Ken Ham's Ark

[TheSkepticChristian]

20 hours ago, The Nehor said:

Again this idea if you do not do it professionally you just do not care.

what are you talking about? I gave you references and links. It's just an irrelevant red herring by Kemara because he knows he lost the debate. 

20 hours ago, Kemara said:

 Furthermore the statistics you have used to peddle this position show not such thing.

I will try one more time. Only 6% of Americans know basic science, but it was 6% of those that were willing to take the test, so the real % of Americans that know basic Science is probably much lower. Guess what, 90% of Americans believe in a personal God, so that fact alone demonstrates that the vast majority of American Theists don't truly care about Science. Non-Theists are not a significant variable in the American Population.  We can say the American population is a Theistic population

No wonder why only 7% of NAS scientists are Theists. 

Quote

Fully 73% of Americans distinguish between astronomy and what is commonly considered a pseudoscience: astrology. Twenty-two percent of Americans incorrectly say that astronomy – not astrology – is the study of how the positions of stars and planets can influence human behavior. Another 5% give some other incorrect response. How much Americans appear to know about science depends on the kinds of questions asked, of course. Science encompasses a vast array of fields and information, and the questions in the new Pew Research survey represent a small slice of science knowledge. On Pew Research Center’s set of 12 multiple-choice questions – some of which include images as part of the questions or answer options – Americans gave more correct than incorrect answers; the median was eight correct answers out of 12 (mean 7.9). Some 27% answered eight or nine questions correctly, while another 26% answered 10 or 11 items correctly. Just 6% of respondents got a perfect score.

http://www.pewinternet.org/2015/09/10/what-the-public-knows-and-does-not-know-about-science/

PS To pass a 12 question test with at least a "C" you have to get 9 correct. 

Edited August 14, 2016 by TheSkepticChristian

[The Nehor]

Just now, TheSkepticChristian said:

what are you talking about? I gave you references and links. It's just an irrelevant red herring by Kemara because he knows he lost the argument. 

No, they did not.

Just now, TheSkepticChristian said:

I will try one more time. Only 6% of Americans know basic science, but it was 6% of those that were willing to take the test, that probably means the real % of Americans that know basic Science is much lower. Guess what, 90% of Americans believe in a personal God. 

So that alone demonstrates that the vast majority of Theists don't truly care about Science. 

No wonder why only 7% of NAS scientists believe in a personal God. 

So 6% of Americans know basic science and because 90% of them believe in God the two must be correlated.

It demonstrates no such thing. It might be indicative but you brush off all other possible explanations and dogmatically assert you are right. Doesn't sound like you are a very good scientist to me. Could you pass that basic science test?

[Calm]

I would suggest taking a psychology research class in order to learn what you can and cannot extrapolate from data. SC.

There is even a free one here:  https://alison.com/courses/RESEARCH-METHODS-IN-PSYCHOLOGY

Have no clue how good it is though.  I will take a look at it if I get tempted to see if another course that I am interested in is worth it.  Maybe even take it to refresh my memory of my psych research classes I took too long ago.

 If you do decide to take it, you might want to take the other psychology courses too.  Time investment is probably a lot less than you spend on the board.

[TheSkepticChristian]

29 minutes ago, Calm said:

I would suggest taking a psychology research class in order to learn what you can and cannot extrapolate from data. SC.

if only 6% of Americans know basic science, that means most American Theists don't know basic Science. It is that simple. Non-Theists  are not a significant variable in the American Population.  We can say the American population is a Theistic population. 

Quote

Ecklund concludes from her research that most scientists do not become irreligious as a consequence of their becoming scientists. “Rather, their reasons for unbelief mirror the circumstances in which other Americans find themselves: they were not raised in a religious home; they have had bad experiences with religion; they disapprove of God or see God as too changeable.” The disproportionately high percentage of nonbelievers among scientists (as compared to the general population) would appear to be the result of self-selection: the irreligious seem more likely to become scientists in the first place.

http://www.thenewatlantis.com/publications/what-scientists-believ

 

37 minutes ago, The Nehor said:

It demonstrates no such thing. It might be indicative but you brush off all other possible explanations and dogmatically assert you are right. Doesn't sound like you are a very good scientist to me. Could you pass that basic science test?

I am not a scientist, but of course! To pass a 12 question test with at least a "C" I have to get 9 correct. 

