Transgender Identiy

[EllenMaksoud]

What if a person had already undergone gender reassignment surgery, and then converted to the LDS Church?

That was my case, though at the time I came to the church no one knew of my early history. Though, certain members of the church have been very proactive in helping to seek answers to this mystery. And, I am often told that if I had not been honest from the beginning, no one would have known. It is hard to advocate dishonesty.  Perhaps the case is that medical issues are not the churches business, and that is what I tell anyone who asks me about this set of issues.

 

It is especially encouraging to increasingly see these children identified very early because preemptive treatment gives them fuller lives.

 

As it developed, in my birth Doctor's profound ignorance (1947), as was the general procedure of the day, he removed my female organs at birth. In those days, the Doctors did not tell the parents and such procedures were not on the medical record. The only way I am able to surmise any of this is from putting together family stories, knowledge of known procedures of the day, and later evidence of past surgery.  When the genetic testing was done around 2011, it was found that genetic issues do exist but it would take a lot more money to determine exactly what they are. The investigators said they felt it to be either XXy (y badly damaged) or Androgen Insensitivity Syndrome of unknown extent.

 

If progress is to be made within the church on this issue, then they need people with great expertise, at least a Doctorate, in genetic issues, not a Heart Surgeon, to study this. And thankfully, if the church does nothing, it won't matter a lot because there are few of us.

 

I say these things in the open because it is clear that education is the only hope of resolving the matter.

[Bernard Gui]

First Presidency approval for exceptions.

[EllenMaksoud]

First Presidency approval for exceptions.

Another way of looking at it, as in the case of those born with either ambiguous genitalia, or both where the wrong one is removed, some of us choose to put back what was wrongfully removed. I may not live long enough to see justice done. There is a growing body of evidence that will eventually change policy. It is just a question of time. I am waiting for that First Presidency approval. I have written no resignation letters, or done any lurid YouTube videos.

[USU78]

I haven't seen anyone being passive aggressive. It seems what is being said is fairly direct. The church does a lot right. In some areas, they need further revelation.

 

And you think that's how it works?  G-d gives His prophets revelations, but only if enough people gripe about the Church and its members, accuse them of contributing to nay causing suicides?

[EllenMaksoud]

And you think that's how it works?  G-d gives His prophets revelations, but only if enough people gripe about the Church and its members, accuse them of contributing to nay causing suicides?

This is a developing situation. Perhaps it should be worded as science gets new revelation? And maybe the future will show that the whole GBLT issue can easily be cured at birth, or not.  I can't remember the details but there is a condition that happens with some infants that is easily treated at birth with some drops in the eyes. I remember getting a sugar cube that prevented my getting polio. All these sorts of things when kept in perspective aren't as serious as we think they are.

 

Remember, they used to moralize about Hansen's Disease. 

 

The pain for me in the Mormon church is my fault. I should never have said a thing, and could have sailed right through membership, and the temple recommend with no questions. And, you will not find my name on any protesters lists. There are enough weird people in the church, I would have fit right in.

[CV75]

Not looking for much debate here but just a discussion and conversation on the issue.

We are taught that gender “is an essential characteristic of individual premortal, mortal, and eternal identity and purpose.” We see that it is a characteristic that isn’t always translated perfectly into mortality on a number of fronts.

 

Some people go a lifetime without the Gospel or the helps the Lord affords. At least the saints have the teachings of Christ to help them gain an eternal perspective and keep the covenants in a world of ambiguity and relentless testing.

 

I believe that people generally deal with their circumstances and conditions in life the best way they can. We have more tools to understand what is going on today, both in terms of medicine and the Gospel, than ever before. But I don’t always think that our expanding scientific knowledge and understanding of the genetics, chemistry, psychology, etc. of gender guarantees much solace, and certainly not the sole basis for sound decision-making. Despite our warranted gratitude for and reliance on the science, those with issues still have to correctly identify and live with his/her spirit’s gender regardless of how anyone thinks biology may have betrayed them. It takes a lot of patience and faith to live without some specific (or even general) answers and to go without the fulfillment of some dreams in this life.

 

Inasmuch as we are to leave the 99 to seek out and rescue the one, the world takes one approach to advertise the plight and relieve the suffering of those tried in this way while the Lord takes another. Ultimately the best comfort is found in the tailor-made solutions the Lord inspires, and not in becoming polarized on an ambiguous point.

[Rain]

Another way of looking at it, as in the case of those born with either ambiguous genitalia, or both where the wrong one is removed, some of us choose to put back what was wrongfully removed. I may not live long enough to see justice done. There is a growing body of evidence that will eventually change policy. It is just a question of time. I am waiting for that First Presidency approval. I have written no resignation letters, or done any lurid YouTube videos.

I'm confused. You no longer consider yourself Mormon, but are now Muslim. Why would you be waiting for first presidency approval?

Edited July 18, 2014 by Rain

[EllenMaksoud]

I'm confused. You no longer consider yourself Mormon, but are now Muslim. Why would you be waiting for first presidency approval?

I'm not optimistic that the GA's will approve this, but there are those who insist they will. It is not a question of suddenly not believing in the church, just that they will want me. I never actually stopped being Muslim and often wear my Hijab, still attend Muslim events, and have Muslim friends.  And, with all the study I have done it is not much of a reach to practice both should it come to that. I didn't stop being Muslim partially because I did not trust the Mormons.

[CV75]

I'm not optimistic that the GA's will approve this, but there are those who insist they will. It is not a question of suddenly not believing in the church, just that they will want me. I never actually stopped being Muslim and often wear my Hijab, still attend Muslim events, and have Muslim friends.  And, with all the study I have done it is not much of a reach to practice both should it come to that. I didn't stop being Muslim partially because I did not trust the Mormons.

If I understand your situation, it is to correct what you consider to be an erroneous gender assignment performed in infancy. While you have based your conclusion on how you feel in your heart of hearts, there seems to have been some reliance on a medical opinion (as part of prayerfully studying it out) and then some push-back based on the resulting the XXy and AIS evidence (which may be misinterpreted: it could just as well be used to support the idea that the extra X and weak y and the AIS were the means to accommodate your female spirit under the circumstances). I trust that you and your priesthood leaders are taking a spiritual approach to this, working together as a council of sorts.

 

I think Church policy is a spiritual approach that leaves space for individual accommodation.

[Rain]

I'm not optimistic that the GA's will approve this, but there are those who insist they will. It is not a question of suddenly not believing in the church, just that they will want me. I never actually stopped being Muslim and often wear my Hijab, still attend Muslim events, and have Muslim friends.  And, with all the study I have done it is not much of a reach to practice both should it come to that. I didn't stop being Muslim partially because I did not trust the Mormons.

Ok, so you were Muslim, then were baptized Mormon while still believing some Muslim things and now are back to identifying being Muslim?

And now the first presidency approval you are waiting for does not specifically concern you but is for Mormon members with similar conditions to you?