Ancient gold plates unearthed

[Rajah Manchou]

...in Boyolali

Apologies for the click-baity title. It caught me off guard too.

Its several thousand miles and 300-400 years off, but still an interesting find. Stone box included.

http://www.ibtimes.sg/indonesia-ancient-gold-plates-unearthed-boyolali-3157

Adding a link to another article I just saw while searching for photos. Gold Plates in China dating to 206 BC-AD 24.

Edited September 11, 2016 by Rajah Manchou
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[Atheist Mormon]

2 hours ago, Rajah Manchou said:

 

Ancient gold plates unearthed

What is this "find" going to ascertain to an "unbeliever" like me?

[Rajah Manchou]

1 hour ago, Atheist Mormon said:

What is this "find" going to ascertain to an "unbeliever" like me?

I don't know. What is it that you don't believe?

[maklelan]

Here's an actual picture of these "plates":

[Rajah Manchou]

17 minutes ago, maklelan said:

Here's an actual picture of these "plates":

Haha, pretty underwhelming. They must have done their SEO keyword research and discovered the term "gold plates" would get more clicks. But that's a nice stone box.

The plates found in China are more plate-like. But read that they weigh 1KG each. That'd make for a massive BOM.



 

Edited September 11, 2016 by Rajah Manchou

[rodheadlee]

What do they say?

[cdowis]

"Chin Le Noodles 10% off".

Edited September 11, 2016 by cdowis

[bcuzbcuz]

8 hours ago, Rajah Manchou said:

...in Boyolali

Apologies for the click-baity title. It caught me off guard too.

Its several thousand miles and 300-400 years off, but still an interesting find. Stone box included.

http://www.ibtimes.sg/indonesia-ancient-gold-plates-unearthed-boyolali-3157

Adding a link to another article I just saw while searching for photos. Gold Plates in China dating to 206 BC-AD 24.

Gold plates with nothing writen on them are.......well, just gold. Non-text not worth the gold they´re not written on.

[Atheist Mormon]

7 hours ago, Rajah Manchou said:

I don't know. What is it that you don't believe?

there's nothing to believe; what you see what you get. It is BoM claims supernatural origins, and that is pure fantasy.

[strappinglad]

7 minutes ago, Atheist Mormon said:

there's nothing to believe; what you see what you get. It is BoM claims supernatural origins, and that is pure fantasy.

From your mouth to God's ear..... in about 70 years.

[cdowis]

10 minutes ago, Atheist Mormon said:

there's nothing to believe; what you see what you get. It is BoM claims supernatural origins, and that is pure fantasy.

Thanks for sharing your personal opinion.  I personally have a certain knowledge that it is God's word.  

And that knowledge is no fantasy.

[Atheist Mormon]

1 hour ago, cdowis said:

Thanks for sharing your personal opinion.  I personally have a certain knowledge that it is God's word.  

And that knowledge is no fantasy.

Not a personal opinion, guaranteed, no such thing exists ......Your knowledge means nothing to the real world (no offense intended)......

[Atheist Mormon]

1 hour ago, strappinglad said:

From your mouth to God's ear..... in about 70 years.

In 70 years what? when he didn't hear last six decades of my life.....

[Robert F. Smith]

13 hours ago, Rajah Manchou said:

...in Boyolali

Apologies for the click-baity title. It caught me off guard too.

Its several thousand miles and 300-400 years off, but still an interesting find. Stone box included.

http://www.ibtimes.sg/indonesia-ancient-gold-plates-unearthed-boyolali-3157

Adding a link to another article I just saw while searching for photos. Gold Plates in China dating to 206 BC-AD 24.

Thanks, Rajah.

The article has these Chinese plates at 23 cm long, 10 cm wide, and 0.3 cm thick.  We can compare that with the estimated size of the BofM gold plates:  20 cm long, 15 cm wide, and each plate from .04 to .05 thick.  These are reasonable real world figures, and well within professional estimates (http://publications.mi.byu.edu/fullscreen/?pub=1110&index=81 ).

[cdowis]

1 hour ago, Atheist Mormon said:

Not a personal opinion, guaranteed, no such thing exists ......Your knowledge means nothing to the real world (no offense intended)......

1 Cor 1 [18] For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.

I rejoice in the foolishness of the cross, and that  I am not of the world.  Hallelujah!

Edited September 12, 2016 by cdowis

[Atheist Mormon]

5 minutes ago, cdowis said:

1 Cor 1 [18] For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.

I rejoice in the foolishness of the cross, and that  I am not of the world.  Hallelujah!

That's good 'Ol Paul for you. It amazes me how anyone can have faith in him (if you studied him, of course). At first he was a henchman of christian persecutors, next thing we read about him is he sees a vision of Jesus, he is converted. Then miraculously he takes over 99% of the Christian doctrine, meanwhile Peter is relegated to be bishop of Rome. (According to the scriptures, even in his own writing) Apostle Paul never professes of learning anything from outside sources, except Jesus Christ himself, and voila! we have a brand new religion a la Paul.

[Robert F. Smith]

4 minutes ago, Atheist Mormon said:

That's good 'Ol Paul for you. It amazes me how anyone can have faith in him (if you studied him, of course). At first he was a henchman of christian persecutors, next thing we read about him is he sees a vision of Jesus, he is converted. Then miraculously he takes over 99% of the Christian doctrine, meanwhile Peter is relegated to be bishop of Rome. (According to the scriptures, even in his own writing) Apostle Paul never professes of learning anything from outside sources, except Jesus Christ himself, and voila! we have a brand new religion a la Paul.