Pew says, " Americans gave more correct than incorrect answers; the median was eight correct answers out of 12 (mean 7.9) "

That is very sad! 

 

Edited August 14, 2016 by TheSkepticChristian

[Kemara]

19 hours ago, TheSkepticChristian said:

I will try one more time. Only 6% of Americans know basic science, but it was 6% of those that were willing to take the test, so the real % of Americans that know basic Science is probably much lower. Guess what, 90% of Americans believe in a personal God, so that fact alone demonstrates that the vast majority of American Theists don't truly care about Science. Non-Theists are not a significant variable in the American Population.  We can say the American population is a Theistic population

 

You can try as many times as you want but the statistics do not show what you are claiming they show. The statistics do not show interest, passion or true caring for science or science progression. You simply pulled that out of thin air. Now run along and find some statistics that present the answer to the question "are you interested in and/or have passion for an/or truly care about science and/or science progression". Report back to me when you have this data. 

[The Nehor]

2 hours ago, TheSkepticChristian said:

I am not a scientist, but of course! To pass a 12 question test with at least a "C" I have to get 9 correct. 

Pew says, " Americans gave more correct than incorrect answers; the median was eight correct answers out of 12 (mean 7.9) "

That is very sad! 

So you are saying you could pass a test on basic science because you can calculate percentages?

I just took the test. It is not a very good measure of scientific knowledge. 

Anyone interested can try the quiz here:

http://www.pewresearch.org/quiz/science-knowledge/

Knowing what astrology is is a scientific question? Not knowing the difference altitude makes in the temperature needed to boil water demonstrates scientific incompetence? Really?

[TheSkepticChristian]

3 hours ago, The Nehor said:

So you are saying you could pass a test on basic science because you can calculate percentages?

No, I said you need to get 9 correct to get a C grade. 

4 hours ago, Kemara said:

. Report back to me when you have this data. 

Questions  

How come only 7% of NAS scientists believe in a personal God?

How come only 33% of AAA scientists believe in God?

5 hours ago, Calm said:

Have no clue how good it is though

Edited August 14, 2016 by TheSkepticChristian

[Kemara]

15 minutes ago, TheSkepticChristian said:

Questions  

How come only 7% of NAS scientists believe in a personal God?

How come only 33% of AAA scientists believe in God?

Based on the statistics that you provided I have no way of knowing and neither do you. 

Question.

How come atheists and agnostics make up only the minority of scientists according to the Pew Research Center survey of 2009? 

Now off you go, find the stats then report back to me.

[thesometimesaint]

12 out of 12.

[TheSkepticChristian]

8 hours ago, Kemara said:

How come atheists and agnostics make up only the minority of scientists according to the Pew Research Center survey of 2009? 

because only 7% of Americans are atheists and agnostics (just 4% are atheist), but it is clear that most scientists are non-Theists. It can be argued that most scientists are atheist and agnostic about a personal God. Let me remind you, you changed the subject, I was talking about Theists. 

Survey: Atheists, Agnostics Know More About Religion Than Religious

http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2010/09/28/130191248/atheists-and-agnostics-know-more-about-bible-than-religious

You think Atheists and Agnostics wouldn't do better in Science? 

Edited August 14, 2016 by TheSkepticChristian

[TheSkepticChristian]

26 minutes ago, thesometimesaint said:

12 out of 12.

Good! You are in the top 6%. 

Edited August 14, 2016 by TheSkepticChristian

[thesometimesaint]

Thank you. I still believe in God too.

[bcuzbcuz]

5 hours ago, thesometimesaint said:

12 out of 12.

I got number 13 right, Are you male or female?

[Kemara]

11 hours ago, TheSkepticChristian said:

You think Atheists and Agnostics wouldn't do better in Science? 

Better than what? Better than the majority of scientists?

Have you found those statistics yet?

[The Nehor]

14 hours ago, TheSkepticChristian said:

You think Atheists and Agnostics wouldn't do better in Science? 

Okay, so let us instead study compulsory science education. Can you show that religious high school students do worse then atheist students. Then we can determine which "do better in science".

[thesometimesaint]

9 hours ago, The Nehor said:

Okay, so let us instead study compulsory science education. Can you show that religious high school students do worse then atheist students. Then we can determine which "do better in science".

