG

[stemelbow]

Wouldn't worry about it. No one takes Scott's clock thing seriously.  There's nothing to add to what you predicted.  I remember because I said something similar as I recall, so I argued with Scott about it.  you're prediction came true.   He should apologize for making a fuss about it.