On the contrary, for those who have in fact studied him and his writings, Paul declares himself to be a Pharisaic rabbi trained by the great Gamaliel.  His writings show his great learning in both rabbinics and in pagan literature.  In this he follows his master, Jesus, who was also a Pharisaic rabbi of Beth Hillel.  Naturally, the Gentiles don't see that.  They don't read Torah or Talmud, and have no idea of the vast interconnections.  James (Jacob the Righteous) the Brother of Jesus, who was also executed by the Sanhedrin, gets much the same treatment from the ignorant Gentiles.

[Rajah Manchou]

59 minutes ago, Robert F. Smith said:

Thanks, Rajah.

The article has these Chinese plates at 23 cm long, 10 cm wide, and 0.3 cm thick.  We can compare that with the estimated size of the BofM gold plates:  20 cm long, 15 cm wide, and each plate from .04 to .05 thick.  These are reasonable real world figures, and well within professional estimates (http://publications.mi.byu.edu/fullscreen/?pub=1110&index=81 ).

So these Chinese plates would be .01-.02 cm thinner than the estimated thickness of the Book of Mormon plates?
Why is the estimation for the BOM plates so thick?

 

Edited September 12, 2016 by Rajah Manchou

[Atheist Mormon]

5 minutes ago, Robert F. Smith said:

On the contrary, for those who have in fact studied him and his writings, Paul declares himself to be a Pharisaic rabbi trained by the great Gamaliel.  His writings show his great learning in both rabbinics and in pagan literature.  In this he follows his master, Jesus, who was also a Pharisaic rabbi of Beth Hillel.  Naturally, the Gentiles don't see that.  They don't read Torah or Talmud, and have no idea of the vast interconnections.  James (Jacob the Righteous) the Brother of Jesus, who was also executed by the Sanhedrin, gets much the same treatment from the ignorant Gentiles.

Big deal!!! About His Higness' writings; Nothing came out of his threats and conjectures about damnations......Last time I knew I should be in deep trouble, since starting to blaspheme the Holy Ghost...Just to show there's nothing to it.....Paul was so  incoherent and insolent.... I'm still waiting to be electrocuted. Or left barely alive to be tortured for eternity.

[waveslider]

1 hour ago, Rajah Manchou said:

So these Chinese plates would be .01-.02 cm thinner than the estimated thickness of the Book of Mormon plates?
Why is the estimation for the BOM plates so thick?

 

It looks like the Chinese plates are .25 thicker. I think you missed the placement of the decimal point:

1 hour ago, Rajah Manchou said:

..... 0.3 cm thick.

 

[Robert F. Smith]

1 hour ago, Rajah Manchou said:

So these Chinese plates would be .01-.02 cm thinner than the estimated thickness of the Book of Mormon plates?
Why is the estimation for the BOM plates so thick?

Yeh, Waveslider got the correction.  My 1984 article has the reason for the thickness estimate for the BofM plates based on descriptions comparing them to common tin, or to parchment.  What we really need is a micrometer reading, but Moroni isn't going to allow that. 

[Robert F. Smith]

1 hour ago, Atheist Mormon said:

Big deal!!! About His Higness' writings; Nothing came out of his threats and conjectures about damnations......Last time I knew I should be in deep trouble, since starting to blaspheme the Holy Ghost...Just to show there's nothing to it.....Paul was so  incoherent and insolent.... I'm still waiting to be electrocuted. Or left barely alive to be tortured for eternity.

The only one who will punish you is yourself.  The only one who has the hate and spitefulness to want that is Satan and his buddies.  

[Rajah Manchou]

2 hours ago, waveslider said:

I think you missed the placement of the decimal point:

Those pesky zeros! Thanks for catching that.

When looking at a cross section the thickness isn't consistent, so the numbers given must be averaged.

[Rajah Manchou]

6 hours ago, Atheist Mormon said:

Not a personal opinion, guaranteed, no such thing exists ......

No such what exists, guaranteed? 

I'm also not a believer in the supernatural, but I don't find anything in the Book of Mormon that doesn't fit in the 5th century AD. Granted, the story of Jesus descending from the sky and a few other things like Nephi zapping his brothers are unexplainable, but these sort of things appear in all historical texts from that period. 

[cdowis]

12 hours ago, Atheist Mormon said:

That's good 'Ol Paul for you. It amazes me how anyone can have faith in him (if you studied him, of course). At first he was a henchman of christian persecutors, next thing we read about him is he sees a vision of Jesus, he is converted. Then miraculously he takes over 99% of the Christian doctrine, meanwhile Peter is relegated to be bishop of Rome. (According to the scriptures, even in his own writing) Apostle Paul never professes of learning anything from outside sources, except Jesus Christ himself, and voila! we have a brand new religion a la Paul.

Peter had an interesting comment regarding Paul

2 Peter 3 [15] And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you;
[16] As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.

Paul was contending with the Judaizers (the law of Moses was still in effect), and got abit carried away with some of  his arguments.  James wrote an epistle to try to straighten things out.

Edited September 12, 2016 by cdowis