Probably would depend on which High School they attend.

 Set Theory is of the devil.

SEE http://boingboing.net/2012/08/07/what-do-christian-fundamentali.html

[bcuzbcuz]

2 hours ago, thesometimesaint said:

Probably would depend on which High School they attend.

 Set Theory is of the devil.

SEE http://boingboing.net/2012/08/07/what-do-christian-fundamentali.html

Wow. Thank you for that very intereting article. And I thought I knew all the different degrees of Whack. 

[The Nehor]

11 hours ago, thesometimesaint said:

Probably would depend on which High School they attend.

 Set Theory is of the devil.

SEE http://boingboing.net/2012/08/07/what-do-christian-fundamentali.html

Set theory is amazingly practical and neat. I never understand why Christians want to ascribe to the devil such neat stuff. It is like they are trying to make the next generation a bunch of Satanists.

[TheSkepticChristian]

On 8/14/2016 at 9:50 PM, Kemara said:

Have you found those statistics yet?

Do you agree that most Americans don't read the scientific literature and Science Books? 

21 hours ago, The Nehor said:

Okay, so let us instead study compulsory science education. Can you show that religious high school students do worse then atheist students. Then we can determine which "do better in science".

"Survey: Atheists, Agnostics Know More About Religion Than Religious" 

 

Edited August 16, 2016 by TheSkepticChristian

[The Nehor]

1 hour ago, TheSkepticChristian said:

"Survey: Atheists, Agnostics Know More About Religion Than Religious" 

In the same way a well-read eunuch understands romance better then a lover or how a childless couple who read about child-rearing know more about parenthood then parents. Religion is not a comprehension test or a measure of one's interest or knowledge of religious history. You seem to venerate academic knowledge over actual experience.

[bcuzbcuz]

5 hours ago, The Nehor said:

In the same way a well-read eunuch understands romance better then a lover or how a childless couple who read about child-rearing know more about parenthood then parents. Religion is not a comprehension test or a measure of one's interest or knowledge of religious history. You seem to venerate academic knowledge over actual experience.

 

If I remember correctly, the survey mentioned above was based on how well people knew eligious facts. It stated:

Atheists and agnostics, Jews and Mormons are among the highest-scoring groups on a new survey of religious knowledge, outperforming evangelical Protestants, mainline Protestants and Catholics on questions about the core teachings, history and leading figures of major world religions.

Questions included: 

On questions about Christianity – including a battery of questions about the Bible – Mormons (7.9 out of 12 right on average) and white evangelical Protestants (7.3 correct on average) show the highest levels of knowledge. Jews and atheists/agnostics stand out for their knowledge of other world religions, including Islam, Buddhism, Hinduism and Judaism; out of 11 such questions on the survey, Jews answer 7.9 correctly (nearly three better than the national average) and atheists/agnostics answer 7.5 correctly (2.5 better than the national average). Atheists/agnostics and Jews also do particularly well on questions about the role of religion in public life, including a question about what the U.S. Constitution says about religion.

I don't believe there was a section of questions directed towards eunuchs.

[The Nehor]

3 hours ago, bcuzbcuz said:

I don't believe there was a section of questions directed towards eunuchs.

Then the study was flawed.

[thesometimesaint]

13 hours ago, TheSkepticChristian said:

Do you agree that most Americans don't read the scientific literature and Science Books? 

"Survey: Atheists, Agnostics Know More About Religion Than Religious" 

 

Hate to be blunt, but most American's don't know much about science or religion.

[TheSkepticChristian]

2 hours ago, thesometimesaint said:

Hate to be blunt, but most American's don't know much about science or religion.

Thank You!  for telling the truth. 

Remember what I said? "Non-Theists are not a significant variable in the American Population. We can say the American population is a Theistic population" Only 4% of the American population is Atheist. 

So we can say that most American Theists don't know much about science or religion. 

14 hours ago, The Nehor said:

 Religion is not a comprehension test or a measure of one's interest or knowledge of religious history. You seem to venerate academic knowledge over actual experience.

I am a Mormon. 

Edited August 16, 2016 by TheSkepticChristian

[Kemara]

16 hours ago, TheSkepticChristian said:

Do you agree that most Americans don't read the scientific literature and Science Books? 

Have you found those statistics yet? Yes or no?